Home › Forums › Explore Media › Acrylics › Question about painting water
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February 24, 2018 at 4:59 pm #451943
Hey everyone –
I take my own reference photos. Those I take of geese or ducks on bodies of water… the water is rarely the pretty blue that we all like to think water should be in pictures. It’s usually greenish-brown.
But when I use photos with greenish-brown water for reference, it seems disingenious to change the color of the water to a pretty blue; on the other hand, it just looks muddy and ugly to paint it the color it is in the photo.
How have you solved this problem? How do you interpret the color of water when the reference photo depicts greenish-brown water?
Thanks,
Mary.Mary Thompson
http://www.wildpinesstudio.netConstructive Criticism Always Welcome.
February 24, 2018 at 6:40 pm #572217I make it a bit 3D…..I use lots of paint so that it actually rises up on the surface.
I usually paint water that invites the viewer to touch.
February 24, 2018 at 6:57 pm #572194Does the water look greenish brown even with a sunny sky?
It could be partly the viewing /photo angle.
Like close up & level vs higher & a bit farther away?
We have wetlands nearby and the water is dirty generally, but from the road view looking down to the water it often reflects various sky colors too.. the road varies about 15′ to 40′ above the water along the stretch of wetlands.~Joy~
February 24, 2018 at 7:05 pm #572195Here are some I took, might give you some ideas ..
~Joy~
February 24, 2018 at 7:13 pm #572197I have painted many water scenes, and I usually go for the color I see, the greenish-brown water. Generally, you can get that color down with yellow ocher and a blue. I think it looks real. Blue water is actually an illusion caused by the reflection of clouds/sky in the water. Water is actually clear, and so, most likely you are seeing reflections of the bottom of the lake, the trees and grass around it.
No longer a member of WC. Bye.
February 24, 2018 at 7:30 pm #572204You as the artist are making choices. If you are slaving yourself to realism, that is a choice, and you need to recognize it as a choice that you are making. Do not succumb to any guilt trip that you are “supposed to” be realistic, or that you “must use” what you see in front of you, or what’s in your photo. These are all choices, including the conscientious desire to paint things realistically as you see them because you happen to like them.
I’m prepared to take the unusual step of showing my own work regarding the subject of “water”, because I went through something similar regarding this, in the last major painting I did several years ago. So here find the subject attached, “Orange Lake”. There is no lake. It is my Mom’s rose garden, but I simply did not want to do everything I was seeing, as that would have been way too boring to me. I do not want all the blades of grass, bleh! Please find attached also the reference image of what I was painting. However I did not paint from an image, I painted from life. The photo is what I was looking at.
Now the major point: what is “water”, in our human perception? Water is first and foremost a surface reflection. Anything that resembles surface reflection, becomes “water” to our visual system. I have been painting various kinds of made-up “water”, as reflection on the ground or “floor”, ever since high school. I have an old Francis Bacon inspired self-portrait of me melting away as a corpse in a chair that’s sitting in a whole room full of water. I figured out a long time ago, from all those painter TV shows like with Bill Alexander that “water” is one of the easiest things you can feed to the human visual system.
Water is often a surface disturbance as well. My “water” tends to have something of the visual effect of ripples in it. The eye is made to zigzag. This isn’t necessarily some realistic zigzag, like you’ve somehow managed to reproduce every ripple upon a lake as your eye or a camera saw it. It is a psychological zigzag. I’m going to make your eye move back and forth, as though you are tracking the surface of rippled water. I’m going to make you look at things going larger to smaller. These sorts of eye movement effects, my sense of placement for one thing vs. another, is pretty core to my work. If you’re wondering why some blotch is or isn’t there, why there is in some sense the quality of looking at a camouflague pattern, none of that is accidental. I may start with something random-ish from an underpanting, but by the time I sign my name on a canvas, every last stroke of that “water” is deliberate and intended.
What colors are in “water” ? Well hopefully I just proved to you, any damn thing you want them to be, as long as you are not chasing high fidelity parameters of realism. I am far more Impressionist and Fauvist in my core influences. Nevertheless, I wanted to point out that half of what you are seeing in this painting is real. That’s what I saw. There’s the reference photo if you’re wondering at the truth of what I saw. And if it’s not “as good” realism as someone else saw, frankly this is less about what I could do, and more about how much time I was willing to spend on the project. I’m still not a quick painter and ultra-meticulous realism would take me a lot longer to render. Even the Impressionist stuff you see before you was a 40 hour project. I didn’t sell that painting, I gave it to my Mom as a gift, so I didn’t exactly have a profit motive to continue with yet more high fidelity realistic rendering. In other words, “Good Enough”.
I love this painting by Henri Matisse, and may yet do “this kind” of water someday. My Mom has had fish ponds with exactly those kinds of fish colors and murk colors in them. Or if not, they’ve existed in various parks in various cities I’ve lived in.
In summary, for me, water is a psychological container for emotional mood, and a vehicle to express eye movement and color as pure 2D design elements. These are choices, and you can choose it too! Or not. If you hanker for more realistic water, go to a museum and stare at all the 19th century painters who did a really excellent job at various kinds of water. I like the really creepy water ala “Ophelia”.
