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Old 11-23-2012, 10:01 AM
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Cariboo Bill Cariboo Bill is offline
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Lightbulb Watercolor Lightfastness Testing Project Discussion

I wonder if as a group we might consider a large scale light fast testing project here on WetCanvas. This is Bruce MacEvoy's article on light fast testing:
http://www.handprint.com/HP/WCL/pigmt9.html

We would need to organize and register what paints we would be testing and hopefully between all of us we would cover most of the brands and most of the paints. No need to go out and purchase paints just use what you've got and test what you want to test.

If we each tested something like 12 to 20 paints, did the set up and then agreed to put them all out on say Jan 1 2013 and do the first check on say May 1 and a final on Sept 1 we would have a fairly thorough, worldwide lightfast check that would be useful for all of us and for newcomers especially. Bruce MacEvoy's last update was 2004 and as he notes continually the source of pigments change, the binders, dispersants and other stuff can change so its time for another thorough look.

We would need at least one moderator for sure and then work out the organization. I am willing to collect up info but that may not be the best options.

Anyone interested? Would this be OK with Wetcanvas? Let's talk.
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Old 11-23-2012, 10:58 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

I like it!

I've been testing my paints in a south-facing window since the beginning of January and February of this year. I'd be happy to share the results - later today, I'm not at home at the moment.
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Old 11-23-2012, 11:05 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

Thanks Sandra, we'll work out the details but we need to come up with a standardized reporting approach, something like the manufacturer, name of the paint, pigment number or numbers if a hue and for already completed tests like yours (I had not anticipated that but it is only sensible so all such contribution would be welcome) and the time of exposure.
Bill
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Old 11-23-2012, 06:52 PM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

Update on tape. I went to Canadian Tire and bought a roll of aluminum tape out of the hardware section and as noted above it is used for taping seems in heating pipes particularly for wood stove or pellet stove applications. It is probably available at Walmart I will take a look when I get the chance.
Bill
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:16 PM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

I'm in... I think this is a great idea...
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Old 11-24-2012, 01:30 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

I'm in!
Have purchased a frame today and will put UV glass in prior to following Handprint instructions. The paints I will test will be known fugitive ones to see what difference UV glass makes.
I will need to know when we southern hemisphere dabblers need to start the test.
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Old 11-24-2012, 06:03 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

This is a great idea. I'd be happy to help as well; most of my tubes are WN, though I have a few DR, Holbein and DS. I also have a Schmincke, Sennelier and Lukas in pans. It's summer here in Australia now so I should get some good results (plus I've already been doing tests on coloured pencils and watersoluble crayons anyway). How will we work out who tests what paints?
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Old 11-24-2012, 07:50 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

I think this is a great idea.... I haven't gone to handprint .... I will... to read the instructions yet... but I recommend that....

once the craziness of posts disappearing on Wet Canvas gets fixed ....

and once the details, timing, etc. of our group effort have been worked out...

that Bill starts a new thread with the detailed instructions in the first post.... i.e. the exact procedure to be followed and the timing, so we are comparing apples to apples.....

I have to leave the house now, but ... I'll go back and read the handprint.com instructions later today..
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Old 11-24-2012, 08:26 AM
Rocket Jones Rocket Jones is offline
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing: Crowdsourcing

I'd be happy to help, but I live in a townhouse and my windows are oriented directly east and west! If we can come up with some acceptable variation for this, I'm in. And since the major paint brands will probably be well represented, I can test the Dick Blick brand from here in the US. I started with them and have a fair selection.
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Old 11-24-2012, 09:03 AM
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The Real Watercolor Lightfast Discussion

Due to the gremlins on Nov 23 the thread I attempted to start got hijacked by a man riding a donkey (a bandito no doubt) so here it is again. I have gotten used to the gremlins and save a copy of all starter threads but it didn't seem useful to try to start it again yesterday with the gremlins still loose. Who knows they may be loose today???

I wonder if as a group we might consider a large scale light fast testing project here on WetCanvas. This is Bruce MacEvoy's article on light fast testing:
http://www.handprint.com/HP/WCL/pigmt9.html

We would need to organize and register what paints we would be testing and hopefully between all of us we would cover most of the brands and most of the paints. No need to go out and purchase paints just use what you've got and test what you want to test.

If we each tested something like 12 to 20 paints, did the set up and then agreed to put them all out on say Jan 1 2013 and do the first check on say May 1 and a final on Sept 1 we would have a fairly thorough, worldwide lightfast check that would be useful for all of us and for newcomers especially. Bruce MacEvoy's last update was 2004 and as he notes continually the source of pigments change, the binders, dispersants and other stuff can change so its time for another thorough look.

