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View Poll Results: Which of the following word groups best describes the group of line directions below?
A) DYNAMIC best describes line #1, ALERT best describes line #2, SOMBER best describes line #3 6 6.90%
B) ALERT best describes line #1, SOMBER best describes line #2, DYNAMIC best describes line #3 72 82.76%
C) SOMBER best describes line #1, DYNAMIC best describes line #2, ALERT best describes line #3 1 1.15%
D)None of these examples accurately match the line types below 8 9.20%
Voters: 87. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-20-2007, 05:30 PM
MikeN MikeN is offline
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by JNick
Scar's face is a more isolated shape, floating in the black of his mane, which gives an impression of instability, of disconnection, of insanity. On the other hand, Mufassa's head looks very stable, being strongly connected to the frame. Scar looks a little like Charles Manson, with that wavy snakey posture. Of course, the eyes contributes to the impression a great deal. Also, the colors in the Scar image are all much cooler, again reinforcing the disconnected feeling, since cool colors tend to recede.

The jagged glass image does cause me anxiety.


Great observatoins Nick, I totally agree.
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Old 08-20-2007, 09:30 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

"vantage point" aka POV is actually one of the most crucial choices for film. The focus for "Scar" is the eyes which seem almost disembodied because of the high contrast.



and lest we forget...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJn_jC4FNDo

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Old 08-21-2007, 11:53 AM
MikeN MikeN is offline
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by zcdz
"vantage point" aka POV is actually one of the most crucial choices for film. The focus for "Scar" is the eyes which seem almost disembodied because of the high contrast.



and lest we forget...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CJn_jC4FNDo

Ziska

Great comments! That video is crazy lol. I wonder how much is accurate in regards to the law. I hear soo many different variations.
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Old 08-21-2007, 03:35 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

I get my copyright info from the graphic artist's guild www.gag.org

Caveat I am not a lawyer. I am not a copyright lawyer. I am just someone in the visual arts trying to hang on by my well bitten fingernails....

The video is pretty spot on- especially in they way they characterize the Mouse and copyright.

Z
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Old 09-21-2007, 11:29 AM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

I have a question regarding the original theory presented in this thread.

Would a landscape orientation itself be a resting/rested base and a portrait be more alert? I realize this is a very general rule of thumb, but would that be a good place to start when composing a painting?

This thread has really had me looking and analyzing.
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Old 09-22-2007, 11:28 AM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Sometimes you can think of landscape *as* portraiture.

http://time-blog.com/looking_around/...edrich_006.jpg
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Old 01-08-2011, 09:20 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Mike, this is a very interesting thread. I am fascinated with this kind of subject. I have also found studying eye movement direction very interesting. I think that it is very interesting how line and shapes evoke feelings and moods. I also find the whole concept of symbols and archetypes very intriguing. What all information how you found out regarding various shapes. For example, you were mentioning how triangular shapes evoke a sense of calmness and stability. What emotions or characteristcs associated with personality have you discovered regarding other shapes, circles, elipses, squares, rectangles and even more complex shapes?

I think that this is a very informative and productive thread. It would be great to visit with you on these topics sometime. By the way, have you done much study into subliminal advertising and similar subjects?

Thank you and the rest of the folks that have contributed to this very worth while study.
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Old 02-21-2011, 04:05 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Mufassa drawn like a rock solid. A triangular form rising from the base, stable with a dynamic background that emanates from him. He has the superior position and looks down his nose at you. Raised eyebrows, “what do you want” he does not think much of you and is close to a sneer, but not.

Scar is in a circular spiraling, twisted and complex set of forms. Made of soft forms, yet sharp teeth and claws and even nostrils lay in wait. The lime green on yellow eyes are acidic. Drawing you into his mad playful but deadly game. His delicious pink tongue like a Popsicle makes you lick your teeth feeling for the flavor. The background is a diffused rock with edges that re-enforce the fragmented angles of this fragmented soul.

