Using other people's photos to create traditional art?

[kraemouse]

I have always wondered what the rules are on using photo's taken by other people as references for paintings or drawings? When I want to paint something (or in my case-- usually someone) I just google search it, take whatever images suit my taste, and start drawing/painting. I don't think I've ever painted a scene from my mind.. I simply don't operate that way, and I dislike working from life (especially in the case of painting people.. Eeek) Anyway, my question is, is the integrity of my work being compromised, and am I breaking any rules here? I feel I'm taking images and making them my own, but who knows how a photographer would feel about it. I havn't sold my work, but I want to make sure that if I'd ever like to, I'd not be getting in trouble.


Edit: I did just find the article about this, but I am still pretty confused about it all.

[Black Spot]

I remember reading an article about an artist who did covers for Time. He got a ton of photos and learnt how to draw that face from any angle, so when he came to do 'his' piece he drew it fresh.

You might want to read http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shepard_Fairey Fair use can be a very muddy puddle.

[Yorky]

Basically you need the photographer's permission as their photographs are copyright. Most photographers will give permission if approached.

Otherwise you have to use copyright free photos.

Doug

[kraemouse]

Well dang, that sucks!

[Greg Long]

Originally Posted by kraemouse

Well dang, that sucks!

Not from the viewpoint of the artist who owns the image you are using as your own. How would you feel if someone was in effect stealing your work? Photography is an art form too.

[Azure Wings]

Part of being an artist is learning how to do it yourself. Take your own photos! It's much easier and less expensive now than ever, with digital cameras.

It's not okay to steal someone else's image. If they give you permission, then it's okay and it's not stealing.

Karen

[mariposa-art]

I am forever pimping DeviantArt's stock photography:

http://browse.deviantart.com/resources/stockart/

There are rules, though. You have to have a DeviantArt account (free to set up) and you have to abide by the rules each photographer gives for the use of their stock. Usually that's credit when posting the art on your blog (or here, or wherever). Sometimes they're more strict, like you can't post the art outside of DeviantArt, but most of the time they want credit and they don't want you to make big bucks (like selling a ton of prints) without asking them first. (But it depends. ALWAYS look for the photographer's rules before using the photo as reference.)

I've approached a lot of DeviantArt stock photographers to ask about using their photos for sale (in galleries and art shows) and never has anyone refused. My impression is that these photographers are aware that most people use their stock photography for Photoshop manipulations, and while some of these Photoshop manips look nice, there are sooooo many of them and not all of them are that . . . good. So when a bonafide "traditional" artist (painting in oils, watercolors, acrylics, etc, as well as digital tablet artists) approaches them, my experience is that they are thrilled! Thrilled! So don't be afraid to approach photographers offering stock photography to see if you can use their photos. Be sure to have a few good pieces in your DeviantArt gallery first, so they can see that you're a traditional artist. I think that really makes a difference.

Again I emphasize, always give respect to the photographers. A while ago I caught out an artist who was using a stock photographer's work and not crediting them. I ratted the artist out to the photographer, since I felt more loyalty to them (they're a favorite photographer) than to the artist. I have no idea what happened with that, but I felt it was very dishonorable to stiff a photographer of credit, when that's the only payment they're asking for!

[EyeSpy]

It's never okay to copy someone else's work without permission. Artists are within their rights to come after you, legally.

Take your own photos, as Karen suggested, above. That way the work will be definitively yours -- instead of trying to make it your own.

Doesn't WC also have a reference library?

[MattOKC]

If the image was shot by an amateur, I simply ask permission and offer a monetary honorarium for the use, and have never been declined. In fact, most even refuse my financial offer and tell me to just go for it. In one case I found a photo in an online news article and was able to track down the photographer, who told me that I had his complete permission but was astonished that his photo had been found in the web magazine, since they had actually never contacted him for consent! So he was cool with me using his image, and furious with the source in which I originally found him.

I also purchase personal use licenses for professionally-shot photos. This only works, however, if you buy the photos from a broker like smugmug which intends to sell usage rights (you buy the image download and usage rights, usually for around $30 per image). If the photo is just in a magazine or something, forget it--the process of getting permission is so complex it's just about impossible. Use the image for personal practice use, but don't sell the work.

[Greg Long]

Originally Posted by kraemouse

I don't think I've ever painted a scene from my mind.. I simply don't operate that way, and I dislike working from life (especially in the case of painting people..

kraemouse, If you are painting people, don't forget to ask their permission both in regard to painting and photographing if you take the photos yourself.

[Yorky]

For UK landscapes check out Geograph, for historic US photos check out the Library of Congress Flickr site, they are all creative commons.

Doug

[Horsa]

You can probably get away with using other people's photos as references if you are not copying any elements of the photos. That is to say if you are painting a picture of a lion and use many photographs to determine what the eyes, nose, paws, coat colour, etc of a lion look like, but do not copy any one lion photograph.

I will often google as many images of my chosen subject as I can, study hem, then turn off the computer and do my drawing, composition, etc. Then if I need to fill in or adjust a particular detail it's back to the references again. This way I try to avoid directly copying any particular reference.

I have also had great success in asking photographers for permission to use their photos as references. Generally even when I have permission I try not to just copy the photograph.

[wynpotter]

Since this is posted in the business sub forum, kraemouse, what would you do if someone walked into your booth at a craft fair or gallery, took a piece of your work, walked out and said nothing,
How about the fellow that downloaded music illegally to his Ipod and was fined something like $5000 a song
If no one values or understands personal ethics then none of these posts will mean anything.

If you like the picture, get a camera, learn how to use it. Pay the expense of going there to that location, wait till the time and setting is what you like, take the picture, then it will be yours.

Wyndham

[CSForest]

Originally Posted by mariposa-art

I am forever pimping DeviantArt's stock photography:

http://browse.deviantart.com/resources/stockart/

Problem with using stock photos is, if a dozen other artists also use that image, then your art looks like someone else's. You want your art to be unique and original. If you can't take your own pictures then at least change what you use enough so it looks like your own. An exact image is copyright protected automatically. But a photographer can't copyright something more general like a concept or a pose. If you like the pose of a person in a photo, use the image as reference for a pose. But change the person enough to make it your own. Change the hair color and style, clothing, facial features. The photographer should be able to look at your painting and not recognize his/her photo in it. Even when I have permission to use a photo I don't like to copy it exactly. Photos aren't usually perfect, especially the ones photographers are willing to give away. They don't give away, or even sell rights to, their best work. You usually need to fix something. Move a deer's leg or ear that's crossing another, fix the lighting, change the background, etc.

Another thing to consider is not all people on DeviantArt are honest, or at least may not know copyright laws. They could be sharing images in the stock photo section that aren't actually theirs and they may not have permission to use. But you wouldn't know. It's just always better to get your own reference.

[Black Spot]

On the positive side Google like you to use their street view. http://billguffey.blogspot.co.uk/200...t-view-as.html