Home Forums Explore Media Oil Painting The Technical Forum Artist vs Student Grade Paints

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  • #474177
    3igAnt
    Default

        Hello,

        What is your oppinion about the difference between student and artist grade oil paints.

        I have almost 19 tubes of student grade oil paints which I bought over a course of 10 years. Most od them are Rowney and Van Gogh paints. Now a days, artist grade oil paints like Rembrandt, Mussini, Schmincke draw my attention but I do not know if it really worths the investment.

        I do not know if the difference in high amount of pigment load in artist grade paints really have an impact on the painting itself. If it has at what level? For example I would like to paint faster without having a need to glaze over an area to make it more vibrant and bold in color. Would artist grade paints help me about this? I would like to convey the idea on my mind with a single brush stroke so that it will conver the canvas without needing a second coat.

        What artist grade paints would you recommend?

        Thanks.

        #838810
        alpha101
        Default

            Hello,

            What is your oppinion about the difference between student and artist grade oil paints.

            I have almost 19 tubes of student grade oil paints which I bought over a course of 10 years. Most od them are Rowney and Van Gogh paints. Now a days, artist grade oil paints like Rembrandt, Mussini, Schmincke draw my attention but I do not know if it really worths the investment.

            I do not know if the difference in high amount of pigment load in artist grade paints really have an impact on the painting itself. If it has at what level? For example I would like to paint faster without having a need to glaze over an area to make it more vibrant and bold in color. Would artist grade paints help me about this? I would like to convey the idea on my mind with a single brush stroke so that it will conver the canvas without needing a second coat.

            What artist grade paints would you recommend?

            Thanks.

            I’m a big fan of Gamblin. Their organic pigment paints are very good at glazing, though, I generally don’t glaze.

            #838844
            Pinguino
            Default

                Now, where have I seen this question asked before?

                #838811
                timetobe
                Default

                    It is an important and popular question often asked on WetCanvas. Searching the oil forum will provide you with past conversations.

                    Also, I suggest you google “oil paint artist vs student”.

                    David

                    [FONT="Georgia"]Painting the world a better place.
                    #838857
                    Richard P
                    Default

                        I am doing paint testing at the moment of student and artist oil colours. I started a thread in this forum about it. Results to follow as paints dry. :)

                        #838775
                        ppeace
                        Default

                            I don’t use student grade. I like old holland and grumbacher. Grumbacher is very economical in comparison-pigment to oil value.

                            But there are certain old holland colors I cannot live without.

                            #838782
                            Anonymous

                                What artist grade paints would you recommend?

                                I like Winsor Newton and Utrecht.

                                #838772
                                WFMartin
                                Default

                                    You will seldom be able to determine whether a painting has been created with student grade, or artist grade paints by looking at it.

                                    The difference is in the handling of the paints, with the lower-pigment, student grade paints being just a bit more difficult to control.

                                    With oil paints, the differences between student grade, and artist grade paints is not nearly as great as with some other mediums, such as watercolors.

                                    But, there is a noticeable difference between the two, however slight. The student paint is just a bit more difficult to control, and you may need to apply more layers of paint in order to build up the color that you want. It is nice to be able to squeeze a paint from its tube onto the palette, and to be able to use it pretty much as it is, for most effects. Some paints are formulated to make that easy, and some make it more difficult.

                                    The goal is to try to select a paint that will handle well, while also exhibiting a degree of covering power. Some expensive paints, such as Old Holland, can be as much of a handling problem because of its stiffness, as a student grade can be because of its thinness. Paints that fall somewhere between can actually be easier to work with than those at either extreme.

                                    Grumbacher is a good choice, as well as M. Graham. I would recommend either of them, and their prices are usually reasonable for the quality of paint. The quality of paintings may all appear to be the same, but the it is the ease of creating the painting that is important to the painter. One’s life should be made EASIER by their selection of materials, rather than more difficult.

                                    However, as a last suggestion, I’d recommend that you try to use up those tubes of student paint, anyway. Mix it with some higher quality paints, or use it by itself for a few paintings. Because of its lower pigmentation, you’ll find that you will tend to go through more student paint than the higher quality paint. But, that’s a good thing if you are trying to use up those tubes of paint.:)

                                    wfmartin. My Blog "Creative Realism"...
                                    https://williamfmartin.blogspot.com

                                    #838849
                                    Raffless
                                    Default

                                        Sometimes student paints are better for your requirements.

