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maverick
04-11-2007, 11:09 PM
Hi everyone! Many of you may have seen me share some "works in progress" paintings where I attempted to follow the Flemish Technique with pretty good results. Those threads can be found here: Salt Shaker (http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=413432), Egg Cup (http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=413919), and Pepper Shaker (http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=413643).

I'm by no means an expert in this technique, nor do I have any strong feelings about it except that it can be very useful for building color depth, ensuring you have a full value range, and helping with accuracy in realism. It's really all about planning ahead for a successful painting. When I was just starting out as a painter, I was often told that I didn't use enough colors. Now I glaze many colors in my paintings, and color glazing is part of the Flemish Technique. Another common mistake I made when I began to paint was to not use a full range of values (shadow and light). Interesting paintings are all about light, and light and shadow work together. The Flemish Technique makes sure you take care of this properly early on.

One of the major differences between the way I normally paint and the Flemish Technique is the monochrome underpainting step, referred to as the "dead layer". This step is very useful because it helps avoid having to correct mistakes while applying color. In fact the whole process stops you from carrying mistakes forward because you have the opportunity to deal with them once and for all during the earlier steps. It's difficult to completely hide something with glazes.

From my readings, I've learned that the Flemish Technique originated from a process used by egg tempura painters to overcome limitations with that medium. It was one of--if not the the first--technique used with the new medium of oil paint, and was adopted by many master painters.

There are supposed to be 7 steps involved in the Flemish Technique, but it depends on how you break it down. The number of steps aren't important really, so we won't get hung up on that. The steps I've been able to piece together are:

Drawing

Sometimes called a cartoon. Of course this is the drawing of the subject you want to paint.

Transfer Drawing to the Support

Traditionally, a rigid wooden panel was used as a support. It was prepared with some kind of white paint. As far as I know, rabbit glue sizing and lead white primer on canvas was used in the Venetian Technique as a later development. Acrylic Gesso is the contemporary medium and it can be used on panels as well as canvas.

To transfer the drawing, you can poke pin holes in it around the major lines you wish to transfer, place the drawing on the canvas and knock some charcoal dust into the holes. Another method is to apply charcoal to the underside of the drawing and trace the image using a hard pencil.

Freehand Drawing Refinements

Once your major lines are transfered, you will refine your drawing. I've found that a sharp pencil is best for this because the detail is not easily washed away in the next step.

Imprimatura

This is a mid-tone wash that seals the drawing and helps you better judge values in the next step. Values tend to appear darker on a plain white surface and you will compensate, only to find out later it's wrong. Pastel artists like to use tinted papers for the same reason.

Umber Layer Shadows

This is where you paint the shadows using the same basic color as the Imprimatura, which is typically Umber. I use Burnt Umber. The shadows are to be glazed. You can do a considerable amount of shading using glazes of one color.

Opaque Highlights

I missed this step during my first couple of attempts, but on the third try I naturally completed it because it seemed logical. I later read that this was indeed part of the process at this stage.

White paint is typically opaque, but it can be glazed if desired. Here we are using white as the third tone in the painting.

Dead Layer

I'm sure this is the step that is questioned the most because it seems like a lot of work for a questionable amount of benefit. But this is typically your complete painting down to the last detail, excluding color. All of your decisions about tone have been made, and you have your complete range of values. It's much easier to keep tonal decisions separate from color decisions.

Color Layers

Here is where you apply as many color glazes as necessary to complete the painting. Multiple layers will give you more depth. The light will bounce off each layer slightly differently giving it a unique glow which helps with realism, and makes the painting more visually appealing.

Highlights and Details

The last step is to complete the final highlights and details. This is an important step because it often gives the painting that extra "something" that gives it life.

*****

Here is the best example that I've produced so far:

Egg Cup
6x6 acrylic on canvas

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/09-Apr-2007/10671-egg__cup_sequence.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/09-Apr-2007/10671-egg_cup2.jpg

Next I will select a photo from the RIL to work on.

