Home Forums Explore Media Watercolor The Learning Zone Non Granulating colours…

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  • #992203
    Abstract Faye
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        Hello everyone….

        Granulating & Non-granulating.

        – is there a magic word, secret sign, number, colour that is/isn’t granulated?

        More than once I have been disappointed painting something to then find the colour is granulating. (or vice-versa) I paint in an expressive way, so can live with it most of the time, but would like to buy more colours and do not feel that I should without a little more understanding of this. I’m currently spending time on the handprint and Jane Blundell sites which are great – but I’d love to find the trick (if there is one) to selecting paint by granulation as well as all the other wonderful things I’ve learned via these sites.

        I appreciate its all about pigments and all the rest of the techy info – but with a limited amount of time to apply to learning this I hoped someone could help me cut to the chase.

        I would really like to include a broad selection of quality non-granulating colours for my next learning fortnight.

        Even a suggestion of one colour that you use that is non granulating would be of great help

        Can anyone help please?

        Thank you
        Faye

        #1210568
        virgil carter
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            The surest and most effective way to determine the characteristics of one’s paints (or paints one may wish to buy) is to simply check the paint manufacturer’s web site and look for the technical characteristics of the paints. Every reputable global paint manufacturer has a web site where the information is listed. The same information is also often found on the web sites of the major watercolor paint retailers, for each brand of paint sold.

            Hope this helps.

            Sling paint,
            Virgil

            Sling paint,
            Virgil Carter
            http://www.virgilcarterfineart.com/

            #1210573
            briantmeyer
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                It is marked on the tubes or on product sheets provided by the maker. It’s also listed on handprint.com which I would rely more on what it says about the pigments than particular brands. ( even thought quite a bit is still valid )

                On that site, the GR column has 0-4 in it, 0 is not all, while 4 is heavily granulating. Then look at your tube and see the pigment code on it, does not have to even be listed as you can assume the pigment is similar. It tends to be the more finely ground staining colors. ( it’s hard to see the heading, it’s the column after the 2 digit “value range” column and just scan for zero’s )

                I also rely on if it’s listed on that site as a top 40 pigment as an indicator of quality. Those are the ones that most here seem to mention the most.

                Note that you might be better off with hot press paper, it has less texture and thus will tend to give you smoother color. You also might want to look at Gouache.

                Thinking Pthalo blue PB15, pthalo green PG7 or PG36, PY154 winsor yellow, PO73 pyrole orange, PR254 pyrole red, PR179 perelene maroon, cadmiums, some quinacridones ( PR209 Quin Red, Quin Magenta ), Dioxazine violet PV23.

                #1210566
                Marcio C
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                    [FONT=Verdana,sans-serif]Here’s a list from Handprint:

                    pigment specific gravity[/FONT] [FONT=Verdana,sans-serif]specific
                    gravity
                    [/FONT][FONT=Verdana,sans-serif]pigments[/FONT] 1.4arylide yellows 1.5diarylide yellows
                    quinacridone violet
                    quinacridone rose
                    indanthrone blue 1.6quinacridone red
                    naphthol reds
                    phthalocyanine blues
                    dioxazine violet 1.7benzimidazolone yellows
                    perylenes
                    perinone orange 1.8pyrrole reds
                    carbon [lamp] black
                    iron [prussian] blue 1.9. 2.0. 2.1phthalocyanine greens

