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~~Kathleen
09-02-2008, 03:24 PM
I am doing a very large painting of a flower. (Yellow Hellebore)
What I would like advise on is the under-painting.
Do I do it in the deepest yellow, or the lightest?
I know, I know, crazy question, but I really do not know!
~~Kathleen

NM Painter
09-02-2008, 03:45 PM
Have you considered an underpainting in the complement? If you let a little peek through, the yellow will really sing.

susme48
09-02-2008, 03:48 PM
Underpainting is something I am lost on:confused: ...mine never seems to show? :o But Mercia has a good idea it seems.

Linee
09-02-2008, 05:04 PM
I think Mercia's idea is a good one. :)

edtree
09-02-2008, 06:52 PM
:wave: Hi Kathleen!

Ah, flower close ups and still lifes, my worst subjects. :eek: I like Mercia's idea too which is better than what I was going to suggest (which was, put down the darks first, glaze the lighter color over it all). I'm excited to see this! Painting BIG to me is SO much easier than small. You'll have to let me know if you agree once you're into this. :D

Elizabeth

Artchrispy
09-02-2008, 06:56 PM
I like the idea of using a complement. Or maybe burnt sienna, which seems to complement everything. Or you could just use the grey value and then you can glaze, paint, then glaze again. Good Luck.

~~Kathleen
09-02-2008, 07:00 PM
I think I will go with the compliment colour then.
The background is a mixture of Purple and Sap Green with undertones of Lemon Yellow!:eek:
(Actually looks pretty good already!:lol:)
~~Kathleen

gaykir
09-02-2008, 09:16 PM
I guess you know I do some floral macros. I either use burnt sienna or payne's grey and it's all based upon if I want the under-tones warm or cool....sienna for warm and paunes for cool. Easy!

deadsam
09-02-2008, 10:56 PM
Usually underpaints I do is in the opposite colors as an underpaint, the only thing is if its yellow on top then it would be purple underneathe, usally you have to be careful when it is a darker underpaint (yellow is extremly light especially when glazing over another color, probably the worst I ever used lol).
I would just make sure the underpaint of purple (if thats the root your going) is light and not to heavy, that darn yellow doesn't cover much and alot comes through (for me anyhow).
Good luck with it :)

gaykir
09-02-2008, 11:13 PM
Kathleen click on the Hall of Fame tab at the beginning of the Acrylic forum and check out the thread In The Red MK2 - WIP . In fact it might be worth your while to check out thios old classroom http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=268085

Some of these old clasrrooms were terrific and there's a lot of great info. Sometimes we forget to take advantage of these resources here!

deadsam
09-02-2008, 11:37 PM
Kathleen click on the Hall of Fame tab at the beginning of the Acrylic forum and check out the thread In The Red MK2 - WIP . In fact it might be worth your while to check out thios old classroom http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=268085

Some of these old clasrrooms were terrific and there's a lot of great info. Sometimes we forget to take advantage of these resources here!

I almost forgot about that underpaint of greyscales I know alot of the old masters used to use that method. Great link :)

~~Kathleen
09-03-2008, 12:08 AM
Firstly, thank-you all so much for your responses.
They are so very welcome.

Now....
Thank-you so much Gayle!
I had read every thread in the hall of fame a while ago.
There are so many resources here, that one tends to forget which ones are relevant at the time!:thumbsup:
I have just finished re-reading it for the second time, and I must say that Nitsa really is a fabulous artist.
(Is she still here?)
And, yes, I have picked up a bunch of pointers again.
More-so now because I have begun glazing in ernest, and plan for my glazing when I begin to paint now.
Again thanks for the "Heads UP!"
~~Kathleen

NM Painter
09-03-2008, 02:02 PM
If you lose the ground, you can always go back in later and overpaint with the color of the ground. I've found the ground works best for me if it's a light/middle value, and thinly painted so that brush strokes don't show through later layers.

NM Painter
09-03-2008, 02:05 PM
Sounds good, Kathleen. Please consider posting WIP photos! I can't wait to see it.

NM Painter
09-03-2008, 02:09 PM
Gayle... being new, I didn't even know about the 'classrooms'. What a great resource! A permanent link to them at the beginning of the forum would be VERY useful... especially to us newbies.

OOPS! Now I see that it's in the Information Kiosk. (never mind):o

~~Kathleen
09-03-2008, 02:20 PM
Sounds good, Kathleen. Please consider posting WIP photos! I can't wait to see it.
__________________
Mercia
See "Whats on your easel above Mercia!:)
~~Kathleen

Sharrm
09-03-2008, 04:47 PM
Hi Kathleen, you've had lots of info given here.
Just my input on the two most recent yellow flowers that I did. one was a rose bud and the last was a Lily.
Both were done as studies, just for this reason, how do you paint yellow flower, without making mud, and keeping them fresh looking. I'm fairly pleased with how they turned out.
I didn't underpaint them at all, for the same reasons deadsam stated in his post. Yellows are very translucent, and lose their freshness with other colors underneath.
I started off with a fairly light color and worked my darks and mid tones after. With some touch ups to the light. It's harder to lighten them than darken them. Also used Zinc white when needed, as it's more translucent
I also think that one could do the greytone values like deadsam remarked, keeping the light areas very light. But haven't tried that yet.
Here's links to the flowers see what you think:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=495977

http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=434439

Hope this helps.......PM me if you would like palette colors or have questions. :wave:

Aires
09-03-2008, 06:11 PM
I don't consider myself accomplished with florals but have done a number of them that turned out to be keepers. When painting a yellow or orange flower I have found that a range of lighter browns and/or siennas are helpful backgrounds. I have also found that just a touch of a suprise color really makes the flowers pop.... as a touch of aqua behind the yellow focal flower. If more than one color flower is used, I try to pick up a speck of those colors also in the background to tie it all together. I can't remember the name of the floral artist who used that method so well but it is what started me on seeing how well it works to pick up at least one other color to make the main flower pop and to include other flower colors, maybe even in the back of a leaf or in a shadow leaf .... My favorite way to do florals.
The color wheel and some practice should help you find your style and make your paintings keepers!:)

JamieWG
09-03-2008, 07:33 PM
Kathleen, I assume you've already started on this, so I think I'm gonna shut up for a change and not rock the boat! :D hehehe.... I am looking forward to seeing which path you've chosen. I'm going to subscribe to this thread; please post a link here if you start another thread with the painting.

Jamie

~~Kathleen
09-03-2008, 08:12 PM
Thanks for your interest everyone.
I started with a Purple:eek: base!

Jamie, I have been posting the progress in "Whats on your Easel.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=515618
So far Post #60 and Post # 68
I find that since I have begun to glaze, the under painting details are really showing up well. (Veins etc,)
I want to take it to the palest of Lemon Yellows as possible with very faint overlays of greens on the petals, the freckles are a wonderful purple.
This is my reference photo taken by my daughter, as I have said, the actual flower was about 1/4" wide.
~~Kathleen
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Sep-2008/92567-reduced.JPG

JamieWG
09-03-2008, 08:35 PM
Kathleen, what a beautiful reference image. No wonder you wanted to paint it! I can't believe how tiny that flower really is. Your daughter must have some great lens! I'll go check out your progress posts.

Jamie