Everyone is welcome to follow along...

ottwork
04-11-2007, 11:22 PM
Yay! :clap: Now I can see if I'm doing mine correctly!! :D Thanks, Mark!

maverick
04-12-2007, 12:10 AM
Correct is a subjective term in art! I think you're doing fine.

Here is the reference image I've chosen. It's an image from the RIL by mprince.

You can get the full resolution image here (http://www.wetcanvas.com/RefLib/showphoto.php?photo=70550&cat=500&ppuser=99429).

Tai Eggplants with Jug

http://www.wetcanvas.com/RefLib/data2//61/medium/Thai_Eggplant.jpg

jan409
04-12-2007, 12:02 PM
This looks interesting. Am anxious to get started. Jan

mseymour
04-12-2007, 12:57 PM
Thanks, Maverick. Look forward to seeing the rest of this tutorial.

Polygon
04-12-2007, 12:59 PM
I'm glad to see you doing this, thanks! I'm very curious about the dead layer, can't wait to see it in "action".

Hoofmama
04-12-2007, 02:14 PM
Does this method work for landscapes? If anyone has any examples, I'd love to see them.

maverick
04-12-2007, 03:36 PM
Jan...glad you could join in.

Merritt...join in if you have time.

Polygon...I'll try my best to use the dead layer to maximum advantage.

Hoofmama...it's a technique for any kind of painting, but I'm generally a still life painter so that's why I chose that particular image. I wouldn't want my inexperience in another genre to get in the way.

dribear
04-12-2007, 05:07 PM
I'll right... I'll give it a shot. Count me in :)

Charlie's Mum
04-12-2007, 05:40 PM
Beautifully explained and presented Mark - thank you so much for teaching yet again :D

Dewi
04-13-2007, 03:48 AM
Hi Mark, now I could make my Thai eggplants look nicer (a few weeks ago, I've painted this from the WDE)
I don't mind to start a new one again if possible.
Thank you for the explanation and looking forward for this lesson.

Clever
04-13-2007, 07:52 AM
Yayyy...it's begun

boo-hoo...I don't have time to paint until next Tuesday.

but I'll be watching!

mprince
04-14-2007, 08:42 AM
Here is zip with some larger crops on those eggplants- these give a little more detail of the forms.

357178

jan409
04-14-2007, 08:55 AM
Thank you. Jan

jocelynsart
04-14-2007, 09:22 AM
Nice to see you Mark! Some gorgeous work and wonderful info.
Jocelyn

Lady Carol
04-14-2007, 09:52 AM
Mark, you are totally my hero.

Thank you for a in depth take on this technique.

TxAggieDarlin
04-14-2007, 10:06 AM
I am sure going to give this a try. Thanks for doing this!

jgary1
04-14-2007, 11:54 AM
What surface do you work on? I have been using acrylics as watercolors and typically use illustration board, or clayboard textured which are made for watercolor application. I don't think those porous surfaces would work well with the Flemish technique, but haven't had any good experiences working with gessoed Masonite or other hard smooth surfaces. So, what will you be working on in this demo so I can maximize the learning benefit?

eyepaint
04-14-2007, 12:34 PM
I'm eager to jump into this project. Go Mark go! :)

maverick
04-15-2007, 01:13 AM
Thanks for dropping in everyone!

It's nice to see some familiar names.

Welcome Dribear!

You're welcome Maureen. I enjoy it, and the experience is good for me.

Dewi...sorry this isn't a new image for you. It's such a nice arrangement and the lighting was just the way I like it.

Join in any time Clever...

Thanks Michael for sharing your fabulous photo and the close ups!

You're welcome Jan!

Hi Jocelyn! And thank you!

Carol...:o

You're welcome Tx!

Gary, I'm working on canvas, but this technique was invented before canvas became popular, so a rigid surface should be fine. I probably can't help you very much if you're using paper that isn't sealed. I don't have any experience with porous paper and acrylics. I work the surface pretty hard with bristle brushes.

Thanks for cheering me on eyepaint!

