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gunzorro
11-22-2009, 05:44 PM
How’s this for timing? Almost exactly one year ago (Nov 17, 2008), I posted my introduction to Blue Ridge paints.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=530314&highlight=blue+ridge+paint

Last Friday (two days ago), I received a selection of Blue Ridge paints (provided by the manufacturer, for those keeping score on integrity points).

I immediately noticed the labels on the tubes look better, and the tubes were jam-packed with paint. Still no color sample on the label, but excellent nonetheless. Packaging for shipment of the individual tubes was better as well.

I was so excited to try them out that at around 10:30PM on Friday night (supposedly just before going to bed), I started a sheet, mixing some of my main interests. I’d been told by Eric Silver (who knows of my dislike of gritty paints) that the natural earths he makes are on the gritty side. Still, I wanted to see for myself. That’s why the Burnt Umber is at the top of the list.

I was also very interested in the Smalt.

I needed to unscrew the caps to see what the paint looked like (the downside of no color swatch label), so why not try some out? Before long, I was knee deep in colors and checking (briefly) against other brands.

My intention is to do a true A-B comparison against other brands, leaning on the Premium lines. That will involve more time and energy and a somewhat disciplined approach. All of which I was not in the mood for on a late Friday night, and this comparison is done to satisfy my personal curiosity.

By the time I was nearly done with this sheet, and having a few questions for Eric (and wanting to show him), I realized I had a document that could provide insights of its own, reflecting on the Blue Ridge paint brand.

My main conclusion from working with these paints is that the product is considerably improved from what I evaluated around a year ago. At that time, I had a few issues with the consistency and handling from pigment to pigment, and a general stiffness or waxiness and slight dullness to the finish. I rated it as belonging in the Artist Grade paints, but not up to the standard I consider allow a paint brand to be considered Premium Grade.

After working for a few hours with these paints, I’m happy to say I can endorse Eric’s hard work and consider his paint line to be in the entry level of the Premium lines that include Michael Harding, Old Holland, Blockx, Vasari, and others. I’ll back this up in the next few days and weeks with direct comparisons to these and other well known brands like Winsor Newton Artist. Congratulations to Eric Silver!

**************

Here are the colors on the chart, along with my initial impressions. Blue Ridge Flemish White used throughout the mixes.

Left column
Burnt Umber – Yes, it is gritty and has a granular/matte type finish. But the color is wonderful, reminding me very much of Blockx’s Burnt Umber (we’ll see later if I am right).

Smalt – An ancient pigment made from blue cobalt glass crystals. Gritty and a weak tinter, but that is to be expected and not unusual. This paint is wonderfully brilliant and would be excellent for painting detail on Wedgewood china, for one thing. A special paint, but excellent at what it is intended for.

Orange Ochre – A natural pigment paint that is under consideration for addition to the Blue Ridge line. I like it very much, leading to some of the later flesh-colored mixes in the right column. Nice consistency and handling and not gritty, slightly matte finish.

Cadmium Black – This pigment is new to me. Eric has said it is cadmium selenide, but I don’t see this on my list of black pigments. Could there be an error? Could it be Cobalt Black? The jury is out collecting info (readers: please share I you have any info). Regardless, the paint is a near-black with a Value around 1 to 1.5, noticeably not “black”. The color is cool when mixed with white – lovely color with great handling and consistency.

Cerulean Blue – Recent pigment acquisition. Very light, bright blue color PB35. A bit matte in finish and waxy in mixing, but not uncommon for Cerulean pigments. Lacks the dull greyness of OH Cerulean, but consistency is similar.

Cad Yellow Light – Absolutely one of the best and most archetypical Cad Yellow Lights I have ever used. Nearly as bright as Cad Lemon, but without the greenish tang. Consistency is awesome, blending is great and pigment is strong as any cadmium should be. Slight matte surface finish. I am so impressed with this paint – I highly recommend it.

