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View Full Version : ANDY, AGAIN!


djstar
01-11-2001, 12:57 AM
This is another wet one, scanned in with the help of pencils on the glass.... just finished it after the winter break.
You can compare him to the last time he modeled at the school.
I am not sure whether I like this as much as the older one, even though there is a more finished quality (Jerry will approve...I hope!) but there is not as much spark.
Waddaya say?
dj*
<IMG SRC="http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/User/Andytwo.jpg" border=0>

degreene72
01-11-2001, 01:20 AM
this is a watercolor, dj? i think it's great.....one suggestion...if you darkened the background on the shadow side and softened the edge of his face there, i think it could add more pizazz....the skin tones are very well done!

David Acres
01-11-2001, 03:17 AM
I was impressed with the first Andy & I'm equally impressed with this version! http://www.wetcanvas.com/ubb/smile.gif

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Dave Acres...
Merely a student of life!:)

'The artist is no more than a receptacle for sensations, a brain, a recording apparatus. But if it interferes, if it dares, feeble apparatus that it is, to deliberately intervene in what it should be translating, its own pettiness gets into the picture. The work becomes inferior.... Paul Cezanne...

jerryW
01-11-2001, 09:24 AM
Andy Rocks!
I'm going back for another taste.

djstar
01-11-2001, 10:25 AM
Watercolor? I thank you for braoadening my range, but none as yet. An oil, and 9x11. still real sticky. Don't do digital camera shots well, they shine too much. So when I get a fresh one, I tend to destroy my scanner!
dj*

cagathoc
01-11-2001, 10:39 AM
I find him very beautiful!

very cute tiny head dj!

cindy

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C. K. Agathocleous ARTwork Gallery (http://members.tripod.com/cagathoc/index.htm)

sandge
01-11-2001, 01:35 PM
This is terrific! http://www.wetcanvas.com/ubb/biggrin.gif

The only thing I might suggest is to really lighten the tonal value of the background to really show off the lovely shape of his head.

best wishes
sandra

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http://www.fletcherfineart.com

Suz
01-11-2001, 05:13 PM
I think it has plenty of sparkle. You are underestimating yourself, your work is prime!

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Suz.

bruin70
01-11-2001, 07:18 PM
dj, this is really a VERY nice piece. it has great drama. i hope you don't mind, but i felt it begged for more drama. so i couldn't stop myself from noodling.

there is great power in dark/black. it is the backbone of a good painting and creates strong imagery. never be afraid to use it. and when you've conquered it, intergrated it into your portraits, they will sing.

i also added a few hilites and darks to pop the ear. nice for a dude with a bald head. notice that the added dark by the nose bridge also pops the eye. in fact, it both pops the eye AND recedes it(like it's coming out of shadow). popped the mouth a bit with some line accent. nose area also.

i was in one of those moods. i'll tell ya,,,your piece is so nice, it was total fun to play with it.....{M}


<IMG SRC="http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/User/Andytwo3.jpg" border=0>

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"it's alright to be judgmental,,,,,,,,if you have taste"...MILT

djstar
01-11-2001, 07:57 PM
Well, nice to not have a consensus!
Bruin, it is odd how, but I worked over an old picture, so the surface was mainly deep Burnt Umber. I sketched the head sort of in the void and right up until the last two poses I had the dark on the left. I was trying like mad to define the tiny ear, the unique shape of the head without definition.
(???) no, that IS what I meant, but I guess I was trying to keep more lost edges than I usually do.
For the last part of the pose, I finally just laid straight RAW umber, cutting out the shapes. The actual background was hot yellow on the left and less bright to the right.
I almost painted the exact opposite picture.
IF I could have blended in the edges, I may have tried what you did. The shadow side of the face seemed to need the definition.
I actually did something totally new with the blending. I only used two brushes. A #2 filbert and a #6 filbert.
Was excellent for softening and defining.
I will admit I just picked up the paints and went at it, but the effect was pretty realistic. I prefer the more painterly look I usually get, but I surprised myself on this one.
dj*

djstar
01-11-2001, 08:28 PM
<IMG SRC="http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/User/Andytwo2.jpg" border=0>
sorta like this.
I guess I can play with my own pictures!!!

sandge
01-11-2001, 08:48 PM
Can I play, too?
I thought I would just try out my suggestion about lightening the background for interest. http://www.wetcanvas.com/ubb/smile.gif
<IMG SRC="http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/User/Andytwo_sf3.jpg" border=0>
best wishes
s

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http://www.fletcherfineart.com

[This message has been edited by sandrafletcher (edited January 11, 2001).]