We would need at least one moderator for sure and then work out the organization. I am willing to collect up info but that may not be the best options.

Anyone interested? Would this be OK with Wetcanvas? Let's talk.
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Old 11-24-2012, 09:43 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfast Testing Discussion

Bill,
I've combined the two threads you started on this project so it didn't get too confusing. I've left your explanatory posts from both threads here even though they repeat some of the same info.

I don't see why this would cause any problem with Wet Canvas. People have individually done some of this sort of test in the past and we have their threads in The Watercolor Handbook.

Your project would be more extensive and cover newer paints as well as older ones with different people doing the testing and reporting.

I will be glad to act as a Moderator with you as the Leader. It would probably be good to start a Watercolor Lightfastness Testing Report thread (which we can make a sticky at the top of the LZ) where those who will participate can post their "before" charts as the beginning of the test images on 1 January 2013. Then more images would be placed in the thread at each stage so they will be together and easy to see any changes.

This thread could run as a discussion thread alongside that one to keep the info less confusing.

What do you think of that method? Any other ideas on how to proceed with this project???

Sylvia
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Old 11-24-2012, 09:52 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfastness Testing Project Discussion

Thank you Sylvia!

When I got to Wetcanvas this morning and looked at the thread it still had the paintings and comments on the paintings in it so I decided to start again and did send a personal message to Yorky to ask him to erase the problem thread, however I see that you have solved the problem VERY well, thanks. Of course now Yorky might show up and erase everything????

Much better with you helping out. OK I like the logic of the sticky reporting thread, would go ahead and make that or do I set it up and you do the magic to make it sticky?

Now I will go back and look at the replies (which I have seen for the first time by the way, yesterday was very confusing and most times when I looked there was the guy riding the donkey though once or twice the real starting post appeared but with none of the comments).
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Old 11-24-2012, 10:00 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfastness Testing Project Discussion

Bill,
We'll have to keep our that this thread stays intact.

You can start the thread and I'll make it a sticky for you.

I remember the guy with the donkey because he was painted in either acrylic or oil (lots of impasto showing along with the canvas) and I was wondering about that because I know you are a watercolorist.

Sylvia
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Old 11-24-2012, 10:08 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfastness Testing Project Discussion

Thank you all for your responses and Tred I think your UV glass test would be an excellent variation though we might want you to add a few very lightfast paints as controls just to get a better sense of the possibilities.

Susan, I think you are probably right that we set up a new post with detailed instructions for the project (is this a project???) that then acts as the clearing ground. Sylvia is going to act as moderator (thank you, thank you Sylvia) and we'll want to get her input since she understands the workings of Wetcanvas far better than I do.

Quote:
Note: Bill has started a thread with the instructions where the test photos and results should be posted. See it here in a sticky at the top of the LZ Forum.

Comments and questions should still go in this thread until Bill starts another one.

So, let's use this thread over the next few days to collect up participants and think about how to go about organizing and then when we have that sorted out we'll start the offical registration thread??

So for example Sandra suggested in her Holbein Aureolin thread a different testing method that might be easier for people. She has created her swatches on what amount to be bookmarks, cut those in half, pasted the one half in the window and then put the other half in a drawer. It fulfills the requirements as far as I can see but does require some kind of organization of those drawer bookmarks.

So ideas, comments, organizational suggestions, at the moment I am thinking that for tracking purposes I will set up a spreadsheet and then worry about how to report out.

By the way I am not concerned about lots of people doing the same manufacturer's colors, the more the merrier and the more likely we can come up with a valid result (but don't start talking statistics!!!).

Also as to the windows available for testing, Yes a south facing window is to be preferred as it will gather the most light possible in that particular location. However next in preference would be an east window I suspect as it might get more light than a west window in the same location BUT not a real issue, we would still be getting good information even if the person was using a north window where there is no direct sunlight, it would provide interesting information. If we have enough people, which is what crowdsourcing is all about we might have all the directions covered and find out interesting stuff.
Bill
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Last edited by painterbear : 11-24-2012 at 12:07 PM.
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Old 11-24-2012, 10:10 AM
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Re: Watercolor Lightfastness Testing Project Discussion

Yes Sylvia, watercolor to the core and I was mildly amused to see that an acrylic post had managed to wander into the Watercolor Learning zone but then it only shows how playful the Wetcanvas gremlins really are!!!
Bill
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