Cobalt Violet Deep – As good as any I have in my collection. Warrants comparison test.

Ivory Black “genuine” – another experimental paint, not on the list. Not fully genuine, but needs a name if it goes into production. This paint contains genuine Ivory Black (so I’m told), plus Charcoal Black and Quinacridone Red (cancels the bluish tint). This is a gritty, somewhat mushy/juicy paint with nearly neutral characteristics. (Personally, I think if Eric is going to do a mix, he should think about making a few Neutral Greys, like Value 3, 5 and 7, or 4-6-8, – what do you readers think?) This one is under consideration, but I was pleased to see it.

Center column

Cadmium Vermilion – What Doak called “genuine Vermilion”, Eric is more aptly calling cadmium, and until positive chemical testing is done, I agree the paint is most likely cadmium. Outside of that debate, this is a wonderful, brilliant creamy-rich color. I strongly recommend it and hold it in as high opinion as the Cad Yellow Light above.

Cad Red Light – Pretty, perhaps more red than some brands. It has a slightly waxy consistency (very slight) and slightly matte appearance. Not as exciting as the Cad Vermilion, but still very nice.

Cad Red Medium Select – This one is listed as a special paint, and I agree. I have an older tube of David Davis Cad Red (medium) that is losing its handling due to use and aging in the tube (losing its stringiness and getting a touch rubbery). It has been my “go-to” Ferrari Red color. Now this one makes a more than suitable replacement. Amazing consistency and mild gloss finish – super vivid. Another super-premium paint.

Ultramarine Blue (medium) – Like many/most UMBs, this one is slightly waxy due to the needed stabilizers. Color, tinting strength and handling are similar to the Old Holland versions I favor. I wish I had had this a few days earlier to include in my UMB comparison – it’s that good.

Cobalt Blue – Light and vivid, it begs to be compared to the best. Good handling and semi-gloss finish.

Burnt Sienna – Deep brown, semi-opaque. I’m curious to see how this stacks up against Vasari’s version. Similar to Vasari, it is quite loose and fluid, but has good tinting strength. Listed as a natural pigment PBr6.

Mars Red – Wonderfully warm and mixes into great flesh tones. Very nice red, rivaling Mussini English Red and Vasari Mars Red – must compare! Smooth consistency and great tinting strength.

Sepia – Another experimental consideration for including into the line. This color is a mixture of ivory black and azo burnt orange, matching Doak’s formulation. Produces a wonderful near-grey that is almost a purple.

Right column

Florentine Lake – a mix of Ruby Pyrol PR264 and Quinacridone Violet PV19, the same pigments as Blockx Carmine (proportions may be different). Very good consistency – not runny or overly waxy, with smooth semi-gloss finish.

Yellow Ochre – Perhaps this seems boring to include, but a lot can be learned from a paint maker by studying the simpler, cheaper paints in the line, like Yellow Ochre. This version is synthetic “Mars-type” PY42, but not as greenish as some. Tinting strength is not overpowering (which I find a plus)and the consistency is very good to excellent with semi-gloss finish.

The next section is a series of mixes featuring earth colors in approximations of useful flesh tones:
Yellow Ochre + Orange Ochre (predominately Orange Ochre, about 3:1)
Orange Ochre + Mars Red (same proportions as above)
Yellow Ochre + Mars Red (equal proportions)
Orange Ochre + Cad Vermilion (about 1:4 ratio)
Burnt Umber + Florentine Lake (about twice as much BU)

Terra Rosa -- Finally, another experimental color, not yet listed in the product line. This is a synthetic, similar to the Mars Red in color and tinting strength, but slightly more orange. This might be an even better choice for skin colors. Very nice handling with semi-gloss finish.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/IMG_7984web.jpg

I'll have some A-B comparisons in the very near future, showing how directly compares with other premium brands.

