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Old 08-19-2004, 01:33 AM
brianwelshman brianwelshman is offline
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Do I, now have copyright?

Hi Guys,
I use photos that are in `public domain`,(permission to copy, checked out) as the `model` for my work. When I put the work up on my `picture trail, web site` I always put COPYRIGHT PROTECTED with the work.
A friend has suggested that I cannot have copyright to the drawing, as I didn`t own the copyright of the photograph.
What do you think??
Cheers brian

See my artwork at
http://www.PictureTrail.com/brianart
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Old 08-19-2004, 12:43 PM
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CarlyHardy CarlyHardy is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

If you have permission to use the photographs as references for your work, then yes, when the painting is created, you have copyright to that painting. The copyright is yours even if you don't register it with the copyright office. Registration is important should someone copy your work without your permission and you need to establish a legal claim.

All the photos in the WetCanvas! library are free to use as references. If you paint using one of them, you own the copyright to your artwork. What you cannot do is reproduce the images as photos....that copyright belongs to the original photographer.

I think what your friend is confusing with copyright is originality. I don't enjoy painting from someone else's photo because I feel the work isn't as original as it would be if the photos were ones that I had taken myself. I also prefer working from life rather than from photos.

carly
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Old 08-19-2004, 05:33 PM
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Rusalka Rusalka is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

How useful is it really to say he has copyright, if the original photo is in the public domain?

He cannot claim exclusive rights to the image if it is a realistic copy of the photo. He would never be able to prove that someone copied his painting or drawing rather than the original image. All it serves to do is to mislead people that the image is his to copyright.
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Old 08-20-2004, 12:41 AM
brianwelshman brianwelshman is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

Thanks for replying guys,
Carly: Out of interest, the statement with these photos is; Reproduction (photocopying, hand-held camera copying, photoduplication and other forms of copying allowed by "fair use"):
Also, you say about "photos in the Wet Canvas Library" I`ve never been there, so thanks, thats another place of interest at WC
I also would like to only use my own photos, but as my favourite subject is Native Americans, that`s the only way left open to me. (I`m from Wales)
Rusalka: I understand what your saying that it might `mislead` people that the photo/image is my copyright; But I just wanted to stop people from `making print copies` of my drawing, and saying it was theirs.
I can prove which is my own drawing, but if someone would prefer to use my drawing version as a `model` rather than the original photograph I would regard that as a compliment.
The only reason that I can think of for doing that though, would be to save them the bother of looking for `public domain images` themselves
Thanks guys, brian
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Old 06-06-2017, 09:12 PM
rw1 rw1 is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

LOL , once something is in the public domain it's their for good . NO you cannot claim copyright .

Last edited by rw1 : 06-06-2017 at 09:17 PM.
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Old 06-06-2017, 10:29 PM
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Cindy Schnackel Cindy Schnackel is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

You own the copyright only to new creative elements you added in your version of a public domain piece. This page on Public Domain Sherpa is pretty good though I have seen a better explanation that dealt more with painting, just can't find it right now: http://www.publicdomainsherpa.com/derivative-work.html I researched this very topic a few years back for a related issue, altered thrift store art, but in my case wasn't making reproductions, I was adding new elements. Courts have not favored copyright ownership in exact replicas (such as a photo or scan) of public domain art. https://hyperallergic.com/261496/uk-...-are-fair-use/ Whether or not a painted replication would be that exact, I dunno, depends!
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Old 06-06-2017, 11:30 PM
webart webart is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

If it was painted or drawn by hand you own the copyright to the artwork no matter if it's copied from a public domain photo. Art is as individual as a signature so even if someone else also made a painting of the same photo you'd still be able to tell the difference between the paintings.
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Old 06-08-2017, 05:08 PM
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Cindy Schnackel Cindy Schnackel is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

Quote:
Originally Posted by webart
If it was painted or drawn by hand you own the copyright to the artwork no matter if it's copied from a public domain photo. Art is as individual as a signature so even if someone else also made a painting of the same photo you'd still be able to tell the difference between the paintings.

I assume you mean if it was copied from a public domain piece, right? Because if it was copied from something that was not in the public domain, it'd be a "derivative work" which is infringement if the work it's derived from is still someone's copyright. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/106
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Old 06-12-2017, 05:06 PM
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Use Her Name Use Her Name is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy Schnackel
I assume you mean if it was copied from a public domain piece, right? Because if it was copied from something that was not in the public domain, it'd be a "derivative work" which is infringement if the work it's derived from is still someone's copyright. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/106

Exactly, because a lot of artists fail to see that a photographer is also an artist, and the photograph is an expression of the photographer's art work.

If you were to copy a photograph of "an eagle" at the San Diego Zoo from a picture taken by a person and posted on-line, it would be their work. If you were to go to the San Diego Zoo, and take a picture of the exact same eagle, in the exact same pose, it would be your work. When someone says that the photo they took is "free" for all use (public domain), then you can use it. Sometimes the Creative Commons people say that you must give them a picture credit.

Derivative, or sampling takes place where you look at the eagle picture and see that you like the other artist's picture of the glint in the eye of the eagle better, and then insert the other artist's eye glint into your picture.

