WetCanvas
Home Member Services Content Areas Tools Info Center WC Partners Shop Help
Channels:
Search for:
in:

Welcome to the WetCanvas forums. You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions, articles and access our other FREE features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please visit our help center.

Go Back   WetCanvas > Explore Media > Colored Pencil
User Name
Password
Register Mark Forums Read

Salute to our Partners
WC! Sponsors

Our Sponsors
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16   Report Bad Post  
Old 01-30-2018, 01:51 PM
Meisie's Avatar
Meisie Meisie is offline
A Local Legend
Living on the Island....
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,429
 
Hails from Canada
Re: Derwent Lightfast

__________________
Charne
Website & Blog - Reflections
Prints
Reply With Quote
  #17   Report Bad Post  
Old 01-31-2018, 12:46 PM
marksmomagain marksmomagain is offline
Veteran Member
western New York
 
Join Date: Dec 2012
Posts: 701
 
Hails from United States
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Quote:
Originally Posted by KarenESP
I wish we still had American Prismacolors... oh well, that and a dollar eight five will buy me a small cup of coffee.

Karen, I have several thousand of the old American Prismacolors. You can bet that I cherish them greatly..
Reply With Quote
  #18   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-01-2018, 03:33 AM
tiago.dagostini tiago.dagostini is offline
Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,563
 
Hails from Brazil
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Quote:
Originally Posted by vanity
Correct me if I'm wrong but FC products tend to do rather poorly in most lightfastness tests...


Yes I have works in Polychromos with 12 years that get quite a lot of sunlight during part of the day that are pristine as new.

Tests are just hat.. artificial tests. The chemical behavior is completely different, not just faster when you hang the product in a massive super exposure for hours in a row compared to normal light exposition that real works would fare.
__________________
"no no! You are doing it all wrong, in the internet we are supposed to be stubborn, inflexible and arrogant. One cannot simply be suddenly reasonable and reflexive in the internet, that breaks years of internet tradition as a medium of anger, arrogance, bigotry and self entitlement. Damm these internet newcomers being nice to to others!!!"

"If brute force does not solve your problem, then you are not using enough!"
Reply With Quote
  #19   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-02-2018, 02:54 AM
vanity's Avatar
vanity vanity is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 515
 
Hails from Poland
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Quote:
Originally Posted by tiago.dagostini
Yes I have works in Polychromos with 12 years that get quite a lot of sunlight during part of the day that are pristine as new.

I have few paintings that include fluorescent pigments that have yet to break down (or so I *think* ) but that would not make me dispute well established claim that they are fugitive; If I did so, I would be entering anecdotal evidence territory and it's never a good thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tiago.dagostini
Tests are just hat.. artificial tests. The chemical behavior is completely different, not just faster when you hang the product in a massive super exposure for hours in a row compared to normal light exposition that real works would fare.

Maybe so, however, I fail to see how tests being "artificial" invalidates any of the findings... I can also see enough results overlap to assume that they are fairly accurate.

Finally... Every artist-grade art supply is expected to be labelled in a certain way and have other qualities in order to be considered such. If there is any logical reason based on the actual research as to why *artist grade* colored pencils are an exception, I'd love to hear it.

To me this is an extremely important issue and I could say much more about it, but this post is already long enough and a bit OT
Reply With Quote
  #20   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-02-2018, 09:00 AM
tiago.dagostini tiago.dagostini is offline
Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,563
 
Hails from Brazil
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Considering the term lightfast is in the title of the post, it is not OT at all.

The point is artificial tests do not translate linearly to real world condition. Its is what we call in math in as a non rigid transformation between the 2 spaces of solutions. All high energy particle interactions have that characteristic.

The only thing you can say is that under THOSE conditions of the test, that specific pencil fare that much better than that other pencil on same conditions. If pencil A fared 3 times better than pencil B, you cannot infer with high certainty that it would still be 3 times better in a more normal light condition (it could be even better or far less of a difference).

That is something people must keep in mind, ratings are about a specific scenario and you might want to consider them as a HINT for other scenarios.. but do it on your own risk.

We will only be sure of how long modern pigments last in real light conditions when enough time has passed with them exposed to real light conditions.
__________________
"no no! You are doing it all wrong, in the internet we are supposed to be stubborn, inflexible and arrogant. One cannot simply be suddenly reasonable and reflexive in the internet, that breaks years of internet tradition as a medium of anger, arrogance, bigotry and self entitlement. Damm these internet newcomers being nice to to others!!!"

"If brute force does not solve your problem, then you are not using enough!"
Reply With Quote
  #21   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-02-2018, 09:53 AM
vanity's Avatar
vanity vanity is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 515
 
Hails from Poland
Re: Derwent Lightfast

I'm sorry, but given that similar results occured a number of times/in most tests I've seen conducted, it is probably safe for to assume that they may likely be translated to "real world" conditions. What you said is also likely true but misses the point that I was trying to convey almost entirely. Additionally, if I had to choose between making assumtions basing on existing data or dismissing all the available information simply because it might not end up being applicable in some theoretical, unverifiable scenario then my choice will be obvious...