Impulse
01-11-2001, 09:01 PM
I liked the drawing fine as it was first posted. I think your choice of colour and background as you were doing is working much better than the retrospective!

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If the individual is ever to come under the power of the ideal to the extent of believing that his concrete longings and needs are to be found in it -- found moreover in a state of fulfillment and gratification, then the ideal must give the illusion of granting present satisfaction. It is this illusory reality that neither philosophy nor religion can attain. Only art achieves it - in the medium of beauty.... Herbert Marcuse, Negations

bruin70
01-11-2001, 09:23 PM
whooops!! i added two more things. i brought back the beard as you intended. it got lost when i went over it with dark. the second is very subtle but important. when i darkened the beard, the chin area appeared to be lighter by comparison. so i had to drop it back. they're were two ways to do this. either drop the value of the chin A LITTLE, so that it settles back into the face,,,,,,or drop the value A LOT and pull it back out with a subtle hilite. i opted for the second move,,,,it has more finesse.

sandra's redo is a strong interpretation, yet different. hers was to silhoette the head with a lighter background, thereby creating a stronger "shape" than mine.

all these redos amplify the fact that your original had a strong presence that lent for many interpretations.

dj,,,don't burden yourself with what is in front of you. let go of the reality a little bit and concentrate on "making your painting work". YOU can make the viewer believe. bring the art piece back to reality AFTER you've punctuated your statement. you'll get a stronger painting. if you start out timid, and try to work up to something strong, you will always fall short because you'd be working within the confines of your original sketch......{M}

<IMG SRC="http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/User/finalandy.jpg" border=0>

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"it's alright to be judgmental,,,,,,,,if you have taste"...MILT

[This message has been edited by bruin70 (edited January 11, 2001).]

bruin70
01-11-2001, 09:43 PM
dj,,,i'd like you to notice something. the two shadows,,,the nose shadow and the edge of the head, are the same. what happens here is because of that, they appear flat to each other(on the same plane).

there are many ways to create depth here. i made the nose shadow thicker and thus set the far face/eye away from the nose. any way you can to vary the difference would create better depth.....{M}

<IMG SRC="http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/User/Andytwo2222.jpg" border=0>

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"it's alright to be judgmental,,,,,,,,if you have taste"...MILT

[This message has been edited by bruin70 (edited January 11, 2001).]

djstar
01-12-2001, 12:13 AM
ok, here is my try at Bruin's try at mood.
<IMG SRC="http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/User/Andytwo2d.jpg" border=0>
I beefed up the contrast a bit. Intensified the shadow on the (my) right eye, blended the edges so his shiny head was not so well, bald.
AND I did it all in corelpaint.
(maybe I am ready to post in DIGITAL forum!)

I now want to tell you what I LIKED about the original.
AND do not think I am disregarding this all. Points are well taken,
I think, for me, the very surface effect by using such similar values reminds me in a super slick way, of VanGogh...("now what is SHE on???!?!?") but I like the flat. I also have watched the faint edges. Very different for me. I don't seem to like using line in painting much, rather brushstrokes, but the flattened turns on the shapes have grown on me.
I lived with this on the wall at work and am going to try to use darks more dramatically when I get the chance next time. I seem to have a residual impressionist bias against actual black. I used aliz. crimson, burnt umber and ultramarine in the shadow under the chin to push it back. It will be a leap of faith to pull out my mars.
I will see if I can scan a couple more guys with beards I did lately and see if you want to give a go at them to.
OH an Sandra, I think yours was really stunning! Love to explore the possibilities!

Linda Ciallelo
01-14-2001, 01:00 AM
Hi DJ, I like this painting very much. After reading all the posts I think that I like the idea of a "little" black in the beard and in a few well chosen very dark areas, and I like sandy's "lighter" background. I guess you might say that I would like more contrast for drama. Otherwise this is one of my favorites.

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Linda Ciallelo

djstar
11-10-2001, 12:21 AM
I just finished a class with Milt and this was his FIRST hands on critique of me.
I just want you all to know, I JUST FIGURED OUT WHAT HE MEANT!!
AND I don't feel bad about not having touched the original, because Milt admitted he doesn't like to paint on dried paint either!!
This was a super post and I kinda like comparing and seeing where I have come from.
dj*

ArtyHelen
11-12-2001, 07:52 AM
Oh, wonderful!!!
And I like the original painting far better than ANY of the edits. I don't think it needed a thing more done to it!
Gorgeous!

Helen

Gavinart
11-12-2001, 09:21 AM
How big is this, DJ, and how long did it take you?

Paintonbrush
11-18-2001, 12:56 PM
Nice work...great thread...thanks for the lesson, I can learn so much from you DJ