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allydoodle
09-30-2011, 06:44 PM
Hello Artists!

Welcome to the Monthly Pastel Sketch Thread!!

The monthly pastel sketch thread is for pastelists of all experience levels who use soft pastels, hard pastels or pastel pencils.
The idea is to fit some sketching time into your week by completing a sketch in one hour or less.
You can sketch anything, whether it be from life or photos.
It's a good idea to time your sketch, keeping it within 60 minutes. You know how time flies when you are creating. So get your pastels out, set your timer and when your time is up, please post your sketches here and share your efforts with us.

For inspiration, please visit our Image Library here (http://www.wetcanvas.com/RefLib/):

Have fun!

Dougwas
10-01-2011, 08:09 PM
Thanks for hosting this month, Chris. I greatly appreciate it.

Well, I guess I will get things going. Here are a couple more Pan sketches. They are both done on 5 x 7 black Pastelmat. The mug took about an hour and the apple about 35 minutes. They were both painted from life. Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Oct-2011/102199-October_01_Mug_Sketch.jpg


http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Oct-2011/102199-October_01_Apple_Sketch.jpg

Doug

robertsloan2
10-01-2011, 09:10 PM
Wow! Doug, these are great. They remind me a little of Carol Marine's paintings except the colors are so lavish and gorgeous. She usually paints more muted subjects. The blocky visible strokes creating the planes of the objects is what reminds me of her style. Your colors are wonderful! Also the forms are so beautiful, you've given both the apple and cup great three dimensional depth.

Dougwas
10-01-2011, 10:19 PM
Thanks for the kind comments, Robert. I am having fun painting these and there is a method to my madness. Thanks for informing me about Carol Marine. That is the type of still life I am striving for. I love her paintings and I watched her demo. Very interesting.

Well, my back allowed me to do one more, so I went for it. This nectarine is painted on 5 x 7 black Pastelmat using Pan Pastel. It is painted from life.

Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Oct-2011/102199-October_01_Nectarine_Sketch.jpg

Doug

allydoodle
10-02-2011, 12:50 AM
Doug, you're on a roll! I absolutely love the mug, did I mention I love it? Great simplicity and color! I also love the apple and nectarine, but that mug just speaks to me! Great job!

robertsloan2
10-02-2011, 01:25 AM
Your nectarine came out too. I still love that cup, it's incredible.

Judibelle
10-02-2011, 08:48 AM
BRAVO. Doug! And I agree with the other comments....your mug looks real enough to drink out of! And the apple and nectarine just glow. Good job on all 3!

robertsloan2
10-02-2011, 06:12 PM
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Oct-2011/70184-10-2-2011-Hunt-239-1-4.jpg
Scavenger Hunt 239, Items #1, 2, 3, 4
8 1/2" x 11"
Carb-Othello pastel pencils on Stillman & Birn Alpha sketchbook.
From life and memory. I couldn't find an exacto blade so I visualized it.

I love sketching with pastel pencils. Going to see if I can get dusty again today!

Dougwas
10-02-2011, 06:29 PM
Good job, Robert. The strokes of the pencils give your drawings energy. Good luck in getting dusty.

Thanks, Chris. Are you sure you love that mug?:D I have to tell the truth. I was staying away from ellipses because I hadn't drawn one for a while, but drawing with just small straight lines made it easy. I had it reading right in no time. So now I am off to try another. Wish me luck.:crossfingers:

Thanks for the nice comments, Judi. I have to admit to liking the mug and apple. That's odd because I don't usually like any of my paintings.:confused:


Doug

allydoodle
10-02-2011, 07:32 PM
Super sketches Robert! I am always amazed at how well you do these fast ones, thest are great!

adigal
10-02-2011, 09:16 PM
OK, I did this today. I admit that I did have an underpainting, but the painting took me about an hour! I called it "My Beach Cottage," although I don't have a beach cottage. I would like one, though! I know my horizon line is a little wonky, I have to fix that.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Oct-2011/369901-photo-5.jpg Thanks for letting me share,
Nancy

robertsloan2
10-02-2011, 09:56 PM
Thank you for the comments on my sketches today. I love the pastel pencils for sketching, they're so strong and show up so well.

Nancy, your cottage landscape is beautiful. I love the blue-violet shadowing, that's just gorgeous. The recession on the fields is great too.

adigal
10-02-2011, 10:15 PM
Thanks, Robert!! I was about to give up painting, but everyone here gave me such good advice and encouragement, I thought I would take what they said, and use it!

I love your kitty, and I especially love the cat toy - great job on all!!!
Nanch

allydoodle
10-02-2011, 11:10 PM
Nice job Nancy! I love the reds in the road, they work well with the browns.

robertsloan2
10-02-2011, 11:36 PM
Spotlight kitty counts as a sketch to me ... I didn't try to refine her, decided I liked her loose and sketchy.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Oct-2011/70184-10-2-2011-Tortie-Tabby-1-Spotlight-Cat.jpg
Tortie-Tabby 1
8" x 10"
Pastel on gray Strathmore Artagain paper
Photo reference by stalksthedawn for October Pastel Spotlight

Dougwas
10-03-2011, 12:13 AM
Nancy- Good job on your landscape. Don't ever give up painting. It is a great hobby to have and you keep getting better with the more time you put into it. Have fun.

Robert- I love the looseness of the sketch of the cat. The muted colors really work well. I hope Ari doesn't get jealous.:cat:

Doug

allydoodle
10-03-2011, 01:13 AM
Great job on the cat Robert! Georgous colors, I think this is one of my favorites of yours.

robertsloan2
10-03-2011, 02:28 AM
Thank you! LOL - Ari doesn't get jealous if I draw other cats. He gets curious though, he likes other cats.

Mij
10-03-2011, 07:15 AM
Thanks to Chris for hosting.:wave:


Thanks for the link Doug, I could not find this thread at all.
See what I've been missing. Not that I do many sketches but to see all these here is lovely.


Good sketches all round. Doug with the mug, apple and nectarine. Nancy with the beach hut ( yes we'd like one they'd be handy for sketching in eh?) Just imagine going down that little path lounger and towel in hand. Then Robert with the smaller items and then the cat – which is very well done. Very painterly yet seems to retain all detail but when you look close it isn't there.
I'd better put this in along with the favourites. Not that I sketch much other than trees – but the least said about them the better :wink2:

jim

adigal
10-03-2011, 08:24 AM
Robert,
Gorgeous cat!!! Very nice, you caught her personality, too!
Nancy

robertsloan2
10-03-2011, 06:01 PM
Thank you! I'll keep sketching today, love those Carb-Othellos! I also like using the Gallery Soft Squares in my sketchbook, they're a bit softer than hard pastels but so inexpensive that I don't worry about using them up.

Dougwas
10-03-2011, 08:30 PM
I had to paint something. All I did today was touch up my larger painting before posting it. Well what should I paint? I Know! A pear!:evil: They are my favorite subject to paint so why not go with the flow. It is another small Pan painting. Painted from life on 5 x7 black Pastelmat. It took 45 minutes to paint. I am trying to paint looser. :confused: Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2011/102199-October_03_Sketch.jpg



Doug

allydoodle
10-03-2011, 11:33 PM
Yup, you're on a roll Doug! I'm really liking what you're doing with these Pan Pastels, you just may have found your niche, so to speak. These have a very modern feel, a little abstract yet real at the same time. I think it's the colors and the edges, super work! It's like you're developing a certain style with these, a style all your own. Keep 'em comin'!:D

robertsloan2
10-04-2011, 02:24 AM
You're definitely on a roll, Doug! I love these pears. This one's gorgeous too. You've definitely been loosening up and keeping the beautiful dimension and rounded shape while you do!

Judibelle
10-04-2011, 09:10 AM
Ditto Chris & Rob, Doug!
I am sorta trying to follow your style with my apples, but the shapes just dont come out quite right. I'll try again today...
Meanwhile, You GO, Guy!

Dougwas
10-04-2011, 12:08 PM
Chris- I don't want this roll to stop. I am happy you feel that way, because I keep telling myself "Maybe you are onto something. Maybe all this art stuff is finally sinking in." All I know is, I am having a blast and I want to see where all of this takes me. I have always said that I wasn't looking for my own style, but I was waiting for my style to find me. Does that make any sense? Thanks for all of your encouraging words, Chris. It helps me keep going.

Robert- Thanks for the kind words. I have been trying to looksen up, but it's not always easy. This time I exaggerated the straight lines and I think it still reads true, so that shows me what I can get away with. Maybe the next larger painting will have these types of shapes. We will see.

Judi- Thanks for those nice words. One way to get away from curved lines is to start with a square. Then you get rid of the corners with diagonal lines then you are left with an octagon. Play with the length and angles and you have an apple. If you watch Carol Marine's demo, that is what she does. Here is the link to her demos. http://www.carolmarine.com/demos.html

Doug

sketchZ1ol
10-04-2011, 01:47 PM
hello
hey Doug !
- saw your pieces in the Studio
and it's good to see your 1 hr ' roughs ' here !