Last edited by vanity : 02-02-2018 at 10:00 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #22   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-02-2018, 11:27 AM
tiago.dagostini tiago.dagostini is offline
Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1,563
 
Hails from Brazil
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Quote:
Originally Posted by vanity
I'm sorry, but given that similar results occured a number of times/in most tests I've seen conducted, it is probably safe for to assume that they may likely be translated to "real world" conditions. What you said is also likely true but misses the point that I was trying to convey almost entirely. Additionally, if I had to choose between making assumtions basing on existing data or dismissing all the available information simply because it might not end up being applicable in some theoretical, unverifiable scenario then my choice will be obvious...


And that is what data scientist are for and why they are so well paid.. to make people not take that "obvious "path.. But feel free...
__________________
"no no! You are doing it all wrong, in the internet we are supposed to be stubborn, inflexible and arrogant. One cannot simply be suddenly reasonable and reflexive in the internet, that breaks years of internet tradition as a medium of anger, arrogance, bigotry and self entitlement. Damm these internet newcomers being nice to to others!!!"

"If brute force does not solve your problem, then you are not using enough!"
Reply With Quote
  #23   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-02-2018, 05:20 PM
Dcam's Avatar
Dcam Dcam is online now
A WC! Legend
NorthWest NJ.
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 22,096
 
Hails from United States
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Would the new UV resistant sprays such as Krylon "fine art" fix make a difference? Is it always light that causes fading.....or also deterioration of the pencil pigment?
Sorry, I know a lot about paint, but not so much CP.
Reply With Quote
  #24   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-03-2018, 09:04 AM
Dcam's Avatar
Dcam Dcam is online now
A WC! Legend
NorthWest NJ.
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 22,096
 
Hails from United States
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Anyone??????
Reply With Quote
  #25   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-03-2018, 01:24 PM
Meisie's Avatar
Meisie Meisie is offline
A Local Legend
Living on the Island....
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 5,429
 
Hails from Canada
Re: Derwent Lightfast

I would expect they would make a difference however I would always add a clear disclaimer to a client with regards UV and other dangers. From what I've heard it is light that causes fading. I've heard of instances where the colour can shift from fixatives too (typically pinks & purples) so a test is always a good idea before you spray. Many cp artists spray their finished pieces routinely, both to preserve and to seal against any possible bloom. And of course if framing without glass it would be an excellent idea to seal the work.
HTH!
__________________
Charne
Website & Blog - Reflections
Prints
Reply With Quote
  #26   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-03-2018, 01:31 PM
Dcam's Avatar
Dcam Dcam is online now
A WC! Legend
NorthWest NJ.
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 22,096
 
Hails from United States
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Thanks Charne I use "Fine Art" spray by krylon and then a good acrylic varnish.
Hate glass.
Reply With Quote
  #27   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-03-2018, 02:20 PM
frida's Avatar
frida frida is offline
A Local Legend
Toronto
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,028
 
Hails from Canada
Re: Derwent Lightfast

I went from Krylon to Winsor & Newton, and I am not a professional, but ALWAYS fix my finished CP work...! Those who are actively selling use more and more UV glass on their frames.

On Amazon I can see Prismacolor, Spectrafix, Sennelier, a Prismacolor "by Grumbacher". Grumbacher also has its own fixative, and there are more. Probably the price has something to say about their quality?
__________________
Raquel

Boldness commands the eye, but nuances hold it there. Margot Schulzke
Reply With Quote
  #28   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-03-2018, 02:29 PM
frida's Avatar
frida frida is offline
A Local Legend
Toronto
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 5,028
 
Hails from Canada
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Lascaux is one I was trying to remember, recommended by selling CP artists...
__________________
Raquel

Boldness commands the eye, but nuances hold it there. Margot Schulzke
Reply With Quote
  #29   Report Bad Post  
Old 02-03-2018, 02:54 PM
Dcam's Avatar
Dcam Dcam is online now
A WC! Legend
NorthWest NJ.
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 22,096
 
Hails from United States
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Raquel: Lascaux is probably the Best of all, but will break the bank. Unusually expensive and you really need a mask or lots of ventilation.
Reply With Quote
  #30   Report Bad Post  
Old 06-25-2018, 03:44 PM
XpP's Avatar
XpP XpP is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 154
 
Re: Derwent Lightfast

Derwent product page is up on their website: https://www.derwentart.com/en/gb/7958/lightfast-pencils.


Leaflet is here: https://www.derwentart.com/a/341027.

Colour Chart is here: https://www.derwentart.com/a/341034.


But only 36 in range?
Reply With Quote

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:20 PM.


© 2014 F+W All rights reserved.