OK, I've been painting all day, so I'll start posting some progress photos now.

maverick
04-15-2007, 01:36 AM
I used the squaring method to enlarge the image onto my canvas which is larger than I normally work with at 24x30.

I outlined the major lines in charcoal so they could be seen more easily. I sprayed it with fixative so the charcoal wouldn't smudge.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_drawing.jpg

maverick
04-15-2007, 01:47 AM
Here is my imprimatura (mid-tone wash). I used Burnt Umber, Sepia, and Sludge (neutral green-gray left-over paint from Tri-Art). Burnt Umber alone will work equally well. I like to mess around and try new try new things. The paint has to be thin so you can see your drawing through it. I made it fairly dark since the overall painting will be dark.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_imprimatura.jpg

maverick
04-15-2007, 02:06 AM
One more update before I call it a day...

Here is the Umber layer where I've used Burnt Umber (and Sepia that I'm starting to experiment with) to glaze all the shadow areas. The lighter areas are left with the original tone from the last step. I mix glazing medium, or water in some cases to the Burnt Umber depending on how dark I want the area I'm working on to be.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_umber.jpg

The next step is the Opaque Highlights which will start to give the painting depth and form.

jan409
04-15-2007, 09:23 AM
I will start working on this this morning. I think it is exciting, learning somthing new. Jan

JamieWG
04-15-2007, 09:43 AM
Bravo! I've really enjoyed reading your seven steps, and the egg came out fabulous. I'm pulling up a chair to follow the rest of this one.

Jamie

jan409
04-15-2007, 11:49 AM
I have started mine this morning, and I guess it is coming along ok. I hope you post more soon so I can see how you are doing and how close I can come to your excellence. Thank you for this class. Jan

Polygon
04-15-2007, 12:38 PM
I'll start mine today, the steps don't look too frightening yet!

Alison2
04-15-2007, 04:10 PM
Maverick,

Thanks so much for this thread. I've been reading up on all the underpainting threads on the acrylics forum (thank you everyone) and up pops this one that I can follow live!

Pulling up a chair and thanks again!

Alison2:wave:

Charlie's Mum
04-15-2007, 04:39 PM
Alison - I hope that chair is in front of your easel!!!

You have to work in this classroom :D :d

eyepaint
04-15-2007, 07:23 PM
Hi Mark, I've begun following your tutorial :)

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Apr-2007/96240-IMGP7236.JPG

Burnt Umber and Payne's Grey and matte medium. C&C welcome :)

Cheers,

Polygon
04-15-2007, 09:20 PM
Mark, I have some questions:

1) if I screw up the umber layer and make my shadows either too dark or too big (or too, uh, wrong, you get the idea :D ), does it get corrected in the opaque highlights layer, or does it wait for correction in the dead layer?

2) on an average painting, around what percentage of the time do you spend on each layer? Does all this pre-painting make the colour layers a relative snap? (I know, sounds like the "what's in it for me" question" :lol: )

I've done my drawing so far. Back later or tomorrow with the next two layers...

Polygon
04-15-2007, 11:24 PM
OK, I only got as far as the imprimatura today but might as well post it. I made it a flat wash over the whole canvas, is that correct? I notice yours, Mark, seemed to have a gradient to it but maybe that's from the camera flash?

I cropped it too, I'm working on a 7 X 9 board so I didn't want my jug and eggplants getting too small.

Andun
04-15-2007, 11:38 PM
This!!!!! This is exactly what I want to know.:)Thanks for showing Maverick!!!!

maverick
04-16-2007, 12:54 AM
Thanks for the comments and for following along everyone...

eyepaint...this is a good start. It might help to look at a B&W version of the reference photo to help you with shading. You will gradually refine the three dimensional aspect of the image in the next two steps.

polygon...ideally you want to advance to each step with as few mistakes as possible, but anything can be fixed at any time. I think of it as "refining". I spend as much time as necessary on each step without getting carried away in the early stages. By the time the dead layer is finished, the painting should be as perfect as possible. At least that's my approach right now. The colour layers aren't exactly a snap, but the job is much easier because each step is supported by the previous. Your imprimatura looks perfect! I didn't spend a lot of time trying to smooth mine out since it's a large canvas and I was impatient.

maverick
04-16-2007, 01:04 AM
Here are my opaque highlights. You can see that things are starting to take shape already. This is only 2 colors! We only have to think about 3 basic shades (mid-tone imprimatura and shadows are already done), and watering down the paint can give several more shades without too much trouble.

