'Art Models 3'.... New Book! My thoughts.....

[Adair_P]

I was recently sent a book to review.... 'Art Models 3'..... here is my review:

I draw and paint every day…. it is not always possible for me to work with life models so I’m frequently searching for references which will prompt me and plant the seed of an idea from which to work. I know plenty of other artists out there who work this way….either from necessity or preference.

My very first impression when I received this book was that the lighting - which is of major importance to me - was exquisitely arranged. I use shadows a lot to help me define form and volume. I have seen other model books and have been most disappointed with the lighting. Great care has been given to this aspect in Art Models 3, just as if I’d arranged the lighting myself, and it is almost as if the model is standing in the studio with me!


There are over 60 poses, some are represented in this book, but there is an accompanying CD with a full range of 360 degree shots of each pose, 24 views of each, and 2 different angles. You can watch them in a slide show if you like a moving target!

At the front of the book there is a small shot of all poses for easy reference.

A wide variety of models will inspire all figure artists… male & female, slim & fuller figured, couples…..even shots of a pregnant model, very tastefully and sensitively photographed. Seated, standing, active poses and reclining…. they’re all here. Artists who just want to practice and hone their drawing skills will find this book extremely valuable. There are poses to suit fantasy artists, or those who design Manga perhaps.

For me, many of the poses and angles appealed and inspired and I will be referencing this book for some new paintings.

The book comes with a solid cover, is beautifully bound and already has
a place in my studio! I can’t wait to begin painting!

My grateful thanks to Maureen and Douglas for putting Art Models 3 together.

[wandathefish]

Hey Pauline, I have an art models book and have used it for some of my poses when doing my charcoal. The dvd that comes with the book enables you to download the pic to your computor and put it in photoshop and adjust the lighting to get enough contrast to see the shadow areas pretty well. I love it and will get more when the budget allows. Thanks for the review!

[trevors]

Thanks Pauline I am giving this serious consideration and will probably buy this on your recommendation

[macrobertson]

I don't paint or draw nudes at home... maybe if I had a studio I would, but for now they are the domain of the life drawing group... or today's ferry ride!

Mac

[Descartes]

Mac have fun with the ferry.

Pauline, thanks for the review, the pictures look really good. I have a few similar books, but recently I've been using DeviantArt stock images. The people who provide these images are wonderful and, until recently, I didn't realise the crap they have to put up with.

[Adair_P]

Originally Posted by wandathefish

The dvd that comes with the book enables you to download the pic to your computor and put it in photoshop and adjust the lighting to get enough contrast to see the shadow areas pretty well.

Thanks for pointing that out Wanda.... I forgot to mention that fact, that you can download the photos, then adjust them however you require for your own needs.

Trevor.....
Mac...... (If I tried that.... what would the other ferry passengers think... )

Nathan.... I like Deviantart too. Some models are soooo generous, e.g. Sophie (Lockstock) ...... and there are others who want to charge $350 for the use of one photo reference!

[red.ochre]

re : the conversation . .

I'm not being critical, however, there is simply a difference in the way we look at a model as artists vs. the way a camera does, and to render art from photographs without accounting for the many skews of lense photography, further complicates the already challenging excercise of portrait/figurative work.

There are numerous tell-tale signs when artists in galleries use photographs for references vs. life studies, and the debates throughout this website have one voice -- those who use photographs defend it. This is not that debate. However, the first attention grabber of these artists using photographs for portrait/figurative work is the anatomy skewed by a lense, and the often cause, is simply because they were shooting down at the model.

I say "artistic perspective", but call it what you will. It's a more accurate representation of anatomy in photography, accomplished by shooting just below center of the model with a slight tic' up (or thereabouts depending on the pose). This perspective artificially elevates the view of the photographed model, as if on a platform, which is how many artists render their works -- looking up at their model.

Granted, some artists do render their work looking down at the model.

Shooting with this "artistic perspective" makes a better reference for study by artists, because it is understandable anatomy, instead of problems, proportions, and foreshortening to correct caused by lense skew. All lense cameras are skewed to begin with, so in effect, shooting with this "artistic perspective", makes the liar, lie for you.

Example :



Even as an amateur photographer, I can repeat this perspective template and achieve similar results.