Feel free to ask question or post comments. :)

sidbledsoe
11-22-2009, 06:59 PM
Nice timing Jim, my shipment is coming tomorrow and you covered all the colors I got! Also will try his newer copal medium. About the cadmium black, that is no longer listed in his colors but now there is a cadmium brown. There is a cadmium brown pr108 http://www.artiscreation.com/red.html
which must be a very brown shade, could this be the very same color and Eric has just renamed it? Thanks a lot!

monkhaus
11-22-2009, 08:18 PM
There's been a Cadmium Brown from Blue Ridge for awhile. It looks significantly different than the Cadmium Black.

TheBaron
11-22-2009, 08:30 PM
Last Friday (two days ago), I received a selection of Blue Ridge paints (provided by the manufacturer, for those keeping score on integrity points).

:)

I knew you were a tester for the paint manufacturers Gunz.:p

No wonder you can stock up the shelves so easy.:D

monkhaus
11-22-2009, 09:12 PM
Oh, at IAS it's listed as Cadmium Black too. Also, though I've removed almost all of my cadmiums... that Select and Cad Yellow Light look nice enough they might make it back in.

On the Gen Ivory Black, what would be wrong with just making it as is? How bluish is it when tinted as a single pigment color that it needs to be "messed" with by adding to it? (Not rhetorical, I really don't have a clue.)

sidbledsoe
11-22-2009, 09:22 PM
On the Gen Ivory Black, what would be wrong with just making it as is? How bluish is it when tinted as a single pigment color that it needs to be "messed" with by adding to it?
I don't know for sure but I would guess because the cost may be extraordinarily high if made purely from ivory. This type thing has been done with genuine lapis lazuli.

monkhaus
11-22-2009, 10:36 PM
Makes good sense.

gunzorro
11-23-2009, 12:40 AM
George -- These and a few tubes of Harding, Blockx and WN I recently received are all I've gotten for "free", in exchange for the opportunity to evaluate.

You and the other readers are the beneficiaries of my generosity otherwise -- I've bought all the other paints I talk about, from Art Spectrum to Vasari -- that's all been out of pocket for me, with no compensation. I've paid for a huge collection of the top paints of the world and gladly share the results with readers on a few forums.

I have absolutely no objection to receiving free paint though -- about time, I'd say! ;) It's no guarantee of a favorable review from me.

When people complain about the high cost of premium paint, I can only laugh and shake my head.

Colin -- Yes, I would try those cadmiums. I'll try to get some direct comparisons with the other brands right away.

Sid -- Good timing! :) Hope this helps, and I'll look forward to your impressions once you've had a chance to work with the new paints.

Dan-007
11-23-2009, 02:50 AM
very cool paints looks like some nice colors!

gunzorro
11-23-2009, 10:26 AM
Dan-007 -- Thanks.

I should mention (as a general note, not directed to you!) that these paints are only a small portion of the Blue Ridge line -- a sampling for evaluation purposes. I hope to do more later, including more commonly used colors.

Minor updates: I was informed today by Eric that the Ivory Black in his special mix is his normal Ivory Black PBk9, not exotic "genuine" Ivory Black.

Also, the Burnt Sienna is natural PR102, not PBr6 -- should be an interesting comparison to the Vasari!

And I apologize if I sounded peeved in my last post about being given paints vs. my personal investment. Most readers have been very appreciative and kind in their comments and seem to understand my motives are simply to provide direct comparisons of paints that are not available elsewhere.

antgeek
11-23-2009, 11:14 AM
thanks for sharing your paints investigation, this info is very helpful!

sidbledsoe
11-23-2009, 03:03 PM
I knew you were a tester for the paint manufacturers Gunz.:p

No wonder you can stock up the shelves so easy.:D

I have spoken with Eric, the owner of Blueridge and he values Jim's work.

monkhaus
11-23-2009, 04:54 PM
This also ties into my belief that those of us who value Jim's efforts and his willingness to use his paints, his time, his paper, etc to make these investigations on our (and his) behalf should perhaps send him a Blick, or whomever, gift certificate every once in a while. Or buy him a tube of paint, etc...