You can see that a fairly decent foundation can make the next step easier to handle. I didn't have to think about correcting anything, even though my umber layer was pretty sketchy. The highlights seemed to give the illusion of smoothness, especially on the eggplants.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_opaque_highlights.jpg

The next step is the dead layer which involves most of the work.

maverick
04-16-2007, 01:12 AM
I should mention that I didn't like the way the patterns on the eggplants turned out and I reworked them later. In the dead layer I painted their forms as if they were plain, and I added the patterns later. So don't copy what I've done, just follow the step to the best of your ability!

bowerbird
04-16-2007, 01:41 AM
This is wonderfull Thanks Mark . Enjoyed your blog:D

maverick
04-16-2007, 11:03 AM
Thanks Maria!

I'm not much of a blogger, but I thought I'd give it a try. I have a natural tendancy to start projects and not continue with them. There's too many things I'd like to try!

jan409
04-16-2007, 11:04 AM
This is my attempt at the Flemish technique. I am to the point you have posted, Mark. I know yours is much better than mine, but I think I am getting the idea. Practice, practice. I am enjoying this so much. Janhttp://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Apr-2007/63545-class_flemish_1.jpg

maverick
04-16-2007, 11:11 AM
Hi Jan, this is good progress! I wouldn't think of it in terms of better or worse. Everyone develops their own style. This is about the technique for building a painting, not about matching my style.

You are right about practice. If you don't lift any weights, you won't build any muscle.

jan409
04-16-2007, 11:34 AM
Thank you for your comments. I am anxious to get to the next step. Jan

TxAggieDarlin
04-16-2007, 12:55 PM
I am always running behind. Off to try and start now...It is looking great so far.:D

Polygon
04-16-2007, 02:56 PM
OK, here are my umber and opaque highlight layers.

Cue the funeral march... I'm ready for the dead layer! :D

maverick
04-16-2007, 08:34 PM
Tx...good to have you join in.

polygon...this is looking great!

OK, I'm actually trying to keep ahead of everyone. I started the dead layer and it's almost done. Here is my first progress photo. At this stage we are basically doing a black and white version of our painting.

Remember that the jug is not really pure white. You want to leave your brightest white for the reflected "catchlights".

I'm using a combination of Ivory Black, Payne's Gray (Prussian Blue + Black), with a tiny bit of Raw Sienna, Burnt Sienna, and White.

As you can see, I gave up on the eggplant patterns, but I'll deal with them later.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_dead_layer_1.jpg

maverick
04-16-2007, 08:41 PM
I will be making corrections to certain things, but nothing major. The leafy part on the far right eggplant wasn't quite the way I wanted it.

orangepassion
04-16-2007, 08:57 PM
Thanks Mark for this class! Instructions are much more fun LIVE.:) Hopefully, I can stick with this one till the end. Here are my attempt. I am having a hard time painting the interesting patterns of the eggplants, maybe because of the size. My painting is 14 x 11 so the eggplants are small.

Oh, you lost your patterns.:eek: I will work on them later too.

Orange

maverick
04-16-2007, 09:01 PM
Here I am further along. I will continue until the dead layer is complete.

Instead of "winging" it, I traced most of, but not all, the patterns onto the eggplants. I'm somewhat of a perfectionist and I think the patterns are one of the most interesting aspects of the painting.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_dead_layer_2.jpg

maverick
04-16-2007, 09:03 PM
Thanks Mark for this class! Instructions are much more fun LIVE.:) Hopefully, I can stick with this one till the end. Here are my attempt. I am having a hard time painting the interesting patterns of the eggplants, maybe because of the size. My painting is 14 x 11 so the eggplants are small.