CM is definitely a talent/concept/' roto-tool to the brain ' :D
> if the Pans are bridging to oil for you ... :cool:x10 .
>> colour/mark with you and ' adigal ' seem to be on a parallel right now .

Ed :}

Judibelle
10-04-2011, 01:49 PM
thanks, Doug...I watched the 10-min. challenge, and the shapes used to form the apple. Gonna give it a try...

Dougwas
10-04-2011, 02:24 PM
Ed- Yes, this is a great place to try things out. I used to live in this thread when I first started out. For the past little while I have been trying to start my paintings/ sketches with small straight lines and get away from curved lines. Sounds easy, but by the time I put pastel to paper I would have curved shapes looking at me. When Robert reminded me about CM the other day, I went to her site, studied her paintings and watch her demos. I am not trying to copy her style, but I am borrowing a thing or two from her.;)

I will be trying all of this neat stuff with WMO's soon. I have just started with oils and have just done some black and white studies, but I have to admit, I have been thinking about how oils would look. We will see soon. Thanks for stopping by, Ed.

Judi- She makes it look easy, and after a while it is easy. Just remember, all apples have different shapes and nobody knows if your painted apple is the same shape as the model. :wink2:

Doug

allydoodle
10-04-2011, 03:30 PM
Doug,

I love Carol Marine's work, her painting a day project is so inspiring. I can see the influence, using straight lines to make a curved object, yet you're putting your own spin on it. I think your style did find you, that's what happened to me actually. I think that is how it really works, you just can't force things. There is something about the way you're handling the Pans that I really like, they sure do seem to work much better on Pastelmat, that's for sure. You're getting great results between your newly discovered style and the subjects you're painting. Kewl stuff!

Dougwas
10-04-2011, 05:43 PM
Chris (btw, that's my wife's name too:) )

I am glad Robert reminded me of her. I had her site bookmarked on my old computer. Then it crashed. I really like her style, with lost edges everywhere. You think something is straight as an arrow but when you zoom into the painting you learn otherwise. Watching her demo really helped me find a method for what I was going for. Too bad they lost their home in a fire, but she is moving to Oregon, which is closer to me. You never know, there might be a workshop down the road.

I know a lot of people look down on paintings that scream color, but I don't care. It may look garish to some people, but I don't care. I will paint the way I want to paint and the way I love to paint. I am a color geek!:D

The pans and pastelmat are just made foe each other. The pans just go on like butter. If it wasn't for Deborah Secor mentioning how she loved the two, I wouldn't have tried them together. I had already given a thumbs down to pastelmat, because it didn't have enough tooth for my sticks. Man, I am sure glad I tried them together.

Anyway, thanks again for all the encouragement. I greatly appreciate it.


Doug

Rockport123
10-04-2011, 05:50 PM
Hi Everyone

This is my first post in the SKETCH thread, it sounded like a great way to warm up. I took a tube of paint and put my pastels pencils to work for 40 min. I did it on a long skinny piece of left over black canson paper. Hop it looks good. C&C's welcomed!
Marlene :clap:

Dougwas
10-04-2011, 06:31 PM
Rockport- Welcome the the Sketch Thread. You did a wonderful job on this. The tube is well formed. Nice work with the pencils. Hope to see more.

Doug

Rockport123
10-04-2011, 07:21 PM
Thanks Doug I'll post again, it's fun!!

Marlene

allydoodle
10-04-2011, 11:32 PM
Hey Marlene, fancy seeing you here! Nice little sketch, we have to find some use for those tubes of paint, don't we :evil: ?!

Rockport123
10-04-2011, 11:51 PM
Yeah! With Pastels around they tend to get a bit dusty!

Marlene

robertsloan2
10-05-2011, 12:46 AM
Marlene, it looks gorgeous! I love your sketch of the tube of paint. It's so rich and lively, with great dimension and depth. Beautiful!

I sketched my cat again with Derwent pastel pencils:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/04-Oct-2011/70184-10-4-2011-Ari-Pastel-Sketches.jpg
Life Sketches of Ari
7" x 10"
Derwent Pastels
Stillman & Birn Epsilon Sketchbook.

allydoodle
10-05-2011, 08:23 AM
Another nice one Robert. I love the soft tones of browns, and the way you used the white of the paper.

allydoodle
10-05-2011, 08:28 AM
Chris (btw, that's my wife's name too:) )

I am glad Robert reminded me of her. I had her site bookmarked on my old computer. Then it crashed. I really like her style, with lost edges everywhere. You think something is straight as an arrow but when you zoom into the painting you learn otherwise. Watching her demo really helped me find a method for what I was going for. Too bad they lost their home in a fire, but she is moving to Oregon, which is closer to me. You never know, there might be a workshop down the road.

I know a lot of people look down on paintings that scream color, but I don't care. It may look garish to some people, but I don't care. I will paint the way I want to paint and the way I love to paint. I am a color geek!:D

The pans and pastelmat are just made foe each other. The pans just go on like butter. If it wasn't for Deborah Secor mentioning how she loved the two, I wouldn't have tried them together. I had already given a thumbs down to pastelmat, because it didn't have enough tooth for my sticks. Man, I am sure glad I tried them together.

Anyway, thanks again for all the encouragement. I greatly appreciate it.


Doug

Doug,

I read about that fire also, tragic and sad, but it sounds like she's pushing forward. She sounds like a very positive person, a good thing.

I'm a color junkie too, though I try to incorporate it in a more traditional way. I love when someone takes color like you're doing and pushes it to the extreme. I occasionaly do that also, and I find it so liberating. I find it works really well with simple still life objects, like what you're doing.

Don't let anyone dictate what works for you, there's room in this world for all tastes and styles, and those that think otherwise need not voice their opinion (or you can at least walk away :smug: ).

You're doing super work with these!

Judibelle
10-05-2011, 09:29 AM
Maureen...welcome! Good job on the sketch...
Robert...another super sketch!

Hoping to have some time to 'sketch' today...still working on the apples....

Rockport123
10-05-2011, 10:12 AM
Hi Judi- Thanks so much for your kind woirds!
Hi Robert- Thank you I really enjoyed sketching that tube, it was so liberating! I LOVE your cat sketch, it has an oriental feel to it, almost sumi like. Great job!
Marlene

robertsloan2
10-06-2011, 03:27 AM
Purr thank you! Ari was such a darling, he posed for me a long time for them. Most of the time he's better than an egg timer for timed gesture sketching. He rolls over or moves every two minutes even if he's in deep sleep.

Marlene, a lot of people have mentioned that. In 2004 my daughter bought me a wonderful sumi-e set for my birthday with ink sticks, ink stone, Chinese brushes, colored ink sticks and everything I need. I've immersed in it and studied several books and many Chinese and Japanese masters. The best thing about that practice is that I stopped getting overdetailed.

spirothet
10-06-2011, 10:11 AM
Doug, nice job on the fruit. I especially liked your last pear with its edgy sides.
Robert, you have mastered painting kitty cats. Good work!
Rockport, I think I have to start looking around the house. A tube of paint, as simple as that! Love it.
Adigal, I love your cottage. I like the way your eye is led to the water by the path.

Rockport123
10-06-2011, 10:26 AM
Hi Robert

That's what I like about oriental painting, it forces you to do more with less. As my teacher used to say "economy of stroke"!

Thanks spirothet, I love just sketching simple things, everything has it's own character!

Marlene

robertsloan2
10-06-2011, 05:43 PM
Marlene, that's exactly it. If I hadn't tried Asian painting I would never have achieved economy of stroke or even understood it. Sometime I'm going to choose a good Chinese or Japanese master and copy the master a couple of times.

Cali, thank you so much! Ari purrs at you! I love drawing cats and can't help being attracted to any feline photo or pose.

adigal
10-07-2011, 12:15 AM
Hi everyone,
I am not sure if this is allowed, but I have been following the advice I have been given, and I have been drawing in pencil a lot - houses, barns, fruit. I also took the advice to copy Monet, since I love color! This is a one hour copy of one of his poppy field paintings. I was trying to figure out how he did his trees, and the color and shapes in the distance, and the yellow light in the distance, also. I know I did mine too close to the mid-ground. Anyway, C&C very welcome!! Thank you,
Nancyhttp://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2011/369901-photo-10.jpg
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2011/369901-Monet_-_Poppy_field,_Argenteuil.jpg

robertsloan2
10-07-2011, 12:34 AM
Wow! Cool dramatic interpretation of Monet's painting. You used stronger contrasts and simpler colors, your poppy field doesn't have as many greens in it and neither do your trees. Yours looks cool though!

robertsloan2
10-07-2011, 03:06 AM
Another Spotlight sketch that I might develop into a full color painting:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/07-Oct-2011/70184-10-6-2011-Shadow-Of-Red-Rocks.jpg
Come into the shadow of this red rock
8 1/2" x 11"
Derwent Pastels
Stillman & Birn Gamma Series Sketchbook
Photo reference by aznugget posted for October Pastel Spotlight.

adigal
10-07-2011, 05:56 AM
Thanks for the feedback, Robert. Yes, I think I will develop it and add the greens. The greens always give me fits. Is that common??

