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  • #458775
    amirbkt2
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        hi
        I want to try oil painting (portrait)for the first time and I been searching around to learn the basics then buy them but there is a couple question that I think there is no answer for them and it’s only by opinion so sorry if I’m asking some basics question

        paint:
        1. some people you should just start with artist quality paint and other say buy cheaper paint and feel free to explore
        I can afford artist paint like gambling but in smaller amount should I go with it or should I buy student paint like van gogh?
        2.do you think should I buy medium like liquin now and get used to them or just focus on basics?

        3.i found a very good deals for gamblin 237 ml can should I buy a white can or it’s a lot and would dry out? :clear:

        canvas

        4.i was looking to buy a Strathmore or fredrix canvas pad or arches paper have anyone tried them and suggest them? and if yes which brand ( canvas pads are 2time cheaper than paper):cat:

        brush

        5.I found a good deal on winsor and newton artist oil brushes on ebay but when I checked blick review people where saying it’s so bad have anyone tried them? (15$ for 5 brush):angel:

        thanks everybody:clap:

        #656270
        amirbkt2
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            I think I need someone to delete those lol I didn’t meant to spam

            #656257
            justgord
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                There are lots of ways to get started, while saving money.

                You may want to try a limited palette, but I would not buy the cheapest tubes of paint.
                I would avoid cheaper brands like Pebeo, Maries, and cheap box sets.

                Solid brands that are good quality are W&N ARTISTS [ not Winton ! ], M Graham, Langridge.
                Best value is Series 1, single pigments.

                I would suggest a limited palette to start :

                – Arilide yellow or hansa yellow [ PY74 ]
                – yellow ochre [ PY42 ] ( for convenience, not strictly needed )
                – Burnt Umber [ PBr7 ]
                – Ultramarine Blue [ PB29 ] or Prussian Blue [ PB27 ]
                – Pyrrol Red [ PR254/255 ] ( or maybe a cheaper napthol red )
                – Titanium white [ PW6 + PW4 ] ( get a larger tube, eg. 100ml )

                – linseed oil
                – odorless solvent

                The codes are the actual ingredients used – the “pigment”.

                I have avoided toxic pigments above. [ no cadmiums reds/yellows or lead whites ]

                You can get by with linseed oil to clean out your brushes instead of smelly turpenoid solvent [ or use odorless citrus based artists solvent sparingly ] .. brushes are ok for a day or two if left with excess linseed. Can use detergent and soap and warm water lather for a full clean.

                Have a look at drawmixpaint on youtube for tutorial on how to mix colors from a limited palette [the so called ‘Zorn palette’ ] – spend a couple days mucking around mixing up colors and painting a big color wheel chart, you’ll learn a lot – I wish I had done this at the start : )

                ps. if you’re in AUS, Art Spectrum are borderline ok for quality, good value, but avoid cheaper Art Prism .. just my opinion.

                Mediums are a whole other topic – initially Id start with :
                – lean medium = 1/2 each linseed and solvent ( for under-painting )
                – fat medium = 1/3 each linseed, stand oil, solvent ( for final layers )
                but there is a lot more to this – Art spectrum lean and fat mediums are fine, Langridge mediums are excellent.

                Enjoy !!

                tl:dr – buy small number of high quality tubes, avoid expensive pigments, stick to series 1 single pigments.

                #656258
                justgord
                Default

                    .. for cheap painting supports I used 3mm MDF or thick cardboard and cut to size with a knife, then 3 coats of acrylic gesso.

                    but I like a nice texture these days, so I glue a light linen down to a board then seal and gesso …

                    Canvas pad is fine too

                    #656275
                    Pat Ryan
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                        but I like a nice texture these days, so I glue a light linen down to a board then seal and gesso …

                        This is interesting to me, because I’m getting ready to make canvas boards out of raw linen and MDF for the first time. I was planning to seal and prime the canvas first, then cut and attach to the boards, but I would prefer to do it your way–attaching the linen first, then sealing and priming. This works for you?