I find Scar and this drawing more interesting because it is more tricky.
I may get a little carried away with this But I sense it is all there even the head tilt is coy.
Mike
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Old 03-01-2011, 12:35 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Thanks very much for posting that great assessment and critique of the two lion pictures. I really enjoy seeing how shape and color is interpreted by different people. Most people do not have ability to communicate it as well as you have.

I think your comparison is very good. Yes, the first figure takes on a very stable look because of the triangle and other factors. The perspective of the viewer is below which causes him to look important. It seems like I remember seeing a picture or video of Nixon that was from more of a bird's eye view that was very unflattering.

I remember looking at what I believe was the first televised presidential debate between Nixon and Kennedy. It is interesting to see how nicely Kennedy stood out from the background in his dark suit. In contrast, Nixon had on a middle toned suit and virtually blended into the background. In addition, the five oclock shadown on Nixon seemed compounded on black and white television.

The way the second figure's head is turned creates a look of tension and instability. Also, the pattern in the background mirrors this same angle. Because of all of the curves and angles, he seems unstable, and unpredictable. In addition to evoking feelings of danger however, I think there is a certain charm or magnetism of the bad lion like the serpent in the garden with less subtility. The line directions as well as the center placement of the eye creates a gravitational pull that draws the viewer directly to his sinister gaze.

I would enjoy hearing your comments on some of my painting compositions sometime. I think that these kinds of comments can be very insightful and helpful in creating a very specific emotions and feelings in a work of art.

Thanks again for your comments,
Keith
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Old 03-03-2011, 08:46 AM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Here is a link to Henry Rankin Poore book on composition it is a free download from Google books there are more books by him also. I highly recommend them. Scott McCloud's "Understanding Comics- The invisible Art" is a clear well articulated book on the formal elements of art found in comic as well as as visual arts. I was surprised by this gem of a book. You can find used copies on line at reasonable cost.
Keith I checked out your site it looks like you chose your compositions by recognizing a good image. That's a good ability. Do you adjust them for rhythm or flow? The relationship between symbolism and composition is a tricky one. I'm sure you have to deal with it all the time. I enjoyed my visit to your site.
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Old 03-03-2011, 09:35 AM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Color was used for mood too. Mufassa is all warm ochres, colors that imply stability and warmth and comfort - firelight or red soil, nature, in landscapes these colors are very appealing to people. Scar leans strongly toward violets, including cartoonish violet eyeshadow under his stylized jagged eyebrows. Both of them are well composed.

Scar's lines are dancing back and forth in a fascinating way, the design of the drawing supports his complex character and conveys something of the style of his charisma. He was a Svengali of a cat in the story, talking his natural enemies into becoming his followers. So he's compelling in a different way.

The triangle shape of Mufassa's head and shoulders seems very mountainlike, while Scar's head, shoulders and paws weave snakishly. So there's a sense of stability and power with Mufassa and a sense of stealth and complexity with Scar.

Neither image is symmetrical but Mufassa implies more symmetry, the asymmetry of Scar's features is another disturbing factor the artists introduced. In a 3/4 view a completely symmetrical face gets asymmetry and becomes a more pleasing abstract. Mufassa has the best light and the best portrait pose in that clip. Scar's seen face forward and has some serious asymmetry - being a cartoon of course, he's not a collection of deformities but a constant fluid boneless motion.

I don't recall Scar's jaw being offset to the right in every pose but it's extreme here. That's anthropomorphic - a human can do that with his lower jaw but a cat really can't. My first reaction was "deformity" because I'm too familiar with cat anatomy but when I moved my own mouth, I realized it was just in a category with the Bela Lugosi-Tim Curry eye shadow.

