Home Forums Explore Media Watercolor The Learning Zone Q: Journal Books — Hot-Press WC Paper vs heavier Mixed-Media Paper

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  • #480238

    I’m stocking up on journals again, to take with me to museums and zoos for in-the-wild sketching. I have, for most of my previous life, used typical “sketchbook” type pads, with typical “drawing” or “sketch” paper inside. But now I want to be able to do some form of watercolor sketching, so I need paper that can take the wetness. I would like to be able to bring with me a small variety of aquarelle-able crayons, something like a set of Inktense by Derwent or the Caran d’Ache Neo-Art or Aqua-Color, or other brands or styles, and a waterbrush in one or two sizes. That would be for the water-media. But I’ll also have a few charcoal sticks or pencils in HB, B, and 2B; and a few graphite sticks in same, HB, B, 2B, maybe softer down to 4B.

    So I ask your advice. Is heavier mixed-media paper adequate for that kind of usage? I generally think no, it’s not. So, instead, I must get some watercolor pads. But the pads seem to (nearly all of the brands) only come in cold-pressed or otherwise rather rough. I like that for some watercolor effects, but it genuinely interferes with my sketching. With a soft graphite pencil sharpened to a point, I don’t want ultra-bumpy paper, I want rather smooth. It doesn’t have to be like onion-skin, but it needs to “take” pointed graphite the way “sketch” or “drawing” paper would do.

    I’m running into worst-of-both-worlds problems here. Either I can get it really too bumpy, or really too thin, but I can’t find the Goldilocks in the middle, heavy enough but also smooth enough.

    And I really prefer spiral-bound. I can handle the “flat” binding (like Moleskine brand) but I’m usually not extremely happy with it. Wire or spiral suits me much better.

    Suggestions? Or am I seeking the wrong sort of thing? Should I alter my style rather than try to buy media that fits it? Etc.. Thanks for any thoughts.

    -----
    Certified Closet Management Engineer, Slung Watercolor Society of America

    #907356
    Lawrence Fox
    Default

        I use the Stillman & Birn Alpha (100#) or Beta series (180#) notebooks. Available in multiple sizes and either hardbound or wirebound (I have some of each).

        I really like them.

        Soft pencils will sometimes smudge on both but a bit less on the Beta series. I find that light-to-medium washes won’t buckle the paper, but your mileage may vary. They also take fountain pens really well (because I often add notes to the pages opposite the paintings (or on the backs of them) so that they sorta become a journal as well as a sketchbook.

        Lawrence

        Lawrence Fox Thornhill, ON
        “Try not. Do, or do not. There is no 'try.'” -- Yoda

        “ I have never failed; I have, however, found ten thousand ways that don’t work”. :lol: -- Unknown
        See my LinkedIn profile or follow me on Twitter: @TheWizardGuy

        #907353
        Delofasht
        Default

            I second the Stillman and Birn sketchbooks. Those and RendR by Crescent are my only sketchbooks now days. RendR can be used for watercolor, but the paper takes on a gray cast while wet, so it somewhat interferes with being able to tell what is going on, also the paper is fairly light for watercolor work, so it needs to get clipped open or flattened later. I love the variety of sizes and bindings for both of these brands.

            - Delo Delofasht
            #907348

            Make your own. :)

            Char --

            CharMing Art -- "Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art." Leonardo DaVinci

            #907362
            janinco
            Default

                I really like Strathmore’s Mixed Media pads. They’re 140 pounds paper, take watercolor well as long as you’re not doing heavy washes, and are fine for other mediums, too. But they’re not spiral bound (Visual Journals are better if that’s your preferred style).

                I put some drafting tape around the outside edges to keep it from buckling if I’m using water…usually small pieces around the perimeter of the pad every two to three inches or so is enough.

                Jan

                #907372
                teshparekh
                Default

                    You may want to check out Strathmore’s 140lb Watercolor Cold Press visual journals. Paper is acid free and is slightly smoother than typical cold press paper.

                    Thank you.

                    - Tesh Parekh

                    #907357
                    Lawrence Fox
                    Default

                        Tesh:

                        Thanks for the suggestion; I’ve seen them in a few local stores and walked right by them (the cover kinda shouted “for kids” to me) but after checking out a couple of reviews…I may try one out for doodles and swatches.

                        Lawrence Fox Thornhill, ON
                        “Try not. Do, or do not. There is no 'try.'” -- Yoda

                        “ I have never failed; I have, however, found ten thousand ways that don’t work”. :lol: -- Unknown
                        See my LinkedIn profile or follow me on Twitter: @TheWizardGuy

                        #907354
                        D’Lady
                        Default

                            I really like Strathmore’s Mixed Media pads. They’re 140 pounds paper, take watercolor well as long as you’re not doing heavy washes, and are fine for other mediums, too. But they’re not spiral bound (Visual Journals are better if that’s your preferred style).

                            I put some drafting tape around the outside edges to keep it from buckling if I’m using water…usually small pieces around the perimeter of the pad every two to three inches or so is enough.

                            Jan

                            Thanks for this suggestion. I just bought one to try out, as I’ve been looking for something like it.

                            -DragonLady

                            Which would be the bigger waste:
                            your art supplies, or your creative soul?

