Home › Forums › Explore Media › Casein, Gouache, and Egg Tempera › Are Grumbacher Opaque Watercolors as Opaque as Gouache?

Viewing 9 posts - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • June 30, 2018 at 12:44 am #458228
    AnArtist123
    Default

        I’m just learning watercolor and I’m interested in using guoache for painting matte background areas around the watercolor or highlights onto the watercolor.

        I prefer gouache pans as I will only be using this occasionally and pans will likely last longer than tubes.

        I’m considering getting the Grumbacher Opaque Watercolor Pan Set and wondered if it was as opaque as gouache. There isn’t much information available about this set.

        The other option is the Caran D’ache Designer Studio Gouache Pan Set with 14 colors + white. The Grumbacher set has 24 colors + white and includes to metallic colors which might be interesting.

        I was hoping that someone might be able to answer my question about the opacity of the Grumbacher Opaque watercolors. Would the Grumbacher Opaque Watercolor be as opaque as gouache?

        I appreciate any insight.

        June 30, 2018 at 4:17 am #649332
        Yorky Administrator Ormskirk
        Default

            I use Caran d’Ache pan gouache, but the Grumbacher set sounds interesting.

            PS Just did an Amazon search and the set shown only has 12 pans and looks identical to the Caran d’Ache set. It is also much more expensive. Maybe they used the wrong picture.

            PPS Just did a Google and found a Youtube video which indicates there are two layers of pans = 24.

            Doug


            We must leave our mark on this world

            June 30, 2018 at 9:35 am #649336
            AnArtist123
            Default

                Yes, the Grumbacher 24 pan set has 2 stacked trays. Grumbacher also makes a single tray 12 pan set. The 24 pan set is available from Dick Blick for about $20 USD but can be priced higher elsewhere. I have seen the suggested retail price as high as $79.99. Amazon shows one listing for $33 and another for $19 USD.

                Have you tried the Caran D’ache gouache for highlights on a watercolor? Was it opaque enough to make a good highlight?

                June 30, 2018 at 10:54 am #649333
                Yorky Administrator Ormskirk
                Default

                    Yes, the white gouache straight from the tube is OK, but it started using bleedproof white and lately a White Uni-ball 17756000 Posca Extra Fine Tip Marker.

                    Doug


                    We must leave our mark on this world

                    July 2, 2018 at 6:24 pm #649335
                    Kosmon
                    Default

                        I’m just learning watercolor and I’m interested in using guoache for painting matte background areas around the watercolor or highlights onto the watercolor.

                        I prefer gouache pans as I will only be using this occasionally and pans will likely last longer than tubes.

                        I’m considering getting the Grumbacher Opaque Watercolor Pan Set and wondered if it was as opaque as gouache. There isn’t much information available about this set.

                        The other option is the Caran D’ache Designer Studio Gouache Pan Set with 14 colors + white. The Grumbacher set has 24 colors + white and includes to metallic colors which might be interesting.

                        Sets that look identical to the Grumbacher Opaque pan set are available from several manufacturers – I’ve used those by Pelikan, Lyra, and Lukas. I can’t see or feel much difference between them, though the Pelikan seem to show up more than the others in mentions by serious artists.

                        I have the Caran d’Ache studio gouache pan set too, and it is definitely a noticeable cut above those other tempera-cake style paints – not as chalky AND more opaque.

                        I also selected a few pans from the St Petersburg White Nights watercolor line too, opaque colors like Chromium Oxide Green and English Red that supplement the Cd’A palette, and they’re equally as good and as effective.

                        Lukas also makes full pans, and you could probably select some opaque paints from that line instead to good effect.

                        (Check the White Nights and the Lukas 1862 color charts to search out the opaques and semi-opaques.)

                        http://www.nevskayapalitra.ru/eng/brands/white_nights

                        https://www.jerrysartarama.com/images/PDFs/LUKAS-Aquarell-1862-Leaflet-2.pdf

                        Hope you find this useful!

