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Old 08-29-2018, 10:33 AM
ArtMaybe ArtMaybe is offline
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Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

I'm American and intend to sell to customers in the USA, where we do not rely on the Metric System. Assume my paintings sell for $500 each.

a) There are standard frame sizes.

b) There are standard-length frame components for making DIY frames.

c) A canvas or panel can be sized to match one-inch increments, such as 24x28" or 36x30".

d) A canvas or panel can be sized to any dimension that suits the artist, with no regard for standard incremental sizing.


I intend to deliver original paintings unframed:

Do buyers of original art tend to have the work custom framed?
If so, would fractional dimensions such as a side that measures 23-3/8" (instead of 23" or 24") result in a price increase for the framing job?

Or do buyers of original art tend to buy standard-sized frames?

Or are they more likely to buy frame components (pre-cut side pieces) and assemble their own frames (from sides that adhere to one-inch increments).

Thanks
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Old 08-29-2018, 11:17 AM
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virgil carter virgil carter is online now
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

This is an age-old question, with no common, agreed-upon answer. Every painter, in every medium, follows their own preferences.

In my experience, folks who purchase artwork, either:

1) Prefer to have their own custom frames made to fit the painting, so that they match their sofa; or

2) Sometimes buy the painting framed by the artist (but not nearly so often).

Good luck!

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Old 08-29-2018, 12:18 PM
theBongolian theBongolian is online now
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

what would be the reason to paint on non-standard size supports? Why not produce a product that will allow the customer to use all options?

When you buy a 4x8 sheet of hardboard and try to maximize every bit to make standard sized panels, you discover that you can't since the saw blade removes too much material. I've tried to "cheat" by splitting the loss up, so each panel is just slightly undersized - since a frame allows a panel to be up to 1/4" undersized. But you're playing with fire when you do that. Better to just scrap a few inches of hardboard and go on with your life -imo.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:24 PM
ArtMaybe ArtMaybe is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by virgil carter
In my experience, folks who purchase artwork, either:

1) Prefer to have their own custom frames made to fit the painting, so that they match their sofa

2) Sometimes buy the painting framed by the artist (but not nearly so often).
To match the sofa. Just as I thought! I figure that's as good an excuse as any for me to NOT take on any framing responsibilities.

And I'm glad your experience suggests that patrons don't expect to receive a framed painting.
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Old 08-29-2018, 12:39 PM
ArtMaybe ArtMaybe is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by theBongolian
what would be the reason to paint on non-standard size supports? Why not produce a product that will allow the customer to use all options?
I think certain proportions are important in creating powerful, lasting works of art. For example, Johannes Vermeer's paintings are often a 1:1.14 ratio, width to height (if I recall correctly).

Quote:
Originally Posted by theBongolian
When you buy a 4x8 sheet of hardboard and try to maximize every bit to make standard sized panels, you discover that you can't...better to just scrap a few inches of hardboard and go on with your life -imo.
Yeah, once again you and I are on the same page. I paint on hardboard panels cut from 4x8' sheets on a table saw. I do like to make best use of the material but 1/8" hardboard is not expensive, so a little waste is okay.

If patrons are likely to opt for custom framing, it seems that non-standard panel dimensions wouldn't matter, right?

My table saw blade cuts an 1/8" kerf, and sometimes the sheet's factory edge is a bit buggered, so I'm never able to get two full-sized 24" panels from a 48" sheet width. But in terms of framing, is it a problem for a 24x24" panel to be a quarter inch shy - actually 23-3/4 x 23-3/4" ?

I figure a panel that's slightly smaller shouldn't pose a problem, as the small gap can be filled easily in the frame's rabbet...
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Old 08-29-2018, 01:03 PM
Harold Roth Harold Roth is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Rabbets would probably cover that but the panel might be loose in the frame. Also, if you're short 1/4" on each side, that means when it gets put in the frame, the bottom will be flush but the top will be 1/2" short because gravity.

Everything I've seen recommends painting in sizes that will work with standard frames. Some places have more standard frame sizes than others, especially for instance square, but I have noticed recently frames for panoramas becoming standard in some outlets (which might also go a ways to explain why people aren't buying so much art--they are making their own with photos from their phones, including panoramas).
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Old 08-29-2018, 01:09 PM
steveo2015 steveo2015 is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

I paint in standard and not standard sizes. I always try to frame anything that is going to a gallery. It just makes a better presentation.
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Old 08-29-2018, 02:38 PM
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Since shows and galleries now accept gallery wrapped canvas in 1 1/2 inch depth, I use those. If the customer wants to frame, it's still possible. I stay with standard sizes most of the time, but have cut boards for commissions. Usually I include framing in that price and if the client wants to have it reframed, that's up to them.
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Old 08-30-2018, 11:21 AM
ArtMaybe ArtMaybe is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harold Roth
Also, if you're short 1/4" on each side, that means when it gets put in the frame, the bottom will be flush but the top will be 1/2" short because gravity.
Hey, Harold. Thanks for your reply. I doubt I'll be 1/4" short on each side, but consider this: I'm sure it's not how a custom frame shop would handle it, but two half-inch long beads of hot melt glue injected into the frame's rabbet at the bottom of the panel would fill the void/gap perfectly, and would ensure that the painted panel does not settle to the bottom. A quick, cheap and effective solution.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Harold Roth
Everything I've seen recommends painting in sizes that will work with standard frames. Some places have more standard frame sizes than others
Yes, common sense suggests what you mention here. But sometimes I'm drawn to unique proportions, and then there are the "Vermeer Proportions" as mentioned above...