                    #1210567
                    Marcio C
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                        Here’s an even more complete list from Handprint:
                        transparent pigments around the color wheel
                        1 light yellow hansa yellow light
                        hansa yellow mediumm
                        benzimidazolone lemon PY3
                        PY97
                        PY175
                        2 deep yellow raw sienna m,d
                        raw umber m,d
                        quinacridone gold m
                        isoindolinone yellow
                        nickel azo yellow m PBr7
                        PBr7
                        PO49
                        PY110
                        PY150
                        3 red orange burnt sienna m,d
                        burnt umber m,d
                        quinacridone burnt orange
                        pyrrole orange PBr7
                        PBr7
                        PO48
                        PO71
                        4 red perylene maroon m
                        quinacridone red m
                        brown madder PR179
                        PR209
                        PR216
                        5 magenta quinacridone magenta m
                        anthraquinoid red
                        quinacridone rose m
                        quinacridone violet m PR122
                        PR177
                        PV19
                        PV19
                        6 red violet cobalt violet deep m
                        ultramarine violet m
                        cobalt violet m PV14
                        PV15
                        PV49
                        7 blue violet ultramarine blue m,d PB29
                        8 middle blue phthalocyanine blue
                        cobalt blue m,d PB15
                        PB28
                        9 cyan blue phthalocyanine turquoise
                        phthalocyanine cyan PB16
                        PB17
                        10 turquoise . .
                        11 blue green phthalocyanine green BS
                        viridian
                        phthalocyanine green YS PG7
                        PG18
                        PG36
                        12 yellow green . .
                        . neutral . .
                        m varies by manufacturer: see individual paint ratings for transparency in the guide to watercolor pigments
                        d transparent at moderate dilution

                        #1210577
                        shadoj
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                            That’s a useful list of transparent colors. However, several granulate; opacity and granulation are mutually exclusive. Just like transparency can vary depending on how a pigment is processed, so can granulation. Best to check the manufacturer’s transparency and granulation rating for the exact tube you’re thinking of buying.

                            In general, but not as a rule: the “chemical-sounding” (synthetic organic) pigments are non-granulating, while the “mineral/earth” pigments are granulating (many are synthetic, too). A lot has to due with varied pigment particle size — something that tends to happen when roasting & grinding up rocks and minerals, but not when synthesizing a “pure” organic chemical pigment in a test tube (where pretty much all the molecules are identical, or in one of a couple chemical forms). Some pigment manufacturers are able to make granulating colors out of usually non-granulating pigments; this can be done with Phthalo blue to make a paint that behaves like the once-common (but toxic) Manganese Blue. Conversely, some of the “earth” pigments can be finely ground/filtered to a nearly-uniform size, removing most or all the granulation, and possibly making the paint more transparent in the process.

                            Some major pigment families that tend to granulate:
                            – Natural & synthetic earths (siennas, umbers), red/iron oxides, yellow ochres/oxides, various other iron forms (black/brown)
                            – Terre verte (natural green earth)
                            – Viridian
                            – Cobalt pigments
                            – Ultramarine pigments
                            – Manganese pigments

                            Confused yet?! :)

                            Jen

                            #1210574
                            Abstract Faye
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                                Hi….

                                Virgil – thank you, I didn’t realise that they gave all the characteristics so that is really useful to know.

                                Brian – excellent, thanks… and thanks also for your list of suggestions. Really great to have a little shortcut list to checkout.

                                Marcio – wow, thank you so much for the lists… this is superb to refer back to without trying to work out what it all means.

                                shadoj – thanks for the advice and tips there… helpful and much appreciated.

                                I think I have my answers – thanks to the wonderful people here – as always, a great help and support.

                                Thank you all so much
                                Faye xx

                                #1210578
                                shadoj
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                                    Missed some from a major group:
                                    The chromium colors (including cerulean and potter’s pink) are granulating in general. Viridian, mentioned above, belongs to this same pigment family.

                                    Jen

                                    #1210563
                                    karenlee
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                                        Winsor & Newton has well organized info on transparent vs. opaque, granulating vs. non-granulating and staining vs. non-staining in their artist’s watercolor brochures which you might find at a nearby art shop.

                                        #1210562

                                        Handprint is becoming very out of date. Bruce hasn’t updated his site in many years, so any changes in formulation or new pigments will not be addressed. He conducted his lightfast tests in 2004 and hasn’t tested anything since that time with the last updates in 2005.

                                        It’s a shame because the site is a wealth of knowledge.