Jim has saved me money, and time, and given me a lot to think about as I've had to put my paints away for the time being.

ebineesey
11-25-2009, 02:28 PM
Wonderful Jim-- As always. Can't wait to see the comparisons.

wetbob
11-26-2009, 03:53 AM
George -- These and a few tubes of Harding, Blockx and WN I recently received are all I've gotten for "free", in exchange for the opportunity to evaluate.

You and the other readers are the beneficiaries of my generosity otherwise -- I've bought all the other paints I talk about, from Art Spectrum to Vasari -- that's all been out of pocket for me, with no compensation. I've paid for a huge collection of the top paints of the world and gladly share the results with readers on a few forums.

Thnx for the transparancy Gunz. Its very important. All work appreciated:thumbsup:

Alex Sunder
11-26-2009, 09:09 AM
Friggin great Gunz!! Thanks!!

sidbledsoe
11-26-2009, 09:22 AM
I got four Blueridge colors this week also and FWIW agree with the things Jim says. But I am not a master paint rater/evaluator like Jim is. I am amazed at some of the things he says in reviews like, "this was a bit waxy and slightly stringy". I can't see that in the photos, I wish I could visit his quality control center and have him show me this stuff in person. I can't wait to employ the real cerulean instead of my usual pthalo hue. They are seeing action already with cad red light being sent to the front lines of the poppy field already:
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/26-Nov-2009/112587-IMG_0065.JPG
The photo looks more saturated than real life but I can never get photos exactly right.

artc
11-26-2009, 12:07 PM
Hello Guns....

Again, thank you for all you're hard work with your paint charts

I was quite shocked to see how reasonably priced these Blue Ridge
paints are on the IAS website.

Could you please tell me what is BR Flemish White..is it an off white
or what?? Is it a faster drying white?? AND what about its consistancy??
I really like the mixtures that you have made...lower right side on my monitor.
What a beautiful range of colors for portrait work. I'd like to buy all those colors and play with the mixtures for portraits.

Thanks for all your help...art

artc
11-26-2009, 12:29 PM
Guns....I have been playing with color mixtures on and off
for weeks now trying to duplicate the complection of this
redheaded woman that I met....her very deep, dark auburn
red hair and her very slightly tinged violet complection were
an inspiration to me.

You're mixture of Burnt Umber and Florentine comes pretty darn close
Thanks for that....oh...BTW...HAPPY THANKSGIVING....art

gunzorro
11-26-2009, 09:48 PM
Art -- I'm glad those mixtures helped.

Yes, Blue Ridge has exceptional price points! It is the most economical of the premium paint types. Get it before it becomes to popular and prices go up someday!

I finished the paint comparisons today and got the photos done, and I think you will be very impressed how it measures up to familiar and premium brands. (Just that pesky evaluating and writing to do! ;) )

The Flemish White is a lead white with special characteristics when mixed with a variety of additives such as Walnut Sun Oil (stiffens it), stearate, and several others. It has a very loose consistency, but not runny or oily (similar to many of the Vasari paints). It is quite a clean white, even without adding titanium. It comes in tubes now, as well as the original jars for mixing easily with additives.

artc
11-27-2009, 07:38 AM
Tnx Guns.....looking fwd to seeing more comparisions
.....kinda disappointed as neither IAS or BR websites have "Orange Ochre"
I guess Eric deceided not to put it into production.
tnx for your help...art

gunzorro
11-27-2009, 10:54 AM
Art -- He's still considering it.

Didn't I give you a bunch of options for Gold Ochre on another thread? Try one of those, like the Blockx.

