Outside the Lines.. February 17 - 23, 2008

[objectivistartist]

An so begins another week - full of promises of delightful colors and inspirations, bourne of much perspirations...:evil::lol:... new faces and new subjects...:thumbsup: and continuations and completions of familiars...:clap:

For myself, finally got the bag top looking presentable, so will try transfering to the stonehenge paper, and begin the rendering of "Mental Escapees".......:clap:

[Rosa Weitzel]

I see so many new faces and beautiful artwork here lately. I've seen so many people in the years come, grow, teach and become successful artist that I can smile and say to my self as I read the magazine, or book, that they are now in I knew them when. Wet canvas is a wonderful place.
I have another new great grand baby her name is Holly we call her Holly Dolly because she was early and really tiny. What a joy and of course she is the most beautiful baby in the world.
I've been remodeling my bathroom, what a job, so no art. Next Monday will be the breakthrough day back to my pencils Yea!
You all take care.:wave:

Rosa

[CRYork]

I'm glad that you will be getting back to your colored pencils. Be sure to post what you are working on, either as a WIP or a finished piece. Congratulations on the new baby in the family! Nice seeing you on the forum again!

Char

[Printmakerguy]

Another week ALREADY?? Wow- Time flies.

This was my LAST FULL WEEK on the ship! I will be getting off Tomorrow or Wed, And heading back to Tampa! A welcome break from the cold up here... We've been sitting in port, and there have been ice storms all day, knocking the power out. Of course- we had power on the ship, since it all comes from generators anyway, but the town was BLACK.

Vacation time is upon me- 4 weeks of (much needed) R&R...

-Andrew

[fawnridge-art]

Congrats Rosa! :clap:
Great Andrew, get some rest and play! :thumbsup:
And good morning, Robert, Char and everyone! :wave:
I am back on another 'Pairing' this time with a twist. My sister and dh is in town so I won't get to post today, maybe tomorrow. Just keep you guessing until then. :evil: :p

[CRYork]

Andrew, I wish I could go to Florida! It's 10 degrees here and the temperature is dropping. We had another ice storm yesterday....rain, then snow, then ice. I hope you get lots of artwork done while you are home.

Kathy, I can't wait to see what the "twist" will be!

Char

[objectivistartist]

>>>>> I can't wait to see what the "twist" will be!<<<<<
Prob just a Chubby Checker thing....:evil::lol:

[faula]

Gorgeous sunny weather here (which is really strange). I have no idea why I am up this late :p Its almost midnight.

[GoldenArt]

Hi all, I do not have a work going presently. I am doing an outdoor sale this saturday. Trying to get everything ready for that. This will be the first set up I have done in several months. I am not sure what to expect. I like to work as people are looking. I plan to have several started at different stages so they can see the process. I will also poll the public to see if i can get an idea what type of work is preferred. I will take pictures of my set-up so I can get suggestions from you all on improvements. Rick

[CRYork]

Wow, Rick! That's great...your own show and sale! I'm not brave enough to do that. So, all the pieces that you have done over the last few months will be for sale? How can you part with them? Of course, I am sure you made copies.

I am so excited! I just finished talking to Sandra Angelo on the phone about the workshop she is teaching in Wisconsin in June. She asked me to email her a few of my portriats...and she will tell me what she thinks I need help with. I told her, I know I need help with doing folds in clothing! It is an honor for me to have her look at my work. After all, the reason I will be going to the workshop will be to improve my work. Now, I just have to decide which portraits will be good enough for her to see!

I'm still working on the folds on my current portrait...it is a long process.

Later, Char

[objectivistartist]

And now, with my Section 8 inspection out of the way [I passed....:clap: - didn't get the stickler had last time], can get on with life and rendering.....:D:thumbsup:

[GoldenArt]

Char, I am excited for you. Your attitude towards learning and the ability to dutifully work through a learning curve will serve you very well. Just remember have fun with it.

I don't want anyone to get the wrong impression, the show I am going to is an outdoor art festival of sorts. It is being set up at a local park and there will be about 12 or so artist. I really do not expect to sell any but it is my way of pretending to do it. Char I don't think I have to worry about selling any, but if I do I can get copies made for me from my digitals. I have about 52 pieces that I will have at the sale. I really would like to get some input on what people would like to see offered. So many times we have people look at our work and say ,Oh this is so great but continue on their way. I really wonder what people hang on their walls. I guess we compete with the $5.99 picture at the local wall-mart.

Rick

[CRYork]

Rick, I think any of your animal drawings would sell...especially the Silverback and the orangitang (spelled wrong) and the lion. Your horse drawings are good ones that might sell, also. I, myself, like your "Old Truck" drawing. I'm sure it would be hard for you to choose.