Either way, it is always far better to use your own sources.
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Old 06-13-2017, 03:31 AM
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freakstyle freakstyle is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy Schnackel
I assume you mean if it was copied from a public domain piece, right? Because if it was copied from something that was not in the public domain, it'd be a "derivative work" which is infringement if the work it's derived from is still someone's copyright. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/106

The OP clearly stated that they only use public domain stuff, so this isn't relevant.

webart is correct. When you create an artwork that is (I believe) 85% different from the original piece, you own the copyright of your artwork. A different medium counts as this.

Copyright is a strange thing anyway. You don't have to register it: The moment you have created it, you own the copyright. The only issue is proving that you have come up with the idea/artwork before someone else, but this is pretty easy to do with the internet nowadays, as posting WIP photos online gives us proof of when it was created. Another way to do this, is by mailing the artwork to yourself.
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Old 06-14-2017, 03:26 PM
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Cindy Schnackel Cindy Schnackel is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

No, actually, there is no percent in the law, about how much you can change it to make it legal. That's a myth. And mailing things to yourself is also a myth. Here are two good articles on copyright myths:

http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html

http://www.theiplawblog.com/2011/01/...pyright-myths/

Registration, while optional, is required to sue for statutory damages and legal fees in court, and official registration thru the govt is the only registration that counts if you had to sue anyone. Suing without it is very difficult, so having copyright in your work simply by creating it is true but only half the story.

Also, my comment about public domain is not irrelevant because many people believe other myths, too, like 'everything online is public domain,' which it isn't. There are also sites offering images, claiming they're public domain, that aren't, because the site and/or infringing 3rd party members exposed copyright protected images there. Here is a good article on Public Domain Myths: http://www.publicdomainsherpa.com/10...ic-domain.html


Quote:
Originally Posted by freakstyle
The OP clearly stated that they only use public domain stuff, so this isn't relevant.

webart is correct. When you create an artwork that is (I believe) 85% different from the original piece, you own the copyright of your artwork. A different medium counts as this.

Copyright is a strange thing anyway. You don't have to register it: The moment you have created it, you own the copyright. The only issue is proving that you have come up with the idea/artwork before someone else, but this is pretty easy to do with the internet nowadays, as posting WIP photos online gives us proof of when it was created. Another way to do this, is by mailing the artwork to yourself.
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Old 06-14-2017, 10:39 PM
webart webart is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

The original question was if you can claim copyright on a painting you made from a photo to which you do not own copyright. If the answer is "no", does that mean if you used someone's copyrighted photo with their permission to make a painting, the photographer then owns copyright to your painting along with the copyright to his photo? That wouldn't make much sense to me.
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Old 06-15-2017, 01:57 AM
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~JMW~ ~JMW~ is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

Quote:
Originally Posted by brianwelshman
Hi Guys,
I use photos that are in `public domain`,(permission to copy, checked out) as the `model` for my work. When I put the work up on my `picture trail, web site` I always put COPYRIGHT PROTECTED with the work.

A friend has suggested that I cannot have copyright to the drawing, as I didn`t own the copyright of the photograph.
What do you think??

Cheers brian

See my artwork at
http://www.PictureTrail.com/brianart

Basically , Your friend is wrong... your own work has your copyright..
Beyond that - from my reading if the ref image was true public domain/free to use, you should be in the clear to sell your work..
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Old 06-15-2017, 05:06 AM
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freakstyle freakstyle is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cindy Schnackel
No, actually, there is no percent in the law, about how much you can change it to make it legal. That's a myth. And mailing things to yourself is also a myth. Here are two good articles on copyright myths

Ok, this was something that was used in the market that I sold stuff in (recasting there is rampant), so I thought the people who mentioned that knew what they were talking about. Learned something again.

EDIT: I checked, and in the Netherlands there is something called 'style protection', where it is allowed to be inspired by a certain style/piece/object, but you have to be very careful not to implement too many of the same features. This law is mostly meant to protect fashion and non-art products.
Since in the Netherlands BJD's aren't considered art, but toys, this is probably why the percentage rule was being discussed among creators, to make sure you're not creating pieces that are too similar to another.

Quote:
Registration, while optional, is required to sue for statutory damages and legal fees in court, and official registration thru the govt is the only registration that counts if you had to sue anyone. Suing without it is very difficult, so having copyright in your work simply by creating it is true but only half the story.

Well, no. In many countries (like mine), registration of copyright is only a method of making sure there isn't any doubt when your artwork was created, but it isn't the only one. If you can proof the work is yours, by showing wip-pictures on your camera (or on your computer... the images contain much more information than just the image), that is considered enough. Which is why I was stressing the 'make wip-pictures of your work'.

So, this is something everyone needs to check for themselves.

The main downside is that today there is a big chance you're dealing with an international case. Someone in country X found your image on the internet and is now making copies for their own gain. From what I've learned in the BJD-hobby, international copyright law is still in its infancy, mostly because of the differences between countries. There are quite a few bjd-makers being recasted. None of them can do anything about it, even if they have proof. In the few cases where recasting lead to a specific company, that company was based in China and when ordered to shut down, they simply started another business in another town or street.
Sueing someone is expensive and most simply don't have the funds.

Last edited by freakstyle : 06-15-2017 at 05:19 AM.
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Old 06-16-2017, 06:33 PM
contumacious contumacious is offline
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Re: Do I, now have copyright?

Confusion like this is why some of my artist friends will only paint from their own photographs. I am considering doing the same. That way you never have to be concerned in the least about any copyright infringements or proper permissions.
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