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Wayne Gaudon
06-10-2002, 06:38 PM
Can someone tell me the colors in Richard Schmid's Pallet?

cobalt fingers
06-10-2002, 09:00 PM
It's in his book, it's not real scary or bold but his work sure holds togther for the lack of hues tossed into the mix. Zorn was the master at that.

JeffG
06-10-2002, 10:33 PM
Cadmium Lemon
Cadmium Yellow Pale
Cadmium Yellow Deep
Yellow Ochre Light
Cadmium Red
Terra Rosa
Aliz Crimson
Transparent Oxide Red
Viridian
Cobalt Blue light
Ultramarine Blue deep
Titanium white

Other additions for warm light or special circumstances

Wayne Gaudon
06-11-2002, 05:27 AM
JeffG .. thanks much

.. I don't have the book and can't find access to it and I don't want to order it through the states as I'll end up paying an extra 15.00 or so for duty. Will get it brough up later in life when a friend visits.

JeffG
06-11-2002, 11:38 AM
No problem. It really is a worthwhile book, but not available in stores, only through Amazon or his site (which is where I ordered it). Expensive, but excellent for the serious beginner.

For more info, check out his website, this page in particular... scroll down to where he discusses his palette.

http://www.richardschmid.com/faq.html

As he stresses, it is what he's found appropriate for his needs at this time, and is not for everyone (he is a master at subdued, overcast landscapes). Still, it is instructive to see how he works.

Wayne Gaudon
06-12-2002, 06:10 AM
Super

Painted Melody
06-12-2002, 01:26 PM
Schmid's Alla Prima book is wonderful. I read it many times a night to digest the amount of information. I also enjoy his down to earth tone when he writes about painting, he writes very sincere.

Jeremy

Einion
06-12-2002, 02:09 PM
Schmid no longer uses real Alizarin Crimson but either of the two replacements from Gamblin or Winsor & Newton, Alizarin Permanent or Permanent Alizarin Crimson respectively; he says Gambin's is a perfect match for the traditional pigment.

Einion

Wayne Gaudon
06-13-2002, 07:47 AM
Firstly, thank you all for your replies. I will get this book as it seems to be a big hit and the man's paintings are a treat to the eyes as well.

Einion
Being as you are the book of knowledge (sincerely felt), I would like to ask about paint. I have read that if you use a heavy paint technique then it's better to use paint with more fillers as it helps you move the paint around. So, the end result is that the student grade paint is a better fit for the artist using thick paint where the more pigment paint is better for the person painting in layers or using paint very thinly as you want more paint than carrier in that case.

1.
Is this a true jusgement?

2. ..
In Winton, the yellows available to me only come in hues how big of a default is that. Do I want to use a hue or should I supplement my line of paint with another brand?

Einion
06-14-2002, 10:10 PM
Hi Wayne, first thanks very much, my references will be gratified to hear they're appreciated ;)

1, purely in terms of mobility, student (or at least cheaper) ranges might actually be preferable if you paint thickly. They tend to be looser straight from the tube because of their higher oil percentage; which would make them easier to push around on the canvas but it will also make them more slippery which some people don't care for. However, paint can be made with less pigment and still be stiff - inert fillers which are practically invisible in oil can be added in quantity without it being obvious (except for the lower-than-expected opacity) and there are chemical thickeners that can turn linseed oil into a thick gel, so not all handle the same way by any means.

Bear in mind though, cheaper ranges are unlikely to age as well as more expensive paint but this is an unknown quantity so without definitive comparative tests you just can't know for sure. Don't worry about it if you don't sweat that sort of thing.

If one paints thinly, ultra-pigmented oils like Michael Harding or Old Holland might be the best bet (although I worry that they might be too lean at times) but the cost benefits are hard to justify if a cheaper range can achieve similar results. Like many things I think it probably boils down to what one is used to more than anything: there are a great many top painters who use brands available in the corner art store, which I personally feel is the best pointer to what paint is capable of in the right hands and much more significant than any amount of self-promotion on behalf of the companies themselves!

2, it depends. The yellows in the Winton range are all synthetic organic pigments, so they will be less opaque than the cadmiums but painting thickly this might not be so much of an issue. Even in moderately-thick films I don't find lower opacity that much of a handicap - a mix of Phthalo Blue and Hansa Yellow Light covers just fine for example if applied with a knife - but a great deal will depend on exactly how one applies and manipulates the paint. The textured brushtroke from a bristle filbert for example can have furrows where the paint lies very thinly, which will show through the colour underneath quite a bit; this may be good or bad depending on what one likes.

I personally would prefer not to do without at least one cadmium yellow (medium if I was limited to just one) not only for its opacity but also for its particular hue and mixing character but, bottom line, if you have never used them you could easily live without them. I do think it's worth trying at least a couple of the expensive inorganic pigments once to decide if you think they're worth it.

Hope it helps,
Einion

Wayne Gaudon
06-15-2002, 08:03 AM
Yes, it helps much. For now, as I am only learning, I'm not worried about longevity as nothing I am making is all that fantastic anyway.
Until I start selling for a price I think deserves better quality, I will stay with Winton. Once I get some cash income, I can experiment. I played with removing some of the oil by leaving the paint out and I found that helped the paint stay put more so when moving it around. It seems that that method will replace the copal as the only benefit I have found from using copal is the quick drying (to touch) and it makes the paint stay put.

