i just don't GET the point of a "focal point"

[maryinasia]

I love the primary and secondary focal point in your heading:

i just don't GET the point of a "focal point"

[bobc100]

Originally Posted by ann chavez

...my "eye" darts around the painting, it doesn't follow any particular path. ... my "eye" never "rests" in a painting.

I guess it's a matter of taste. I usually don't want my attention to just move around randomly or to move constantly without the variation and time to ponder that the occasional pause brings to the experience.

I like to think of my experience of a painting as a journey in which my attention travels along paths from one destination to another. In a realistic painting, this journey occurs both across the surface of the image and through the space being represented. Keep in mind, of course, that these the paths can be created by compositional elements in many different ways and that they are never anything more than suggestions which allow for a great deal of variation. This is what makes the journey through a successful painting a novel and exciting one no matter how long we look at it. The artist, of course, need not be aware of any of this when instinctively creating a composition, but the fact that they aren't aware of creating and orchestrating my journey doesn't make it any less real to me.

In most cases I find it more interesting when my journey travels from destination to destination rather than just moving randomly about. This gives the painting a sense of purpose and structure. It is more interesting still when these destinations vary in importance, thus providing a richer journey and a more complex purpose and structure. There are, of course, always exceptions in art and there are many paintings I consider successful which don't follow these guidelines (most of those, however, achieve their success from the way they intentionally choose not to include focal points).

[ann chavez]

mary in asia--that's a good one!

bobc100--thank you for your comments. very well put. more for me to ponder.

the reason i have been desperate to figure out "what is a focal point?" and "why?" is that when i'm painting, i don't think of focal point, but i'm constantly plagued by the knowledge that i SHOULD. i SHOULD be making one area of the painting more focused, more contrasty, more dramatic, more interesting/intriguing, etc than the rest of the painting. but i can never figure out WHICH area SHOULD be that. i guess i thought that if i knew WHY a painting needs a coi/fp, then i could purposely include one in my paintings.

with what i've been given on this thread, i will certainly be better able to experiment with making fps/cois. it's a lot to think about, and i really appreciate all the feedback.

[Yorky]

For some good info on composition see these tips by Barbara Simmons.

Doug

[ann chavez]

that website looks marvelous! thanks, doug!

[maryinasia]

cool website!

maybe there's more than one way to draw the viewer into the picture.

[Avena Cash]

Cute drawing, although I actually think that in this picture this viewer stays with the boy's head. That area including the hand and head becomes the focal point because the rest of the image has little going on, so the eye hardly travels.

[Horsa]

Originally Posted by Use Her Name

Anyone who does any kind of creative work sees the importance of a "Focal Point."

The title of this thread alone is enough to disprove this statement.

I have seen many works of art that do not seem to have a single "focal point". Where is the focal point at Alta Mira, Lascaux, or Chauvet?

Interestingly none of the books I have read on Chinese Brush Painting or Sumi-e place much emphasis on having a focal point.

If I crop a painting to different proportions do I change the focal point? If I paint a painting that is entirely gray scale except for one splash of bright colour is that colour the focal point, regardless of where it occurs in the painting?

Is it possible for me to make an interesting work that does not have a focal point?

Does all work have a focal point? If so is there a universal way to find it?

[Horsa]

The red blanket in the bedroom holds my eye because it is the only red in the painting and because it presents an eye of calm, almost boringness amid the chaos of the rest of the painting. Visually it is interesting only by contrast with its surroundings. If one were to take a knife and cut the painting into pieces element by element the red patch of the blanket would be one of the least interesting visual elements if placed on its own against a plain field.

Is this what the story is about?

[WFMartin]

I also believe that there is one fact that is quite relative to the question of creating a center of interest. Almost always when an artist includes a live person, or an animal, or a figure of almost any sort, that usually, and automatically becomes the immediate center of interest.

Often, just a man-made object in an otherwise natural landscape will also become a definite center of interest.

Just a couple of observations.

[Keith Russell]

Originally Posted by WFMartin

It does rather make one wonder, doesn't it? Personally, I am amused by those who perform elaborate post-mortems on old masters' paintings, during which they draw their perceived lines of force, often criss-crossing and intersecting each other in an attempt to prove, both to themselves and others, that the artist was executing some elaborate plan of "eye travel".

I had seen these ridiculous (and often, quite arbitrary) line drawings of "the way the eye moves through the picture" examples for years, and had always thought they were utter nonense--until I attended a workshop given by illustrator Vicent diFate.

He explained composition, focal points, and eye movement in a way that made sense because it was not arbitrary.

I still compose primarily via intuition, but having good "rules" to double check myself, is certainly helpful.

I've seen some paintings totally annihilated by these post-mortem drawings, wondering at the time whether the old master actually performed such profound, pre-painting planning, or whether he just sat down to paint a pretty picture. And, somewhere in that musing of mine also lies the ultimate placing of the point of interest, or focal point.

It is often confusing to me when someone states that you should create lines that lead the eye into the painting from the outer edges. But, what's to prevent these same lines of force from leading the eye out of the painting? Sometimes this is more confusing to me than that of the focal point.

Again, while this, too, can seem arbitrary, there are some simple rules that can work. A figure gesturing away from the center of the picture leads the eye out, and the eye is led along "downward" slopes or angles, in the downward direction. Artists can definitely use such devices to control the audience's gaze.

Yes, something that leads "into" the painting can also lead "out", but there are also definite things that artists can do to lead the eye back into the picture--or take the viewer "out", with no visual way to return.

Hey, just keep paintin', .....and have fun at it. I'm sure those old masters did exactly that.

[Keith Russell]

Originally Posted by maryinasia

cool website!

maybe there's more than one way to draw the viewer into the picture.

The downward-sloping pencil takes my gaze to the lower left corner (for example) and there it remains...The river, as it moves to the lower right does the same thing in the other direction...

[ryansumo]

As an artist learning about composition from a video tutorial that I downloaded was the breakthrough for me. While post mortems of artworks may all be off-base and the artist never intended these sorts of focal points and lines of directions in the first place, I find that I work so much better when I have a focal point to build around. When I don't, I feel like I am striking out blindly and haphazardly, and the results are the same. When I have a focal point and I build a story in my head around that focal point, it clarifies everything for me and I can proceed so much more smoothly.

[La_]

here's a simple, visual demo of putting a scene in the 'proper' spot
golden mean

la

[claude j greengrass]

Originally Posted by ryansumo

As an artist learning about composition from a video tutorial that I downloaded was the breakthrough for me. ...

Can you provide a link to the video tutorial on composition?