Home Forums Explore Media Watercolor The Learning Zone Faber castell Albrecht Durer help me choose single pencils please

Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 19 total)
  • Author
    Posts
  • #993756
    EarlytoRise
    Default

        With a beautiful array of 120 pencils I’m finding it hard to make choices about which particular pencils would be most useful/ versatile. I would like to use them in colour mixing so for those who have them all or know the colours well can you help me out? I have 3 questions:

        1. Which colours (pencil nos or names please) do you think would be best for colour mixing choosing cool and warm reds, yellows and blues.

        2. Which pencils would be best using the CYM system.

        3. Which colours could you simply not do without (favourites for any other reason)

        I don’t have a bricks and mortar shop close enough to me to have real look plus i’m interested in your views. I also don’t have a particular (limited) amount of pencils in mind though hopefully you will help me narrow it down even a little.

        Thanks in advance

        #1246116
        janinco
        Default

            I have a few of the pencils, but only the ones that have higher lightfast ratings. If you’re just using them in a sketchbook that will be closed, then it’s probably not as much of an issue, but I would never use their reds for a regular painting.

            As far as what colors to use, that’s such a personal thing, but in general you can go with the basic warm/cool for each primary and then some of the other colors you think you would use often. Basically the same as choosing a palette for regular watercolor painting (lots of information on that in the handbook).

            This is a link to a PDF of the lightfast rating for their pencils:
            http://www.fabercastell.com/~/media/local/us/Service/color-charts/Albrecht%20Durer%20Watercolor%20Pencils.ashx

            If I were doing much with watercolor pencils I would pay the extra and go with the Caran d’Ache Museum Aquarelle pencils because of their lightfast ratings.
            http://www.dickblick.com/products/caran-dache-museum-aquarelle-pencils/

            Jan

            #1246118
            briantmeyer
            Default

                I am not using that brand, but I use them in conjunction with my watercolor palette. I am using supracolor ones. I only buy a few colors. I am not listing their proper color names which I don’t look at that much, but I am assuming the names in your brand will be different.

                Black and Various Grays and White, these are for utility, and they don’t have a color. The black and gray I hardly ever use, the white is for seascapes. I prefer these to graphite since I can erase them via lifting methods like I would watercolors. These are also good for figuring out values in my sketchbook.

                Then I use the earthy colors. Generally the colors are Yellow ochre ( yellowy ), Burnt Sienna ( orangey ), Burnt Umber ( dark greenish red ). These also are generally more lightfast since earth colors are usually made made from cheap pigments which won’t fade. Sometimes I choose colors which won’t clash with my picture, so something which is going to be bright yellow, I might use yellow ochre. Other times I just like the look that using burnt umber gives.

                I have a blue ( kind of an ultramarine color ) and I just don’t use it that much, but then I tend to mix my intense colors into dull earthy colors anyway, and it just does not seem to work for me.

                My choices, except for the grayscale ones, were mostly paints on my first palette, I just never got viridian. This let me plan things out in pencil and have an idea of the color, but also when I use them with my watercolors, it makes them not be more obtrusive than I want them to be. Lately though I like using the three earth colors to further refine details as a finishing touch, especially on figure drawing.

                I would suggest listing your current watercolor palette, and then choose pencils that match in general color, with some attention to whether they are lightfast, and perhaps mixes you like doing.

                You can probably also mix brands, the Caran d’Ache Museum Aquarelle pencils are a lot higher quality, but I don’t like how soft their leads are which is why I prefer the supracolors. I’d probably use the higher end museum line if I wanted more variety of color, but stick with the supracolor for my three earthy colors.

                #1246115
                indraneel
                Default

                    Thanks Brian! I’ve been wondering for quite some time now on how best to get along with my watercolor pencils. Also, a wonderful painting!

                    #1246117
                    Hoplite
                    Default

                        I take along all my watercolor pencils with me in a case and don’t particularly select out a specific set. As I recall, Liz Steel has listed a limited set she uses…

                        Let me preface the stars (asterisks) lightfast ratings Faber Castell uses.
                        *** translates directly to 7 or 8 on the Blue Wool Scale. Basically, the same as ASTM 1 rating (most lightfast).
                        ** translates to a 5 or 6 on the BWS. ASTM 2 is supposed to be 6 on the BWS, the bottom end of what is considered reasonably lightfast. The trick is, you don’t know what given pencil is a 5 or a 6. Now, if the non-watercolor version of the same FC pencil (Polychromos line) is a three star, it’s quite likely the color is downgraded in thinner wash form, probably to a six, but it’s something you either want to test for yourself, find something that is a surer thing, or just use in a sketchbook that generally speaking isn’t kept open to sunlight. Of the two star pencils listed below, all are three star in non-watercolor form except the Middle Purple Pink.

