Home › Forums › Explore Media › Watercolor › The Learning Zone › Tube paint recommendation
- This topic has 26 replies, 22 voices, and was last updated 7 years, 8 months ago by Cyntada.
-
AuthorPosts
-
July 19, 2016 at 8:40 pm #994265
I’m interested in trying out tube paints next.
I’m very new to watercolors, so I wouldn’t want to spend more than $100 on a set or a few individual tubes.
I already have a pan set that is pretty vibrant, but a bit opaque. So I’m interested in trying something with good transparency.
July 19, 2016 at 10:04 pm #1254748My second set was 24 tubes of St.Petersburg White Night: £40 in 2010. In my opinion, they are not top notch quality but I do rate them better than W&N Cotman and the price was right. I don’t know if there are currently available. All I could find was White Knight pans.
I got lucky on the WetCanvas Swap Shop and purchased 50 tubes of Daniel Smith for only $100. DS makes one of the best watercolour available today but at a price that I doubt I could afford today. YMMV
It is only on a basis of knowledge that we can become free to compose naturally. -- Bernard Dunstan
blog.jlk.netJuly 19, 2016 at 10:16 pm #1254745I’m interested in trying out tube paints next.
I’m very new to watercolors, so I wouldn’t want to spend more than $100 on a set or a few individual tubes.
I already have a pan set that is pretty vibrant, but a bit opaque. So I’m interested in trying something with good transparency.
I was able to get a good range of artist grade tube colors from Holbien when I was first starting out. These are really quite large tubes (15ml) for the price. If you have an idea what colors you want you can easily get 8-10 colors or so for under $100 depending on pigment choices. Other options include W&N cotman (student grade), which you can get really tiny 5ml tubes for pretty cheap, or even blick’s own brand watercolors (14ml tubes) which are fairly decent… not top quality but good for beginners. Personally I’d go with the largest tube for the price (Holbein).
I think my first ‘set’ consisted of the holbein colors below. The price for these 8 on Dickblick right now is $96.72 +S&H
Burnt Umber
Aureolin
Cad Yellow Light
Quinacridone Gold
Quinacridone Red
Peacock Blue
Cobalt Blue
Hooker’s GreenLaura Roberts
Can be found at http://panchroma.co.nz, https://lauraroberts.deviantart.com and
https://www.instagram.com/panchromastudio/July 20, 2016 at 3:21 am #1254763Jacksons often have greatly reduced prices on sets of paints https://www.jacksonsart.com/brands/winsor-newton/w-n-professional-watercolour
I’d recommend Windsor and Newton professional but only because I’m used to them and my painting is so much improved using them
W & N website lists the qualities including transparency of each colour.
http://www.winsornewton.com/uk/discover/resources/composition-permanence/professional-water-colourSo many lovely colours but you only need a few.:)
[FONT="Comic Sans MS"]Wendy
July 20, 2016 at 4:49 am #1254756Hi@All
Paint maker can use different paste formulas for tubes and pans.
W/N for example & D/R.
Schminke use the same on both.
Most paint maker offer Students or/and Artist grade pigments in tubes.
To name a few…the W.P. list
Mijello *
Umton Bravy *
Schminke *
Daler Rowney *
Sennelier
D.Smith
Bloxx
Maimerie
Rembrant
Graham
Da Vinci
St.Petersburg
Old Holland
W & N
Lukas
Kremer *
Tintoretto
Zecchi
America Journey
Art Spectrum
Camel
Turner
Jackson
Pelikan
Reeves *
Shin Han
Holbein
KuretakeGouache :
Caran d´Ache
and ….and…
Ok, what ´s good whats not..this is my list *
If you choose a palette size ~ 12 Hues / 100.- just google for transparent single pigment on the above brands…
5-7-15-ml tube ? look for the price most larger tube are less expensive.
EURO List 01/2016 .. Example : French Ultra Marine Blue FUB
12 Hues may this Palette goes..
2 Reds warm cold
2 Yellow warm cold
2 Blue warm cold
4 Neutrals
1 Magenta
1 Green or Teal Blue.
Cheers W.P.
Humor is just another defense against the universe.........On-Line Homebase........
July 20, 2016 at 5:44 am #1254744The more different colors you use, the easier it is to get mud. I’m with the 3 primaries (red, yellow, blue)- a warm and cool of each. I also use a brown madder (or burnt sienna) pigment a lot. If you want, add one each of the secondary colors (violet, green, orange). That’s 10 colors. This has been my permanent palette for many years. Look for the boxed sets. Dick Blick and Cheap Joes each have them. Other companies probably do also. Use the money you save on quality paper.