Is there a good way to speed drying that won't raise the cracking level as with thicker paint I know they have a tendencey to crack before thin paints will if applied properly.

My Basic Pallet at the moment is:
Cad Yellow Light
Yellow Oxide
Thalo Blue
Ultra Marine Blue
Red Madder or Alz Crimson
Cad Red Med
Verte Green

I have lots of other color but I find these are the basic requirements for a landscape painting.

Thank you again and if you can help speed up the drying time that would be appreciated. Storage is a problem as I am in a tiny little apartment and if they dry to touch fast, I can just put them in a storage compartment and they are out of the way. Using Canvas gluded to Masonie.

Einion
06-15-2002, 01:36 PM
Well if longevity is not a concern there are many ways of speeding drying, adding cobalt dryer is probably the simplest (be careful with it though, it's very toxic and easier to accidentally ingest than paint). If you don't mind a slight increase in transparency boiled linseed oil or an alkyd medium will speed drying.

Einion

Wayne Gaudon
06-15-2002, 04:33 PM
thanks again.

Later,

Einion
06-16-2002, 07:11 PM
De nada, glad to help.

Wayne Gaudon
06-17-2002, 11:02 AM
I have decided to do my charts using these 11 colors. Thanks to all who lent a hand. This is going to be a good learning experience. I use Titanium White for a white.

Cad Yellow Med
Yellow Ochre
Naples Yellow
Cer Blue
Thalo Blue
Ultra Marine Blue
Cad Red Medium
Alz Crimson
Rose Madder
Quin Violet
Verte Green

artbabe21
06-17-2002, 01:57 PM
Originally posted by Wayne Gaudon
Is there a good way to speed drying that won't raise the cracking level as with thicker paint I know they have a tendencey to crack before thin paints will if applied properly.


Wayne, I have used W&N's alkyd white oil with my regular palette for faster drying time when painting during the winter when it's cold and I can't really open windows too long in sub degree temps and know you have this exact problem.

Einion, do you see any problem with this, since one can mix the alkyd's with regular oils?
Cathleen~

Wayne Gaudon
06-17-2002, 08:06 PM
Cathleen~
I have found a reference to Black Oil .. this is Walnut or Linseed Oil Boiled with lead and it will be tack dry in 24 hours .. so I am led to believe. It seems it will darken your color a little but there will be no further darkening as the oil is as dark as it will ever get and will not yellow. The lead is only 2% of the process and is not dangerous unless you ingest it so it shouldn't be a concern .. (Keep away from kids).

It is supposed to add gloss to the painting and make the paint manageable like the copal does. Speaking of the copal, I have had no luck in getting anything done yet with copal that would not need varnishing so I would think it's the last I will order. I'll use up what I got on my present Paintings (studies) or sell it on eBay when I get the black oil as I can get good drying time and gloss from the Black Oil.

Did you get your copal sample yet?

artbabe21
06-18-2002, 10:26 AM
Originally posted by Wayne Gaudon
Cathleen~
I have found a reference to Black Oil .. this is Walnut or Linseed Oil Boiled with lead and it will be tack dry in 24 hours ..

Wayne,
I saw that thread but never read it, I can get the same result, "dry to tack or more in 24 hrs."with the alkyd paint and not have to worry about about ingesting lead. Sometimes I get so involved in that other zone I have been known to put brushes in my mouth, etc. However it doesn't give me much sheen to my work. I have received my copal samples yesterday & will give them a try, if I ever get painting time again!!!!!!!! Between travel, company, family commitments-----it's turning out to be a bleak summer for painting. This is when I am sure I should just be a hermit!!!!!!!!
Cathleen~:confused:

Wayne Gaudon
06-18-2002, 11:00 AM
You can always paint in your mind for the summer because in the scheme of things, family should come first. Enjoy.

artbabe21
06-18-2002, 11:19 AM
Family always comes first, it's just that I'd like a balance. I have missed 8 years of painting and am so ready to go here and find
I have to keep waiting even more. Summer is so short here and I hate to miss painting outdoors! I paint in my head all the time, that's what I was doing the last 8 years, now I need to release
them!!!!

BTW, I don't eat brushes, per my last post, just will quickly hold one between my teeth while I use another.

Cathleen~:rolleyes:

Wayne Gaudon
06-18-2002, 07:24 PM
I use a liner and times another one and I have the same habit .. I am going to drill a few holes in my easle so I can just stick them in there as chewing on paint is not a good idea ..

artbabe21
07-03-2002, 03:30 PM
Can anyone enlighten me to the wonders of this book and what it covers besides the obvious? It seems the only ones available are $95 through a web site. While I realize this is a subjective question, I'd just like any opinions on how deeply I might want to pursue this book--
thanks, Cathleen~:o

Einion
07-05-2002, 12:15 AM
Hey, beats 300 to 600 bucks for his figure and landscape books! Might be an idea to see if your local library will acquire it so you can peruse it for free :)

Einion

artbabe21
07-05-2002, 10:59 AM
Thanks Einion,
We have such a lousy library here, but I'd forgotten about the loans from other libraries that might have the book. I will check that out.
Cathleen~