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sharcol91
07-18-2007, 10:47 PM
I've been reading where a lot of you are spraying fixative to the grounds before working on the painting. If you have Wallis or Colorfix, are you supposed to spray it with fixative before you start your drawing? It might be a personal preference, but I've seen a lot of people talk about it. Thanks for responding. I'm just getting started with pastels.

JON805
07-19-2007, 12:58 AM
Since working on Wallis I have not used Fixative in years.

mrking
07-19-2007, 01:08 AM
I use fixative on canson when I lose the tooth. On sanded paper I have no need to use fixative.

Deborah Secor
07-19-2007, 01:08 AM
I guess I'm a little confused... I really think most of us here DON'T spray fixative at all, and no on I know of sprays fix on Wallis or Colourfix before painting. A few might spray a charcoal UNDERdrawing with workable fixative before applying color over it, but I don't even do that...

For a little perspective on my method you can check out this article: Underlying Shapes (http://http://www.wetcanvas.com/Articles2/23609/460/)

Deborah

mrking
07-19-2007, 01:26 AM
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Articles2/23609/460/ <-- link fixed

Pabs
07-19-2007, 05:44 AM
I only spray fixative on Canson MT when I've finished. Only once, ever, have I sprayed it on a piece of work to add a little more once I thought it was "completed".
Regards,
Pabs

sharcol91
07-19-2007, 12:28 PM
Thank you so much for your replies. I have also read that some will spray fixative in the middle of the painting to be able to add more layers. I'm supposing the fixative adds a little more for the pastel to grab a hold of.

bluefish
07-19-2007, 03:48 PM
do some research on fixatives - there is an abundant amout of material on this site - ....go to Donna A's site and look up fixatives - see has it RIGHT! - even the work of the national gallery! and yes, we do spray two or three light coats of Lascaux fixative after completing the painting or else you'll have it all over your mats, glass etc., no matter what type of surface you use(including aluminum oxide surfaces)! ........'bluefish':cool:

PeggyB
07-19-2007, 06:05 PM
do some research on fixatives - there is an abundant amout of material on this site - ....go to Donna A's site and look up fixatives - see has it RIGHT! - even the work of the national gallery!

and yes, we do spray two or three light coats of Lascaux fixative after completing the painting or else you'll have it all over your mats, glass etc., no matter what type of surface you use(including aluminum oxide surfaces)! ........'bluefish':cool:

Don't know that I'd go that far in saying the pastel will be all over everything, Blue. Sometimes I spray and sometimes I don't, and I have many different reasons for doing so if I do. I have large paintings that have been shipped all over the country with linen wrapped mats and plexiglass, and they've returned to me without any observable dusting. I do take the plexi off and put them under glass once they've completed the "competition circuit". These paintings have all been done on sanded surfaces of various brands. Surfaces with less tooth do tend to shed pastel, and I will lightly fix those - with LasCaux fixative. Sometimes I'll use various fixatives during the painting process for various reasons. If I want to darken an area or "seal" an area so the color won't blend into the next one I'm using, I'll use a final fixative spray (nonworkable spray). If I want to get back some tooth on an over worked area (that doesn't happen on sanded surfaces for me) I'll use a workable spray like LasCaux. If I want to create texture beyone what the surface allows, I'll use both workable and nonworkable sprays. However, I've never heard of anyone using a spray before starting to paint other than as Deborah has suggested.

What I'm saying is you'll have to do your own experimenting to know what you want to use. Spraying does change the texture of the surface, and some change the color of the pastel greatly - which may or may not be what you want. LasCaux is one that doesn't change much.

Peggy

BTW, Bluefish said, "and yes, we do spray two or three light coats of Lascaux fixative ..... " Would that be an imperial "We" Blue? :lol: just teasing.

bluefish
07-19-2007, 07:03 PM
want to see my 'crown' and 'robes'? :D

PeggyB
07-19-2007, 09:22 PM
want to see my 'crown' and 'robes'? :D

Could you just paint a pastel of them and post it??? :lol:
Peggy

Deborah Secor
07-19-2007, 11:28 PM
I really don't care for Lascaux fixative at all, so don't include me in that royal WE! I use Sennelier fixative for soft pastels, called La Tour, IF I use any fix at all--which I usually don't unless the painting is going long distances in a shipping container. For the first sixteen years of my career I never once used fixative...