I love rocks/cliffs, so I cannot wait to see you develop that painting! Are you going to stick with that palette? And what colors do you add to your rocks? I am working on getting rocks right, and I always want to make them colors that don't generally exist!!

I will be waiting with interest to see you develop that!
Nancy

robertsloan2
10-07-2011, 06:59 AM
The greens give a lot of painters fits, in pastels or oils or anything. You have enough other colors in the poppy field that bringing them in will just give it sparkle.

Thank you!

My color harmonies tend to emerge with the painting. In color the reference has a clear primary color scheme - red rocks, blue sky, yellow foliage on the foreground trees are all strong. I'm not sure what I'll do in color, might play with some color thumbnails first. That and rearrange the areas at the bottom, I was doing them loosely on purpose.

What I add to my rocks depends on time of day, type of rocks, local color of rocks, color harmony of the painting. I don't know until I'm painting and reach for the right sticks at the moment. Generally I do use some neutrals or mix complements for them though.

Rocks can work with colors that are more intense than life. Rocks with golden sunlit sides and shadowy violets can look great at a certain time of day when light gray rocks really do look at that - think dawn or very late evening before sunset, just barely before sonset. The mad colors are sometimes true ones!

allydoodle
10-07-2011, 09:02 AM
Hi everyone,
I am not sure if this is allowed, but I have been following the advice I have been given, and I have been drawing in pencil a lot - houses, barns, fruit. I also took the advice to copy Monet, since I love color! This is a one hour copy of one of his poppy field paintings. I was trying to figure out how he did his trees, and the color and shapes in the distance, and the yellow light in the distance, also. I know I did mine too close to the mid-ground. Anyway, C&C very welcome!! Thank you,
Nancyhttp://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2011/369901-photo-10.jpg
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2011/369901-Monet_-_Poppy_field,_Argenteuil.jpg

This is what you need to do Nancy! Copy works of artists that you admire, and do it often. Eventually you will be able to translate what you've learned into some of your own work. When I first started out doing landscapes I used this same approach. I just couldn't figure out how to get depth, atmosphere, and all the things that make a landscape work. I could do a portrait or still life, but the lanscape alluded me (sometimes I think it still does :lol: ). I learned so much by just repeating this exercise over and over again. I painted countless copies of other artists works. I mostly painted the contemporary artists I admire, but whatever artist you like is all that matters. It may take awhile, and you may paint a lot of paintings, but it will help you, definitely it will.

I already see vast improvement. I have a few suggestions, the first being make sure to pick a painting you totally like. You like everything about it. The second suggestion would be to paint it exactly like the artist painted it. Don't make changes, think of yourself as not yet ready to make changes, as you are trying to learn "how they did that", not "how to change what they did and still make it work". That being said, I would definitely put more greens into the grass, to help you figure out how to paint greens. Again, look at these as learning tools, not finished pieces of art. You are not making your next masterpiece, you are trying to figure out how to paint with greens (just an example). So, go back and see if you can get the grass to look like the original painting. Only after you've done many paintings like this should you try to make changes to see if they work. Also, after painting these oh so many paintings, you can then try something from a photo you took. Hopefully you will have gathered the knowledge necessary and apply it to your own creations.

These are my thoughts on this approach, and I'm sharing them with you because it worked for me. Great job!

adigal
10-07-2011, 12:01 PM
Chris,
I am having trouble getting the same colors. Suggestions? Thanks,
Nancy

Davkin
10-07-2011, 12:49 PM
Chris,
I am having trouble getting the same colors. Suggestions? Thanks,
Nancy

With pastel I wouldn't worry so much about trying to match the color in a master painting, it's very unlikely you'll be able to match many of the colors, and franky, it's not that important. First focus on picking a stick that's the right value. As they say, a painting with a good value structure will work regardless of the colors used. After value try and match the temperature as close as possible. If you can do those two things you'll be close enough.

David

allydoodle
10-07-2011, 01:07 PM
Nice sketch Robert, it looks like a great start to a finished painting for sure!

allydoodle
10-07-2011, 01:13 PM
Chris,
I am having trouble getting the same colors. Suggestions? Thanks,
Nancy

You've got some of those greens already, I see some of them on the right side of the trees. If you've got a soft peach that will work also, and some soft violets, as I see that in the grass. Use the red at a minimum, just to indicate a couple of flowers (like Monet did), a little goes a long way in a landscape. Also, do you have a soft slate blue or even a soft violet/grey about the same value as those distant hills/trees? If so, put them over the darks that you currently have in those distant hills/trees, to create atomosphere and distance. Right now you've got them too dark. Remember, you're trying to figure out what the artist did, not improve upon it. Right now you need to try to understand how he got the painting to look as good as it does. Don't try to change it, at least not for now. That's for later when you figure things out :evil: !

You're doing great!

adigal
10-07-2011, 02:57 PM
Thanks, David and Chris,
I will play with this when I get home. I am not trying to be different!!
With my limited abilities, it just hasn't looked like the painting yet. I will take your suggestions, and post it when I am finished, if that is OK, since it will be more than an hour sketch?
Thank you,
Nancy

allydoodle
10-07-2011, 03:07 PM
Thanks, David and Chris,
I will play with this when I get home. I am not trying to be different!!
With my limited abilities, it just hasn't looked like the painting yet. I will take your suggestions, and post it when I am finished, if that is OK, since it will be more than an hour sketch?
Thank you,
Nancy

Of course you can Nancy, no problem at all!

Lyons
10-07-2011, 04:34 PM
This is what you need to do....Copy works of artists that you admire, and do it often. Eventually you will be able to translate what you've learned into some of your own work. ....... I learned so much by just repeating this exercise over and over again. I painted countless copies of other artists works. I mostly painted the contemporary artists I admire, but whatever artist you like is all that matters. .....

Chris,

I like what you said to Nancy. But is spawns a number of questions.

I like to do just as you said. I love the work of Richard McKinley. So I tape up a picture of one of his works on my easile board and try to look deep into the work and figure out how he did it and try to replicate it...for my own practice and technique improvement.

But, when I'm done, my wife says I did a wonderful job and wants to mat and frame it and give it to a relative or hang it on one of our walls.

Question 1: Should I sign my name to a work I do like this? Usually, for me, signing my name signifies to me that I'm "done" done with the painting...no more touching it. But I always feel ackward about signing my name to what is really a copy of anothers work.

Question 2: If I sign it and frame it and give it away, should I clearly write on the back that it is my work of a [McKinley] work and give his title?

Question 3: When does your own work of anothers work become your own? For instance, if I take a subject of another painter, their location, angle, view, colors, etc. But paint it my way, even if it looks, say 80% like his/hers, when does it become mine? I would always fear that if I sold it or even if it hangs in a relatives house, someone might come along and say "That's not a Lyons work, that's a McKinley, or an attempt at a McKinley".

Cause what if I was at a Workshop, there could be 12 paintings all very similar of the same mountains and valley, cause each student is trying to paint their own painting of the same subject. When does theirs become their own?

Question 4: Like Nance did, she scanned and attached to the thread both her and Monets painting to show how she did with the master. Monet is dead. But, could I attach a McKinley to this thread, or because he is a living painter, could I get in trouble for scanning, and attaching his work to this thread to show how I did with one of his works.

Thanks, I love the advice, cause most of my paintings so far are recreations of someone elses. I do paint my own scenes, from photos so far, no plein air yet, but since I'm still in the practice mode, I try what has worked for someone else.

-Doug Lyons

Davkin
10-07-2011, 04:56 PM
I'll attempt my answers to your question, I'm sure others will feel differently on some of them;

#1 - I would say no, or at least write "After Mckinley" underneath.

#2 - I personally would not give a painting to someone that is a copy of a living artist, but if you do you definately should should make it clear somehow that it is a copy.

#3 - I'd say it's only yours if you start with your own vision only. I personally beleive any time you use another's painting as a referance it's not 100% your own. I'm not saying you can't look at another artist's work for ideas on how to handle certain issues, but if you are actually using their work as a reference then the resulting work really isn't yours even if looks different. Now multiple artist's working from the same photo ref or same subject is a different matter, as long as you're not looking over the shoulder of another artist and copying what they are doing then the work is your own.

#4 - You can't attach a photo of the work of a living artist without their permission without violating copyright. You could however provide a link to the photo on their website.

David

allydoodle
10-07-2011, 05:26 PM
Chris,

I like what you said to Nancy. But is spawns a number of questions.

I like to do just as you said. I love the work of Richard McKinley. So I tape up a picture of one of his works on my easile board and try to look deep into the work and figure out how he did it and try to replicate it...for my own practice and technique improvement.

But, when I'm done, my wife says I did a wonderful job and wants to mat and frame it and give it to a relative or hang it on one of our walls.

Question 1: Should I sign my name to a work I do like this? Usually, for me, signing my name signifies to me that I'm "done" done with the painting...no more touching it. But I always feel ackward about signing my name to what is really a copy of anothers work.