Oh, you lost your patterns.:eek: I will work on them later too.

Orange

Haaha! What a coincidence. I just gave away my secret to the patterns in my post above...

Nice effort so far!

orangepassion
04-16-2007, 09:23 PM
Thanks. Cool patterns! How did you trace them?

Orange

Polygon
04-16-2007, 10:51 PM
Mark, is there any particular approach to painting the dead layer, or do we just do a repeat of shadows, highlights, adding more detail as we go? It's the addition of detail basically as it will appear in the final painting that makes this layer distinct, right?

whitelion
04-16-2007, 11:38 PM
Mark, Your work is fabulous and the extra effort you are putting into this WIP is greatly appreciated. It's probably due to my mental limitations, but I don't derive much from seeing this type of WIP which basically shows a stage of a painting and states that this is what my picture looks like after step XXX.

Could you address some of the following questions which I, and maybe some others, would find very helpful ? What is the consistency of the paint in the dead layer? What do you use to thin the paint? What type of brushstokes are used to apply the paint? What kind of brush? Is the dead layer accomplished in one pass or is it the result of many thin layers? Is there any other information along these lines which you think would be helpful in understanding this process?

Any response would be greatly appreciated and put to good use.

Alan

maverick
04-17-2007, 01:58 AM
Orange...I enlarged the reference photo in PhotoShop to the size of my canvas. Then I cut the eggplants with the patterns out of the image and printed them. Each one fit on letter sized paper. Since the squaring method I used to draw on the canvas is pretty accurate, everything lined up well when I positioned the paper over the painting. You can rub charcoal on the back and trace with a hard pencil or even a pen to transfer the lines to the painting.

Polygon, what you've described is correct. I'm working on the shadows again using the combination of colors I listed, with black being the predominant color. At the same time I'm refining the highlights with white being the predominant color. I don't want any of the umber to show through anymore, so I work on covering it up. I'm also glazing to get smooth transitions. The detail is refined. The end result is the completed painting without color. We don't want to spend any time making changes when we are glazing color later on.

Alan...the dead layer is just a monochrome version of the finished painting and the consistency of the paint and type of brush strokes depend on the painter. But I would definitely say that glazing and building up layers gradually is the key when using this process. You want to see the underlying image as a guide for as long as it is helpful.

I use Golden Glazing Liquid, and the consistency could be compared to liquid dish soap. I squeeze a small pool of the glazing medium onto my palette and then mix in some color. The amount of color will vary depending on how transparent I want it to be. I try to err on the side of too little color, then when I paint on the canvas I can make a quick adjustment if necessary. I might use some water if I want to thin the glazing medium.

My brush strokes and type of brush depend on what I'm painting and how far I am in my layering. The dead layer is more of a step than an actual single layer. I could be adding many glazed layers to one part of the painting, and very few elsewhere.

If I want to blend the light side of a round object like the eggplants, I will use a filbert (flat rounded) bristle brush and no medium. I scrub the brush in tight circular motions. Then I start on the dark side and do the same. If I do it quickly before both sides dry, I can get a nice transition. Then I will typically glaze on top of that in an attempt to smooth areas. I always glaze the subtle reflections. When I glaze, I would normally use a synthetic round or filbert brush and use short or long strokes depending on the detail or area I want to cover. A very thin glaze typically needs a long broad stroke for the color to be even. I sometimes have to go over it several times to get it right. It's like skim coating drywall. You may have to take a few swipes at it to get it. When that's drying, I'll move on to another part of the painting or I will use a hairdryer. Painting over partially dried glaze can get you in trouble if you brush too hard. The layer underneath will disintegrate.

I hope this answers Your questions. If not, then let me know!