                                        Dick Blick’s website offers some excellent pigment data for most manufacturers. You’ll have to visit Daniel Smith’s website for their information.

                                        Char --

                                        CharMing Art -- "Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art." Leonardo DaVinci

                                        #1210570

                                        You have a great list of wonderful non-granulating colours:-)

                                        Here are some more great colours that really granulate well. All Daniel Smith. Many are Primateks.

                                        Buff titanium (creamy opaque granulating colour)
                                        Goethite (granulating yellow earth between yellow ochre and raw siennaO
                                        Transparent Red Oxide (Granulating bright earth between Quin burnt orange and burnt sienna
                                        Transparent Brown Oxide warm granulating brown
                                        Transparent Yellow Oxide granulating earth yellow
                                        E.F. Red Iron Oxide – rich granulating burnt sienna earth colour
                                        E.F Brown Iron Oxide – rich granulating burnt umber hue
                                        Indian Red very opaque granulating earth red
                                        Piemontite Genuine very granulating red earth pigment
                                        Green Apatite Genuine very granulating multi hued sap green pigment
                                        Jadeite Genuine very granulating between phthtalo green and perylene green
                                        Blue Apatite Genuine stormy blue grey
                                        Sodalite Genuine deep granulating blue grey
                                        Lunar Black very granulating amazing black
                                        Lunar red rock – very granulating indian red earth
                                        lunar violet and lunar blue – mixed colours with lunar black – interesting but mixtures
                                        Rose of Ultramarine – granulates nicely but a mixture
                                        Imperial purple – mixture again but nice granulation
                                        Potter’s Pink – granulating soft duty pink
                                        Cobalt Turquoise – gorgeous granulating heavy pigment
                                        Cerulean Chromium – opaque granulating blue
                                        Amethyst genuine – deep granulating and sparkly purple
                                        Hematite Burnt Scarlet – granulating burnt sienna hue with other colours visible
                                        Undersea green – mix of ultramarine and Quin Gold

                                        I have loaded many of these on my blog watercolour comparisons but there are more to do so check back in a few weeks.

                                        Cheers, Jane

                                        My Website
                                        My Blog

                                        #1210579
                                        shadoj
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                                            Awesome granulating list, Jane… grouping those pigments, we can generalize a little on their behavior:

                                            Iron Oxide / Earth Group:
                                            Goethite
                                            Transparent Red Oxide
                                            Transparent Brown Oxide
                                            Transparent Yellow Oxide
                                            E.F. Red Iron Oxide
                                            E.F Brown Iron Oxide
                                            Indian Red
                                            Piemontite Genuine
                                            Lunar Black & mixes: lunar violet and lunar blue
                                            Lunar red rock
                                            Hematite Burnt Scarlet

                                            Other Ground-Up/Earth Minerals Group:
                                            Green Apatite Genuine
                                            Jadeite Genuine
                                            Blue Apatite
                                            Sodalite Genuine
                                            Amethyst Genuine

                                            Chromiums:
                                            Potter’s Pink
                                            Cerulan Chromium (also a Cobalt)

                                            Cobalts:
                                            Cerulan Chromium (also a Chromium)
                                            Cobalt Turquoise

                                            Ultramarines:
                                            Rose of Ultramarine (mixture)
                                            Imperial purple (mixture)
                                            Undersea green (mixture)

                                            Variable:
                                            Titanium Buff — varies in granulation by manufacturer, so check the tube/web/brochure!

                                            Jen

                                            #1210561

                                            Generally speaking transparent staining colours are non granulating because of the fine pigment particles.

                                            Doug


                                            We must leave our mark on this world

                                            #1210571

                                            Here’s a paint-out I did for someone of a bunch of Granulating colours, just for reference.

                                            Cheers, Jane

                                            My Website
                                            My Blog

                                            #1210564
                                            karenlee
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                                                Nice job, Jane! I must say I really enjoy working with the Daniel Smith Primatek paints and highly recommend them; can’t beat ’em for granulation.

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