Have you done any still lifes? I think those would sell. I think Indians and southwestern paintings would sell, too.

Just taking a break from my portrait...now back to work.

Char

[quickcat327]

Has anyone here entered the prisma art contest? I recieved an email from sanford reguarding it. Top prise is $5000.00

[Brattgirl]

I'm planning on it. But I got til May to create something I hope is good enough. lol.

I'd like to know where you portrait artists find your clients. I am baffled. I had a co-worker tell me that a woman at our job was going to call me about doing a portrait for her. When the call never came, I questioned my co-worker (who is close friends with the woman) and she told me that the woman looked at my website, and my prices were too high. REALLY? I charge $80 for an 8x10 colored pencil portrait. AND there is a fine print at the bottome that says prices are negotiable! I am totally cheap compared to some of you other guys...and I know this woman isn't poor. She has money. So I just don't get it. And that's not the first person to not want to pay me that much for a portrait. Am I really that bad? I didn't think I was, but I guess I was wrong. People see my art and it's not worth $80? I figured I'd keep it low til I built a client base. Maybe it's where I live? But that can't be...cause where I work (where this woman works) is a high tourist area, full of rich people. So why can't I get any of them to commission me for a portrait?? I even told another lady I work with to bring me in a picture of her dogs and I will draw them, free. Just to get the word out, ya know? But it's been like 3 weeks, and she hasn't brought me the picture. So there goes that idea. Boy I'll tell ya...I just don't know how to get started here! What am I doing wrong?

[CRYork]

I can't really say that you are doing anything wrong, except that if you lower your prices you will get lots of commissions, and then your work will be out there for more people to see. I know $80 doesn't seem like much, but the general public does not want to pay that much. I don't charge much for my portraits, but I am almost overwhelmed with commissions. I admit, I wish I was charging more, because sometimes they take a very long time to do them, and I know my portraits are worth more. But, I want the commissions...someday, when I improve with my work, I will raise my prices again. (I just raised them this January). I am still doing commissions that I got in 2007, so I have to charge the old prices. Right now, I am not really making much money, since I spend so much on pencils and paper.

Consider lowering your prices, or do portraits for family and friends, and get your work out for people to see. I was allowed to show my portfolio at church and have gotten many commissions from there (I was giving 25% of my profit to the building fund). Now, a lot of people have seen my portraits, and word spreads by word of mouth.

You have to put yourself out there, too. My recent 6 subject portrait commission was because I admired a photo on the desk of the car dealership where we bought our truck. Now, I have a 16x20 portrait hanging in a public place, and a lot of people will be seeing it. (I did an 8x10 of his grand-daughter first, then he commissioned me to do all 6 of his grand-children)

You, and everyone else, have probably already heard that story.

I hope this helps, and good luck!

Char

[GoldenArt]

Jenna, I know how you feel. One good thing we have going is,art sure is fun to do. I laugh at my art room, starting to look like a storeage area. I will keep painting them and collect them myself. Your art is professional quality and you know it. Never doubt that. We will all just have to keep plugging away. The people that think that is too high of a price for your art are not the customer that will but art anyway. I will let you know what the people say about what they would like to see. I will be taking a survey. I will also be tracking the number of people that visit and what sells from the other artist. I am not even sure what type artist will be there. The first week was last saturday and I understand some sales were made. Keep in mind the reports are coming from the organizers, I am greatful for the chance to try.

[CRYork]

I just thought I would let you know that my computer crashed last night...I guess it is the hard drive. So, until it is fixed, I won't be on here very much. I'm using my son's computer right now. I can't believe how attached I am to my computer and addicted to WC!

I finished my commission and delivered it today....she said she thought it was awesome! I will be starting another one today!

Char

[Ittybit]

GoldenArt: Good luck on your outside show, hope all goes smoothly for you. It seems to be a good venue from the conversation I have had with artists about having a tent show. Pricing is a hard question, but one artist did tell me something that I find very interest. He said that sometimes if we price our work too low it is as bad for sales as pricing it to high. He told me that if we do not value our own art how can we expect others to appreciate our efforts. It makes sense if you think about it. Many people view art from the dollar side of the equation as much as from the artistic side and they feel if a piece is priced too low it is not worth the investment and art is an investment as well as a luxury. I think your work is really great. It presents well and you should draw lots of interest from the public. Hope you have good weather and lots of fun.

quickcat327: I was thinking about entering the "For Arts Sake" Prismacolor art contest, went and looked up all the rules and such. Since the piece cannot have won an award or been previously shown I will have to get busy and create a piece just for it. Hope I have time. Good luck with your venture if you enter.