                                        Less saturated(good for lower chroma paintings)
                                        Freedom from waste worries(creative spirit unleashed).

                                        #838838
                                        JCannon
                                        Default

                                            I hope I won’t annoy anyone by repeating opinions/observations made in other posts.

                                            Although pro-grade paint is (almost) always better, student grade is usually acceptable (and, in the opinion of some, preferable) for certain highly-concentrated pigments: Diox purple, the pthalos, Mars earth colors (PR101), Anthroquinone red (PR177, the most common Alizarin Crimson substitute), yellow ochre made with PY42. I don’t use black very often, so student grade usually serves my purposes there. If you can find a PV19 in a student line, go for it. It’s always nice to have a quin in your collection.

                                            But for certain colors, it really is best to go pro. My personal “go pro” list would include Cad red, Cad Orange, Cad yellow — hell, just about ANY yellow — Mauve, Ultramarine, Cerulean, and the umbers. Life is easier if you have at least one high-quality very dark umber. Most prefer Burnt umber. Also, I buy a pro-quality Prussian blue, even though that pigment is very strong. It’s just a color I love.

                                            I have an old ultra-cheap Titanium White, which is surprisingly decent. But most of the time, you’re probably better off shelling out a little extra for white.

                                            I also consider it a good idea to collect as many variants of Naples Yellow as you can find. The formulations always differ from brand to brand (except for the few companies that produce REAL Naples Yellow.) Sometimes, the student NY will be more useful to you than the pro version.

                                            Winton and Gamblin 1980 are good student paints, in my experience. I’ve never tried Van Gogh but some here speak very highly of it.

                                            Utrecht, M. Graham and Winsor & Newton offer good pro-quality Cads that won’t break the bank. In these pages, I’ve often recommended Richeson Shiva, the cheapest of the pro lines. They are particularly good in Ultramarine and other blues, as well as their earth colors.

                                            If you’re intrigued by “snob” paint — Old Holland, Harding, Maimeri Puro and so forth — I can only suggest that you look for one color that really “sings” to you, a color that most other brands don’t carry. Shell out the required 30 or 40 or 50 bucks. Yes, it’s an indulgence. Afterward you may decide that it wasn’t worth it; On the other hand, you may want to go 100% snob for the rest of your life.

                                            #838839
                                            Michael Lion
                                            Default

                                                Although pro-grade paint is (almost) always better, student grade is usually acceptable (and, in the opinion of some, preferable) for certain highly-concentrated pigments: Diox purple, the pthalos, Mars earth colors (PR101), Anthroquinone red (PR177, the most common Alizarin Crimson substitute), yellow ochre made with PY42. I don’t use black very often, so student grade usually serves my purposes there. If you can find a PV19 in a student line, go for it. It’s always nice to have a quin in your collection.

                                                But for certain colors, it really is best to go pro. My personal “go pro” list would include Cad red, Cad Orange, Cad yellow — hell, just about ANY yellow — Mauve, Ultramarine, Cerulean, and the umbers. Life is easier if you have at least one high-quality very dark umber. Most prefer Burnt umber. Also, I buy a pro-quality Prussian blue, even though that pigment is very strong. It’s just a color I love.

                                                I agree with this advice, except for the word “better” which is pretty subjective. Student grade paint almost always has less pigment load. So stick to strong colors like phthalos, dioxazine, lamp black, earth colors. Never use a student yellow, yellow is a very expensive pigement, even the Hansa Yellow PY74 is an expensive pigment, so student yellows are so weak that they are almost useless. Even the cheap “artists” brands like Grumbacher dilute their yellows with fillers.

                                                Earth colors: people will pay a lot of money for exotic natural earth colors from expensive brands that aren’t any more powerful than a cheap student-quality earth color.

                                                I don’t understand the advice about umber, I never use it. Maybe umber is needed by people who are black phobic, but mixing any earth color with black gives you an umber-like color. Having three non-umber earth colors, plus ivory black and mars black is kind of like having six different umbers at your disposal. And by the way, Mars Black is a color that is not sold in any student line because it’s more expensive than lamp black, so there’s an example of why you need to buy artist-quality sometimes.

