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Old 09-04-2018, 09:33 AM
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MarialenaS MarialenaS is offline
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Royal Blue

Can someone tell me please what is the colour code of Royal Blue. It is a PB .. what?
Which blue is the so called Royal Blue?
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Old 09-04-2018, 09:44 AM
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iamdaie iamdaie is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

Have u tried asking the office of the royal family? Maybe they can help
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Old 09-04-2018, 10:16 AM
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Watercollar Watercollar is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

Hi Marialena, there was a "Royal Blue" dye originating in 18th century.

Some watercolour paint manufacturers (Holbein) call PB60 Royal Blue (the dark version) and Sennelier and Shinhan use PW6 to create a lighter shade based on phthalos and PB66 indigo...

I'd be very interested to know if you find out more.
I wonder if PB60 was actually invented in the 1700's and not patented until 1901... a far fetched theory perhaps
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Old 09-04-2018, 10:26 AM
Catspeare Catspeare is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

I have the Holbein Royal Blue PB60 -

PB60—Indanthrene Blue

Pigment Type- organic, vat dyes

Chemical Name- complex, insoluble anthraquinone

Chemical Formula- C28H14N2O4

Properties- Indanthrene Blue is a clear, clean, deep blue organic pigment. It has moderate to high tinting strength and is not as overpowering as Phthalo Blue. Hansa Yellow Deep, Benzimidazolone Orange, and Raw Umber are its best mixing complements.-

Permanence-
Indanthrene Blue is permanent with excellent lightfastness in both masstone and tints.

Toxicity- Indanthrene Blue varies in its acute toxicity, though toxicity is generally slight.

History- Indanthrene Blue is the oldest vat dye, discovered and patented in 1901 by Rene Bohn. It is considered the first anthraquinone vat dye, a group of dyes characterized by excellent lightfastness. The pigment originates from this dye.

Alternate Names- Indanthrone.

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Old 09-04-2018, 10:48 AM
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iamdaie iamdaie is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

i have a rowney version...how is it differ from ultramarine?
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Old 09-04-2018, 11:02 AM
learning to paint learning to paint is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

I just browsed Wikipedia for Royal Blue. The writers do not speak in terms of pigments, so your question is reduced to a marketing question for artists who buy paint from a variety of suppliers. I do not believe there is any sort of Royal Blue standard, but instead, a collection of different colors. This becomes more complicated because there is, apparently, a web version of Royal Blue which differs quite a lot from the version used in print.
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Old 09-04-2018, 12:59 PM
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savras savras is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

I couldn't find any watercolor with name Royal Blue. But I can safely assume that there is no such single-pigment paint known by other more popular name anyways.

There are some oil paints with the exact name all of which are mixtures of white plus blue (either ultramarine, or cobalt blue, or cerulean).
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Old 09-04-2018, 01:45 PM
indraneel indraneel is online now
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Re: Royal Blue

Royal blue is a color name, not a dye name, nor a pigment name.
PBxx stands for Pigment Blue xx.
So no, Royal blue will not have a PB color index. You need to know the actual pigment name to find the CI.
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Old 09-04-2018, 02:30 PM
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Delofasht Delofasht is online now
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Re: Royal Blue

Artiscreation is an excellent resource for finding a specific color. . . go to blues, try ctrl+f to open search page, type in Royal, then quickly click through the next find until you see a color by a manufacturer that has Royal blue and look at the pigment used by that manufacturer. Tada!

Kind of surprised that so many artists struggle to utilize the resources we have available online.

Of the available pigments, many are used for that name, from PB15:2 or 15:3 all the way to PB60 and everything in between. That said, of all the pigments sometimes referred to as Royal Blue, I only saw PB60 being used by a watercolor manufacturer and that was Holbein. Of course this is only for single pigment colors, surely there are plenty of mixes that represent it and utilize any number of blue pigments. Fun, fun.
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Old 09-04-2018, 02:34 PM
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Re: Royal Blue

Quote:
Originally Posted by iamdaie
i have a rowney version...how is it differ from ultramarine?