                        Canvas pad is fine too

                        I agree. There are some good canvas pads out there, also canvas boards, pre-gessoed MDF boards, and pre-stretched and gessoed canvases. If you’re just starting out, you might want to start out the easy way, by buying already-prepared substrates.

                        Oil painting can be technically daunting for a novice. You might also want to consider using Galkyd, Liquin, or Neo Megilp as a medium for that reason. It’s a simpler way to get started. Drying oils like linseed or walnut, plus a solvent (I’m liking Gamsol rather than odorless paint thinner nowadays), are the classic way to go, but alkyd mediums like Galkyd, etc., might make it easier to focus on the art rather than the mechanics for now. (You can actually go solvent free if you want to avoid solvents altogether for health reasons. Mix your paints with drying oil and/or an alkyd medium, then clean the brushes with oil and soap.)

                        Jerry’s Artarama and Dick Blick have good prices and free shipping if you buy more than $35 worth.

                        Whatever you do, relax and have fun!

                        #656178
                        RogueRipple
                        Default

                            Paint: I have lots of Van Gogh, it’s probably the best value in paint. It’s not artist grade but it’s better than most student grade paints. Somewhere in between artist and student, I’d say. If you can afford artist grade paint, go for it. But not if it means that you will be hesitant to use it. That’s one advantage of using less expensive paint, you’ll be more inclined to use a sufficient quantity of paint on your palette while learning. I personally would not buy a large can of white, but do get a larger tube.

                            Support: There is nothing wrong with Fredrix canvas pads. I use them for practice. It’s real canvas, so you still have the feel of canvas under your brush.

                            Brushes: Personal preference, but I like the Princeton 6300 Dakota series of synthetic bristle brushes. They’re a good brush and a good value.

                            I don’t really use mediums so I won’t comment on that. Justgord’s reply has some good advice on using a limited palette. That’s a good way to save money and learn about color mixing.

                            - Kelvin

                            "Things fall apart, it's scientific." - David Byrne

                            #656265
                            Devorahdraws
                            Default

                                I haven’t used it yet myself, but I’ve been told that Plaza’s “Plaza Oil” is actually the Richeson Shiva Oils. If you sign up for membership with Plaza (free) they pretty regularly have 30, 40, or 50% off of one item sales, and you could snag the Plaza Artists’ Oil starter set. Online the price is listed at $33 USD right now for six paints, if you managed to get it 50% off that’d be $16.50 for 6 artist grade oil paints. Or a little more than that at 40% off.

                                It comes with:
                                Napthol Red
                                Arylide Yellow Light
                                Phthalo Green
                                Ultramarine Blue Deep
                                Burnt Sienna
                                Titanium White

                                The rest of the line (whether it’s called Shiva Richeson or Plaza Artist’s) is pretty affordable too, so you could add in a paint or two.

                                #656227
                                kinasi
                                Default

                                    canvas

                                    4.i was looking to buy a Strathmore or fredrix canvas pad or arches paper have anyone tried them and suggest them? and if yes which brand ( canvas pads are 2time cheaper than paper):cat:

                                    Canvas is just thick artist paper. Linen and cotton are the fibers used in artist paper and the exact same fibers you find in canvas pad paper or canvas. The only difference is the size of the fibers (in papermaking you beat the fibers down into more of a pulp form) instead of a weave. It’s only recently that we started to make a new type of paper that isn’t like canvas at all, instead of making it from plant fibers, it’s made with wood pulp and glue.

                                    The cheapest paper is mostly wood pulp, slightly more expensive is bond paper (the paper banknotes are made from) which contains rag cotton and linen fibers, the most expensive is artist paper, which can be anywhere from 50 to 100 percent cotton or linen.

                                    It’s no coincidence that paper brands are making canvas, a canvas is just an artist paper with the heaviest fibers separated from the batch.

