Just to prove I can

[Dana Design]

joolee said:

Thank you all for your comments. I just want to say that the purpose of this posting wasn't to reignite the debate about what is or is not acceptable practice when getting the intial strokes on the drawing surface.

Good! Everyone has their own method in placing the form on canvas and there are no 'bad' methods. I echo what Peter has said in spades!

Debate isn't necessary.

[Wassie]

I trace the outline for my portraits and don't feel at all bad about it. From a live model I do a lot of measuring as do portrait artists from which I have taken workshops so what is the difference - grid, trace or measure?

I have decided to only have critical critiques on paintings where I know I have a problem and don't what it is or how to fix it. I once had 2 professional artists to critique a painting I was happy with and one just tore it to pieces, criticizing everything I did. The second artist, not knowing about the first critique, went over it with a fine tooth comb and showed how everything the first artist didn't like, actually worked in my painting. The second artist highly praised my painting. So, critiques are in the eyes of the critiquer.

[lovin art]

Jools

Im glad you found the demo grand to watch, those skintones are amazing arent they!! ........be on the lookout for his other stuff......good luck on your path with oils, such fun isnt it!!

[hblenkle]

I started with a drawing class in the 80's. Took many painting classes after that and could tell I was progressively getting rusty. Recently I have taken drawing classes again as a refresher. I had so much fun. I even took a portrait drawing class where they used sanguine and white pencils. I am thinking I will do a few portrait drawings and refresh my drawing ability.

[joolee]

Thank you for pushing, Peter

Hi Wassie - One man's meat is another man's poison, but a critique which only criticises is pointless and cruel.

Thanks Sandra - oh I'm having the best time ever

hblenke - I have attended a few life classes over the last few months and had to draw then, but I don't enjoy it as much as painting - either with pastels or oils. But we are still drawing with a brush when we paint, aren't we?

Jools

[hblenkle]

Joolee:
Yes., but when tracing and projecting images we are bypassing the preliminary drawing stage. I used tracing and projecting to get to the painting stage fast, but noticed I was getting rusty at the preliminary drawing. A few portrait sketches periodically and not rusty anymore.
Harold

[Dana Design]

Just also remember that any projection will have some flaws, distortions. Will possibly be 'rounder' especially in portraits.

[hblenkle]

Good point. Sort of like camera distortion. Photos are a good resource, but have some distortions usually too.

[MadMaddy]

I usually do lot's of lurking on this forum as I admire you all greatly. Jools, this is turning out wonderfully. I will definitely keep an eye out on it as I want to see the finish.

I have used a grid for portraits in the past and have found myself needing to go back to push myself to refresh my drawing skills. It becomes easy to rely to heavily on the grid to do all your critical thinking for you. I find it becomes harder to find my mistakes and work through correcting them when I use it too often. On the flip side, it is a useful tool when I am in a hurry (which unfortunately, I often am since i have small children.)

I am working on a nine person portrait for a customer and I tried a projection as I didn't want to grid that small and ended up having to redo about half the faces anyway since they were distorted. I would have saved time to just start off without any help in that case.

I suppose, to sum up, I think all those things can be useful tools for an artist at times, but reliance upon them can lead to losing that which we have striven for. I also think about Vermeer and Leonardo, and I figure that they may have used tools when necessary (ie when doing work for a patron who's satisfaction meant food on the table) but I am sure they spent many hours drawing without them.

Just thought to put my two cents in for what it is worth. If I ever get the time, I will post the portrait I am working on now as it would be nice to have the extra eyes.

[GraceWays]

Your work is lovely! Thanks for sharing.

[amyeverhart]

We knew you could do it! But you should be proud of yourself!!

[Netty]

Beautiful Jools.... I love Daniel Green's work, he is a master, Jools have you watched any of his instructional dvds, they are a must have , exceptionally wonderful!!!
We paint because we have to,or we will go crazy.... , how we do this in my honest oppinion is no ones business....
You just go from skill to skill jools, great to see you pushing yourself..

[joolee]

Not to get too deep into the drawing/tracing/gridding debate - I am finding that I am doing about the same amount of tweaking with my paintbrush as I do when I trace the basic outline .

Looking at you portraits Lara, I would say your drawing skills are of the highest quality . Please lets see some of your portraits on this forum, staring with the one you are doing now. Nine heads in one painting - wow! I have never understood the value of gridding and would much prefer to draw freehand than use this option. I guess you need to be meticulous to get it right - and I just don't have the right approach.

Thank you Grace & Amy.

Hi Annie . Nice to see you here and thank you. I don't have any of his videos. I have seen them and would like them, but they are a touch expensive (unless anyone out there has any second hand DVDs you want to sell??).

I ditched the photocopy and put the panting of Caroline up on the computer screen I have next to my easel - oh my, those skin tones are to die for. This exercise has now morphed from an exercise in drawing to an exercise in painting skin tones. Am I frustrated - oh yes, you bet I am. Here is where I am so far. The photo has lightened the skin tones, but they are no-where near right yet. The nose needs work as it has been moved about a bit



Jools

[Peter D]

It's going well Jools and it is all your work.

[lovin art]

I love this Girl, your getting the essance of the original and thats what counts....!!