Question 2: If I sign it and frame it and give it away, should I clearly write on the back that it is my work of a [McKinley] work and give his title?

Question 3: When does your own work of anothers work become your own? For instance, if I take a subject of another painter, their location, angle, view, colors, etc. But paint it my way, even if it looks, say 80% like his/hers, when does it become mine? I would always fear that if I sold it or even if it hangs in a relatives house, someone might come along and say "That's not a Lyons work, that's a McKinley, or an attempt at a McKinley".

Cause what if I was at a Workshop, there could be 12 paintings all very similar of the same mountains and valley, cause each student is trying to paint their own painting of the same subject. When does theirs become their own?

Question 4: Like Nance did, she scanned and attached to the thread both her and Monets painting to show how she did with the master. Monet is dead. But, could I attach a McKinley to this thread, or because he is a living painter, could I get in trouble for scanning, and attaching his work to this thread to show how I did with one of his works.

Thanks, I love the advice, cause most of my paintings so far are recreations of someone elses. I do paint my own scenes, from photos so far, no plein air yet, but since I'm still in the practice mode, I try what has worked for someone else.

-Doug Lyons

Hi Doug,

All valid questions that come up when someone uses this approach to learning how to paint something. I'll try to answer your questions to the best of my ability.

1. You can sign your name, but you need to put "after McKinley" there as well, so it is clear that your painting is actually a copy of someone else's work. Make sure you put it on the front of teh painting near your signature, not on the back.

2. See above answer, it is the same. Make sure you put it on the front of the painting near your signature, not on the back.

3. A work becomes your own when it is totally your own creation. That is, you either paint from life, paint from your own photo, or if you paint from someone else's photo you have permission to do so. It is always nice to give credit to the person that took the photo. If you post it on a website, you can say "painted from John Doe's photo, with permission". If you sell the work, you should put that on the back of the painting. If you use a photo from WetCanvas' library and you post the painting here on WetCanvas, you should give credit to the person that submitted the photo to the library. Most people do that here on WetCanvas, it is nice for the person that took the photo to know that someone used it. Outside of WetCanvas you probably don't need to do that with WetCanvas references, as they are copyright free. Your paintings can be displayed without giving reference to the person that took the photo. But that is only for WetCanvas references. Other references need to be handled according to whatever restrictions may apply.

If you are at a workshop and 12 people are painting from life the same scene, it is your own work. No one can "own the land", so it is your own painting with your own vision.

4. Pretty much what David said, you cannot post a photo of his work without permission, you will violate copyright laws, but you can post a link to his website where people can go to view it.

When I used this approach to teach myself landscapes, I just matted and stored the paintings for future reference for myself. None are in frames, none will ever be entered into shows, and none are sold. They were done for me to learn and advance my skills, much like the paintings I did when I was in a mentorship with an accomplished pastel artist. I was painting still life for the most part, and some portraits. Those works were either done under direction from him, or he actually had his hand in the work to show me what to do. These were learning tools that I still have, but I don't consider them to be my own work, they were not done completely with my own hand/mind. The many books that are published by accomplished artists with the intent to teach can and should be used for that purpose. Copying those paintings is a great way to figure things out. Just remember that the paintings you create are copies of someone else's work, not your own. There's no way around that.

At some point in time, you will become more comfortable branching out and trying to paint using your own references, and when you do it will feel both liberating and exciting. It will happen, the more you paint the better you get. Just view the 'copies' as private lessons from someone that you admire, that's what I did.

robertsloan2
10-07-2011, 09:12 PM
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/07-Oct-2011/70184-10-7-2011-Rooster-ref-by-sundiver-WDE.jpg
Rooster
9" x 12"
Black and white sketching crayons
Aquabee Recycled Rough Sketch Paper
Photo reference by Sundiver for October 7 2011 Weekend Drawing Event (http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=950971).

They're something like Mungyo's version of Conte crayons, the little black and white sticks in my 64 color half stick Mungyo set. So I figured they'd count as hard pastels - they have a dry dusty texture, not an oil pastel or wax texture.

allydoodle
10-07-2011, 09:25 PM
Well Robert, you're officially on a roll! Nice sketch, I love roosters, such fun subjects with attitude and personality!

spirothet
10-07-2011, 09:35 PM
Robert, can you tell me what pill you are taking for this roll you are on???? Well done on the rooster! It would have been dynamite in color, but love it as is. Cali

adigal
10-07-2011, 10:14 PM
I agree with all the critiques, I love your rooster! You inspired me to try one!!
Nancy

robertsloan2
10-07-2011, 10:31 PM
Purr thank you! He'd be even prettier in color, he's got iridescent black on his tail and deep red body, bright red comb and wattle - very dramatic rooster! Can't wait to see your version!

Rockport123
10-08-2011, 06:02 PM
LOVE that Rooster Robert! I looked around my studio and warmed up my pastel pencils on my dear fathers old Pentax K-1000. Could have worked on it longer than 1 hour but my challenge was 1 hour, and I was determined to stick to it! I used the same old piece of black Canson paper.
hope it looks ok. C&C's always welcome!
Marlene

robertsloan2
10-08-2011, 07:13 PM
Marlene, that's lovely! Every time I see a painting on black it's so vivid and powerful. I like how you vignetted the edges and created such an effective wood grain texture on the table or shelf. Great color harmony with blue and muted orange, it's powerful. Perfect perspective. That's a gorgeous sketch of a tough subject!

allydoodle
10-08-2011, 07:27 PM
That's really nice Marlene! Isn't it neat to paint ordinary objects, it turns them into something special (though this camera already is special as it was your Dad's). Now that you've put in your one hour, maybe you can take it a bit further? It might be worth it, so far it looks great!

Rockport123
10-08-2011, 09:27 PM
Thanks so much Robert! It was a tough subject, it's not worth doing unless I challange myself. Believe it or not until now I hadn't done any color sketches on black paper.

Hi Chris- Maybe I'll finish it, I'll see if I feel the urge. Sometimes I think the quick sketch should stand on it's own. Thanks for the kind words!!!

Marlene

adigal
10-10-2011, 07:33 AM
Nice work, Marlene! I really love it! And I love that camera - my first serious camera, and still my favorite. It taught me so much about photography!<
Nancy

Rockport123
10-10-2011, 07:54 AM
Thanks Nancy! It's my favorite camera as well, takes great shots!

Marlene

Dougwas
10-10-2011, 07:23 PM
Robert- It must be nice to have a willing (sometimes) model to sketch when ever you want. Another beautiful sketch of Ari. Your red rock sketch will look good as a full painting and your rooster looks like he rules the roost.

Nancy- Your painting has very bold colors. You have been given some very good advice. Copy what you see. Look closely and try to copy what the greats do. Keep at it.

Marlene- I really like the camera! Interesting shapes and angles. As Chris said, it's always neat to just paint what you have around the house. You met your challenge.


I have a full set of FC pastel pencils and 24 Derwent pastel pencils and could never find the right paper to use, until I just tried them on Pastelmat. I now have another love affair.:heart: This is just a tiny 3.5 x 3.5 sketch and it took about 45 minutes. I sped up after I got used to what the pencils could do on the paper. If the pear looks familiar, it's because it is one of my fake ones and you will probably see it again.:D

I am looking forward to experimenting more with the pencils.

Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2011/102199-October_10_Sketch.jpg

Doug

robertsloan2
10-10-2011, 07:57 PM
Cool pear, Doug! I love the way you're varying the colors and backgrounds on each of the pear studies. You have me tempted to do one!

Yep... I was tempted. I have some plastic fruits that my friend gave me when she moved me to San Francisco. I took out a pear, an apple and some grapes to do an oil pastels still life and today decided to sketch just the pear.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2011/70184-10-10-2011-Pear-Study.jpg
Pear Study
5" x 7"
Mungyo Gallery Soft Squares pastels
Black Arches cover stock removed from an Arches watercolor block.

I'm so glad I've got all those plastic fruits now. Real fruit rarely lasts long enough for me to sketch it.

Dougwas
10-10-2011, 08:52 PM
Wecome to the Pear Club, Robert. Your colors just pop on that black paper. I like how you added the cast shadow color in the pear.

I have two fake pears, but they are the same shape. One is green and the other is yellow. I also have a couple of apples and red and green bunches of grapes. Haven't gotten the nerve to paint the grapes yet, but maybe I will attemp them with the pencils.

Doug

robertsloan2
10-10-2011, 09:04 PM
Grapes are fun! I like doing them if I feel like noodling over a lot of little shapes. One thing that could work with the two identical pears if they're not symmetrical would be to turn them at different angles. Mine is leaning over very asymmetrical. If I turned it facing me or leaning away or the other direction it'd look different.

There's also varying it by imagination, draw it a little taller or fatter, make the indentation wider and so on. Just having any pear is enough to make up a bunch of them - that and memory.

allydoodle
10-10-2011, 10:45 PM
A pear club, that's what I see emerging here! Nice job Doug, you've found yet another 'art supply' to explore, Yeah!

