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  #46   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-23-2009, 07:15 AM
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Colorix Colorix is offline
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

Why, certainly! The fact that the left pear is potatoe shaped doesn't matter, as it gives variety and lets the other pear stand as the star of the show. Now, it is only the shape that is similar to the root-bulb, the texture, colour, and how it reflects light is pure pear. I think Greene sometimes uses papers, and sometimes the sanded papers. Wouldn't surprise me if he primes boards himself. He pays meticulous attention to all parts of a painting, so he'd have brought the rumpled cloth to a much higher degree of finish. The handling of the cloth looks too unfinished, and is therefore distracting, as the forms do not flow into each other smoothly. I'm not familiar with his techniques, but my guess is that he has a very light hand, which enables multiple layers. Or, his collection of pastel sticks is so vast that he can choose a stick with the perfect match of colour. (I know that is true, he has tons of sticks.)

With the right combination of papers and sticks, and the right pressure of the sticks on the paper, you'll be able to layer a lot.

Do post in the Pastel Studio Gallery, people will love your work! The handling of the pears and the values are very fine!

Charlie
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Old 12-23-2009, 03:41 PM
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

Thank you, Charlie.
I believe I'm confusing myself by wanting to imitate more than one artist's style. I like the layering technique of Daniel Greene and at the same time likes the looseness of Harley Brown's strokes. This pear is more of Harley's style. The cloth was intended to look unfinished and just to give the impression that it's a cloth.
Anyway, I've posted a couple of my works in the gallery forum. Feel free to check them out and give your critiques.
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Old 12-24-2009, 03:29 PM
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

Quote:
Originally Posted by straycat27
Thanks, Charlie.
Can you critic on the technique?
I know the one on the left looked like a potato.
That was my first attempt on Canson MT.
I have a few more and some of them trying to imitate Daniel Greene's style of layering, in vain of course.

The one that is shaped like a potato looks like a real pear. My daughter bought some pears for me to paint a few months ago and one of them had that potato-shape. They vary in interesting ways. It looks real, if you had chosen pears with exactly the standard pear-shape it would lose something. I like it that it's smaller and less shapely.

Especially if you're working from real fruit, go with its irregularities as they are. It always looks better than idealizing it.
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Old 12-26-2009, 12:27 PM
sketchZ1ol sketchZ1ol is offline
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

hello. I have been to a few of Mr. Greene's demos in person. At that time, he worked on Canson Mi Tientes paper with a tint he decided was best to compliment the model's skin tone. He put several papers underneath to cushion the top paper.
Charlie, yes, his collection of pastels is vast. Interestingly, he drafted out his reference points, lines, proportions with a sharpened Nupastel stick (Van Dyke Brown, I think) in the first 20 min sitting, and used others throughout the demo. His touch was quite varied.
Straycat-I'd suggest you get some good charcoal (medium and/or soft) and a pad of Strathmore 400 or 500 white paper to work on with the charcoal. You can teach yourself a lot about touch/pressure and with a stump or folded tissue get more knowledge about touch, + blending. General's Charcoal pencils (2B,4B,6B) would also be good to have.
Not to toot my horn, but my latest pic/post in 'WIP-what would you do?' shows a variety of pressures=results on paper.
Hope that's all helpful. Ed
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Old 12-28-2009, 05:37 PM
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

sketchZ1ol
Quote:
hello. I have been to a few of Mr. Greene's demos in person. At that time, he worked on Canson Mi Tientes paper with a tint he decided was best to compliment the model's skin tone. He put several papers underneath to cushion the top paper.
Charlie, yes, his collection of pastels is vast. Interestingly, he drafted out his reference points, lines, proportions with a sharpened Nupastel stick (Van Dyke Brown, I think) in the first 20 min sitting, and used others throughout the demo. His touch was quite varied.
Straycat-I'd suggest you get some good charcoal (medium and/or soft) and a pad of Strathmore 400 or 500 white paper to work on with the charcoal. You can teach yourself a lot about touch/pressure and with a stump or folded tissue get more knowledge about touch, + blending. General's Charcoal pencils (2B,4B,6B) would also be good to have.
Not to toot my horn, but my latest pic/post in 'WIP-what would you do?' shows a variety of pressures=results on paper.
Hope that's all helpful. Ed
Thank you, Ed.
Mr. Greene is a very good instructor. I watch his video over and over again. I don't work with oil but I intend to get his video as well.