                                    #656174
                                    Delofasht
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                                        Arches oil paper is really nice to paint on, and you can paint in both sides of it so you can double your efficiency in learning. It does not act like normal canvas or have a weave similar or anything like that at all, so do not expect it to. I honestly suggest Hahnemühle oil paper as the oil paper of choice for someone who likes a surface that acts like regular canvas. It mimics the texture, feel, and finished look while drying less matte than Arches does in thinner applications of paint. I like oil paper because it is light, easy to tape down to a single piece of hardboard, and can be mounted to a hardboard if I make a finished piece that looks good on it.

                                        For paints, M Graham are my favorite brand, but if you want to utilize a good student brand it is hard to find anything better than the Plaza Oils, Van Gogh, or Gamblin 1980s. Any of these work wonderfully. For most skins tones you can get away with using a “Zorn” palette: white, yellow ochre, cad red, and black. For a modern equivalent, cad red can become pyrol red (or 254), this has a very similar hue range but tings out a bit cooler than cadmium red, making pink areas of skin easier to achieve. This actually provides for a slightly larger mixing gamut, but the wider the range of colors one can make the more difficult it is to use the colors. This is the main benefit of a simplified palette of colors though, you can easily navigate the color ranges and tell when you are too yellow, red, or gray.

                                        I like an extended palette that includes a Quinacridone Rose and Prussian Blue instead of using black, and I replace yellow Ochre with Indian Yellow (PY 110), this results in a full range color mixing palette. This is what I suggest people wanting a full palette to include as the colors are all strong, mix to any hue, and have wonderful versatility, allowing you to paint whatever subjects.

                                        I avoid Strathmore products lately, been rather displeased with how they feel, maybe fine for some people but I just do not like them anymore. (I started with their products and got along fine but now find their quality seems to be restraining me. Do not get cans of paint if you are a beginner, they are easy to accidentally not seal completely when closing and end up with faster drying paint in the can.

                                        For brushes, just grab a couple good hot hair bristle brushes, or my choice is Polytip Catalyst Synthetic brushes. I generally suggest for learning to paint small, you can do a lot more paintings this way with less paint and smaller brushes, all of this is affordable. Once you feel confident, then you can do some big works and buy a couple bigger brushes. There are a number of artists who would go counter to my suggestion, insisting a student not feel scared to dump lots of money on painting big, developing confidence and carefree attitude is good, but at the right time. Start cheap but quality, move bigger and more expensive later. Enjoy the oil painting journey!

                                        - Delo Delofasht
                                        #656264
                                        PhuongMy
                                        Default

                                            I’m a beginner too, and I always try to buy the best oil paints I could find and afford. I use W&N oil paints. Holbein’s, kusakabe’, Holland etc… are in my stock but I keep them for later experiments with multi layering techniques.

                                            I have W&N brushes and they are good to me, l like them.

                                            oil painting (from middle of April 2018)

                                            C&C are always welcome.

                                            #656271
                                            amirbkt2
                                            Default

                                                There are lots of ways to get started, while saving money.

                                                You may want to try a limited palette, but I would not buy the cheapest tubes of paint.
                                                I would avoid cheaper brands like Pebeo, Maries, and cheap box sets.

                                                Solid brands that are good quality are W&N ARTISTS [ not Winton ! ], M Graham, Langridge.
                                                Best value is Series 1, single pigments.

                                                I would suggest a limited palette to start :

                                                – Arilide yellow or hansa yellow [ PY74 ]
                                                – yellow ochre [ PY42 ] ( for convenience, not strictly needed )
                                                – Burnt Umber [ PBr7 ]
                                                – Ultramarine Blue [ PB29 ] or Prussian Blue [ PB27 ]
                                                – Pyrrol Red [ PR254/255 ] ( or maybe a cheaper napthol red )
                                                – Titanium white [ PW6 + PW4 ] ( get a larger tube, eg. 100ml )

                                                so i bought titanium white and ultramarine so far and going for yellow ochre and burnt umber next but still confused about what red to chose so many people saying go for alizarin and others say lighter red like pr 254/255
                                                probbably i would buy napthol red

                                                thanks you helped a lot

                                                .. for cheap painting supports I used 3mm MDF or thick cardboard and cut to size with a knife, then 3 coats of acrylic gesso.