I love your pear too Robert, the yellow against that brown background works very well!

I love painting pears, their shape is wonderful, and they come in so many different colors (and they change colors nicely too as you paint them, practically before your very eyes! - though not if they're fake, but those don't rot :lol: , a good thing!).

Grapes are a real challenge, the green ones are difficult to get 'transparent', tricky and an excellent exercise.

Judibelle
10-11-2011, 08:51 AM
Hey...I love the Pear Club... may even join, myself! I have some wooden fruit, not TOO real-looking, but passable...Will give it a try....
Great looking pears,Doug and Rob. Best one yet, Doug!

great job on the camera, Marlene!
and Rob...love your rooster!
nice going, y'all...

allydoodle
10-11-2011, 09:17 AM
Hey...I love the Pear Club... may even join, myself! I have some wooden fruit, not TOO real-looking, but passable...Will give it a try....
Great looking pears,Doug and Rob. Best one yet, Doug!

great job on the camera, Marlene!
and Rob...love your rooster!
nice going, y'all...

So make them look like wood then, that could be neat! Why not, it could look really neat Judi!

Rockport123
10-11-2011, 10:25 AM
Doug- I love the soft gradations of grey/greens in your pear!!

Robert- You pear is great! The use of complementary colors really electrify it!

Marlene

Rockport123
10-11-2011, 10:28 AM
Unfortunately I have no pear to offer, however, I've always wanted to sketch my little blue jar. I included my necklace to add a little interest. Here's my hours worth, hope it reads well! C&C's always welcome.

Marlene

allydoodle
10-11-2011, 10:49 AM
Another gem Marlene, the colors look great on the dark paper!

Dougwas
10-11-2011, 10:57 AM
Chris- Sure, something else to fill my mind up with trying to figure out how to do things. Sticks, pans and now pencils. Oh well, I have them so I may as well use them. Thanks for your comment on my pear. I have never gotten tired of painting fruit, as you can tell.:lol: Last night I was trying to figure out how to paint green grapes with the pencils. Thanks Chris!;)

Judi- Sure you can join in on the fun! Chris has a great idea about making your fruit look like wooden fruit. Thanks for the kind words on my little pear.

Marlene- What an interesting shape and you did it well. Nice colors in the jar and the lid looks well lit. It's not a pear, but we will let it go.:lol: Good job, Marlene. Thanks for the encouraging words on my pear.


Doug

Rockport123
10-11-2011, 02:54 PM
Thanks Doug! Maybe I'll do fruit next! HA!!

Marlene

Rockport123
10-11-2011, 02:56 PM
Hi Chris

Thanks! That dark paper really makes things stand out!!
Marlene

Dougwas
10-11-2011, 04:09 PM
So, continuing with the fruit theme, I decided to add some colored glass to it. This is on 5 x 7 buttercup Pastelmat and was painted with pan pastels. It took the whole hour.

I kind of like the funky bottle, but not too sure about the orange.

Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/11-Oct-2011/102199-October_11_Sketch.jpg

Doug

Greenbrier33
10-11-2011, 04:53 PM
Dough,

I like the reflected like...one to another... orange on the "funky" bottle and some green on the orange. Love to turn it into a poster just for these colors.

allydoodle
10-11-2011, 06:37 PM
Now those colors rock Doug! I like the orange, it has form and presence, works for me :D .

Dougwas
10-11-2011, 07:38 PM
David- Thanks for the comments. I like the color combination too.

Chris- Thanks. I guess the orange is growing on me, but it is gone from the next setup. I am trying three different colored bottles. Wish me luck.


Doug

robertsloan2
10-11-2011, 08:15 PM
Marlene, your little blue box came out gorgeous. I love that, the shimmer on both the box and the necklace is so beoutiful. Stunning!

Doug, cool orange and bottle painting with Pans. The bottle is great and the green reflecting on the orange is cool too. Looking forward to more with bottles.

Rockport123
10-12-2011, 08:17 AM
Hi Doug!

I Love your funky bottle and orange, I almost feel they can dance!!!

Marlene

Dougwas
10-12-2011, 03:32 PM
Thanks, Marlene and Robert. That bottle was given to me by my MIL. When we were visiting she said if I saw anything I wanted to just ask. I ended up with a few still life props and the green bottle was one of them.

Here id a bad example on how to paint glass, but I figured I may as well post it anyway. It is done with pans and is on 5 x 7 buttercup Pastelmat. It took about an hour over two days.

I think I might paint with my sticks for the next one. Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2011/102199-October_12_Sketch.jpg


Doug

Rockport123
10-12-2011, 03:49 PM
I know you're not happy with it but I think together they make a strong statement! I like!
Marlene

Dharma_bum
10-12-2011, 04:45 PM
Here is my first sketchbook entry, a buttercup squash on black Somerset Velvet paper. It's not really a velvet or velour type surface, but it does seem to hold pastel surprisingly well for a standard sort of print making paper. Next time I'll get a lighter color though, but the black works ok for this dark subject.

I plan on doing a whole series of squash sketches and still life paintings. They come in so many shapes and colors, are as much fun to do as pears.

I used a combination of Pans and softies for this one, the violet background is all Pans, and used some in the squash too.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2011/41430-Scan-4.jpg

Dan

allydoodle
10-12-2011, 04:56 PM
Hey Doug, the colors are those bottles are great! I like the setup, I think you're on the right track with that. Glass bottles are difficult, you just have to paint the shapes, and forget about what it is. Paint the crazy reflections and shapes without thinking, so to speak. I think you'll probably have an easier time of it using the sticks, the pans are a bit different to handle. Nice job, I'll be looking for your second version.

Nice job Dan! I've heard that Somerset paper is nice for pastels. A lot of people really like the black, you've handled it well. I think it works great for this subject, you've got some nice texture going on.

Judibelle
10-12-2011, 05:06 PM
Hey, Doug....Your glass bottles are lookin' good...and I love the funky green bottle, too...
Marlene...Your glass jar and necklace came out beautifully....very well done!


Well, here is the wooden fruit you asked for....apple, pear, and something with a big pit...not quite sure what...maybe a mango...
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2011/103700-scan0001.jpg_wooden_fruit.jpg


I acutally bought a couple of pears and avacados today....will be experimenting with them later...
gotta keep up with the "painting/sketching a day", as Larry Seiler advocates.
Seems like that is the theme for this month....from every direction!

allydoodle
10-12-2011, 05:25 PM
Good job Judi, I love that red! Yes, sketching every day, something I've started doing as well. It seems to be catching, everybody's been talking about it. Even at my local club there is a friend of mine that's been sketching everyday, and her book is looking beautiful!

Judibelle
10-12-2011, 07:09 PM
thanks, Chris. I've just started a new sketchbook for the dailies, but have to use carbothello pastel pencils, as i think the regular softies would smear all over the place. I dont really like using the pencils, though.

The wooden fruit was done with regular softies on pastel paper, mostly Mt. Visions.

allydoodle
10-12-2011, 07:44 PM
thanks, Chris. I've just started a new sketchbook for the dailies, but have to use carbothello pastel pencils, as i think the regular softies would smear all over the place. I dont really like using the pencils, though.

The wooden fruit was done with regular softies on pastel paper, mostly Mt. Visions.

I love Mount Visions, great pastel. I've started sketching using graphite for the 'dry' work, and Inktense pencils for the brush work. I get color when I want it, and black and white when I don't. Two different books. I really love my pastel pencils, but for sketchbooks even they get messy and smeary. I wanted something that would stay put, so to speak. I have to say, no matter what though, there's nothing like pastel :D .

robertsloan2
10-12-2011, 08:23 PM
Judi, good job on that still life with your wooden fruit. I think the one with the big pit looks like an avocado sliced open. Mango pits are a bit different, flat and oval and covered with threads that hold more of the orange pulp. Good arrangement and I like the soft edged shadows suggesting diffuse lighting.

Dharma, your butternut squash on Somerset black velvet paper is gorgeous. I like the violet background, it really makes the green pop.

Doug, your three glass objects came out beautiful. You captured the variegation and colored light in the shadows so well. You might be a bit unsatisfied but I like this. The only thing that might improve it could be a few sharp highlights in white or near-white where the light strikes the outer surface of the glass. Adding those highlights last preserves the integrity of the variations inside the bottle and creates another layer.

Looking forward to seeing more when you get back to your sticks! Pans and sticks work well together too.

Dougwas
10-13-2011, 11:33 AM
Dan- That squash looks fantastic! The black paper works well with the greens and the pan violet backgroung looks great. Looking forward to your still life paintings.

Judi- Atta girl! You are painting every day and it is great to see. I know exactly the wooden fruit you painted. You did a good job on them. It's fun to look around the house and see all the different things you can paint.

Thanks to everyone for the comments and encouragement on the colored glass. I have more and want to use at least one piece in my next still life painting. And you guys are right, I think it is easier to do it with the sticks.