C&C WELCOMEDJan
July 20, 2016 at 8:16 am #1254746The M.Graham intermediate set is a really good deal at $81, plus you could add a few more tubes to fill out your budget of $100 if you wanted to but it isn’t necessary. With this assortment of colors you can mix up anything you like, plus it’s 15 ml tubes which will last you a very long time:
http://www.merriartist.com/M_Graham_Intermediate_10_Color_Watercolor_Set_p/grm-33-10set.htmThis set from Holbein is also nice, and about $33 but it’s teeeeeny tiny 5ml tubes:
https://www.amazon.com/Holbein-W403-Watercolor-ml-%252c-Tubes/dp/B000WD5WSK/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1469016560&sr=8-1&keywords=holbein+watercolor+setThis set from Winsor and Newton is also nice at $80 but again, teeny tiny 5 ml tubes.
https://www.guirys.com/winsor-newton-artists-water-colour-boxes-and-setsIf you decide to go with individual tubes rather than a set, you can mix and match brands and still stay within your budget.
Good luck!
July 20, 2016 at 8:32 am #1254753MaimeriBlu has some wonderful transparent paints. Check them out at DickBlick.com
July 20, 2016 at 8:50 am #1254743The pigments one uses have a lot to do with the way one paints. Staining organic pigments are also non granulating, and cheap since they have the highest tinting strength and used industrially in enormous quantities. Non staining mineral pigments are granulating and expensive, (thankfully the iron oxides and ultramarine are cheap). And, while granulating pigments are also a bit opaque, it’s not the same opaque one finds in chalk filled student colors. These are vibrant and a little goes a long way, which means they can be granulating and still look transparent in light washes.
The problem in watercolor, as opposed to all other media is that one can generously use the water for a whole range of effects… and these effects look spectacular when the pigments are granulating (large particle size), since they are pushed every which way by the water and give the final washes a distinct character. This is missing in other media, so the actual pigments don’t really matter a lot there. OTOH, staining pigments in watercolor are particularly useful for under layers, where subsequent brushing will not lift them up.
What one really means by mud is not always the muddy color (umber or yellow ochre is just mud, but we happily use it all the same), but going into damp washes and disturbing the flow of the pigment particles (maybe even pilling up the paper), and generating a rather unsightly texture……. which may actually work well (like in foliage) if that’s what one wants, but usually is accidental and horrible..
Another thing to note… unless one does florals, most natural colors are fairly muted. I get by just fine with the bright iron oxides and have to continually tone down the ultramarine. So, super strong reds pyrrole, naphthol, cadmium are usually required in moderation, so little in fact that I don’t mind replacing the beautifully granulating cadmium with more versatile organics. Unfortunately, on the cyan/turquoise side, however, there are no cheap muted granulating pigments, so one has to either make do with ultramarine and chromium oxide mixtures with the phalocyanine blues and greens, or use the terribly expensive (but beautiful and perfect) cobalts and viridian. As for yellow, other than flowers, everything else is actually iron oxide.
July 20, 2016 at 9:35 am #1254749If you are looking at tube watercolor paints, I would not buy a set. I’d pick out a 6-color secondary or 12-color tertiary palette of paints which will allow you to paint just about anything in any approach you wish, from painting with saturation to painting with neutrals.
If you are in the U.S., just about the most economical artist-grade paints available are American Journey paints (made by Davinci) for the Internet art retailer Cheap Joe’s. It’s hard to beat these, but there are many good recognized global paint manufacturers to choose from. Few will be as inexpensive as the line of of 15ml and 37ml tube paints from American Journey at Cheap’s!
Sling paint,
VirgilSling paint,
Virgil Carter
http://www.virgilcarterfineart.com/July 20, 2016 at 10:18 pm #1254751I’ll second Maimeri Blu as a brand choice, they were my first pro watercolors and served me well while I gained experience.
I was going to recommend Da Vinci, though I can’t disagree with Virgil’s suggestion of American Journey. Have not used them but see too many positive recommendations not to give them a nod.
CK =)
I take great comfort in knowing that my genuine typos will probably be blamed on some device's autocorrect.
DIY art supplies, sketches, and more: cyntada.com / @cyntadaJuly 20, 2016 at 11:01 pm #1254739I agree with Virgil that sets aren’t always the best or most economical choice. The region where you live makes a big difference in what you can afford to purchase.
