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Old 12-11-2018, 08:19 PM
phil alvirez phil alvirez is offline
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oil or acrylics-which 1?

whats the advantage of each 1?
1-acrs dry too fast; oils take forever.
some need something that is not too fast, but that we dont have to wait too long.
2-now there are fast oils (alkyds), and slow acrs (dont know the name of the chemistry).
so, which 1 works for you?
differences between brands, if more than 1 on each type?
so far i have seen that are several alkyd brands, but only 1 slow acr (golden open), but may be others.
any1 who has experienced both?
comments, sources?

thanks.
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Old 12-12-2018, 02:49 AM
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

You can try Acrylic for underpainting and then use Oil paint on top. Acrylic underlayer dries fast, while oil paint do not sink in acrylic. That gives time economy and very good longevity to painting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z2fMcRkTYWs&t=640s
He did acrylic underpainting for oils.

Last edited by Gigalot : 12-12-2018 at 02:52 AM.
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Old 12-12-2018, 07:32 AM
phil alvirez phil alvirez is offline
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

thank you very much for the idea and the example.
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Old 12-12-2018, 07:33 AM
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

I agree with the above.

I like acrylics if I use flow enhancer and matt medium so they flow better and I can glaze, scratch through etc etc etc

Previously I only really used them for underpainting as oils could do so much more for the way I paint - soft diffused edges where I needed them, which aren't easy with acrylics and water, you need to use a medium.

I love Griffin Alkyd oils for their fast drying, I don't want to wait days/weeks to be able to glaze and work over layers.
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Old 12-12-2018, 08:55 AM
phil alvirez phil alvirez is offline
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

thank you for your insight. great way to use them.
am curious about: "flow enhancer and matt medium"
could you provide links or exact details on them?
names, brands, sources...
additives are sometimes the solution.
thanks again for your comments.
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Old 12-12-2018, 09:07 AM
yakker0117 yakker0117 is offline
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

Following.
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:45 AM
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

I use Gamblin Oils. They aren't fast drying but you can use a fast drying medium like Galkyd to speed up the process.
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Old 12-12-2018, 10:49 AM
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

I like Ateliar Interactives for my acrylic painting. I can get oil like edges with it quite easily.
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Old 12-12-2018, 02:41 PM
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

I might suggest you try using plain old oils for one or two paintings, without any fast-drying mediums, just to see if you like it. There's a joy to oil painting that is unique to the medium.

My oil paints don't take "forever" to dry. They're mostly dry to the touch in a week or so, even without fast-drying mediums, regardless of the brand I use. (I use all sorts of brands, though I lean toward more buttery consistencies: M. Graham, Rembrandt, Winsor & Newton, Michael Harding, Gamblin.)

I like that time frame because it gives me a few days to paint wet-in-wet if I want, or to wait a bit longer and do something more like glazing. But I almost always like having the option to adjust while the painting is still wet. My drawing, colors, composition, values etc are rarely perfect after my first go! I know one can just paint over acrylics, but they don't give you the option of wet-in-wet, and that's a very nice option.

If I am indeed done with wet-in-wet, then yes, I put a painting aside for a week or so and work on something else. I think this is good for developing skill. Better to work on many paintings in a year than just one magnum opus. As Kevin McPherson says, we should aim to start 500 different paintings. Oil painting encourages this by encouraging us to set things aside, try something new, then come back to the first painting.

In sum, I have nothing against acrylics. But why not try the pure oil experience first?
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Old 12-12-2018, 02:52 PM
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

Quote:
Originally Posted by phil alvirez
thank you for your insight. great way to use them.
am curious about: "flow enhancer and matt medium"
could you provide links or exact details on them?
names, brands, sources...
additives are sometimes the solution.
thanks again for your comments.

just do a search on youtube and there are bound to be demos

flow enhancer you mix one part to ten parts of water. It delays drying time by 10 minutes, allowing you to achieve softer colour transitions and gives you more time - very transparent.

Matt medium (there is also gloss) gives you 10 minutes or so to push the paint around before it dries and enables brilliant glazes of colour, including light over dark, which you can scratch through and move it around.
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Old 12-12-2018, 05:05 PM
phil alvirez phil alvirez is offline
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grotius
I might suggest you try using plain old oils for one or two paintings, without any fast-drying mediums, just to see if you like it. There's a joy to oil painting that is unique to the medium.

My oil paints don't take "forever" to dry. They're mostly dry to the touch in a week or so, even without fast-drying mediums, regardless of the brand I use. (I use all sorts of brands, though I lean toward more buttery consistencies: M. Graham, Rembrandt, Winsor & Newton, Michael Harding, Gamblin.)