I am getting into the habit of having my pastel paper taped to the backing board so if I feel like painting I don't have to waste time prepping everything. It is working well. Last night I felt like painting so I quickly set up this bowl and apple and flew at it. I wanted to stay loose and see what happened. This is what happened. It is painted on 5 x 7 Belgium Mist Wallis paper using a variety of softies and took about 45 minutes.

Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Oct-2011/102199-October_12_Sketch2.jpg

Doug

allydoodle
10-13-2011, 12:20 PM
Another nice sketch Doug! Don't you just love Wallis Belgium Mist? I do, it's great for portraits, a nice neutral color to start with.

Judibelle
10-13-2011, 12:30 PM
Dan...Sorry I missed you squash before...Nice Job!
thanks, Rob and Doug, for your comments on the wooden fruit..
Doug, your latest is a winner! You've got me seeing pears and apples in my sleep! Have been sketching pears in my new sketchbook...they are finally becoming a bit easier....but it's difficult, using the pastel pencils....cant control them as well...

robertsloan2
10-13-2011, 12:35 PM
Great still life, Doug! I like the way you handled the color. It's primaries and yet it's very rich, you must have been using them back and forth in the shadows to keep it that unified. Well done! I'm looking forward to seeing you paint the glass bottles into your new still lifes.

Dougwas
10-13-2011, 04:57 PM
Chris- Belgium Mist Wallis was the first sanded paper I ever tried. I do like it becaus you can leave parts of the paper showing and not have glaring white spots staring at you. Thanks for the nice comment.

Judi- lol Blame me for seeing fruit in your sleep. Don't worry if you don't get the shape right, because you are the only one who will know. That's one of the great things about painting fruit. You can make it any shape you want.:D Thanks for your kind words. Keep up that daily painting.

Robert- I tried to let the colors flow over the edges and let the colors mingle a bit. I wasn't worried about staying within the lines. It was a fun piece. No glass in the next still life. I am borrowing the stacking coffee cups idea.;)
Thanks for looking, Robert.


Doug

robertsloan2
10-13-2011, 10:26 PM
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Oct-2011/70184-10-13-2011-Golden-Gate-Bridge-6-photo-BarbaraW-800.jpg
Golden Gate Bridge VI
8" x 10"
Carb-Othello Pastel Pencils
Light blue Canson Mi-Tientes pastel paper
Photo reference by BarbaraW used with permission.

Dougwas
10-13-2011, 11:45 PM
Nice sketch of a SF landmark. Your pencil strokes give it a rainy feeling. Glad you got some sketching in after your problems today. Hang in there.

Doug

Dharma_bum
10-14-2011, 05:32 AM
Thanks for the kind comments folks.

Judi --- Like the way you have blended the colors in the wooden fruit.

Doug ---The lighting on your orange cup is great, lot of subtle value changes there, difficult to do with yellow, for me anyway.

Robert --- Nice perspective all around on the bridge.

I tried another of a strange little gourd earlier today (well, Thursday), but it went sour on me. It was on Canson smooth side, and filled up quickly due to the constant revisions. I hit it with some Spectrafix, and it buckled pretty good, but I may be able to salvage it with another go tomorrow… um… later today.

Dan

allydoodle
10-14-2011, 08:49 AM
Nice sketch of the Golden Gate Robert! You've got some good atmosphere with very little strokes.

robertsloan2
10-14-2011, 04:36 PM
Thank you! I'm pretty happy with that foggy day one. It doesn't look a thing like my other Golden Gate Bridge painting so I can probably display it at the same time. I used the blue paper as a unifying element even though I used a similar blue in some areas of sky and water. It worked better than I hoped.

Here's a sketch that I'll turn into a street view of San Francisco in pastels later on. Right now I'm going to keep it as one of my six "Unfinished Examples" of my work for my Street Artist Program screening.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2011/70184-10-14-2011-Street-View-Progress-2.jpg
Potrero Street View Progress 2
9" x 12" marked up for 8" x 10" picture area
Graphite sketch on orange Canson Mi-Tientes pastel paper.
From my life sketch of Potrero Street Scene "Progress 1" in pen on Robert Bateman sketchbook.

I'm supposed to show six examples of stages for creating my art or craft. This would be easier if it was a craft. I'm not used to starting a painting and leaving it unfinished if it's something that would take only an hour or two to finish. Been procrastinating on the "Unfinished" examples but today I've got one done. I can always finish it later after the screening.

I still need to add cars too, but that would be easier after I get out again and do some life sketches of parked cars.

Dougwas
10-14-2011, 06:36 PM
Robert- Well, you could show them a sketch book or two as a creative stage, a place where you make quick sketches that could turn into paintings. You could also show them some thumbnails, different crops of photos in Gimp, color studies, photo of a painting at the blocked in stage and have the finished painting to show them.

There are more things out there, but that's what I came up with off the top of my head. If I think of anything else I will let you know.

Doug

robertsloan2
10-14-2011, 07:41 PM
That's what I figured I'd do - bring a couple of my sketchbooks, let them see some notans and other preliminaries. Thanks for the ideas. I hadn't thought of it but I could print out a couple of my photos to show them I take my own reference photos. I need to check my phone to see if I took a photo of the Potrero Street scene. I think it was too dark though.

Oh YES! I snapped some photos before the appointment! I've got that street! WOOT! So that makes three "stages" of the Potrero Street Scene! Now I should do another one in watercolor without pen accents or pen sketch ready for watercolor washes, I could do all of the "partials" on that one scene.

I will have my phone with me so I can open up the phone to show them the photo. I have trouble pulling my photos off the phone because in Windows 7 the software to transfer photos to hard drive won't run. I'd have to buy it again in an updated version.

Dougwas
10-14-2011, 08:44 PM
I am sure you will have enough things to show them, Robert. It sure is difficult to try and put everything we do into steps. We just do things without thinking about it.


Here is another pear. This time I decided to go bold. What the heck, that's what this thread is for. This is painted on 5 x 7 Belgium Mist Wallis paper with a variety of softies. It took about 40 minutes.

I don't think I got the perspective correct and the planes of the plate aren't to wll defined. Oh well.

Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2011/102199-October_14_Sketch.jpg

Doug

robertsloan2
10-14-2011, 10:09 PM
Oh this is great! You did get the perspective right for standing over it looking straight down at it on the table. The pear looks like a distorted extra long neck mutant pear but I have seen them that distorted. It just looks like an unusual one, not like it's impossible. It's very cool. Love the strong colors and beautiful textures!

adigal
10-14-2011, 10:54 PM
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2011/369901-photo-1.jpg
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2011/369901-photo.jpg

Hi all,
Did this tonight in slightly less than an hour, it's a Winslow Homer painting. I had done two sketches of it earlier, but hadn't done any color. I didn't have time to put the boat in, and I know my trees came out fuller, which they weren't supposed to, but any suggestions are very welcome. Thank you!!
Nancy

allydoodle
10-14-2011, 11:55 PM
I don't show up for a few hours and you guys go crazy on me :lol: !

Nice sketch Robert, it will definitely show the first step in planning a painting.

I see a series of these Doug, you've got quite a few done already. Absolutely fun colors, they really make a statement, a good thing! I absolutely love that red you've got in the background, georgous.

This looks great Nancy! It looks like you're doing very well, I like the way you're mixing up the greens.

robertsloan2
10-15-2011, 03:11 AM
Looking good, Nancy! I love the strong values and the dancing, graceful tree shapes.

Thanks for the comments on my sketch! I'll probably do another one and block it in, still have four "unfinished" pieces to do.

adigal
10-15-2011, 07:09 AM
Thanks for the encouragement, Chris and Robert. You guys are the best, always willing to reach out and help!

Question: I have decided to copy some Winslow Homer paintings, as many of his subjects are set in the Adirondacks and the Jersey shore, both places I call home. But so many of his paintings have so little value contrast. Should I stick with the ones that have more contrast at this point? Thanks in advance,
nancy

allydoodle
10-15-2011, 10:40 AM
Question: I have decided to copy some Winslow Homer paintings, as many of his subjects are set in the Adirondacks and the Jersey shore, both places I call home. But so many of his paintings have so little value contrast. Should I stick with the ones that have more contrast at this point? Thanks in advance,
nancy

I would say paint what you love, then you will love what you paint. It will show and come through in the work. I would say Homer knew what he was doing with values (more than us mere mortals anway :lol: ), so just copy what you like, and "paint what you see", not what your brain is telling you, but rather what your eyes are telling you. There is much to be learned from Winslow Homer, that much I'm sure!

Rockport123
10-15-2011, 12:18 PM
All your sketches are marvelous!!!!!!!! Love the color usage on everyone of them!!!! The pencel sketches look great!!! Much said with a minimal amount of line!

Adigal- Soak in your surroundings as Homer did, observe their characteristics and then paint what your heart tells you to! That was the genious of Homer he put his expirences on canvas, and told the story with composition and color. Go for it!!!! Your sketches are super!

Rockport123
10-15-2011, 12:26 PM
On that note, living near the water, I have always loved to watch the waves as they crash upon the shore. So I sketched, from memory, the water. I used just pan pastels and did it on a long/narraw piece of black canson paper.
I only have a set of blues and grays, (they called it the seascape set), so it was a challange rendering it. Hope it looks good, C&C's welcome.