                                                but I like a nice texture these days, so I glue a light linen down to a board then seal and gesso …

                                                Canvas pad is fine too

                                                since i have a big roll of heavy watercolor paper i was thinking to primed it and stretched for now then go for canvas i hope it works

                                                Oil painting can be technically daunting for a novice. You might also want to consider using Galkyd, Liquin, or Neo Megilp as a medium for that reason. It’s a simpler way to get started. Drying oils like linseed or walnut, plus a solvent (I’m liking Gamsol rather than odorless paint thinner nowadays), are the classic way to go, but alkyd mediums like Galkyd, etc., might make it easier to focus on the art rather than the mechanics for now. (You can actually go solvent free if you want to avoid solvents altogether for health reasons. Mix your paints with drying oil and/or an alkyd medium, then clean the brushes with oil and soap.)

                                                i bought a bottle of stand oil and gamsol for now to give it a try maybe in future i go with a fast drying like a liquin
                                                thanks

                                                paint: I have lots of Van Gogh, it’s probably the best value in paint. It’s not artist grade but it’s better than most student grade paints. Somewhere in between artist and student, I’d say. If you can afford artist grade paint, go for it. But not if it means that you will be hesitant to use it. That’s one advantage of using less expensive paint, you’ll be more inclined to use a sufficient quantity of paint on your palette while learning. I personally would not buy a large can of white, but do get a larger tube.

                                                since i’m not really new to art ( i been doing portrait in other medium for around 2 years) i decided go with series 1 artist paint but i got them actually really cheap

                                                I haven’t used it yet myself, but I’ve been told that Plaza’s “Plaza Oil” is actually the Richeson Shiva Oils. If you sign up for membership with Plaza (free) they pretty regularly have 30, 40, or 50% off of one item sales, and you could snag the Plaza Artists’ Oil starter set. Online the price is listed at $33 USD right now for six paints, if you managed to get it 50% off that’d be $16.50 for 6 artist grade oil paints. Or a little more than that at 40% off.

                                                it seems like a really good paint thanks

                                                Re: advise for a beginner

                                                Arches oil paper is really nice to paint on, and you can paint in both sides of it so you can double your efficiency in learning. It does not act like normal canvas or have a weave similar or anything like that at all, so do not expect it to. I honestly suggest Hahnemühle oil paper as the oil paper of choice for someone who likes a surface that acts like regular canvas. It mimics the texture, feel, and finished look while drying less matte than Arches does in thinner applications of paint. I like oil paper because it is light, easy to tape down to a single piece of hardboard, and can be mounted to a hardboard if I make a finished piece that looks good on it.

                                                For paints, M Graham are my favorite brand, but if you want to utilize a good student brand it is hard to find anything better than the Plaza Oils, Van Gogh, or Gamblin 1980s. Any of these work wonderfully. For most skins tones you can get away with using a “Zorn” palette: white, yellow ochre, cad red, and black. For a modern equivalent, cad red can become pyrol red (or 254), this has a very similar hue range but tings out a bit cooler than cadmium red, making pink areas of skin easier to achieve. This actually provides for a slightly larger mixing gamut, but the wider the range of colors one can make the more difficult it is to use the colors. This is the main benefit of a simplified palette of colors though, you can easily navigate the color ranges and tell when you are too yellow, red, or gray.

                                                I’m gonna buy a arches oil paper for finished art works and prime my own watercolor paper for sketching

                                                I was thinking about using limited pallete too thanks for color suggestion I needed it

                                                I’m a beginner too, and I always try to buy the best oil paints I could find and afford. I use W&N oil paints. Holbein’s, kusakabe’, Holland etc… are in my stock but I keep them for later experiments with multi layering techniques.

                                                I have W&N brushes and they are good to me, l like them.

