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Judibelle
11-20-2008, 07:55 AM
I bought a set of the new grays (neutrals) from TerryLudwig, but I really dont know how (in what circustances) to use them. I dont know what I expected them to be like, but they are beyond me for when and how to use them to their advantage.
thanks for whatever input you can give me...
Judibelle

Kathryn Wilson
11-20-2008, 08:16 AM
Perhaps sending Terry Ludwig this question might give you some help. He is a member here and you can try PMing him for information.

Deborah Secor
11-20-2008, 09:03 AM
Judibelle, I think you need to look around and think about where and when you might need neutral colors in painting. Wander around through the paintings posted and take a notice not just of 'gray' but any color that isn't saturated and pure, but is more grayed down, thus neutral in color. I find that neutrals are like the stage on which a lovely saturated color or colors can play the star. They provide the framework for color, allowing the viewer to concentrate better.

Here's a painting where the grays support the richer colors, I think:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/20-Nov-2008/23609-GraniteTranquility.jpg
So don't think of making gray paintings (although you can) but of gray as another tool used in making colors work.

Hope that helps!

Deborah

Judibelle
11-20-2008, 09:08 AM
Thanks, Kathryn and Deborah..yes, I wasnt thinking of making 'gray' paintings, but actually 'how to make colors work'. That's my problem, I think...I dont quite know how to do that. But your sample gives me some idea. Thanks.
JB

Judibelle
11-20-2008, 09:09 AM
...sorry...not 'want' but 'wasnt'

Shirl Parker
11-21-2008, 10:40 AM
Judibelle, you have a short period of time, several minutes I think, to edit your post after you submit it. You will see a button in the lower right corner of the post "Edit". Just click on it and make your corrections.

Kathryn Wilson
11-21-2008, 10:45 AM
And you can always ask a Mod to correct it for you by using the little red triangle button in the upper right corner of your post.

I've corrected it for you.

TurkeyVulture
11-21-2008, 11:10 AM
Thanks, Kathryn and Deborah..yes, I wasnt thinking of making 'gray' paintings, but actually 'how to make colors work'. That's my problem, I think...I dont quite know how to do that. But your sample gives me some idea. Thanks.
JB
I'm a total newbie to pastels, but you might find Kevin MacPherson's books on oil painting really useful for answering your questions about how to make colors (and neutrals) work. I've also found Peggy Macnamara's books on watercolor painting useful re: neutrals. Both artists give a lot of insight that is easy to understand about color and using/creating neutrals. Color stuff applies to any medium. :)

Judibelle
11-21-2008, 11:15 AM
Thanks, Shirl, Kathryn ....Good to know about being able to edit....
and for the references, Libbie, thanks.
JB

dhonegger
11-21-2008, 05:12 PM
If pastel colors come in greyed down tones, why would one want to use grey pastels? Don't the greyed tones of each color take care of the need for greyed-down areas? Or are we talking about using the grey pure as opposed to using it to modify color? Even considering this approach, I still don't see its effect and can't imagine where I would use pure grey, unless doing pewter or silver surfaces, grey cloth, or any item that is pure grey. Am I following the correct thinking?

Diane

Shirl Parker
11-21-2008, 05:16 PM
There are lots of instances of grey shades in clouds. White flowers sometimes need grey to produce shadows. Just two ideas off the top of my head.

Judibelle
11-21-2008, 05:33 PM
Diane.. these dont seem to be pure gray, but tones of colors. But they all look gray to me, thus my question about where,when, or how to use them.
i guess it's a matter of getting used to when grey is needed (like in the clouds or shading of flowers.) I;m not sure how much I will really use them, and have considered sending them back....
but i want to give them a fair trial...
JB

ArtSavesLives
11-21-2008, 06:13 PM
I love neutrals but haven't mastered their use yet. They are what make your colors pop. I have studied my favorite artists over that last few years and found that they actually use pure colors judiciously, almost as accents to mostly neutral paintings. . . which really works!

Those green-greys, blue-greys, and violet-greys will go a long way to defining atmosphere in landscapes.

Richard McKinley did a couple of blogs on neutrals: http://pastelpointersblog.artistsnetwork.com/CommentView,guid,46e8da29-1a0d-4d97-a15e-3fa1f0334a12.aspx
http://pastelpointersblog.artistsnetwork.com/SearchView.aspx?q=neutrals

Judibelle
11-21-2008, 06:20 PM
thanks for the McKinley links...very helpful!
JB

dhonegger
11-21-2008, 08:38 PM
Diane.. these dont seem to be pure gray, but tones of colors. But they all look gray to me, thus my question about where,when, or how to use them.
i guess it's a matter of getting used to when grey is needed (like in the clouds or shading of flowers.) I;m not sure how much I will really use them, and have considered sending them back....
but i want to give them a fair trial...
JB

Ah, okay. Now I understand. Thanks.

robertsloan2
11-24-2008, 05:17 AM
Fog, mist, squirrel fur, deer hide, rocks, many nature subjects come out beautiful in muted color schemes entirely. I've been having fun in Colourful Still Life but have also done a lot of paintings and drawings entirely in neutrals and soft nature colors. When the grays all are muted grayed versions of colors and there's a full spectrum of muted colors, then all the color effects that work in the Colourful Still Life class could work as something subtle.

If I used one flat gray in a fog it'd be a bit dull but might still be the right color. Scumbling a violet gray over a brownish gray could give it a complementary zing, come out about like the flat gray but make it livelier.

I've always loved the super color concentrated pastel paintings but Deborah's example shows what neutrals can do with them. I tossed in earth tones too because aside from doing human skin and animals, I usually use the browns with the grays when I'm going in that direction.

Judibelle
11-24-2008, 07:41 AM
ooooh, thanks Robert. Gives me a lot of ideas for use. I even used a couple yesterday in my snow scene. still, will take practice, like anything else, I guess.
JB

Deborah Secor
11-24-2008, 12:25 PM
Some visuals for you!

417399
Liz Haywood-Sullivan

417400
Sally Strand

417401
Marc Hanson

417402
Haywood-Sullivan again

417403
Kim Lordier

Judibelle
11-24-2008, 01:02 PM
thanks, Deborah... for the references....I think I'm getting it...now to 'use' it!
JB

robertsloan2
11-24-2008, 03:02 PM
Thanks for those inspiring examples, Deborah. I'm smiling just at the sight of them and full of ideas for new paintings.