[objectivistartist]

well, for my part - been suggested to go for, say, $20/hr and price that way -since most mine not run more than 10 - 20 hours tops, and it then gives a medium to work with.... of course the smaller ones go for less, since only put in 5 - 10 in on them.. a thought anyway - after ye get going good in sales, THEN ye can up the price per hour...

[RobinZ]

Jenna, I looked at your site and definitely don't think you are overcharging for your cp portraits, they are lovely.

Not everyone who express interest actually orders. There's lots of reasons and you never know actually why.

I also have had ppl tell me my prices are too high. Whether they meant they didn't value art, so wouldn't pay ANYONE that much, or they meant my work stunk so they wouldn't pay ME that much, who knows! I get it now, I got that when I charged $90 for an 8 x 10 and all through the 5 years I've been doing this. Whatever!

You just have to get out there more, imo. I would recommend visiting the art business forum here. Most folks there will tell you they spend as much time marketing as they do painting. You can pick up a lot of good tips on business.

[RobinZ]

Yesterday I had an art thrill of monumental proportions! I actually got to a small Chuck Close exhibit in person!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Close

UNBELIEVABLE!! One of them was created by fingerprints. Another was an 80 color silkscreen self portrait, done by creating teeny grids and putting shapes in each teeny square. Another was a wood cut.

Really made me think about getting more creative with my cps. I wonder if my art can grow up??

Not to mention his physical condition...What an inspiration, he's my new hero. Anyone else here a "Chuck" fan?

[TessDB]

Oh yes! Been fascinated with his work ever since he did a few segments for Sesame Street (and who says it's just for preschoolers? :lol: ).

Got back in town from a long weekend at my Dad & Stepmom's and promptly got flattened by the flu. Ick. All I can say? Wash your Hands! Just because you're paranoid, doesn't mean the germs aren't out to get you!!! :lol:

Feeling much better this morning, hoping against hope the boy-o (with his school petri-dish immune system) will skip this and that hubby (who got whalloped harder than I did) gets over it soon...

Jenna-- a very wise person (thank you Robin! :wave: ) told me that if you get *every* commission, you've set your prices too low. Definitely cruise the art business forum, lots of good info and ideas and support over there.

Off to catch up on some more of the fab work going on in the forum!
Tess

[Andi Rebirth]

Robin, I love his work, and being disabled he is an inspriation to me. I, like Tess, know him first from sesame street. I am really jealous, great opportunity. Andi

[GoldenArt]

Robin thanks for the link, there is so much I have never seen. His story shows that art does not come from physical abilities, if you are an artist you will create. Robin I like the thought that our art can grow up. I guess we must feed it properly. Rick

Char,OUCH!!! I hope you had a backup to save all your art. I don't back up as much as I should. I do keep all my art on extra camera disk though. Get it fixed and get back in here, your presence will be missed. Rick

[coffeecup12]

Here's a thought about not getting commissions. My husband is a part-time taxidermist. He's been in business since '91 and has very few customers from our hometown and old classmates, but he has done very well with his business anyway. It's our opinion that most people ( not all of course ) don't respect what their old buddies and peers do, and seek others to do their work for them. I don't know how well this theory holds up in general. Try promoting outside of your area. Also, the rich ones who can afford to go on the hunting trips, have the nicest guns and trucks and 4wheelers are the ones who think the price is too high. My husband has learned that he can continue to raise his price a little every year and he still gets all the work he needs.

[faula]

Never heard of Chuck Close, interesting stuff!
I charge £10 an hour but have set commission rates for portraits because I know roughly how long they will take me. Some people say thats too low, others too high. Many people don't actually realize how long even a simple looking piece of art can so often don't think its worth the money the artists wants. or they expect cheaper or free art because they know you from work, family, school etc.

[Brattgirl]

Thank you all for your advice and encouragement. I will spend more time in the art business forum. And I've decided that I am going to subtly remind the woman from work that I offered to draw her dog for free...and see if I can get her to bring in the pictures. But I'm going to wait til after I finish the portrait I'm doing for my friend. Then I will look into other ways I can market. Thank you all! :)

[objectivistartist]

Just letting y'all know - am going on a trip beginning this afternoon, and will not be back on the net until back, on the 28th..... have a productive and fun week, surprising me with many new renderings.....:lol::lol::rolleyes:
[and no - not got "Mental Escapees" anywhere done - will continue on it after the return....]

[fawnridge-art]

Thanks for the link, Robin
Get better Tess
Sorry about your computer Char
Have a great trip Robert
Good advise all an pricing- business forum good place for great advise also- on pricing, the net sales, marketing, etc.