                                                same here I always look on the ebay for cheap paint and some times I found super super cheap paint like 14 ml wn watercolor that are 13 I bought them for 2.5!!!

                                                #656252
                                                Michael Lion
                                                Default

                                                    I don’t recommend Arches oil paper for a beginner, it’s an extremely idiosyncratic surface.

                                                    Canson Canva-Paper, on the other hand, is a lot like painting on linen, but for a tiny fraction of the price. Easy to cut to any desired size. Ready to paint on with no priming needed. Highly recommended.

                                                    #656175
                                                    Delofasht
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                                                        Michael I had totally forgotten about Canson’s Canva-Paper, I meant to pick some up and give it a try, will have to do that on the next order.

                                                        - Delo Delofasht
                                                        #656266
                                                        TomMather
                                                        Default

                                                            Some thoughts for beginners. Canvas panels are inexpensive. Although perhaps slightly more to buy than paper, panels will be much less expensive to frame than paper. Likewise, stretched canvas costs more than most panels and paper, but doesn’t need framing at all if you use gallery wrap.

                                                            Start with a limited palette of colors, but buy high quality artists grade paints. Why? Because a tube of paint generally lasts a long time, particularly colors that you don’t use a lot (reds for me). Don’t worry about being wedded to a particular brand. Buy whatever high quality paints are on sale or priced better.

                                                            For my purposes, and I paint mostly landscapes, I use these colors the most, in the following order: ultramarine blue, burnt umber, titanium white, burnt sienna, cadmium yellow light, cerulean blue (for skies), yellow ochre and alizarin crimson permanent. Occasionally I use cadmium red and sap green. I have piles of tubes of old paints that I have rarely ever used because they aren’t needed or don’t mix well for me — such as pthalo blue, viridian green, and various reds.

                                                            Mediums are a whole other ball of wax. As a beginner you might want to start out with a linseed oil medium and odorless mineral spirits such as Gamsol. If you would rather avoid solvents, you might want to consider water mixable oil paints right at the outset. Myself, I generally use Galkyd, an alkyd medium, because it makes the paint dry faster. However, linseed oil is more traditional if you are more patient about paint drying than me. I’ve also tried Gamblin’s solvent free medium with good results and it dries slightly faster than linseed oil with similar working characteristics.

                                                            One more point. I learned to oil paint by toning the canvas first with a light wash of paint thinned with OMS. I use burnt sienna because it works well for landscapes, being a complimentary color to blues and greens. Toning a canvas helps you judge colors and values better than painting on a stark white canvas. You can tone with other colors, such as greens and blues for portraits. You can also tone with acrylic paints to cut down on solvents.

                                                            #656182
                                                            AnnieA
                                                            Default

                                                                A good place to start is with a limited palette and most frequently the one recommended focuses on the three primary colors: red, yellow and blue, and uses a cool and warm version of each. This type of palette is especially good for beginners because it helps a newbie learn how to mix paints. If you’re unfamiliar with some of these terms, a very good explanation is here: https://blog.mitchalbala.com/expanded-primaries-landscape-painting-palette/
                                                                Note that the article discusses a palette that works great for landscapes. It wouldn’t be a bad place to start for any new painter, but since you said you’re intending to focus on portraiture, you might want to ask the questions about the best paint choices for that in the Portrait Forum here at WC.

                                                                It’s hard to answer questions about brushes without knowing more about how you want to paint (impasto? glazed layers?). Different brushes serve different purposes and techniques. Starting out with some middle-of-the-road brushes is probably your best bet, and maybe you should get a few of the stiffer bristle ones and then also some softer synthetics. I find Utrecht to be a very good value for their quality, and probably about the right place for a beginner to start, as are some of the brushes made by Simmons. There are three basic types of brushes: filberts (oval shape at the end), flats (flat at the end) and brights (also flat at the end but with much shorter bristles). Filberts are very good for portraits, and flats are quite versatile too. Brights have their uses, but until you’ve got more experience, there’s no need to try them.

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