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thollis
07-27-2007, 06:49 PM
I've been painting/drawing with soft and hard pastels on Canson Mi-Tientes Papers since I was in art school (and its readily available at my local craft store). I don't love it. Some of it has virtually no tooth. Others have a tooth that looks like burlap. ick.

-I want to know what brands other people use/recommend.

-I've heard some people recommend Kitty Wallis sanded paper. I've ordered samples to see it for myself. Any recommendations on use of this?

-Can pastels be used on surfaces other than paper reliably? primed board for example. If so what kind of primer? what are other considerations for this type of use?

-I've heard of pastels on primed paper surfaces also - advantages? disadvantage?

Thanks!

water girl
07-27-2007, 07:05 PM
Oh, where to begin....
Experiment until you find the surface you feel most comfortable using: Kitty Wallis, Art Spectrum, La Carte, Ersta, or 140 lb Arches watercolor paper with a watercolor underpainting. Sanded papers will allow you to build up many more layers of rich pastels. Just remember that some sanded papers will accept a wash, while others will disintegrate when liquid touches the surface. Happy experimentation!

prestonsega
07-27-2007, 08:04 PM
Wallis is the only support I use.....It may be more expensive but it I have some good works on recycled Wallis.

Paula Ford
07-27-2007, 10:46 PM
Wallis is really the only thing I use also. It's the best. Though I suggest you experiment. Everyone has different tastes in paper.

Paula

jkt
07-28-2007, 02:47 AM
I started on Canson and liked it. Then Wallis was recommended at a workshop. It is great! Also I like La Carte. Now I go between Wallis and La Carte. I second the suggestion of experimenting and finding what works for you.

JoAnne

maggie latham
07-28-2007, 07:01 AM
Hello,
Experimentation is the best way to get to know what you like and don’t like. Dakota pastels offer a sampler pack of various surfaces, which is a good way to try out new papers without investing in large sheets. For me, I have tried many surfaces, including a lot of home made grounds on various substrates…. but I always come back to Wallis, and remember what a joy it is to paint on after being a way form it. It can be mounted on gatorboard, masonite etc. There are several threads about mounting Wallis to board.....if you do a search. I am a firm believer in buying the best quality art products that you can afford…. as the pigments are richer…this goes the same for papers. In my opinion Wallis is the Rolls Royce of sanded papers.
Have fun…
Maggie

Pabs
07-30-2007, 06:51 AM
Art Spectrum Colourfix gets my vote - I think it's brilliant. Wonderful surface, holds the pastel very well, and has an excellent range of colours to start with which really enhances your work.
And a big plus for me - although dearer than Canson MT etc, it's certainly not out of everyone's reach prisewise. Excellent value for money.
Regards,
Pabs

GMGen
08-01-2007, 04:14 PM
If I wanted to use watercolor blocks because I like the idea of underpainting in watercolor, would you use cold press or rough?

Gammy Hayes
08-01-2007, 08:16 PM
I have only been working for 6 years...but experimenting alot. I sometimes use a Golden ground made for pastels brushed onto watercolor paper, or Winsor Newton Clear Gesso. I also do my own boards .....several steps with mat medium (acrylic) , aluminum oxide grit or pumice (FF or FFF) grades , and brushed or rolled on with a roller. Underneath can be paper (heavy) or masonite, sealed with acrylic gel medium, or gesso.....lots of artists do this type of thing. Some use illustration boards, but then you are getting in the price range of Kitty Wallis, which is still my favorite for portraiture, or fine pieces.

I like to also adhere a thin foamie sheeting (craft foam I get in rolls)with gel medium to a board and then put the rough ground over. All of these give me different effects. They allow me to do underpaintings in watery acrylics, watercolors, or even oil washes. Then I paint over them with my soft pastels. The foamie board gives a wonderful surface that is attentive to the pressure of my strokes. (Paul DeMarris.....at [email protected]) was my wonderful mentor, via emails, as I am a Kansan and he is from Tenn. I think his web site still offers the instructions. He is a great inspiration and help if you want to try this. He also has wonderful homemade pastels...he offers.

Hope this gives you ideas.

Lynette (Gammy Hayes):cat: :clap: :cool: :wink2:

BruceF
08-02-2007, 01:47 AM
If I wanted to use watercolor blocks because I like the idea of underpainting in watercolor, would you use cold press or rough?
I'd use the rough as it would have more tooth for layering the pastels.

But, you can underpaint with Wallis, Colorfix, and some of the other pastel papers.

GMGen
08-02-2007, 11:21 AM
I'd use the rough as it would have more tooth for layering the pastels.

But, you can underpaint with Wallis, Colorfix, and some of the other pastel papers.

I really like the idea of using blocks for plein air, and they are far more economical (25 sheets as opposed to 8 for the same money)

I think I'll do a little work with the watercolor paper before I move onto more expensive things like wallis, but thanks

maggie latham
08-07-2007, 07:49 AM
Gwen,
Me again! I use watercolor blocks quite often as I paint in watercolor also. In my experience I have found that the cold pressed arches blocks are perfect, but I always give the paper two coats of colorfix pastel primer/ground in white and let it dry. I f you try to apply pastel to unprimed watercolor paper it does not produce such good results. If you are just starting out in pastels, you really should by a sample pack of papers, because different surfaces affect your work. Good Luck, and post some of your new paintings for us to see….
Maggie

scall0way
08-08-2007, 01:16 PM
I know so many people adore Wallis, but it is just not my favorite, a little bit too rough and "toothy" for me. I'm a finger blender and I wore my finger raw when trying out Wallis - but can't happily use any other blending technique.

As far as the surface goes I love Colourfix paper the best, but it does not come in any size I like which is a disappointment to me. Colourfix also sells just their primer, and I have used that on watercolor paper. It works, but does not seem to work as well for me as the actual Colourfix paper does, so I don't really have any answers. I mostly just use Canson (smooth side) because it's pretty cheap, and I seem to be able to get the effects I want on it. I buy it in the 12x16 multi-color pads.

thollis
08-08-2007, 05:00 PM
I have been using 300lb rough watercolor blocks that I found amidst a pile of art supplies my grandmother left me. I love it so far. It takes ALOT of pigment without losing tooth...and you can erase it to hell and back without tearing it.

scall0way
08-10-2007, 12:48 PM
I have been using 300lb rough watercolor blocks that I found amidst a pile of art supplies my grandmother left me. I love it so far. It takes ALOT of pigment without losing tooth.

Interesting, I tried some 300lb watercolor paper one time because I had a bunch left over from a watercolor class I took one time. I *hated* watercolor, and knew I would never use the paper for its intended purpose. :)

But I didn't like this either as it did not take a lot of pigment at all, and was impossible to layer. It was a complete washout. But I have used it some with several coatings of Colourfix ground, not the best but sort of workable.