Roberson's Oil Painting Medium (vs Liquin)

[vee_209]

Has anybody ever tried Roberson's oil painting medium? I wonder if it is any good? It was mentioned in some books and I would like to know if it is significantly better than Liquin. I know that they are completely different but I would like to know more about the difference between their handling properties. It's quite expensive so i wonder what more benefits i will get out of it apart from the fact that it is a British 19th century formula medium.

Also, is it much different from Roberson's Glazing medium. This one is a lot cheaper.

Many thanks in advance.

Vee

[dcorc]

Hi - if you mean the Roberson's sold in the UK by Cornelissen's - yes, I've tried it - I've used it on my "Turner" MOM back in February - it contains "double thick mastic varnish, drying linseed oil, and synthetic copal varnish" (which probably = alkyd - so despite being from the original company, it's not the original material ).

It's a great deal more thixotropic than Liquin - add a little to the paint on the palette with a knife (rather less than their recommended 2:1 paint/medium - I'd say 4:1 or 5:1 ) - it works nicely on the brush, flows well, and then sets up very quickly on the canvas to a tacky-draggy state.

I'd suggest you buy a small 60ml pot of it and have a play - that's what I got for the MOM painting, and I've still got more than half of it left (though the painting's not quite finished yet either.)

Dave

[rroberts]

I doubt my reply will be anywhere near as helpful as dcorc's comments above, but I hope the information is helpful.

"Roberson's Medium" is a 19th Century English concoction of a leaded copal drying varnish compounded with regular megilp and oil of spike.

In other words, it is a variation of jelling mediums known loosely as megilp, maroger, etc., usually made by simply mixing leaded oil (known as "black oil") with mastic varnish. The result, within minutes, is a soft jelly enabling more manipulation with oil paint while it reduced tendencies towards running or spreading ; also, the mastic jelly allowed especial facility with the brush and faster-drying.

The addition of copal in Roberson's Medium presumably strengthens the binding characteristics of 'regular' megilp.

I use maroger medium, but have not tried Roberson's Medium, mostly because I haven't felt any compelling reason to try it. For what it's worth, I like maroger, even though debates about it seem to be a recurring topic.

One BIG problem is that not all products bearing the Roberson's Medium label are the real thing. There are only a few trustworthy suppliers, and their formulations vary according to what they think is the best version. (for instance, Grumbacher copal medium has no copal whatever - its an alkyd). It is justifiably expensive, given the ingredients that go into making it. Far better to make your own, but that's a completely different matter.

As to whether Roberson's has any advantage of merit over Liquin, other than price, would require some organized testing. Until then, I suspect that personal opinion will rein over empirical evidence.

[dcorc]

Hi Robert - I'd guess that the comparison with Maroger is closer than that with Liquin - it's certainly the reason I got it, as it seemed the closest thing readily available off the shelf here in London to a Maroger's (Roberson's/Cornelissen's do market a "Maroger's" but it's even further from the sort of formulation discussed here than the "Robersons" is). Those in the US do seem to be at an advantage as to the availability of reasonably authentic versions of these media commercially from a few suppliers. Personally, I've regarded it as prohibitively expensive to order stuff internationally, but I know others do so.

Dave

[rroberts]

Originally Posted by dcorc

Those in the US do seem to be at an advantage as to the availability of reasonably authentic versions of these media commercially from a few suppliers. Personally, I've regarded it as prohibitively expensive to order stuff internationally, but I know others do so.

Hmmm ... Seems this kind of thing could be an ideal venture for an enterprising person. The principal suppliers in the U.S. are niche market entrepreneurs known mostly by word of mouth - Robert Doak, for instance.

I wonder if there are European sources that we in the U.S. don't really hear anything about. Surely one would think there might be an equivalent to Robert Doak, Studio Products, etc.

[vee_209]

Thank you very much for your help, Robert and Dave. Has anyone ever tried Robrerson's glazing medium at all? Is that much different from the normal painting medium? Once again.. in comparision to Liquin?

Vee

[dcorc]

From Cornelissen's website, "Roberson's glazing medium" contains turps/damar/stand oil/cobalt dryers.

Dave

[Trisha H]

I've tried the Robersons Glaze Medium, but didn't like it. It may just be a personal preference, but it seemed too thin, too glossy and a somewhat 'hard' finish.

Trisha.

[Brad121]

Is Roberson's Oil Painting Medium described as a fast drying medium?

I suppose inorder to ensure fat over lean, one would simply add more of the medium in upper layers ?
Or would one perhaps add a little stand oil or something?

Brad

[turlogh]

Originally Posted by Brad121

Is Roberson's Oil Painting Medium described as a fast drying medium?

I suppose inorder to ensure fat over lean, one would simply add more of the medium in upper layers ?
Or would one perhaps add a little stand oil or something?

Classic Roberson's contains black oil, mastic varnish, and copal varnish (with solvents that are not significant to this discussion because they evaporate away). Any medium made with black oil will dry quickly.

The principle of fat over lean simply means that upper layers should not be less flexible than lower layers. It is not something to get fetishistic about. If you simply add about the same amount of Maroger's/Roberson's/Meglip to each layer (and you should only use very small amounts), there should be no problems. You don't need to add other stuff, except of course that you should not add medium-free paint on top of layers with medium. It is fine to glaze in upper layers with a different medium that is oil-rich, such as black oil mixed with Venice turpentine.

[Brad121]

Thanks for your reply, however I have some reservations as to whether or not the present Roberson's oil Painting medium is made in the traditional way with black oil. I have a 60ml tub which is the product of Roberson's, but I've been led to beleive that perhaps it has some substitute in place of the lead.

I don't have it in front of me, but I beleive details given on the www.cornelissen.com site (UK Art supplier) says of the ingredients 'Double thick.mastic varnish.pale drying linseed oil/synthetic copal varnish. After 8-10 hours drying gives rich brilliant effect without extra gloss'.

I should have read this before asking my question..Obviously it's described as a fast drying medium!
However whilst it is from Roberson's and is their Oil painting medium, it doesn't appear to be to the original recipe...Alas.
I rather wish that it did contain the original ingredients, but the description doesn't indicate so...

If you can throw any light on their substitute dryer, it would be most interesting.

thanks,

Brad