I was curious about the poll and didn't expect so many others to agree with my answer - that was pretty cool.
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Old 03-04-2011, 05:24 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Quote:
Originally Posted by mburrell
Here is a link to Henry Rankin Poore book on composition it is a free download from Google books there are more books by him also. I highly recommend them. Scott McCloud's "Understanding Comics- The invisible Art" is a clear well articulated book on the formal elements of art found in comic as well as as visual arts. I was surprised by this gem of a book. You can find used copies on line at reasonable cost.
Keith I checked out your site it looks like you chose your compositions by recognizing a good image. That's a good ability. Do you adjust them for rhythm or flow? The relationship between symbolism and composition is a tricky one. I'm sure you have to deal with it all the time. I enjoyed my visit to your site.

I checked out your site too. You are very talented. You work has a real strength to it at the same time it has nice flow and is inviting. I also like the overall look of your website. Thanks for the book recommendations . They sound exactly like the thing I enjoy reading.

Yes, I probably obsess over the compositions too much at times. It's difficult often to balance the more intitutive of what feels and seems right with other compositional planning. I usually spend quite a lot of time thinking about the subject and mood of a picture and then try to make that work compositionally. Often I end up going in a very different direction as I begin developing the composition.

Yes, in paintings that are highly symbolic or allegorical, there are other elements that have to be factored in besides the normal compositional decisions. There have been paintings that were pretty difficult to compose that I would have thought would have been easier. There have been some in which themes and other aspects were more complex but seem to just flow into place from the beginning. It's tough to predict which ones will come easier.

I often get my wife or others somewhat involved in the composition process. I get them to look at a still life display for example and try to listen to the way they describe how they "feel" regarding various objects or elements of the set up. Some of the conversations are pretty similar to a lot of comments in this thread regarding the two lion characters. I will ask a lot of strange questions regarding the subjects and composition. For example does this object/section seem peaceful/happy/sad etc? Or does this section of the painting seem more masculine or feminine?

I believe that objects even like a vase, fruit, drappery or any object has archetypal and symbolic characteristics. I try to keep these things in mind when trying to unify the whole design with various components that may consist of dualities and other contrasts.

As Robert brings out, color is also an important element in creating harmony as well as mood and emotion. I think that this is often one of the first things that a person responds to when viewing a piece of art. I think that color like most any thing else on a sybolic or psychological level can be either positive or negative. For example, white can represent purity and innocense, but at times may come across as sterile and cold. A blue color depending upon the context could evoke feelings of peace, serenity and relaxation on the other hand could seem sad and depressing. That's why I think that it's good when planning a painting to go through a lot of basic questions about the piece in order to see if the emotion/thoughts and moods that are coming across as intended.

Keith
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Old 06-20-2011, 11:28 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

When I choose composition, it's almost always vertical. Someone once told me that's because I'm an upbeat person who sees life thru rose colored glasses (that comment was because of color choices). And I tend to agree with their assessment...I tire of the horizontal composition...just too relaxing. The paintings tend to become serene. Recently I gravitate to a square canvas most of the time...something about working in the round on a square appeals to me. Not sure what that says yet!

Voted in the poll with the other majority votes...but would add that the diagonal line doesn't seem that dynamic to me...just moreso than the other two. In an abstract demo once, I drew upright lines across the canvas and ask the group what do you see. Without hesitation they all replied....trees. I then added a swatch of color horizontally and looked at the group. They all guessed....water...a lake and trees. My first color was red and the second was purple so that had nothing to do with choices. The directional lines were simply mentally suggestive.

Interesting thread...thanks!
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Old 11-12-2011, 12:14 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Much of what is covered here in this thread is in Rudolf Arnheim's Art and Visual Perception. It makes for bedtime reading. Going through this thread is more stimulating and more likely to be retained in my brain for future use.
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Old 11-12-2011, 01:52 PM
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Re: Visual Associations and communication

Wow! New here, but I am impressed with this thread.....I am a painter with many years of experience, but this treatise on line signifigance in composition causes me to look at work, my own and others' in a completely new perspective.
Than you!

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