In Canada, I advise my Students to buy Da Vinci 15 or 37 ml tubes which are generally more economical than any other brand. They begin with a warm and cool of each primary along with an orange, a single pigment green (such as viridian or phthalo green) and a couple of earths such as burnt sienna and raw umber. This makes a nice basic palette from which to build upon.
Unfortunately, this selection costs out at about $150.
Char --
CharMing Art -- "Where the spirit does not work with the hand, there is no art." Leonardo DaVinci
July 21, 2016 at 8:22 am #1254758I admire your interest and solicitation for advice. I’ll jump on Virgil’s recommendation of DaVinci (also American Journey). After some research, I chose DV for its quality and affordability.
Once the brand was selected, like you I then searched for colors that were transparent or semi-transparent (and also single pigment – just my particular preference after some study.)
I also wanted a cool and warm version of each primary as well as an earth tone or two. Though I’ve added to it since then, here’s where I landed with my original purchase, well under $100:
Hansa Yellow Light – PY3
Hansa Yellow Deep – PY65
Permanent Red – PR188
Alizarin Crimson (Quin) – PV19
French Ultramarine Blue (red shade) – PB29
Phthalo Blue – PB15
Raw Sienna – PBr7
Burnt Sienna – PBr7As I said, I’ve added to my palette since this original upgrade to artist grade paints, but I should use your message as a motivator to get back to a more limited range of pigments. This video by Alek Krylow was tremendously helpful to me to see that I purchased some paint tubes/pigments that weren’t necessary because my mixing range in a basic palette is greater than I thought: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=py1cjGcroyE.
Good luck with your choices!
FrankFrankM
July 21, 2016 at 11:50 am #1254762Jacksons in the UK also sells own brand artists quality watercolour paints which are reputedly made by Sennelier. They sell individual tubes plus sets of 3,6,12,18,and 24 which are even better value. I believe North Americal customers can reclaim VAT, Currently 20%, and they have a sale on at the moment with 15% off. The tubes contain 21ml!
In all these things we are more than conquerors.
July 21, 2016 at 2:03 pm #1254754When buying paints the sets are just awful for tubes, the combinations never make any sense.
I don’t start with brand, rather I start with pigments, then work backwards to the brands. This lets me focus on pure pigments which are technically the same regardless of brand, just like C&H brand sugar is the exact same thing as Generic Sugar. This isn’t totally true with pigments ( grinding and sourcing, even color vary a bit, but for a beginner they aren’t different enough to matter )
The big difference is often usage of glycerin and Ox Gall. These are the additives used.
The student grade stuff has no Ox Gall, and if the pigment is expensive they water it down, while in artist grade versions they jack the price up. If you get student grade you want to avoid the pigments where this is happening. If you can choose artist grade, but if money is an issue, Van gogh and Cotman student grade are as good as some of the lesser artist grade brands, and totally suitable for artist grade work.
Most of the brands the pans and tubes are the same stuff, except winsor newton who uses less glycerin, which makes their tube paints dry to be like rocks. Adding a drop of glycerin to any brands tube paint solves this problem, and is cheap, a thing of it costs $5 and will last you lifetime.
I set up this chart, which notes the good pigments as discussed on this forum, it’s really a synthesis of many opinions, but it’s aim is to simplify your choices while still ensuring all your choices are good.
https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/1172450/Watercolor%20Guide.pdfI avoid the bad pigments, except for the infamous ones which artists use even though they fade where it’s marked as “fugitive”, for the most part any of these is a good choice. I am not trying to force my views, and there are reasons why some artists like these, but I put good alternatives right next to them.
I also listed the various brands as examples where it will fit, with the student grades as well where those are similar to artist grade paints. If a pigment is sold in every brand like “ultramarine blue” I just list as many as will fit, you have to double check if it’s in your chosen brand. Just make sure you double check the pigment code on the tube, it starts with a P and ends with a number, and looks like PB29 for Ultramarine blue.
I’d suggest not being brand loyal, but basically pick one pigment from each page for the primary and secondary colors, which will give you a secondary palette. I’d suggest avoiding the ones marked as fugitive, and if you are chemically sensitive to avoid the ones marked as toxic. There are other ways to pick a palette ( like pairs of primarys ) but I think the important thing is to get a variety.
I listed all the various brands as well, what is sold in your part of the world is going to vary, so you are going to have to figure out what works for you.
Brian T Meyer
My Site - Instagram[/url] - FacebookUseful links: Watercolor FAQs - Watercolor Handbook - Handprint - Listing of Watercolor Societies - Watercolor Guide (Pigment Listing)
-
AuthorPosts
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
Register For This Site
A password will be e-mailed to you.
Search