Home Forums Explore Media Pen and Ink Lamy or Rotring Artpen… or something else? HELP!

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  • #991496
    ImpastoArtist
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        Hi everyone,

        I haven’t posted on here very often, so please forgive me if this post is in the wrong location.

        I am wanting to get into sketchbook work with pen, ink and perhaps water color washes. I know that this has been posted on other threads, but I just couldn’t find the info I was after there. Can you help?

        Down to my question…
        What pen would you recommend? I’m thinking a Lamy Safari or Rotring Artpen. Or is there another better product out there? I know nothing about these pens.

        By trade I was a Draftsman, so I do know the Rapidograph pens very well. They are high maintenance, and I think, lack personality. For me; now I would like to try something a little more expressive that I can take with me easily. So a pen with a varied nib size would be great.

        I would be grateful to hear your recommendations… plus if you have example of your work I could see (with the pen you recommend), that would be fantastic! You know what they say… a picture says a thousand words! That way I can see the type of mark said pen would typically make.

        Eagerly awaiting your reply,
        Mark

        [FONT=Century Gothic]

        Visit my website: http://www.markduggan.co.nz/

        #1197854

        I was a surveyor and used Rotring pens for decades. I personally love the Lamy Safari pens and use them with Noodler’s Bulletproof ink which is safe to use in fountain pens and is waterproof when dry. I have a refilling adaptor so I fill from the bottle. I also do pen and wash.

        I am not keen on the Art Pen as the cartriges are not waterproof.

        Doug


        We must leave our mark on this world

        #1197860
        Anonymous

            Rotring art pen & Lamy in their extra fine size are still pretty broad, if you want a finer line to compare with a radiograph .3 or .2 you will have to look further – If you can let me know of a specific radiograph width as a target size ,I could recommend some specific models, many of them much cheaper than the two you mention!
            BUT !!!! getting a flexible dip pen like nib to get that range of variety in your lines is just not possible, such a pen does not exist in any kind of reliable form at least . However using a fountain pen will give you more character in the quality of lines when compared to a radiograph & the liberation from having to hold the pen close to vertical is also a big plus point. A fountain pens’ nib can often be used upside down resulting in a finer line. Using a pen with a “dry” ink feed ( ie. Pilot) combined with a thick ink type (ie. pelican) can enable you to get quite some variety of line character by changing speed of line making & the using the corners of nib at a angle.
            Adding watercolour to a ink drawing requires a special ink if you are to avoid it leaching into the paint & making a mess-Platinum carbon ink, which is expensive & unlikely to be sold in the store round the corner. Using this ink also restricts your choice of pen a bit as it needs a good gushing federate, (the lamy & rotring are ok for carbon ink).The platinum desk pen is ok for this ink too but gives a finer line than the other 2 pens. You will have to use any pen filled with the carbon ink every day to keep it from gumming up & dying on you ! it should get a really good wash through between each filling. All fountain pen inks are prone to fading, & as such are not suitable for work to be sold or hung on the wall, the platinum carbon ink IS permanent so is OK for such use.

            #1197861
            Anonymous

                http://www.peninkwatercolorsketching.com/rotring-artpen-review.htm
                Here are some drawing samples of the rotring art pen compared with the platinum carbon desk pen, for me the desk pen lines are more noticeably thinner in real life than is apparent in this comparison picture.

                #1197859
                ImpastoArtist
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                    Thanks for the great feedback Doug and Pedlars. Getting this info from people who actually use the pens is a great help.

                    I had never thought about the inks in terms of lightfastness. Another factor to add to the mix!

                    [FONT=Century Gothic]

                    Visit my website: http://www.markduggan.co.nz/

                    #1197855

                    Lightfastness is not as important as water resistance in my sketch books, but both usually come with pigmented inks.

                    Doug


                    We must leave our mark on this world

                    #1197862
                    Anonymous

                        Doug you mention that you’re not keen on the Rotring art pen because the cartridges are not waterproof but that pen actually takes “standard” international size cartridges so I wouldn’t let that influence your pen choice.
                        Besides get a syringe & fill it with any bottled fountain pen ink in the empty cartridge – it’s much cheaper !
                        One thing I actually like about the Rotring cartridge ink is that after you have done a line drawing with it, you can take a wash from the drawn lines with just a wet brush. For me this is great for traveling light when sketching outdoors.

                        #1197856

                        I like the Lamy because it fits in my pocket and takes an adaptor. I use an EF nib. Here’s a thread where I used it for sketching on holiday.. See post #34 for details of the pen and ink.

                        Doug


                        We must leave our mark on this world

                        #1197863
                        Anonymous

                            Yes Doug I know what you mean about fitting in the pocket, the Rotring art pen is a bit big!
                            Another consideration is that it is a bit conspicuous for sketching in public places, it definitely draws attention whereas the Lamy looks normal – you could be just writing. I know there are some people who actually cut that pointed end off the rotring ! but as the Lamy is very similar I can’t see the point in bothering.
                            BTW there are many converters from other manufacturers that fit the Rotring art pen although Rotring don’t actually make one themselves.
                            As I mentioned both the Rotring art pen & the Lamy even in their EF sizes give too broad a line for my style of drawing but they are both very widely used & universally well thought of- in the final analysis there’s little to separate them outside of the pen body styling. I suppose you could say the lamy is a little bit wetter & the rotring nib a little bit more subtle but there’s only a hairs breadth between the two.
                            Cheers Mike

                            #1197857
                            Andrew
                            Default

                                While I do love the Rotring. I learned drafting (pre-CAD) using rotring technical pens and old school lettering pens.

                                That said, for drawing and sketching, if I need a single pen, I much prefer a fountain style pen. More variety of line, and it is less rigid, which to me, makes a stronger drawing.

                                My personal preference is for dip pens, bamboo (or quill) pens, or sumi e brushes. All of which I can also use with my watercolours as well.

                                Andrew

                                "Never ascribe to malice what adequately can be explained as stupidity"
                                - Robert J. Hanlon

                                “What a genius, that Picasso. It is a pity he doesn't paint.” - Marc Chagall

                                #1197858
                                Bergere
                                Default

                                    For fine detail, I use Copic 0.03. Only pen I have found to be this fine.
                                    Works well with watercolor pencil wash, as it doesn’t bleed.

                                    http://www.dickblick.com/products/copic-multiliner-sp-pens/

                                    See what I am up to on my Blog page ~
                                    http://inkbrushcreations.blogspot.com/

                                    #1197864
                                    Anonymous

                                        Hi Bergere, yes, fine tipped pens are my holy grail too.
                                        I’ve got a 0.03 copic which is a no nonsense way of getting those hair thin lines ,there are a couple of alternatives which will give as fine a line. Pilot make a 0.25 gel pen which is delicate & not as robust as the Copic but gives a blacker, darker line of the same width when used with a gentle touch. After that I use a Gillot 290 dip pen to get as thin a line, there really isn’t much choice at this tiny line width & I also use fountain pens that I’ve ground down to a needle point.

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