                        Kos

                        Hemmed & Hawn
                        from
                        PERESTRELLO's BOX[/COLOR][/COLOR][/B]
                        Root, Bone, Sticks & Stone
                        July 28, 2018 at 11:23 am #649334
                        ntl
                        Default

                            AnArtist, do you check this thread any more?
                            What did you decide to get–the Grumbacher Opaque Watercolor Pan Set –or the gouache? Are you happy with your purchase?
                            Or did you get something else?

                            July 28, 2018 at 12:00 pm #649337
                            AnArtist123
                            Default

                                I appreciate all of the responses. I asked questions on this forum, on 2 of the watercolor YouTube channels ( The Mind of Watercolor (Scott Mitchell) and Owings Art (Marty Owings) as well as asking Grumbacher/ChartPak directly. I got enough information to determine that the Grumbacher Opaque set was not as opaque as Gouache.

                                Since the 2 sets are not the same media, I ended up buying both sets. After swatching both, the Grumbacher Opaque is more opaque than transparent watercolors with a more matte finish. The Caran d’Ache Designer Studio Pan set is definitely more opaque than the Grumbacher.

                                The Grumbacher pan sets (Transparent and Opaque) are very popular but is not as lightfast as the tube watercolors in either the Grumbacher Academy Watercolor or the Grumbacher Finest Watercolor lines. Surprisingly the Grumbacher Academy line has a majority ASTM lightfast ratings of I, a few IIs and only 2 colors are fugitve (Alizarin Crimson, Rose Madder). Grumbacher Academy also has 15-20 colors that are single pigment.

                                I am just getting started in watercolor and wanted to experiment with the different types of water soluble media. I plan to experiment with the Grumbacher Opaque for matte backgrounds to see how that will make a watercolor subject pop off the page. The Caran d’Ache gouache set will be used to experiment with colored highlights. I know the traditional highlights are white. In computer graphics, there are more options for using colored specular highlights on different materials. So I wanted to experiment with colored highlights on watercolor. Having the premixed gouache colors may help a newbie keep the highlight colors more consistent as well as getting the highlight exoeriments done more quickly. If I like the look, I may start mixing my own colors from there.

                                July 28, 2018 at 12:03 pm #649338
                                AnArtist123
                                Default

                                    Sets that look identical to the Grumbacher Opaque pan set are available from several manufacturers – I’ve used those by Pelikan, Lyra, and Lukas. I can’t see or feel much difference between them, though the Pelikan seem to show up more than the others in mentions by serious artists.

                                    I have the Caran d’Ache studio gouache pan set too, and it is definitely a noticeable cut above those other tempera-cake style paints – not as chalky AND more opaque.

                                    I also selected a few pans from the St Petersburg White Nights watercolor line too, opaque colors like Chromium Oxide Green and English Red that supplement the Cd’A palette, and they’re equally as good and as effective.

                                    Lukas also makes full pans, and you could probably select some opaque paints from that line instead to good effect.

                                    (Check the White Nights and the Lukas 1862 color charts to search out the opaques and semi-opaques.)

                                    [URL=http://www.nevskayapalitra.ru/eng/brands/white_nights]http://www.nevskayapalitra.ru/eng/brands/white_nights[/URL]

                                    [URL=https://www.jerrysartarama.com/images/PDFs/LUKAS-Aquarell-1862-Leaflet-2.pdf]https://www.jerrysartarama.com/images/PDFs/LUKAS-Aquarell-1862-Leaflet-2.pdf[/URL]

                                    Hope you find this useful!

                                    Kos

                                    Thanks for the information on the Pelikan set being similar. I suspected that was true since it looks so much like the Grumbacher pan sets. They are also both made in Germany. The rest of the Grumbach line is made in the US.

                                    Thanks for the information on Lukas and White Nights. too!

                                    July 28, 2018 at 12:05 pm #649339
                                    AnArtist123
                                    Default

                                        Yes, the white gouache straight from the tube is OK, but it started using bleedproof white and lately a White Uni-ball 17756000 Posca Extra Fine Tip Marker.

                                        Doug

                                        I had seen the Uniball pens and wondered if they were comparable to the Gelly Roll white. Thanks!

                                      • Author
                                        Posts
                                      Viewing 9 posts - 1 through 9 (of 9 total)
                                      • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.


                                      Lost your password?
                                      Register