I decided not to offer direct comparison of the Blue Ridge Orange Ochre or an other the others not in the current line-up. I did a selection of 12 paints. (As you will soon see. . . ;) )

artc
11-27-2009, 11:33 AM
Yes you did...thank you...
I'm looking forward to seeing those mixtures...art

gunzorro
11-27-2009, 12:57 PM
I’m pleased to be able to present these results showing how Blue Ridge paints fare in direct comparison to many fine brands, most having long and illustrious reputations.

For more information on Blue Ridge paints, see their website:
www.blueridgeoilpaint.com

Comparison Criteria

The qualities I’m looking for when I conduct these comparisons are:

Color (fidelity) – is the color pure and vivid (or dull and grey), representing the common agreement of hue? Main attributes are proper value and high chroma.
Handling and fluidity (consistency) – is the paint stiff or fluid, chunky or fine?
Tinting strength – is the paint able to overcome other colors easily, or is it weak and overwhelmed in mixing?
Finish – how does the surface appear when dry (matte, semi-matte, semi-gloss, gloss)?


It is to be assumed that the paints are the accepted or expected pigments, not "hues". If there is a mix or pigment added to shift color that should be noted when comparing several brands of paint. The attempt is made to use only the same pigment designation, and if there is any shift from lot to lot, to have as close of a color match as possible.

Here is the first of the head-to-head comparisons of Blue Ridge against selected brands I feel are the best of the best, or personal favorites.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/IMG_7993web.jpg

Cobalt Blue
Blue Ridge is the highest value (lightest) and strongest chroma straight from the tube. It equaled Blockx in color and tinting, and surpassed Winsor Newton. Handling matched WN, but was surpassed by Blockx. Blockx is my overall choice by a slim margin over BR, but BR over WN.

Ultramarine Blue
Harding has the highest chroma on the initial mix with white; OH is the strongest tinter overall; BR has excellent characteristics with a semi-matte finish (the others are semi-gloss). Although almost too close to call, OH is the winner here by a small margin, but the difference between the three is almost indistinguishable – excellent showing for BR.

Cerulean Blue
BR has a wonderful deep color and matte finish from the tube, and is almost exactly the same in color and tinting as WN in mixes. Blockx has the strongest color and smoothest handling and finish is glossy. All have excellent color fidelity. Blockx is winner, with BR and WN tied.

Cobalt Violet Deep
Blue Ridge uses a slightly bluer version of cobalt violet, compared to the reddish versions of Blockx and OH. BR finish is semi-matte, where OH is semi-gloss and Blockx is gloss. BR matches Blockx in tinting strength, but OH is the strongest tinter among the three.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/IMG_7997web.jpg

Yellow Ochre (synthetic PY42)
BR is slightly lighter from the tube, but otherwise a match for Blockx, with Blockx having slightly better handling, and glossier finish. L&B is the strongest tinter of the three. Essentially a three-way tie.

Mars Red
Blockx’s color is slightly more purple, but otherwise the strongest tinter and has glossy finish. Vasari and BR are very close in color, with Vasari slightly more yellow. BR is stronger tinter than Vasari and has semi-matte finish, compared to Vasari’s gloss. Tie with Vasari.

Burnt Sienna
BR is extremely close to Vasari in color and strength, Vasari very slightly stronger tinter. Both BR and Vasari are slightly stronger tinters than Mussini, and Mussini is very slightly more orange than red. Excellent semi-gloss finish for all three. Slight edge to Vasari for strength and handling, but virtually a three-way tie.

Burnt Umber
BR is slightly different from the other two (not bad, different). BR is very matte and granular – more of an old-style handmade earth color. It has lower chroma (color intensity) making it slightly greyer than we’d usually expect. Having said that, it is an excellent color with very good tinting strength. Both Blockx and OH have slightly higher chroma and a reddish color. Blockx has a nice semi-gloss finish.