I like that time frame because it gives me a few days to paint wet-in-wet if I want, or to wait a bit longer and do something more like glazing. But I almost always like having the option to adjust while the painting is still wet. My drawing, colors, composition, values etc are rarely perfect after my first go! I know one can just paint over acrylics, but they don't give you the option of wet-in-wet, and that's a very nice option.

If I am indeed done with wet-in-wet, then yes, I put a painting aside for a week or so and work on something else. I think this is good for developing skill. Better to work on many paintings in a year than just one magnum opus. As Kevin McPherson says, we should aim to start 500 different paintings. Oil painting encourages this by encouraging us to set things aside, try something new, then come back to the first painting.

In sum, I have nothing against acrylics. But why not try the pure oil experience first?

thank you for your advice. when i started painting, it was oil. for a long time. but not wet on wet. and i do several paints at same time. recently am learning to paint fast because i want to try plein air. hence my quest. so far i have tried golden open (slow acrylics) and also have tried w&n griffin alkyd (fast oil) and still have not decided which fits me best. but would like to hear for as many as possible personal experiences. and as there are many options with all kinds of additives, it is great to hear from all of you. keep the input coming!
and again, thank you all for so great advice.

Last edited by phil alvirez : 12-12-2018 at 05:12 PM.
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Old 12-12-2018, 05:10 PM
phil alvirez phil alvirez is offline
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

Quote:
Originally Posted by vhere
just do a search on youtube and there are bound to be demos

flow enhancer you mix one part to ten parts of water. It delays drying time by 10 minutes, allowing you to achieve softer colour transitions and gives you more time - very transparent.

Matt medium (there is also gloss) gives you 10 minutes or so to push the paint around before it dries and enables brilliant glazes of colour, including light over dark, which you can scratch through and move it around.

thanks for your ideas. and, yes, i have been searching. but still would be good to hear from all of you what you use and where you get it. would you?
and, what is the 'flow enhancer'? who makes it? is that the name to look for? who sells it? what is that '1 part'? of what? matt medium: from whom?
see my point? thanks again.
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Old 12-12-2018, 05:47 PM
JCannon JCannon is offline
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

I think buyers are biased in favor of oil paintings, so one must take that into consideration.

Oils have many virtues and many drawbacks. The main virtue, in my opinion, is ease of blending. Not too long ago, I did a portrait based on a 19th century photo. The bowtie began as a black shape; once the black was dry (a few days), I went in with rust brown paint and molded and shaped it. A photo-real bowtie came together in about twenty minutes. With acrylics, things would have taken much longer.

And when it comes to reproducing skin, there's nothing quite like oil. Hard to explain why.
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Old 12-12-2018, 05:52 PM
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

Most of the basic beginner info you are asking about can be found with online web searches.. And on most of the paint manufacturers websites..

You tube videos can show you how & explain how to use, and what mediums & retarders are.. and the difference between Oils & acrylics..

If you are sensitive to chemicals/odors or have limited space for storing oil paintings, then I'd suggest acrylics..
They can be blended just like oils, but it takes time & studying- Jerry Yarnell on you tube.. shows how he does it and has nice beginners and intermediate videos..
and practice, you can't mix piles of colors and have them sitting a long time like oils..
1 color mix at a time & use that , then next color & use it, so on..

I am trying a small set of Golden Open Acrylics, but not seeing that much difference in dry times, they do seem oilier and leave a shine when applied and left at a slight thickness.
I won't buy those again..


There are sticky threads on each forum topic here that has a lot of basic beginner information.. or use the WC search for flow , mediums ..
Using searches for those will save a lot or typing & trying to explain everything in a post.

These links will help you find some of the forums & stickys above them..
acrylic forum- http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/foru...p?s=&forumid=9

Color Theory and Mixing - http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/foru...?s=&forumid=14
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Last edited by ~JMW~ : 12-12-2018 at 06:06 PM.
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Old 12-12-2018, 06:08 PM
phil alvirez phil alvirez is offline
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Re: oil or acrylics-which 1?

Quote:
Originally Posted by JCannon
I think buyers are biased in favor of oil paintings, so one must take that into consideration.

Oils have many virtues and many drawbacks. The main virtue, in my opinion, is ease of blending. Not too long ago, I did a portrait based on a 19th century photo. The bowtie began as a black shape; once the black was dry (a few days), I went in with rust brown paint and molded and shaped it. A photo-real bowtie came together in about twenty minutes. With acrylics, things would have taken much longer.

And when it comes to reproducing skin, there's nothing quite like oil. Hard to explain why.

couldnt agree more. great comments.
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