Marlene

allydoodle
10-15-2011, 02:49 PM
Great job Marlene, I feel just like I'm sitting at Fire Island! I guess you did have enough colors, that seascape set seems to be set up perfectly.

Dougwas
10-15-2011, 03:00 PM
Nancy- Looking good. I think you did a good job on the sky. One thing that took me a long time to "get" was the pressure used to apply the pastel. It's just a thought, but maybe if you tried using a lighter touch you would end up with a more layered look. Experiment with a scrap piece of paper and use different pressures with the same pastel and see how many different strokes you can come up with. I know it's not easy trying to learn how to use pastels, but you are doing a fine job and the best way to learn is to actually do it. Keep up the good work and keep those paintings coming. :thumbsup:

Marlene- Beautiful painting from memory. And with such a limited palette as well. Good job.

Robert- I want to practise that point of view. I like looking at other still life paintings with this perspective, because I think they are interesting and it helps with the depth. Plus you only have to think of one color for the table cloth with no b/g wall.:D

Chris- I figured I may as well try the bold color for the table in a sketch before trying it in a larger painting. I have to go to Fabricland and get more fabric now that I am concentrating on still lifes. I think there is a box somewhere in the house with more fabric, but I can't find it. The joys of moving. Thanks for the kind words.

Doug

Rockport123
10-15-2011, 03:15 PM
Thanks Chris! I still want to eventually get more pan pastel colors they work out well for underpainting sometimes.

Thank you so much Doug!

Marlene

allydoodle
10-15-2011, 05:49 PM
Thanks Chris! I still want to eventually get more pan pastel colors they work out well for underpainting sometimes.

Marlene

I have quite a few Pans, and all I use them for is underpainting. I don't quite like working with them through the whole process, but for me using them for underpaintings is what I like most.

adigal
10-15-2011, 06:20 PM
Thank you for the kind words and advice, Doug! I appreciate it.

And thank you, Rockport, for the encouragement. I have been struggling for a year with painting, and it seems as though improvements are very slow.

Nancy

robertsloan2
10-15-2011, 06:55 PM
On that note, living near the water, I have always loved to watch the waves as they crash upon the shore. So I sketched, from memory, the water. I used just pan pastels and did it on a long/narraw piece of black canson paper.
I only have a set of blues and grays, (they called it the seascape set), so it was a challange rendering it. Hope it looks good, C&C's welcome.

Marlene

Marlene, this is so beautiful. I love the way you used the wedge sponge to give it those jazzy strokes, curves that come together out of overlapped short straight strokes. Your waves are so lively and your veils of color are marvelous. You really took advantage of the transparency of Pan Pastels in this. Even the edge of the sky is lively and artistic.

I hope you do pick up some more Pan Pastels. What might help now would be getting a Painters Set so that you've got primaries, secondaries and brown. You'd only really overlap one blue with the 10 color Painters.

Rockport123
10-17-2011, 08:51 AM
I have quite a few Pans, and all I use them for is underpainting. I don't quite like working with them through the whole process, but for me using them for underpaintings is what I like most.

I agree, I wouldn't want to work with them primarily, but they give me a good start, especially when I do plein aire.

Rockport123
10-17-2011, 08:57 AM
Thank you for the kind words and advice, Doug! I appreciate it.

And thank you, Rockport, for the encouragement. I have been struggling for a year with painting, and it seems as though improvements are very slow.

Nancy

I know sometimes improvement seems like it comes in a snails pace, but I found that all of a sudden things begin to happen. It's like a vail being lifted from your eyes, and you start "seeing" things in a whole new light.
Hang in there and things will happen! :clap:

Rockport123
10-17-2011, 09:00 AM
Marlene, this is so beautiful. I love the way you used the wedge sponge to give it those jazzy strokes, curves that come together out of overlapped short straight strokes. Your waves are so lively and your veils of color are marvelous. You really took advantage of the transparency of Pan Pastels in this. Even the edge of the sky is lively and artistic.

I hope you do pick up some more Pan Pastels. What might help now would be getting a Painters Set so that you've got primaries, secondaries and brown. You'd only really overlap one blue with the 10 color Painters.

Thank you so much Robert! I plan to purchase more pans, I've seen Debra Secords skies done with pans and they are marvelous! :clap:

Dougwas
10-17-2011, 11:18 AM
Thank you for the kind words and advice, Doug! I appreciate it.

And thank you, Rockport, for the encouragement. I have been struggling for a year with painting, and it seems as though improvements are very slow.

Nancy

Nancy

Over the past few years I have learned so much about art. So what do you do with this knowledge? Paint of course. It's just that the hand doesn't do what the brain tells it to do right away. It takes time for your hand to understand what the brain is saying. This might sound strange, but the more knowledge you gain now, the better you will be as an artist down the road. And the secret isn't really a secret; you must work at it. Painting and drawing every day will help you along the way. Even if it is only for half an hour, you are still getting closer to having the hand do what the brain tells it to do.

If you have persisted for a year, then we know you have the desire to learn. Read art books, watch videos and keep painting and participating here and you will see an improvement. It's not easy, I have had my ups and downs over the past four and a half years, but I have kept at it and I know I am a better artist to day than I was in 2007.

Keep at it Nancy. You will see an improvement if you keep up your dedication. I promise you.


Doug

adigal
10-17-2011, 09:43 PM
Thank you, Doug. I do really appreciate the encouragement. I just did another one hour sketch, I am going to post it. I do try!!
nanc

adigal
10-17-2011, 09:45 PM
HI all,
I did this is just about an hour. It is actually not as dark as it looks - I took the picture with my i-phone. It is on Canson papers, with Rembrandt, Unison and Sennerlier pastels.

Thanks for looking, andy C&C,
nancyhttp://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/17-Oct-2011/369901-photo-2.jpg

robertsloan2
10-17-2011, 09:49 PM
Nancy, this is awesome. It looks great. I love the reflections in the water.

allydoodle
10-17-2011, 10:04 PM
I like what I'm seeing Nancy. There's improvement already, I see atmosphere and distance in those hills, and nice variation in your greens. Keep them coming!

Dougwas
10-18-2011, 12:23 AM
Nancy- There is depth in your painting. Nice reflections. Keep them coming.

Doug

Rockport123
10-18-2011, 07:14 AM
Hi Nancy

Excellant sketch, I love the purple in the distant hill and the variation of colors in the trees. Keep those Pastels going!!!!

Marlene

adigal
10-18-2011, 07:32 AM
Thank you for the encouragement. It looks flat to me, I have to figure out why. I think I will play with it more!!
Nancy

allydoodle
10-18-2011, 10:00 AM
Thank you for the encouragement. It looks flat to me, I have to figure out why. I think I will play with it more!!
Nancy

You actually have more space and distance in this one versus some of your other work. If you want even more distance, the trees all the way to the right could be lightened and cooled more to show they are farther away than the ones towards the left. Show some layering, so to speak. I think though, you have shown distance and space with those distant hills.

adigal
10-19-2011, 09:41 PM
Hi all,
I did this in about 45 minutes. I have to clean up the place where the two mountains meet in the front. I started it, hated it, went to put it away, but I rubbed the pastel in, and I loved the colors, so I kept going. C&C welcome!!!
Nancy
The picture was clear, I don't know what happened. :confused:
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/19-Oct-2011/369901-DSC_0001_2.JPG

allydoodle
10-19-2011, 10:36 PM
Nice job Nancy, I like the colors too. Glad you kept at it, the more you do the better you will get!

adigal
10-19-2011, 11:12 PM
I need a better picture, this is embarrassing. It isn't as bad as it looks!!!
LOL!!
Nancy

robertsloan2
10-22-2011, 12:36 AM
Nancy, this one is beautiful. I can see the muddy yellowish cast of the photo and mentally correct for it - your use of color is beautiful and I love the shapes of the major value masses. Well done!

Rockport123
10-22-2011, 10:05 AM
Looks great Nancy, I love the greens and purples!

gakinme
10-22-2011, 08:05 PM
So many nice sketches this month! Everyone is so prolific.

I only a couple this month.

This is based on Delacroix's Head of a Lion.

Faber Castell Polychromos hard pastel and Terry Ludwig soft pastel
65 lb light purple cardstock with Colorfix clear pastel ground 8.5 x 11 inch

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/19-Oct-2011/86669-delacroix_lion.jpg


For this, I used pan pastel with a paper towel since it's faster than those sponges and I used the brevity of Chinese concept of doing animals with a few key strokes but only using Cretacolor Nero pencil. With dusty medium, you cannot use a normal graphite pencil on top. So now, it's almost like a Chinese painting - one of my goals of using western materials for our type of interpretation.

Reference photo is from IMAGES FOR WDE: OCTOBER 21 (http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=952586).

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Oct-2011/86669-camel01.jpg

I went to the library and borrowed a Frederic Remington illustration book. Next week, I'll go to the main library and get all his books so I could sketch them.