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c80/gunzorro/IMG_7999web.jpg

Cadmium Yellow Light
BR Cad Yellow Light is unusual compared to the other two (the difference is very difficult to see in the photo/web reproduction). It is very slightly darker, and slightly shifted toward green (like a deeper version of Cad Lemon). The Blockx and Vasari are both semi-gloss/gloss, compared to the BR semi-matte finish. Blockx is the brightest of the three, and Vasari is the loosest consistency. BR has the strongest tinting strength. Comparing these three is quite difficult due to their unique properties (I was trying to match the color most closely), so I’ll have to give this a three-way tie as well. If you want a more matte appearance and a slightly “dark lemon” look, BR is the one.

Cadmium Vermilion
(For several years there has been debate as to whether Robert Doak’s Vermilion was genuine or not. BR steps up to state it is classifying the pigment as cadmium, after having worked with Doak in his facility. Here is the first head-to-head comparison with the same pigment used in Doak’s Vermilion.)
BR is an exact match for the Doak paint in color, and has slightly better consistency. Williamsburg has been included for comparison, although not an exact match to the other two. WB is lighter from the tube, but slightly stronger tinter in mixes. Doak Vermilion has always been a favorite of mine, and the BR meets or beats it at its own game (at a lower price too).

Cadmium Red Medium Select
BR made a special run of paint, precisely ground and aged, and the results couldn’t have been better. Like a fine wine, this paint is worthy to compete against all comers. My favorite in the color category, from David Davis (a vintage tube), is still king on tinting strength by a tiny margin, but the BR is a worthy replacement. Although Maimeri Puro is lighter from the tube, it is a near match to BR in mixes. BR has the glossiest finish of the three.

Florentine Lake
A mix of Pyrol Ruby PR264 and Quinacridone Violet PV19, the BR version closely approximates the Michael Harding genuine Alizarin, than it does the similar pigment mix (different proportions) in Blockx’s Carmine. The BR is slightly purpler than Alizarin, but a worthwhile lightfast substitute. Excellent handling and semi-gloss finish for all three.

*********

As you can see, Blue Ridge has been able to hold its own against a particularly bias selection from all top brands (trying to compare to the best among all brands). While BR might not have “won” every category, to even come close is an honor, and tying or winning an amazing feat against such large and historic companies as Blockx and Old Holland.

As a result of comparing this broad selection of Blue Ridge paints, I’ve moved it up in my rankings to the beginning of the Premium grade.

Premium Grade Paints
(top to bottom ranking)

Old Holland
Vasari
Blockx
Michael Harding
Schmincke Mussini
Maimeri Puro
Williamsburg
Studio Products
Blue Ridge

Congratulations to Blue Ridge!

TruEnuff
11-28-2009, 10:21 PM
I only recently discovered this thread...and others equally educational....posted by gunzorro. I can't offer anything but a sincere thank you for the painstaking time and effort that has gone into these posts and the research behind them. It's just amazing.

Keep Painting! :wave:

dotb
11-29-2009, 12:41 AM
Ditto what Bruce said!

CareyG
11-29-2009, 03:48 AM
Jim, these look great! Thank you so much, as always! :)

~!Carey

gunzorro
12-03-2009, 12:51 AM
Bruce, dotb and Carey -- thanks so much! :) Glad it helps.

artc
12-04-2009, 08:01 AM
What ...beautiful....BEAUTIFUL...color charts...
THANK YOU....so much gunszorro....god...I can almost
smell the paint...errrr....ummmmm....can I ask a really
dumb question here???

Where or what classification does Winsor Newton ARTIST grade
paint fall into???

I've used Old Holland and Blockx paints for years and really like
them...no problems whatsoever.

Painting for me is just an enjoyable hobby...and....until
I started reading your posts, I had never heard of Vasari
or Doak?? or Studio Products...so I'm not really familiar
with the premium brands.