                            #907365

                            Thanks for the suggestions! I’ve been shopping. I found a few possibilities — at a brick-and-mortar I bought a spiral journal of hot-press watercolor paper by “hand book paper co.” (this is Fluid paper, Speedball is affiliated somehow) and am happy with how it also takes graphic dry media; bought a few different brands’ smaller tablets of heavier mixed-media paper and am not too happy with how they take washes; this includes a Strathmore 184 lb (= 300 gsm) mixed-media paper pad, not SO bad but not like WC paper … seems there are options, but oddly, it’s quite difficult to get (a) smooth surface and (b) seized enough for legit. watercolor washes and (c) gathered together in a spiral or wire or legit. flat-lying binding. Doesn’t exist at Blick (they suggested the Arches 24 sheets of hot-press which you can get in a spiral-bound but it would be over-the-top, I’m thinking, in terms of field journals that are supposed to be down-and-dirty, to pay over $2 per sheet, and anyway it doesn’t come small enough for my nearby museum regulations that allow maximum US legal-sized 8.5 x 14 inches). I’ve never heard of Stillman and Birn, will look-into; and will make sure to double-check Strathmore’s WC cold-press in case they’re smoother than what I assumed, maybe smooth enough for what I want, thanks for the info all!

                            -----
                            Certified Closet Management Engineer, Slung Watercolor Society of America

                            #907355
                            D’Lady
                            Default

                                seems there are options, but oddly, it’s quite difficult to get (a) smooth surface and (b) seized enough for legit. watercolor washes and (c) gathered together in a spiral or wire or legit. flat-lying binding.

                                I’m questing for this, too. So, if you find something great, please do let us all know.

                                -DragonLady

                                Which would be the bigger waste:
                                your art supplies, or your creative soul?

                                #907375
                                Kosmon
                                Default

                                    Note that the wire-bound Strathmore Mixed Media ‘Visual Journals’ are 90#, while their Mixed Media pads are 140#.

                                    That said, they do take watercolor pencil/crayon and light watercolor very well.

                                    Kos

                                    Hemmed & Hawn
                                    from
                                    PERESTRELLO's BOX[/COLOR][/COLOR][/B]
                                    Root, Bone, Sticks & Stone
                                    #907366

                                    Am pretty happy with the Fluid papers in the Hand Book Paper Company that I mentioned, like these (note, you can see the text “hot press” if you zoom the image)

                                    https://www.amazon.com/Papers-Field-Watercolor-Journal-Inches/dp/B07C7TNC3F/ref=asc_df_B07C7TNC3F/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=309807964063&hvpos=1o1&hvnetw=g&hvrand=11466934673874484736&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9025151&hvtargid=pla-636259632936&psc=1

                                    I’ve just tried the Strathmore mixed-media paper that is 184 lbs, but it didn’t excite me. It took a drop or two of water just fine, in the manner that would be helpful for (for example) line-and-wash drawings. I might do a lot of those, so, I might get some of that paper. I could see that the style would be useful for outdoor work anyway, it’s a bit limited in how gew-gaw-mad you go, so that’s helpful in plein aire situations. But sometimes I really want to do a legitimate wash, fully laid on, and even apply different weights and wetness-degrees of paint at periods of time in the lifespan of that wash. This latter method, more along the lines of “traditional watercolor wash” treatment, really wasn’t looking like it would work on the mixed-media no matter how heavy the stock of paper.

                                    I am noticing, however, that the info on Stillman and Birn papers are right up my alley. Check out their website, you’ll see they have a novel way of naming things (lines of paper named alpha, beta, zeta, gamma, etc.), but there’s a good comparison page https://www.stillmanandbirn.com/specs.html which makes clear what each of the Greek letters means. “Zeta” means heavy and smooth. Aha! Despite the fact that their customer-service rep didn’t know these were just what I was looking for, I found them on Blick’s website (Jackson’s, I’ve just learned, is overseas from me, since I’m in the USA, right?) so I might try a few.

                                    -----
                                    Certified Closet Management Engineer, Slung Watercolor Society of America

                                    #907376
                                    w/c nana8
                                    Default

                                        I’ve ordered from Jackson several times–paint, paper and brushes. Shipping is free if you buy some brushes (brush prices are great) and they convert from £ to $ automatically. Free shipping can take a couple weeks, though. I’ve never been disappointed dealing with them. You may find what you are looking for there.

                                        ~ Carol

                                        'We are too prone to engrave our trials on marble, and write our blessings in sand.' ~ Spurgeon
                                        C&C appreciated

                                        #907373
                                        Kaylen
                                        Default

                                            https://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1401823

                                            Kaylen Savoie
                                            https://www.savoieartist.com/
                                            At least twice a year,paint something better than you ever painted before.

                                            #907349

                                            Kaylen, I don’t think our OP is interested in making his own sketchbooks.

                                            I have filled many books of my own making and love using them. I can insert a variety of papers in them for alternative media, various weights and even lined paper for taking notes.

                                            I did price out spiral binding at Staples. I didn’t recommend it in my Art Journaling thread because it was very expensive. I do, however, have a spiral punch and can buy both plastic and wire bindings in various lengths. The problem I encountered was that my machine could not punch through the very heavy cover boards. Had I chosen a softer, thinner material for the covers, I could have spiral bound them.

                                            Even with the increased prices on paper, I can still make my books for less than $10.

                                            EDIT: One of the issues that people seemed to be experiencing was that Arches 140# cp paper was cracking when they folded it. The cord bound books really didn’t seem to work for them. But, tearing the pages to size and using metal rings after punching holes for them was a really good solution. I actually prefer the rings and often buy bigger and bigger sizes as my books expand.

                                            Char --

                                            CharMing Art -- "Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art." Leonardo DaVinci

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