Still working on 'Pairing' series. Didn't get to the leaves yesterday. Ended up designing some cards from older works instead. Have one series of 6 in a deco look, and some just botanical looking. Plan to take some to the next show I do. Can be either a craft one or an art one. Good cross-over material. Will try to get to the drawing today, if I don't get side-tracked again. :lol:

[CRYork]

Rick, I didn't have my drawings backed up on CD, but luckily they are still on my camera, so I will be going to get a CD made of them. Best Buy has our computer,and we paid them $99 to try to retrieve all of our pictures. I have my fingers crossed.

Tess, you must be talking about me! I know my prices are WAY too low, and I am doing one commission after another. I am beginning to be resentful, but it is not their fault, it is mine. But, I feel that once they see how much time that I put into it, they would pay me more than I was asking and at least, come close to paying me what it is worth. I thought the person I did "Fallen Soldier" for would offer me more, since it took me a long time to do it, and I had a lot of small details to put in. Also, I thought my niece would offer me more, because it was so much more involved than my usual portraits. But, again, it is my fault! Believe me, I am going to raise my prices again! Granted, I need to improve in my work before I can charge $80 or $90 for an 8x10...but I am soooo underpaid, and I am becoming resentful.

You'll be missed, Robert! Have a safe trip!

I have to sign off, I am using my son's computer, and he is starting to ask me, "When are you going to be finished?"

Char

[Jack Pryce]

Yesterday I had an art thrill of monumental proportions! I actually got to a small Chuck Close exhibit in person!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chuck_Close

he's my new hero. Anyone else here a "Chuck" fan?

Another Chuck Close fan here Robin.
I have a book "Photorealism" Published by Louis K. Meisel with several examples of his excellent work.

[GoldenArt]

Hi all, I have got 36 pieces packed, e-z up tent ,wall section,table and all the other goodies ready to go. Weather report says 30 % chance of rain from 9am thru 3:00pm. Guess what time the show hours are. You guessed it 9-3,omen, I think not. Going to be a great day. Wish me luck and I will report back on sunday night. Rick

PS When I get back I will make a list of the things I took to do the show and the things I forgot and should have taken.

[pencilcase]

I wish you the very best of luck, Rick, though you won't need it, except maybe with the weather. Don't forget your pencils!

[RobinZ]

Good luck Rick!

Faula: Many people don't actually realize how long even a simple looking piece of art can so often don't think its worth the money the artists wants

Ha, ha, so true! So often things that are skillfully done look "easy" to those who never tried it!

Jack, if you get the chance to see Close's work in person, absolutely go. LOL, I almost never let my kids watch Sesame Street, so missed that! I was a t.v. nazi mom. :D Somehow my poor kids survived me. LOL.

[RobinZ]

Char: Granted, I need to improve in my work before I can charge $80 or $90 for an 8x10...but I am soooo underpaid, and I am becoming resentful

Char, I got to a point when I was undercharging where I felt like a little factory and I wasn't growing as an artist at all because of the pressure of deadlines. Also, customers want what they see in your portfolio, which contrains creativity and growth. IMO. :D

I stopped marketing as much and instead started doing other things... experimented with different media and subjects, took a class, etc., I felt I could be more creative, and tried out things that were out of my comfort zone.

I really enjoyed aceos, not much time commitment but could play. I threw out plenty, but I learned a lot!

It's important to feed yourself as an artist.

[fawnridge-art]

Rick, hope today is going great for you. On the list that I forgot at my first show last year....was the roof of the canopy!!! Frame-had it, walls-yes, tables-yep, but - no roof!!! Good thing it was a sunny day. BUT.. Bad thing it was a sunny day! Had to work at keeping my pieces in the shade. What a learning curve! Will never do that again! :lol:

Char- I'm agreeing with everyone, you are underselling yourself. And as you said, to the point of resentment! I was really concerned about it when you mentioned it took 90 hours for that family one. I know you learned a lot with it and it is up for display and marketing, but still! If you asked only a dollar an hour, it would have been $90! So how many cents did you work for? If you think about it like that, you really need to reassess your fees! YOU ARE WORTH MORE!!!!!!!!!!!!! (There, I made my point. ;) )I Love yah, you know! Now love yourself and your work!

[GoldenArt]

Thanks for all the good wishes on the show.

I will post a quick note on the show here but will post complete on new one tomorrow.

Set up at 8 o'clock, right?...I got stopped at 7:45 1/2 block from the park in a boatload of traffic for a 5 K run they where having. Waited in that until 8:32

I thought no problem still have plenty of time to set up. Got set up and People started coming to booth almost too soon. I had a real good response for the 2 hour and 15 minutes before the storm....more tomorrow. Rick