February 24, 2018 at 7:31 pm #572198This is oil over acrylic, my recent painting.
I used dark greens, browns, a bit of super light blue…..almost white:Derek
Website: www.artderek.com
DEMONSTRATIONS:https://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1363787
https://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1343600
https://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1431363February 24, 2018 at 7:34 pm #572196And sometimes water really is silty & dirty like after hard rains or flooding…
If you show one of your refs , we might have more specific thoughts for it…~Joy~
February 24, 2018 at 9:04 pm #572211I read a quote from a rather famous artist recently who said that art is what you can get away with. So you can do anything you feel like with water, but whether it is any good is whether it works in the painting. I try to be realistic, so I paint what I see and try to at least make the viewer see it as water. When you think about it, even if you are standing at the scene looking at the water, it may look different depending on where your focus is. If you are focusing on the bottom in shallow water, you will see the rocks or weeds underneath. If you focus on the surface of the water, you will see reflections. Painting is an experiment in my view, and water is one of my favorite things to experiment with.
Everything else being equal, I would rather be in the painting zone.
Website: www.mikesartshack.com
February 25, 2018 at 12:42 am #572213If the water is clear and you are looking straight down at it, you are seeing the color of the bottom. It can be very hard to make a pleasing color match for mud on the river bottom.
That fact does not obligate you to make an ugly painting.
Tonal values are more important than colors. Get the light and dark passages right and the colors will take care of themselves.
A painting is never really done as long as I can get my hands on it.
February 25, 2018 at 7:54 am #572202Wow! Thank you everyone for such the detailed answers. I didn’t expect such an outpouring of information. It’s wonderful and very appreciated.
I know that I *COULD* paint water *ANY* color, but I’m choosing at the moment to paint in a style more realistic while still interpreting the subject for drama and beauty. So I’m all about making it more beautiful and dramatic by adjusting color and contrast. At the same time, I want it to look like a real place someone would enjoy visiting for an afternoon, for example.
Here’s a photo typical of the water photos I usually capture; I took this one yesterday. Skies were overcast.
I have never thought about changing my own angle to the water and sun (e.g. squatting down – my knees don’t like that ) in order to change what reflections are captured by the camera. Most of my photographs are taken *in the moment* – meaning, intuitively (some might say impulsively) so I just aim, zoom, and shoot. I adjust composition, head position, and unseemly details in post.
As you see in the photo, the water behind the geese is greenish-brown with whitish ripples. So in an image such as this, should I simply interpret the water as gray-blue as if at least some of the sky was reflected?
Thanks again,
Mary.Mary Thompson
http://www.wildpinesstudio.netConstructive Criticism Always Welcome.
February 25, 2018 at 8:22 am #572212My suggestion for this picture is to interpret the ripples as a light blue to indicate the sky reflection, and paint the rest of the water as grey with a slight green/brown. Making a quick sketch with the colors can yield ideas.
Everything else being equal, I would rather be in the painting zone.
Website: www.mikesartshack.com
February 26, 2018 at 8:36 am #572205My own rather biased view, as you can surely guess from my own work I showed, is that your problem isn’t in the realm of “water”. It’s in the realm of color theory.
What’s important about that photograph are those birds. Their coloration in the photo is fantastic. The water, not at all, it’s pretty much junk. Not faulting you as a photographer for that. You described your photographic process and got good birds as a reference photo. The water is an afterthought and clearly isn’t cooperating. Not like you waited around Monet-style for “just the right water” to happen.
The rippling and highlight effects are interesting and not a loss though. I hope that my comments above on the “psychological essence of water” are helpful in that regard. Water is reflection, water is layers, water is highlights.
Anyways what you need to do is decide on the color scheme of those birds. It could be pretty darned close to, or exactly, what you’ve photographed. Them’s good lookin’ birds. Then, everything else about the painting, needs to support that. There are many color theory directions you could go in to do that. Which way you go is totally up to you. You’ve been handed this giant “ground” that can contain any colors you want.
There was that school of art, I recall Fernard Leger as an exemplar, where the artists would paint industrial subjects, “ugly” things, but make them beautiful. That’s the “problem” you are faced with your photo of the water. It’s not really a problem, it’s the opportunity to choose whatever you wish. You can go very realistic, you can go very abstract. Lots of room to maneuver within the human visual phenomenon of “water”.
February 26, 2018 at 8:45 am #572206Tonal values are more important than colors. Get the light and dark passages right and the colors will take care of themselves.
I agree that value contrast would be a valid way to take on this subject. For instance, one might make the body of the water mostly dark browns, darker than what is actually in the photo. That would make the birds pop more.
However, one could also go in pure color theory directions where value is not important or the arbiter. The water could be entirely fetid pastels. That would make the dark parts of the birds, pop.
There are many very outlandish things you could do, but they would require a deft handling of color theory to pull off.
At least you’ve got some high contrast birds, they’re inherently interesting as is. Support that somehow.
February 26, 2018 at 8:48 am #572207I used dark greens, browns, a bit of super light blue…..almost white:
Derek that’s great water BTW. And it demonstrates that water is a collection of colors with highlights. It’s not “one thing”, it’s an interaction of components.
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