Home › Forums › The Learning Center › Color Theory and Mixing › looking for a replacement for Cad yellow light
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October 17, 2018 at 12:31 pm #463489
Opaque, probably, or add white (or other opaque) to a transparent yellow?
Thanks.October 17, 2018 at 12:45 pm #713072Have you seen Utrecht’s advertisement for their Cadmium replacement colors? Haven’t tried them, but my understanding is that (unlike other “hue” colors) they are supposed to emulate not ony the hue, but the mixing qualities and opacity.
Lately I’ve added Nickel Titanate (PY53), which is definitely yellow (rather than lean orange or lean green), and is fairly opaque. I’m using Gamblin’s paint, but some other manufacturers have it. It does not have as much chroma as Cadmium Yellow, but its chroma can be boosted with something else that lacks the opacity. I added PY53 because I got tired of having to mix Titanium White with one of my transparent yellows, when I needed something opaque. I don’t use Cadmium.
October 17, 2018 at 2:27 pm #713067Thanks. No, I’ll go look… That does look good.
I have several tubes of transparent yellows, and am in learning/practice/studies mode right now.October 18, 2018 at 9:49 am #713065Bismuth Vanadate yellow, PY184 is a good lightfast yellow color to replace Cadmium Yellow light. It has reasonable opacity.
For cheap Cadmium Yellow HUE you can also try to use PY74 or PY3. Add Titanium White to boost opacity.October 18, 2018 at 11:25 am #713074PY184 would indeed be a good choice. In fact, it is the main ingredient in Utrecht’s “Cadmium-Free Yellow Light.” The difference is that the Utrecht color has a touch of PY110 and whites, apparently intended to match the hue and mixing performance of real Cadmium Yellow Light. If you instead try the Cadmium-Free Lemon Yellow, it is PY184 mixed with some white.
Also: Above, when I described PY53 as not leaning its hue, I was not quite correct. It does lean very slightly green, rather like a “lemon yellow” color. So does PY184, I believe.
PY53 is considered to be non-toxic, although it does get a California Prop 65 warning. PY184 can be toxic in industrial uses and with long-term exposure, but not in ordinary artistic usage; however, that is enough caution to forbid usage in my environment.
October 18, 2018 at 11:54 am #713077I would use PY42 (Yellow Ochre/Oxide) where you can as it’s super cheap, extreemly lightfast and very opaque. Then where you need higher chroma you could use a more transparent yellow over a white base.
October 18, 2018 at 12:25 pm #713063Is’t Bismuth Vanadate yellow, PY184 a heavy metal as well?
Would is be considered any safer?
Seems to be just as expensive as Cad. Yellow.Just asking …
October 18, 2018 at 1:03 pm #713075Is’t Bismuth Vanadate yellow, PY184 a heavy metal as well?
Would is be considered any safer?…A very good question, so I did a little research. The underlying issue is bio-availability, which can be in terms of ingestion, skin or eye contact, or dust inhalation. The last of these is of importance in industrial use and paint manufacture, but of little importance to artists unless you like to sand the paint layers.
Bio-availability will depend on the compound itself, plus the tendency of the compound to release things such as metal ions into the surroundings. And, it will depend on whether the bad stuff can be absorbed by humans and migrate in the body to some place where it will do damage. The damage may be short term (poisonous), or long term (carcinogenic. etc.).
Cadmium is both extremely toxic and carcinogenic. The Cadmium compounds used in artist paints have low bio-availability; if they didn’t, then Cadmium would not have been allowed for so many years. But the Cadmium compounds are not entirely un-available, and the dust is particularly bad. Thus, Cadmium is gradually being eliminated from many applications.
Turns out that (in general), Bismuth is much less of a problem than Lead or Cadmium. For example, Bismuth Subsalicyclate is the active ingredient in Pepto-Bismol, which is swallowed.
Vanadium can also cause problems, but they are unlikely, and primarily caused by dusts.
Note that some metal compounds, containing Zinc, Copper, and Iron, are nutritive in sufficiently low doses, and poisonous in sufficiently high doses. Thus, adults taking an Iron nutritional supplement (rarely needed) are warned to keep it away from children, because a slight overdose for adults (no harm to adults), is toxic to children.
When I looked for an opaque non-Cadmium yellow, I gave some thought to the new Utrecht paints. Might still try some, in the future. Or I could buy straight PY184 in another brand. But I chose PY53 because I like single-pigment paints, and it is less chromatic (my desire) than PY184.
October 19, 2018 at 4:37 pm #713060AnonymousFor a Cad Yellow sub, I have used Utrecht’s Cad Yellow Hue which is a pretty light yellow and is rated opaque.
October 20, 2018 at 12:32 am #713068Thank you all. Not sure what I’ll do, I don’t mind the cadmiums. For now, I will work with the yellows I do have and add white.
October 20, 2018 at 1:12 am #713079Hansa Yellow (same as Windsor Yellow,if using W&N). It’s a little greener than the cad yel light.
I’ve tried to find a replacement for Cad Yellow Light because of $$, but I found none. Hope your luck is better.
October 22, 2018 at 2:46 pm #713064For a Cad Yellow sub, I have used Utrecht’s Cad Yellow Hue which is a pretty light yellow and is rated opaque.
Huh? Is this a typo? From Blick’s site:
Utrecht Artists’ Oil Colors
02122-4355 — Cadmium Yellow Hue
This color contains the following pigments:PY37—Cadmium Yellow
PW4—Zinc WhiteOctober 22, 2018 at 9:39 pm #713061AnonymousI have seen Blick make a couple of mistakes and that looks like one,
the tube has always listed the pigments as
PY73- Arylide yellow
PW4- zinc whiteOctober 23, 2018 at 6:43 am #713059A big advantage of Bismuth Yellow (PY 184) over Cadmium Yellow (PY 35) is that Bismuth is weatherfast. This means you can expose it to the elements without any major problems. If cadmiums are exposed to moisture and light at the same time, they start to fade.
October 23, 2018 at 11:36 am #713062I have seen Blick make a couple of mistakes and that looks like one,
the tube has always listed the pigments as
PY73- Arylide yellow
PW4- zinc whiteI was impressed by the price of that Cad. Hue with REAL Cadmium in it!
I thought it was a typo – otherwise I’m buying a ton of that.
Still it looks nice.
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