There are poses in Model 3 where the photographer shot using this perspective, I can see them . . and there are poses where the photographer is shooting down at the model, or from an off-center, and I can see those too. Again, I'm not being critical, and it's not detrimental to the photography, the product, or the time it takes to develop such a thing, but I am putting in the suggestion box for Model 4, my thoughts, if artists are to use this as a reference tool.

I'll probably be one of them

Anyway, forward a thanks to the photographer for not getting his neck hairs up. The book and CD are a great price. I'll get it.

[wandathefish]

Hey Red, I would like to say that the photo you show is a very classical perspective and does look as if the model is on a dias. However, in thinking about putting figures in landscapes and interiors, the perspective may need to be more various than that of a studio model stand. So though I like that perspective for a classic study, I also like many other perspectives. One nice thing about these books is that they put the model on a turntable and let you see the pose through 360 degrees which is wonderful for finding that perfect angle to draw from.

[jocelynsart]

I don't know, I've looked at them off and on over the last few years, thinking I'd love to own one, but I find them a bit too boring or perfect, or something. The light is too professionally done, too "studioish", on them, and they have no texture, just smooth lean surfaces all evenly toned (pigment wise). Originally, the lighting was too soft and all around, no contrast. The new one looks like there is a bit. However, I find that there is not variations in the lighting conditions, like what you see on the models you get at life sessions, colours in the shadow, reflections off drapery or the surround, etc. Neat little happening Imperfections if I may.
I think they are a great and convenient tool though, when there is no other available source for an artist to work from as well as to correct or body perspective view or pose one is working on themsleves, from their own ref or client ref.
I sort of considered investing in them as I love painting the figure but work done from them cannot be exhibited, sold, etc. either; as far as I know from reading. So I kind of passed up considering spending $ on them.
Jocelyn

[Lauren F-M]

Hmmmm...

Actually, I've never seen any of this book series, but am aware of similar books (have one) for illustration reference, which is what I've used it for when wearing my 'illustrator' hat.

However, except for one time doing some drawings of the lovely Sophie from a thread Pauline ran here a few years ago, I have only drawn and painted the naked human from life.

I realize that if one primarily paints nudes -- as Pauline does -- this might not always be possible, so she has found other sources to add to her well of material. Works well for Pauline, as I've seen by her beautiful paintings. I gather that the vast knowledge she has of the figure (and her medium) comes from her experience drawing from live models (sorry, Pauline, don't know how this lasped into referring to you in the third person) -- which might not work so well for artists new to drawing and painting the figure, if they worked from photographic references only.

While I wouldn't say I'd never use this kind of book -- I'm sure I would find it a useful reference -- at present I'm happy working with live models when I have the opportunity. Also, as I'm presently studying the approach of atelier-art (don't know how better to refer to it), the emphasis is on working from life, with dramatic lighting for strong light and shadow on the figure.

Thanks for posting this thread, Pauline. It's an interesting discussion, as well as being informative.

Cheers, Lauren

[Adair_P]

Originally Posted by jocelynsart

.......I love painting the figure but work done from them cannot be exhibited, sold, etc. either; as far as I know from reading. .....

I think this may not be entirely true, but I will ask Douglas to comment on this aspect. My belief is that paintings from these references can be sold...... but if you are into realism maybe that is different. Derivatives shouldn't be a problem at all.

It's true that you won't get all those 'nice' interferences that can happen when drawing/painting from life..... but if studying the form by practising from this book can help hone life skills I'm all for it..... especially when 'new' artists want to cram in some figure drawing to advance their knowledge.

I don't think these sorts of references replace Life Drawing.... not all all, and I'd never never suggest that, but for some artists and aspiring artists they can be a great supplement.

Lauren.... Yes, as an illustrators reference book, I'd say these books would be invaluable. You are lucky being able to attend atelier.... A good discussion here..... and I know that the publishers are very interested in this thread and will read all our comments. Trying to get him to join in!!!
I forwarded Richard's comments on to him, and he is aware of the thread.

I draw from life and from photographic references, sometimes combining the two..... I don't think one is right and one is wrong..... I think whatever gets one drawing has to be good.


Mac..... you don't need a studio, you can just sketch with the book on your knee, or in the car (as a couple of our members do) ...


Thanks everyone for your opinions and comments here.....

[simpleuserid]

Hi Folks,

Douglas here -- the photographer for Live Model Books. Pauline invited me to comment. I'm just a photographer, not an artist, but I'll put in my 2-cents.