I've put one of his illustrations in color to this painting background by Fernand Nungren 1859-1932 of a Wall Street Canyon.

Faber Castell Polychromos hard pastel
Derwent pastel pencil
Colorfix blue pastel paper 9x12 inch

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Oct-2011/86669-cowboy01.jpg

robertsloan2
10-23-2011, 12:11 AM
Sandra, these three are excellent! I didn't see the lion when I posted on the All-Media Thread because I didn't page back - wow! Gorgeous lion. The best of your animals is the one I missed. You know me and cats, it's a great interpretation of a master.

Did my tree study from a WDE reference. I like it.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Oct-2011/70184-10-22-2011-Golden-Evening.jpg
Golden Evening
7" x 10"
color Conte on recycled brown paper
photo reference by mclmd

Rockport123
10-23-2011, 09:12 AM
Sandra your three sketches are great!!!! Robert your trees have a nice rythum!!!!!

Marlene

allydoodle
10-23-2011, 02:34 PM
Nice job on the sketches Sandra! Your colors are so beautiful, especiall the last one. Great movement in the first, and the second has a beautiful softness.

Excellent sketch Robert! I like the color palette on the brown paper, it works very well.

robertsloan2
10-23-2011, 02:54 PM
Thank you! I couldn't resist trying to create multiple planes in those trees as they faded off. I was going to just choose one interesting tree for a study but that reference grabbed me with the atmospheric effect.

nkoconnell
10-23-2011, 05:57 PM
I haven't painted in months but got out into the woods for a bit today. I need to spend more time getting dirty and less looking through years of posts on here!

Please excuse the crappy iPhone pic. Approx. 1 1/2 hours - medium gray Canson with a mixture of pastels - mostly NuPastel and MV.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Oct-2011/336541-photo2.JPG

robertsloan2
10-23-2011, 06:22 PM
Beautiful! I love the fall foliage, the way it's just starting to turn with areas of gold and orange coming through all the greens. The reflections are superb. The blurred edge of a car window in the composition's interesting - you must have used a reference. I'm wondering why you included it, that's an unusual element. I like the way you softened it so that it's just a bit of context to the image and gives a first impression of a photo till I see the painterly texture of the focal area.

allydoodle
10-23-2011, 10:37 PM
Welcome to the pastel forum nkoconnell. Nice job on this, the tops of the tree line is especially well done. Nice shapes! I also like the colors you've used in the greens.

nkoconnell
10-23-2011, 11:26 PM
Thanks for your kind comments, Robert. What looks like a car window is actually a shadow of said window.. I took the picture in the car immediately after finishing it and accidentally caught the shadow. So, it's not actually part of the painting.

robertsloan2
10-24-2011, 04:10 AM
Oh! It would have been odd if it was, though definitely original. Beautiful painting!

If you ever do anything like that, definitely keep it blurry and use enough of it to give context.

Rockport123
10-24-2011, 01:39 PM
You've handled the greens very nicely.

robertsloan2
10-25-2011, 04:18 PM
Definitely a sketch, this is a one minute Ari in black and sanguine Conte. I wanted to see how hard pastels would work on the raw mat scrap. Conte is actually harder than any of my other hard pastels, so now I know I can use the others on mat scrap freely. It's also a success in conciseness getting his face that small with that texture, down to the pupils of his eyes (rather large at times).

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/25-Oct-2011/70184-10-25-2011-Ari-Mat-Scrap-Conte-Test.jpg

allydoodle
10-25-2011, 04:23 PM
Super little sketch Robert, loose with nice line work. :thumbsup:

robertsloan2
10-25-2011, 04:29 PM
Purr thank you! That's what was such a breakthrough for me in it - being able to vary the line that much. I was inspired by Jackie Simmonds blog article yesterday, had to try it!

Dougwas
10-25-2011, 08:01 PM
Nancy- Where are you??? I hope you are keeping at it. Please post some more sketches here. Just think of them as exercises, that way there is no pressure on you. Just practice. I'm pulling for you.

Sandra- Some very interesting experiments. I really like the lion. He looks great with that background. I love the intense colors of the cliffs in your last painting.

Robert- Nice airy space between those trees. That yellow looks looks great with the violets and against the brown paper. As usual, you did a good job on Ari, your live-in model.

knoconnel- Welcome to the dusty part of WC. You did a great job on your painting. The trees are very well done. Now you should get dusty again.


I can't believe it has been ten days since I last painted. I decided to start slowly and paint something I know. Hehe, yup, a pear. But I added an orange to the mix as well to brighten things up a bit.

This is painted on 5 x 6 UArt 600 grit paper using a variety of softies and took about an hour.

Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/25-Oct-2011/102199-October_24_Sketch.jpg


Doug

robertsloan2
10-25-2011, 08:13 PM
Doug, I like this one! The contrast between the pink wall and cool gray-green tabletop is beautiful. I like the subtle hue gradation from left to right on it, took me a moment to realize what it was about that gray-green table top that was so beautiful. The different shadows are interesting. This one's lovely.

allydoodle
10-26-2011, 12:59 AM
I like this a lot Doug. The cast shadows are reading very well, and the colors just zing! Beautiful!

Judibelle
10-26-2011, 02:05 PM
Best one yet, Doug....excellent shadings...
nice job on the foliage, nk....
Sandra...as usual, lots of energy in your sketches!
same with your trees, Robert....

Dont think I've posted here all month...decided it was about time i did....so here is a page from the sketchbook I've been working in....
using just pastel pencils...
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/26-Oct-2011/103700-scan0003.jpg__sketchbook.jpg

still working on the pears...

sketchZ1ol
10-26-2011, 03:07 PM
hello
Judi - good colour !
why not try sticks to make bulk/basic colour
then go back in with the pencils ?

nothing ventured ... :)

Ed :}

Dougwas
10-26-2011, 03:32 PM
Robert- Decided to go with a muted color for the table and see what happened. I love painting hue gradations and I am trying to make them subtle. Glad you you noticed.

Chris- Thanks. I tried not to make the shadows too dark this time. Dark, but not too dark.

Judi- Thank you very much for those encouraging words.

Your sketches are great! I love the shapes of your pears. Pantel pencils are fantastic for sketching. Keep at it.

Doug

allydoodle
10-26-2011, 06:09 PM
It's great to sketch like that Judi, there is much to be learned from those quick studies. Nice job!

robertsloan2
10-27-2011, 11:43 AM
Cool studies, Judi! The pears are well shaped and rounded. The spiky oak leaf is awesome, like the turning colors following the veins naturally and the curling. Great!

Rockport123
10-28-2011, 11:30 AM
You guys have done some wonderful sketches!!!!! I love them all! Their vitality is awsome!!!!!

I did this sketch this am in about 1 hour. These quick renderings really loosen me up for my days painting! Hope you like it. C&C's always welcome.

Marlene :clap:

Dougwas
10-28-2011, 11:37 AM
You did a wonderful job on this, Marlene. The flowers look so full and are well formed. The colors are all bright and cheery. Well done.

Doug

allydoodle
10-28-2011, 12:32 PM
Nice flowers Marlene! Your color palette naturally lends itself to flowers, beautifully done!

Rockport123
10-28-2011, 01:42 PM
Thank you so much Doug and Chris!!! They were fun!

Marlene

adigal
10-29-2011, 08:00 AM
Nice work,Marlene! In an hour, you created depth and believable flowers, and a wonderful vase for them!! Wow!!
Nancy

Rockport123
10-29-2011, 09:46 AM
Thank you so much Nancy, as the old addage states, practice makes perfect,(or close to it)!

Marlene

sketchZ1ol
10-29-2011, 01:28 PM
hello
Marlene
i like the confidence of the marks ,
the sense of texture as painterly ,
and the mid to high key palette .
- if you used one brand , this certainly shows its versatility :)

Ed :}

Rockport123
10-29-2011, 03:58 PM
Thank you Ed! I think I just used some old Holbines, they're pretty good for random sketches.

Marlene

sketchZ1ol
10-29-2011, 04:20 PM
hello
Marlene
yvw :)
Holbine - yes i have some from open stock .
> is the surface paper or sanded ?

Ed :}

robertsloan2
10-29-2011, 07:19 PM
Marlene, this is lovely! Frame and sell it. I think it's elegant exactly as it is!

robertsloan2
10-31-2011, 12:15 AM
Did a Spotlight sketch - definitely one for the Sketch thread rather than the Gallery since I copied a master.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/30-Oct-2011/70184-10-30-2011-Copy-of-Monet-Spotlight.jpg
Monet copy for October Pastel Spotlight
5" x 8"
Color Conte on Aquabee Bogus Recycled brown paper.
I don't know the title of the Monet original but I love it.

allydoodle
10-31-2011, 12:29 AM
Super job Robert! There's nothing like a Monet, isn't there? His colors are georgous, always a treat. I like your version, very nicely done!

robertsloan2
10-31-2011, 02:37 AM
Thank you! This is the first time I've dared to copy a Monet and I love it. I will probably do this again sometime, it's helping me so much.