The other day, I tried so hard to duplicate Blueridge Florentine
Lake by mixing Blockx Carmine with Will. Burnt Umber. No luck...
I gotta order some of that BR FL.
THANK YOU agn....art

gunzorro
12-04-2009, 10:37 AM
Artie -- I currently rank WN Artist at the top of the Artist grade, an upgrade since trying some of their recent production -- moved them from the middle of Artist to the top end. So, good stuff, just below Premium, but not Premium.

Here are my current standings of paints I am personally familiar with:

Student grade paints
DR Georgian
Van Gogh
Permalba/Bob Ross
Winton
Maimeri Classico (best of Student)

Artist grade paints
Grumbacher
Zecchi
Da Vinci
Art Spectrum (Australia)
Lefranc et Bourgeois
Gamblin
Holbein
Schmincke Norma
Sennelier
M. Graham
Rembrandt
Robert Doak
Daniel Smith
Winsor Newton (highest Artist rank)

Premium grade paints
Blue Ridge
Studio Products
Williamsburg
Maimeri Puro
Michael Harding
Schmincke Mussini
Blockx
Vasari
Old Holland (highest Premium rank)

*************
As far as duplicating the BR Florentine, you won't do it with any earth color. The paint is a combination of Pyrol Ruby PR264 and Quincridone PV19. Although the Blockx Carmine is the same mix, the proportions are different and who knows which of the three versions of Quinacridone PV19 were used without testing? It could be the ruby, magenta, or violet! :) It can certainly be matched, there's no doubt about it, but you'll need to get away from the Burnt Umber and try adding some PV19s to the Blockx Carmine.

artc
12-04-2009, 11:18 AM
Thank you...very interesting

Novenus
12-27-2009, 10:42 AM
It's been a while since I visited and posted on this site but a big thanks to Jim for doing his tests. I've been slowly replacing some of my Mussini colors with BR and I have to say that the Vermilion (before labeled as cad) and Burnt Umber are my permanents for portraiture. Florentine Lake is a wonderful lightfast replacement for Alizarin Crimson. I have yet to use his jarred Flemish White (as I have two huge tubes of Harding and OH Cremnitz) but am fascinated with the additives in building impasto. Congrats to Eric Silver as I know he has been tweaking and reformulating paints to improve his line overall.

I have mentioned this before but the only medium I now use is Eric's new Copal medium. It's perfect for my lack of patience, and creates a wonderful film (if a bit dark -- but I don't mind that).

Time to buy some paints and linen from Eric... :)

Snail
04-10-2010, 08:47 PM
Thanks, all. After coming across this thread I ordered some paints from Eric at Blue Ridge. They arrived yesterday and I'm happily testing them out. Really like the Florentine Lake. The paints are a very soft consistency -- much more so than OH and somewhat more so than W&N -- which makes them very easy to use right out of the tube. Very nice!

sidbledsoe
04-10-2010, 10:23 PM
Snail, Eric uses a linseed/walnut mix 3/4 linseed and 1/4 walnut, I asked him why he added the walnut and he said it was solely for the handling/consistency qualities that the added walnut imparts.

Snail
04-11-2010, 12:41 AM
Thanks, Sid. That's very interesting. They definitely have a totally different feel from what I'm used to, but I think I like it.

The colors I picked up were: Cadmium Vermilion, Florentine Lake, Pyrol Ruby Red, Trans Red Oxide, Yves Klein Blue, Cadmium Yellow Light, Burnt Sienna and (free) Flemish White.

I've only tried out three colors so far, though!

monkhaus
04-11-2010, 03:28 PM
Snail, what a great series of choices. I've not used the Transparent Red Oxide, nor the Yves Klein Blue and would be curious to know what you think. BR's Cad Yellow Light and the Cad Red Medium Select (curse you gunz) has made me start putting Cad's back, slowly, on my palette.

gunzorro
04-11-2010, 08:58 PM
Ha-ha! :) (Sorry?)

Snail -- please tell us what you think after you work with them.