Originally Posted by Adair_P

My belief is that paintings from these references can be sold

Absolutely! In fact here's an example. A number of Heather's pieces were inspired by our photos.

Originally Posted by Adair_P

if studying the form by practising from this book can help hone life skills I'm all for it..... especially when 'new' artists want to cram in some figure drawing to advance their knowledge.

Practice was one of the main uses we pictured for our photos.

Originally Posted by Adair_P

I don't think these sorts of references replace Life Drawing.... not all all, and I'd never never suggest that, but for some artists and aspiring artists they can be a great supplement.

Again I agree with Pauline. We never intended the photos to be a replacement for live models. But they have their advantages. For example, a photo is always available and the model never moves so you can come back to it again and again and work on a piece over time.

On a related topic, we're working on a book now with Butch Krieger (he's a contributing editor for the Artist's Magazine) which will teach drawing from photos. One of the points Butch makes is that even the great masters started out drawing from 2-dimensional works. That is, instead of working from life, they actually worked from other artists' paintings. So the idea has some significant history in classical art training.

Regarding the perspective question, I sent a lengthy reply to Pauline the other day. I'll post some of that here:
I try to shoot fairly close to chest height. But many people ask us to intentionally shoot above or below the horizon, particularly from worm's eye view or from overhead looking down, precisely so they can study the distortion. I can post some examples if anyone's interested (or you can look up Mandy301 at our posespace website, it has worm's eye, straight on and overhead views).

We try to always shoot one rotation at chest height and, when time and circumstance allow, we mix in those other angles. Unfortunately, for every angle we add, we also add another 4-hours of painstaking editing. (per pose!) And we only have one person working on this project full time, me. So we just don't have the time to shoot multiple angles for every pose.

Another thing we try to do is shoot from a "normal" distance. Basically, we try to approximate what you would see if you were observing the model yourself. Of course, cameras never really match the human visual system. Here's a longer explanation on wikipedia.

There's a lot more that we consider when setting up the poses. For example, I haven't even touched on our lighting philosophy yet. But I've probably gone on far too long already so I'll leave it at that.

Thanks for inviting me to comment!

Cheers,
Douglas

[Adair_P]

Oh Hi Douglas..... and welcome to the Wet Canvas Figure Forum! It's great to have you here and for you to put forward your reasons and strategy behind the book..... which I think is a super resource.

Thank you for replying to my invitation.

I think the models are very generous for becoming involved in the book too and at this point I would like to thank them.

Must rush now.... I've missed my Life Frawing Group today, so I will be getting my 'fix' later on from Art Models 3 .

[red.ochre]

Originally Posted by simpleuserid

Thanks for inviting me to comment!

I think what you've done is quite an endeavor, and have been browsing the website. Where I am all on the side of working from life, frankly, I don't have access to models so I can probably put something like this to use.

Bear with me on exaggerating this example of the problem, a centered shot (left) vs. a simulated down shot (right). At a glance, there's little difference, and if you didn't have the photo on the left it probably wouldn't be noticeable, but the anatomy is skewed in the simulation (right) by the lense because of the downshot. That's not about foreshortening . . it's about anatomy math.

Human Purportions 101 :


Example of anatomy distortion :


Image taken from :
http://anatomicalfigures.com/html/ma...atomicalf.html


As a hobbyist, I know how difficult it is to photograph the human form -- I've shot sculpture trying to practice. The only thing worse is architecture. So I'm not being critical, just saying, if it's about the study of the human form (vs. fan art, etc.), then it makes a difference. Imagine a sculptor student who didn't have a model using your book . . that's me.

Most of the shots are not a problem, but the further you are from center, the more anatomy distortion there is. Throwing my .02 in for next time.

Best wishes.

[jocelynsart]

You know what, they are great for illustrators' reference for sure.
I am a huge fan of working from my reference (take lots of badgering for it lol!), but I still don't have much interest in these nude ref books. I think it is because they are too unvaried, too boring and I'd need to transfer them in to an environment reference, in order to complete a full painting working from them. However, I tend to prefer odd lighting conditions so I may be looking at these refs in a specifically personal taste way.
However, for keeping up drawing from the human form, they are fantastic. They are a godsend to many artists.
In college we were able to gain access to very expensive figure sample books ($500 range). They were of the clothed figure, various ages, in different positions or in faux activities. They were an illustrators' ref tool. This is a similar idea only a lot more affordable and accessible.