                                                #838858
                                                Richard P
                                                Default

                                                    And by the way, Mars Black is a color that is not sold in any student line because it’s more expensive than lamp black, so there’s an example of why you need to buy artist-quality sometimes.

                                                    It is in some student lines: Maimeri Classico and Jackson’s Artist Oils (UK) have it.

                                                    #838840
                                                    Michael Lion
                                                    Default

                                                        It is in some student lines: Maimeri Classico and Jackson’s Artist Oils (UK) have it.

                                                        I was not aware of that. But I’m sure it’s a mars black mixed with a lot of cheap fillers and not a super powerful and opaque mars black.

                                                        However, as a lot of artists don’t seem to want a super-powerful and opaque black, they could probably save money by buying the student mars black instead of Old Holland ivory black.

                                                        #838859
                                                        Richard P
                                                        Default

                                                            No all of them are totally opaque (I tested with backlighting)

                                                            #838813
                                                            3igAnt
                                                            Default

                                                                Thanks for the answers alot.

                                                                Well, I have almost all the basic colors. Here I write the list of colors I have below.

                                                                Today I bought two tubes of Maimeri Artisti Zinc Whites. I chosed that because titanium white has a very powerful tinting stregth and I wanted something low in tinting streght. I mostly like to paint seascapes and I thought zinc white is a better option for sea and sky painting.

                                                                I chosed Maimeri Aristi because they were in discount and also I read that Artisti is a better quality paint about pigment load. I assumed that if I tint my student grade paints, atleast this zinc white would alittle bit uplift the total pigment amount in the mixture. Maybe it is not correct but I just thought like that. Do you think it is correct?

                                                                And the quality of the art ceation titanium white is really not good. When I try to mix paint in it, It feels like so synthetic and IMO not fun to work with. I hope this new Maimer Artisti Zinc White will have a more organic feeling.

                                                                Below is my list of paints.
                                                                >Do you think that, are there colors which will be better to change with artist grade colors?
                                                                >Or maybe missing colors that I must buy for better mixtures?
                                                                >Or maybe colors that must be ommited and not needed to make my color collection more balanced and more simple.

                                                                I am almost got used using them. Some are so easy to work with and some are really hard to control and need to get accustomed to. After a while the ones that are hard to control become more predictable and esasy to handşe. But if I replace some of them the life about painting will become easier, I would like to give it a try.

                                                                To tell the truth I am triyng to learn painting on my own. I try to do this on and off for a long while. I think +15 years. But learning curve was slow due to lack of time. But for the last 2-3 years I am more serious about oil painting and I learned alot during this time. I experiment, paint, read articles, watch you tube videos and observe and imagine as much as I can. I try to do my best to learn to paint as good as I can on my own. But you know, I need alot of help and this paint quality issue is a question for me. But now I understand better.

                                                                Blues
                                                                1-Ultramarine blue – Van Gogh series 1
                                                                2-Phthalo blue – Art Creation
                                                                3-Cobalt Blue – pebeo
                                                                4-Celeste – Maimeri Classico

                                                                Yellows
                                                                5-Cadmium yellow – Van Gogh series 2
                                                                6-Cadmium orange – Van Gogh series 2
                                                                7-Naples yellow – Van Gogh series 1

                                                                Reds
                                                                8-Vermillion red – Schmicke Akademie
                                                                9-Magenta – Pebeo

                                                                Geens
                                                                10-Cobalt Green – Scmicke Norma seriea 2
                                                                11-Vridian Green – Winsor and Newton
                                                                12-Phthalo Green – Rowney

                                                                Earth Colors
                                                                13-Burnt sienna – Van Gogh series 1
                                                                14-Raw umber – Rowney
                                                                15-Raw sienna – Rowney
                                                                16-Burnt umber – Rowney
                                                                17-Yellow Ochre – Rowney
                                                                18-Indian Red – Rowney

                                                                Blacks
                                                                19-Ivory Black – Rowney

                                                                Whites
                                                                Titanium white – Art creation
                                                                Zinc White – Maimeri Aristi

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