As for the cushion, I watched Ramon Kelly saying it's better not to have it at all and easier to really put down the pastel on the paper. I guess I have to experiment it myself and see which suits me better.

Mr. Greene's video was made in 2002 and he already has more than 3000 pastels that time. And he has been using the same taboret for more than 30 years! AMAZING.

Ed, I started with charcoal but have been using charcoal powder mostly. I vary my strokes in finger blending. Here's the latest that I've done with the medium and the other version was tinted with the tinted charcoal.





robertsloan2
Quote:
Quote:
Originally Posted by straycat27
Thanks, Charlie.
Can you critic on the technique?
I know the one on the left looked like a potato.
That was my first attempt on Canson MT.
I have a few more and some of them trying to imitate Daniel Greene's style of layering, in vain of course.

The one that is shaped like a potato looks like a real pear. My daughter bought some pears for me to paint a few months ago and one of them had that potato-shape. They vary in interesting ways. It looks real, if you had chosen pears with exactly the standard pear-shape it would lose something. I like it that it's smaller and less shapely.

Especially if you're working from real fruit, go with its irregularities as they are. It always looks better than idealizing it.
Thank you, Robert.
I don't work from life, but I did take the picture of these fruits.
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Old 12-28-2009, 07:42 PM
sketchZ1ol sketchZ1ol is offline
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

hello. whoa! Nice work Robert! :thumbs up:
To come back to the original post; papers/supports have their individual character. How the pastel is applied to the surface seems to be an underlying issue (pardon the pun).
I've enjoyed being a part of this discussion. holiday wishes to all, E
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Old 12-29-2009, 06:34 AM
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

Robert (straycat), beautiful portraits! The tinted charcoal one is amazing, I had no idea it could be that beautiful, the charcoal, thanks for the treat!

The 'big' guys get full sets given to them, so no wonder they have so many! I read an article by Greene where he talks about his sticks and his way of sorting them. Mind-spinning, if you're not as meticulous. I toss a few nubbins into a box, and make do with some 200+ of them, planning to slim down that palette as it is too extensive...

Charlie
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Old 12-29-2009, 08:15 AM
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

I'm still somewhat of a beginner using pastels. I've found that I like the brown kraft/recycled paper the best and then if I need something to paint on more durable, I use mat board. Yup, you read right, mat board. I prefer smooth surfaces than rough.
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Old 12-30-2009, 05:00 PM
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Re: what a difference a paper makes/beginner

sketchZ1ol
Quote:
hello. whoa! Nice work Robert! :thumbs up:
To come back to the original post; papers/supports have their individual character. How the pastel is applied to the surface seems to be an underlying issue (pardon the pun).
I've enjoyed being a part of this discussion. holiday wishes to all, E
Thank you, Ed.
Happy New Year to all.


Colorix
Quote:
Robert (straycat), beautiful portraits! The tinted charcoal one is amazing, I had no idea it could be that beautiful, the charcoal, thanks for the treat!
Thank you, Charlie.
I find the tinted charcoal pencils too hard, harder than most hard pastels. And I also believe one can achieve the same effects using pastel. But I'm flattered that you find it beautiful.
Quote:
The 'big' guys get full sets given to them, so no wonder they have so many! I read an article by Greene where he talks about his sticks and his way of sorting them. Mind-spinning, if you're not as meticulous. I toss a few nubbins into a box, and make do with some 200+ of them, planning to slim down that palette as it is too extensive...
hahaha..it's probably part of advertisement. But I agree with you. He stated in his video that he has to look into his storage just to find a particular color.

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