Indanthrene blue is a deep dark non granulating blue. Not as dark as indigo.
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Old 09-04-2018, 04:25 PM
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Re: Royal Blue

In one of his intro-level videos on YouTube, Rick Surowicz states that the "Royal Blue" which he is referring to is actually ... can't remember what, sorry ... a specific pigment that I was familiar with. It was probably Indanthrene, IIRC. But you can check him out, he's on YouTube.
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Old 09-04-2018, 05:10 PM
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MarialenaS MarialenaS is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

Thank you all for the replies.
Royal Blue is not Intanthrone blue, it doesn't look the same, but I was unable to find any information about what is consistent of. What is the pigment that it is made.
@Delo not even at Artiscreation that is an updated database.

Royal blue is supposed to be this colour:



while intanthrone is supposed to be this one:



I'm asking just from curiosity because I read somewhere about this blue but I haven't seen this hue in a watercolour paint.

It looks a lot though like my Smalt pigment. Quite close and that is the reason I asked. Perhaps my Smalt blue that is supposed to be a PB32 ( supposed because no one can be certain about this) it is a Royal Blue.
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Old 09-04-2018, 05:15 PM
indraneel indraneel is online now
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Re: Royal Blue

Well, now that you mention, MR ZBUKVIC has Royal Blue on his palette shown in the DVD "Watercolor on Location". Since he did/does use Holbein, that may be it... Holbein Royal Blue.

So apparently, it seems Mr Z and Marialena both have some similarity in their choice of colors!!!
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Old 09-04-2018, 05:50 PM
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MarialenaS MarialenaS is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

But the question is what is this royal blue made of.
I say that my blue is a Smalt as it looks like a French Ultramarine in steroids! But the Royal Blue seems to be a completely different colour.

The Holbein one is an Indanthrone blue marketed as Royal Blue. But the real Royal Blue doesn't look that bright.

We have a mystery here....hm.
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Old 09-04-2018, 06:27 PM
Philologist Philologist is offline
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Re: Royal Blue

It is the same problem as the one emerging in that other thread, where you people were discussing about transparent colours and ended up talking about alizarin. Alizarin is both a colour (#E32636 or 227, 38, 54 in sRGB) and a pigment (pr83). Actually it existed as a colour and colourant way before it was synthesized as that pigment. But it has a long cultural history and exists in pretty much every European language (that I speak and I am familiar with, at least) that it cannot be confined to the relatively modern identification with the synthetic pigment pr83: it is a colour -a word in our "visual" vocabulary- indeed, just like cerulean, viridian, sienna etc (unlike chenistry terms like indanthrone, phthalocyanine, quinacridone etc). So, you can *say* that you use alizarin while using pr264. That's why companies (like Sennelier, Cotman and Renesan for example) are legitimised to use (and do use indeed) the term (without the addition of the hue denomination) to label a product that does NOT contain pr83.

Back on topic, royal blue is a colour, not a pigment. Actually it is two colours, emerging in two different historical occurrences. Originally royal blue was the colour of the fleur-de-lis in the French royal court, the colour of the emperor's clothes etc. It was made by a plethora of materials, ranging from dyes used to colour the clothes of kings to the pigment of lapis lazuli. It was purpley, the colour of the most pure (and expensive) parts of lazuli which coincides with the rough milled modern french ultramarine (pb29 but of the French varieties, unlike the greenish DS ultramarine or Schmincke's finest). But it was not necessarily made out of a specific pigment, it was a colour first and foremost. Original smalt, simply put cobalt and glass shards melted together, fell right under the category of royal blue and was used as such by many artists of the time.
A paler purpley blue was called queen blue, for obvious reasons. This (or roughly this) colour, about a century ago, became the colour of the fountain pen inks, which must be made very diluted or else the feed will clog. This pale warm blue was also called royal blue, probably because queen blue would not stick well with all the male merchants and male scholars who bought and used it. Patriarchal achromatopsia?
In any case, because of this fountain pen colour, which to this date is the standard fountain pen ink for every major brand, we end up with colours like Holbein and Sennelier Royal blue (also DS Lavender I believe) which are very pale, include white, are nothing like the colours of Louis but refer to that second hue named royal blue.

Edit because of dreaded AutoCorrect.

Last edited by Philologist : 09-04-2018 at 06:32 PM.

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