                        An example on alternatives: while the middle Cadmium Yellow is **, the light and dark versions of Cadmium Yellow (from FC) are both ***. Since it is for sketchbooks, I imagine Liz is more concerned about mixing properties than strict lightfastness. Anyway, her list:

                        Cadmium Yellow 107 **
                        Deep Scarlet Red 219 **
                        Middle Purple Pink 125 **
                        Dark Indigo 157 ***
                        Ultramarine 120 **
                        Permanent Green Olive 167 ***
                        Brown Ochre 182 **
                        Burnt Sienna 283 ***
                        Walnut Brown 177 ***
                        Warm Gray IV 273 ***
                        Cobalt Green 156 ***

                        #1246119
                        EarlytoRise
                        Default

                            Thank you all very much for your speedy replies.

                            I thought these would compliment the polychromos 60 set that I was given at christmas, bit disappointed now that the** are akin to 5-6 on the blue wool scale if I understand you correctly (that’s a revelation to me!) I was intending to use all the polys for final work not just sketchbook now I think I will seperate the **’s and use them for under layers and/or in my sketchbook.

                            Was sorely tempted by the CD museum but put off by the price as I was only seeking to experiment with colour mixing (largely but no exclusively for underpainting) I am abandoning the basis on which I was initially going to make my colour selections as I am persuaded that they might best be used for sketching. I may just chose my favourite colours in the CD even though they wont be an exact colour match to my polys. If I do by any of the FC A Durer’s I’ll remember to stick to the * .

                            Thanks again for taking the time and helping me to to come to a decision :thumbsup:

                            #1246124
                            Minerva C
                            Default

                                I was at first thinking of buying Albrech Durer too but I ended up ordering Museum. They arrived this week and I feel that I made the right decision. They are very nice to use. But look at the star rating on them. There actually is one colour that only has two stars out of five. Some have three.
                                In the Albrecht Durer line it is those with *** that have the highest lightfastness. You only wrote *. 6 and above are considered lightfast on the BW scale.

                                C

                                "It is only when we are no longer fearful that we begin to create."
                                J.M.W. Turner

                                #1246120
                                EarlytoRise
                                Default

                                    Yes of course Minerva you are right about the most lightfast pencils being*** rating on Albert Durer (I was somewhat distracted by my three year old during the time of my last post :)) thank you for making sure I was clear and for the feedback about the museum range. Did you chose singles or opt for one of the sets?

                                    #1246125
                                    Minerva C
                                    Default

                                        I got a bit nuts and ordered the Standard set of 12, the Landscape set of 20 and 21 singles. If the full set of 76 had been available in a cardbord box and not only in an expensive wooden box I would probably have bought it… Good it was not :)

                                        C

                                        "It is only when we are no longer fearful that we begin to create."
                                        J.M.W. Turner

                                        #1246126
                                        Minerva C
                                        Default

                                            These are the colours in the sets.

                                            C

                                            "It is only when we are no longer fearful that we begin to create."
                                            J.M.W. Turner

                                            #1246113

                                            I have a set of the Faber Castel Art Grip Aquarelle… are they considered Student Grade? The Faber Castel website doesn’t offer any specs.

                                            Char --

                                            CharMing Art -- "Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art." Leonardo DaVinci

                                            #1246123
                                            LuckyLaura
                                            Default

                                                Char, as far as I know they are just very good student-grade. This guy said that’s what they are and he reviews a lot of watercolour pencils: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VfHMuGWW5Ro

                                                In this comparison video he did, he rated them 4th out of 9, immediately behind CdA Museum, FC Albrecht Durer, and CdA Supracolour: https://youtu.be/fq2LHoXQ2RU?t=6m7s

                                                #1246127
                                                Minerva C
                                                Default

                                                    I have tried to find lightfastness information without any luck. FC has this information on their chart for Albrecht Durer but not for Art Grip.

                                                    I read a few years ago that FC had blue boxes for their student quality sets and green for their artist quality sets. Could this be true? And red for children.

                                                    C

                                                    "It is only when we are no longer fearful that we begin to create."
                                                    J.M.W. Turner

                                                    #1246128
                                                    Minerva C
                                                    Default

                                                        I found this on FC:s web.

                                                        http://www.fabercastell.com/creative-studio

                                                        Entrance products for young artists.

                                                        C

                                                        "It is only when we are no longer fearful that we begin to create."
                                                        J.M.W. Turner

                                                        #1246121
                                                        EarlytoRise
                                                        Default

                                                            Oooh Minerva thank you for posting those hand drawn colour charts. The Museum pencil colours look quite outstanding even in their dry state (which I’m not usually a fan of) if you feel the urge to do the rest of your new collection I’d love to see those too, lucky you!

                                                            I had a look in my polychromos 60 set to see how many were ** and thankfully there were not too many, only three pencils (a couple of pinks and a purple)

                                                          Viewing 15 posts - 1 through 15 (of 19 total)
                                                          • You must be logged in to reply to this topic.