WetCanvas
Home Member Services Content Areas Tools Info Center WC Partners Shop Help
Channels:
Search for:
in:

Welcome to the WetCanvas forums. You are currently viewing our boards as a guest which gives you limited access to view most discussions, articles and access our other FREE features. By joining our free community you will have access to post topics, communicate privately with other members (PM), respond to polls, upload your own photos and access many other special features. Registration is fast, simple and absolutely free so please, join our community today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please visit our help center.

Go Back   WetCanvas > Explore Media > Oil Painting > The Technical Forum
User Name
Password
Register Mark Forums Read

Salute to our Partners
WC! Sponsors

Our Sponsors
Reply  
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-04-2019, 05:01 PM
Richard P Richard P is offline
Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,599
 
Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

Hi all,

I'm wondering what the practical differences are between using a dark blue leaning red (PR83, PR177, PR187, PR264, PV19 Violet) compared to a brighter valued red (PR254, PR255, PR188, PR112, maybe PR170)

I've only ever used a brighter red (with PR122 as an additional option), so wondering what effect there would be switching to a darker red when painting most types of scenes (still life, landscape, portrait, etc..)

Cheers,
Richard
Reply With Quote
  #2   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-04-2019, 06:29 PM
Marc Kingsland's Avatar
Marc Kingsland Marc Kingsland is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 438
 
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

I hardly ever need the brighter reds and yellows for my landscapes. (I suppose I'd call them that) I mean one could use them, but I'd always be reducing the chroma to iron oxide levels anyway, so I mostly don't bother with them.

However The first thing that comes to mind with blue reds or orange reds is that the bluish ones are closer to the primary red. Although they also tend to be more transparent as well. (keeping in mind that I use cadmiums) So I find for one reason or another the blue reds to be more flexible.

The only real way to know what works for you is to use it yourself. Not much help I know.
__________________
insert pithy comment here.
Reply With Quote
  #3   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-04-2019, 08:23 PM
Delofasht's Avatar
Delofasht Delofasht is online now
Immortalized
Town of George, Kentucky
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,080
 
Hails from United States
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

Depends on what else is on your palette.
__________________
- Delo

Delofasht
Reply With Quote
  #4   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-05-2019, 02:40 PM
joshuaw joshuaw is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 246
 
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

I mean, this really is a color "theory" question.

Just depends on what hues you need to be within your gamut. Blue leaning reds tend to be darker in mass tone and often transparent, but also quite chromatic so that they can be tinted while retaining color.

If you need to flex a color to lean more purple, or lower the value of a red while retaining some chroma, then they're particularly helpful. Also, given their transparency, they can be used for mixing into a glaze.

I suppose for realistic paintings, if you're trying to limit your palette, you could escape using them. I've used just tiny amounts of my PR177 for my most recent self portrait, and maybe I could've forgone it.

That said, I'm not one to deny myself. I've collected a large range of pigment choices. I enjoy it, and I'm a glutton for paint.
Reply With Quote
  #5   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-05-2019, 04:39 PM
Richard P Richard P is offline
Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jul 2017
Posts: 1,599
 
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

Thanks all, this is useful. I paint realism and mostly portraits, so I don't think I've ever used a bright high-chroma red that's not been reduced in saturation. I normally use Iron oxides for skin colours anyway.

Just curious how well it works. I guess for still lifes and fruit you'd probably need a higher valued chromatic red?
Reply With Quote
  #6   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-05-2019, 04:54 PM
DAK723's Avatar
DAK723 DAK723 is offline
WC! Guide
Rochester, NY
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 12,548
 
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

While lots of folks dislike the concept of warm and cool, since reds and greens are the two colors at the border of warm and cool colors, it is with reds (and greens) that the use of both warm and cooler varieties is most useful, in my opinion. So for example, let's say you are painting something that is a fairly neutral red - some flowers perhaps. In the sunlight, the reds will be warmer (leaning towards orange) and in the shade - or the shadows, the red will lean towards magenta. So, it may depend on the light - and thus both warmer and cooler reds have an important place on your palette.

Don
__________________
Don Ketchek, WC Guide - Pastels

My Blog My Art Gallery My Photo Gallery
Reply With Quote
  #7   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-07-2019, 07:34 PM
Ted Bunker's Avatar
Ted Bunker Ted Bunker is online now
Senior Member
Southern NJ
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 233
 
Hails from United States
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

Describing colors I find using color-bias more practical that warm-cool. But, where I find warm-cool useful is describing low-chroma grays;
- warm gray, red-orangish
- cool gray, bluish
- French gray yellow-greenish
__________________
Radical Fundemunsellist
Reply With Quote
  #8   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-07-2019, 08:08 PM
Delofasht's Avatar
Delofasht Delofasht is online now
Immortalized
Town of George, Kentucky
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 4,080
 
Hails from United States
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

My question was really geared toward understanding what limitations you are placing on your own palette, as the difference it will make in your work will greatly depend on how a dark valued blue leaning red is going to work with what you have on the palette. If you lack a strong orange or orange leaning yellow, the access to oranges from yellow and a blue leaning red will be much more limited and not very light valued while intensely colorful.

If you do not have an orange leaning yellow at all, every orange mixed will end up muted and unable to achieve the intensity needed for some fairly common lighting conditions, like candle or lamp lit skin which often needs very pale and highly chromatic oranges.

Edit: Assuming you are painting directly and not glazing, which a number of transparent pigments can achieve that by glazing over light valued underpainting.
__________________
- Delo

Delofasht
Reply With Quote
  #9   Report Bad Post  
Old 12-09-2019, 03:41 PM
Ed Hopper Ed Hopper is offline
New Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2019
Posts: 14
 
Re: Differences between using a dark blue leaning red compared to a bright red

Quote:
Originally Posted by Richard P
Thanks all, this is useful. I paint realism and mostly portraits, so I don't think I've ever used a bright high-chroma red that's not been reduced in saturation. I normally use Iron oxides for skin colours anyway.

Just curious how well it works. I guess for still lifes and fruit you'd probably need a higher valued chromatic red?

Paul Foxton talks about fruit in one of his videos and how to nail them using the Munsell system but getting the reds especially.. Here you go Apples.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v4ssIOhS8DQ
Reply With Quote

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:58 AM.


© 2014 F+W All rights reserved.