As for people making their own large-scale panoramas, I figure that's a whole different animal. People who put that over the sofa might want a "real painting" for another location/application, or might not appreciate paintings at all...
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Old 08-30-2018, 11:23 AM
ArtMaybe ArtMaybe is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by steveo2015
I paint in standard and not standard sizes. I always try to frame anything that is going to a gallery. It just makes a better presentation.
Thanks, Steve. If I EVER get a gallery to take me on ( ) I'll have to consider that.
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Old 08-30-2018, 11:31 AM
ArtMaybe ArtMaybe is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by CarlyHardy
Since shows and galleries now accept gallery wrapped canvas in 1 1/2 inch depth, I use those. If the customer wants to frame, it's still possible. I stay with standard sizes most of the time, but have cut boards for commissions. Usually I include framing in that price and if the client wants to have it reframed, that's up to them.
Thanks, Carly. I paint on panel with wood cradling behind. For smaller works the overal thickness is 1/8" + 3/4" = 7/8"
Not deep enough for the Gallery Wrap option.
And no canvas to wrap, so I'm outta luck.

At this point I don't want to add framing to my responsibilities, so I'm glad to hang my hat on your closing statement, "If the client wants to have it (re)framed, that's up to them."
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Old 08-30-2018, 12:18 PM
Harold Roth Harold Roth is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtMaybe
Hey, Harold. Thanks for your reply. I doubt I'll be 1/4" short on each side, but consider this: I'm sure it's not how a custom frame shop would handle it, but two half-inch long beads of hot melt glue injected into the frame's rabbet at the bottom of the panel would fill the void/gap perfectly, and would ensure that the painted panel does not settle to the bottom. A quick, cheap and effective solution.
Yeah, but I guess it just sounds like more work to me. I do not saw up my own panels, either. I don't even gesso stuff myself anymore, if I can help it.

Quote:
Yes, common sense suggests what you mention here. But sometimes I'm drawn to unique proportions, and then there are the "Vermeer Proportions" as mentioned above...
I personally really love the 1:2 proportion, but I found out it is not easy to get paper for good prints if it's, say, 18 x 36", which is a size I love. Even reducing it to 12 x 24" means having to buy a roll and cutting it up, etc. So I am not going to be using that size canvas anymore.

Quote:
As for people making their own large-scale panoramas, I figure that's a whole different animal. People who put that over the sofa might want a "real painting" for another location/application, or might not appreciate paintings at all...
True. Someone mentioned elsewhere about the photos from phones, and I have to say that I know a number of people who do not consider themselves artists or photographers who take amazingly good photos with their phone. Then seeing the panorama printers and how you could get it mounted on a panel, I thought, sheesh. No way to compete with that sort of thing.
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Old 08-30-2018, 01:12 PM
theBongolian theBongolian is online now
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ArtMaybe
Thanks, Carly. I paint on panel with wood cradling behind. For smaller works the overal thickness is 1/8" + 3/4" = 7/8"
Not deep enough for the Gallery Wrap option.
And no canvas to wrap, so I'm outta luck.
You can mount your 1/8" panel on 1"x2" on the 2" side (which is actually 1.5" - sometimes a little less depending on supply) - So you end up with a cradled panel that is right at 1.5". No need to "wrap" just paint or stain the cradle.
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Old 08-30-2018, 01:29 PM
theBongolian theBongolian is online now
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

If I were to make a non-standard sized painting I would be sure to cradle or float frame it so the customer would not be forced to buy a custom frame.

On a related note - I've bought used frames that I thought were one size, but when I got home and measured them turned out to be custom frames made to a near - but not standard size. - now i know to ALWAYS measure a used frame before buying.
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Old 08-30-2018, 05:51 PM
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RobinZ RobinZ is offline
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Re: Painting Size: Standard frame dimensions, or free-form sizes?

I sell all of my paintings unframed, in mostly standard sizes.

I doubt many people use the frame thingies where they have to put it together themselves. I've had to coach them how to use a store bought standard frame.

I sell the gallery wrapped, too.

I sell only online so if I sold in person, I would frame, I think. But nice, standard sized ones.

I also have bought frames that didn't fit anything! I do know how to stretch my own canvas, but unless the frame was spectacular, don't think I would use it. They are in the attic, the graveyard for "someday" projects!
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