Oh, and thanks for fixing the link, Mike! :o

Deborah

PeggyB
07-20-2007, 02:39 AM
I really don't care for Lascaux fixative at all, so don't include me in that royal WE! I use Sennelier fixative for soft pastels, called La Tour, IF I use any fix at all--which I usually don't unless the painting is going long distances in a shipping container. For the first sixteen years of my career I never once used fixative...

Oh, and thanks for fixing the link, Mike! :o

Deborah

Well different strokes, etc. I used La Tour for the first time today, and I'm not crazy about it! It darkened the pastels more than the LasCaux, and "dripped" a drop on the surface of the painting. I don't have that trouble with the LasCaux. However, I'll try it again as I know for me sometimes it takes a time or two to get accustomed to a new product.

Like Deborah, I didn't use any fixatives at all for many years - can't say exactly how many, but I'm guessing somewhere between 15 - 20 years. At the present, I'm experimenting with more fixative and spray varnish to completely seal the pastel. So far I'm not crazy about that method either, but wanted to see what the excitement was all about creating "glassless pastels". I highly suspect I'll be soon returning to "pure pastel". :)

Peggy

bluefish
07-20-2007, 07:57 AM
for our newer viewers it's "Lascaux", not LasCaux - don't want people confused!

originally, I (note, not we!) fixed utilizing Grumbacher 'Tuff Film' final fix after completion and 'Tuff Film' during the working session - ( both Deborah and Peggy were still in 'diapers') - then came the era of it's ungodly to 'fix' a pastel - it all had to be natural! But soiled mats, pastel on the glass, and customer complaints followed with a subsequent re-birth of fixing pastels! 'what goes around, comes around'!

more recently, a lot of scientific research has been carried out which summerizing, states that fixing is the way to hold the pastel onto the supporting surface - and low and behold, after all these years, it was recommended that the 'Tuff Film' did a great job!

I used the Sennie 'fixative' and IMHO it was O.K. but the Lascaux is my choice - it is crystal clear, doesn't darken the painting (when used in multiple light coats) , sprays evenly, but is not cheap! Over the years, his highness :) has used almost all know and unknown brands of fixative and rates Lascaux his choice, followed closely by 'Tuff Film'! Sure hope this helps some of our new pastelist!

As you can see, Deborah has success with one product, Peggy with another, so try various products to see what suits your needs!

PS Peggy - that posting would spoil all the 'fun'! :smug:

'bluefish':cool:

Snowbound
07-20-2007, 09:07 AM
I use fixative selectively. Learned a lot from Bill Creevy's book about using it in creative ways. This week I took a bunch of stuff I had stuck to my wall down to put away (otherwise it intimidates me). I had a quick, high contrast and bold sketch with a load of pastel on it that I wanted to stabelize before putting it away, and I wanted to make sure it had an even coverage because of the style. I sprayed the heck out of that piece-- repeated light layers, letting dry in between (outdoors on my deck during a brief period of no rain this past week). In this case, I used Krylon workable (which I'd gotten specifically because it does not contain a material that I am horridly sensitive to, not because of any particular characteristics). I absolutely love the effect the fixative gave this painting. For this painting, it was a good addition. I'm going to try that again, on purpose. I am also going to try using spray varnish on some pieces. As with every medium, there are different schools of thought about a lot of things. With pastels, this is one.

Personally, I don't have a problem with the idea that fixative or varnish "changes" the character of the pastel material. For me, that effect becomes part of the artistic process, not simply something that is done as an afterthought. I don't want to be limited by a single consideration as an artist. (I've even applied safflower oil to a few things, and liked the effect.)

I love learning about the experiences of other artists, and one of the most important things for me is hearing WHY someone feels something works for them, or, even more importantly, why it doesn't. The very thing that doesn't work for someone else may be the solution I am looking for and didn't know it! Knowing the thought processes behind other artists choices helps me learn to make my own.

Dayle Ann