Dharma_bum
04-14-2010, 05:51 PM
Florentine Lake
A mix of Pyrol Ruby PR264 and Quinacridone Violet PV19, the BR version closely approximates the Michael Harding genuine Alizarin, than it does the similar pigment mix (different proportions) in Blockx’s Carmine. The BR is slightly purpler than Alizarin, but a worthwhile lightfast substitute. Excellent handling and semi-gloss finish for all three.



Jim--- According to the BR website, this is a combination of PR254 AND PV23, though from the look of it, I would have expected PR264 as well.

Dan

Keron
04-14-2010, 06:38 PM
Ha-ha! :) (Sorry?)

Snail -- please tell us what you think after you work with them.

I have worked with Erics paint for a couple of years now and overall I have and do recommend his paints. I have also used his copal retouch for imprimaturas and ebauche. It's very nice for that and lean. He also provides sunthickened oil in linseed and walnut which I have used to make up my own mediums with damar and turp. I do agree with you about the natural burnt umber being on the gritty side. I do use it but find the texture can get in the way but will use it situationally. I would suggest trying his lead tin yellows. The lead tin light in particular can be used to lovely effect as a white replacement. I have even used it to lighten the lead tin yellow dark.
Jim, I wonder have you ever reviewed any of the paints made by Kama Pigments of Montreal, Canada? I would sure be interested in your take on it. I have some of their colors and so far have been pleased.

winecountry
04-14-2010, 08:42 PM
Hey Jim you know those P# all you paint geeks throw around, is there a website somewhere to see these,and what they mean ..... I'd like to look up some of my paints....

Thanks:thumbsup:

PS I have some Flor. Lake coming from Doak....I miss aliz on my palette, and most of the subs are way too strong....

gunzorro
04-14-2010, 08:42 PM
Dan -- Thanks. That is an odd error, and you are right, of course! I don't know how I got that the two forumulas confused. Thanks for the cross-checking. Can't go back and edit, so hopefully some readers will make it this far into the thread.

Keron -- I've not ever used the Kama paints, but I own their sensational (and reasonably priced) Canada Balsam. I don't know that their paints are very common in the US. I certainly don't know of any distributors, other than direct purchase from Canada.

Colleen -- Here's my go-to site:

http://www.artiscreation.com/white.html

Snail
04-14-2010, 09:10 PM
Ha-ha! :) (Sorry?)

Snail -- please tell us what you think after you work with them.

I definitely will. I'm just working my way slowly through them. Really like the Florentine Lake and Cad Yellow Light thus far.

Also, Eric seems like a really nice guy. He friended me on Facebook and it seems he's working on some new colors: Hansa Yellow, Permanent Alizarin...

I certainly do like the consistency of these paints. Very nice!

gunzorro
04-15-2010, 11:00 AM
Dan -- I've spoken to Eric Silver at Blue Ridge, and it turns out I'm only 1/2 wrong! :)

My original statement:

Florentine Lake
A mix of Pyrol Ruby PR264 and Quinacridone Violet PV19, the BR version closely approximates the Michael Harding genuine Alizarin, than it does the similar pigment mix (different proportions) in Blockx’s Carmine. The BR is slightly purpler than Alizarin, but a worthwhile lightfast substitute.


It turns out that Eric has an uncorrected typo on his website (probably fixed by now, or very shortly). The pigment is supposed to be listed as PR264, not PR254.

I was wrong on the identification of the second pigment. It is not Quinacridone PV19, it is Dioxazine PV23 as it says on the BR website.

So, one typo from Eric, and a different one from me!

This explains why I couldn't get a color match from the Blockx Carmine example with PR264 and PV19. At the base of such an inconsistency lies an error (or two). Thanks for spotting the inconsistencies. :)

Dharma_bum
04-15-2010, 04:04 PM
I got an email from him this morning with the same info. Looks like the Pyrole Ruby is straight PR264 too.

Dan

gunzorro
04-15-2010, 04:54 PM
Dan -- Yes, I'm sure it is.