Glaskolben
04-17-2007, 02:43 AM
You know, I have always wondered if the "Flemish Technique" was limited to oils only. Since oils are not opaque, light passes through them. But, what about acrylics? Your study is helping me to see how it can work. I have lots of tubes of oils, but, I can't stand the smell of the turpentine and other spirits. I wish I could find someone local who loves oils that would take them off my hands! LOL! I want to enjoy my acrylics, and I think you have brought life back to them and me. Thanks so much for pursuing this and sharing it.

whitelion
04-17-2007, 09:41 AM
MARK, thank you. Your detailed answer makes this the best painting lesson I have ever had.

Thanks again.

Alan

TxAggieDarlin
04-17-2007, 11:53 AM
I am trying, but it does not look near as good as yours:(

maverick
04-17-2007, 11:58 AM
OK, here is another update.

I'm continuing to cover my umber layer, working on one area and then moving to another until the paint dries. I'm always adding some amount of glazing medium to my paint.

I've refined the jug. I'm using an off-white on the jug so my highlights will show. The highlights are straight Titanium White. I will later glaze a very tiny touch of black over the brightest part of the jug so the highlights show even better. I keep going over the transition between dark and light on the jug by glazing. There is a visible gray strip separating the two areas. I think this will be a main point of interest in the painting, so it will pay off to have it as smooth a possible. I've also built up the shadows and covered more of the background.

Note: I added too much Payne's Gray when I did the eggplant leaves to the left of the jug...oops!

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/17-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_dead_layer_3.jpg

maverick
04-17-2007, 12:17 PM
You know, I have always wondered if the "Flemish Technique" was limited to oils only. Since oils are not opaque, light passes through them. But, what about acrylics? Your study is helping me to see how it can work. I have lots of tubes of oils, but, I can't stand the smell of the turpentine and other spirits. I wish I could find someone local who loves oils that would take them off my hands! LOL! I want to enjoy my acrylics, and I think you have brought life back to them and me. Thanks so much for pursuing this and sharing it.

Since it was invented before oils and adapted for it, I thought it could work for acrylics too. I also paint in oils sometimes and I use Liquin, which is a fast-drying alkyd medium, for glazing. Glazing in acrylics and oils is very much the same. Blending is another story.

I think you could still keep your oils, just get rid of the turpentine. I use a very strong non-toxic cleaner that has no vapor. The name escapes me right now, but you can get something similar at an art supply store. The paint comes out of the brush very easily. Liquin has a slight odor, but it's not like turpentine.

The main problem with acrylics for some people is that the paint dries almost immediately and they have no time to blend. The two techniques that I use to get similar results to oil paint is by scrubbing paint with a bristle brush in a circular motion (the edges will be soft), and glazing.

maverick
04-17-2007, 12:19 PM
MARK, thank you. Your detailed answer makes this the best painting lesson I have ever had.

Thanks again.

Alan

You're welcome Alan. Please feel free to ask more questions. I'll do my best to answer them.

maverick
04-17-2007, 12:21 PM
I am trying, but it does not look near as good as yours:(

Whatever you do, don't give up! Post a photo so we can take a look.

TxAggieDarlin
04-17-2007, 01:17 PM
Well I will do that, thanks....
Question: When we start using color, why will that not cover up everything we have done? Just a real thin wash when we do the color?

maverick
04-17-2007, 02:09 PM
Tx...yes, the color will be thinned. I'm using glazing medium, but water will also work. We want to see the values from our dead layer underneath. As we build on that, you may think that we're covering up the dead layer. This is true, but it will be in transparent glazes. Some light will reach the dead layer and have an impact on the way the painting looks.

During the color layer(s), we will be less concerned about value, since that has already been done. If we choose to do so, we can re-establish some of the values that we feel are not the way we intended. This should be very minor because as I said, the work has already been done.

I am pretty sure the color layers will be straight forward and go relatively quickly. The jug won't need very much work at all. A great deal of the work will be on the eggplants. Since most of the painting is shadow, two or three glazes of color to bring them to life will be all that is needed.

One of the reasons the Flemish Technique gained attention in the first place was the luminosity of the paintings compared to what was done before. This was achieved by multiple transparent glazes.

TxAggieDarlin
04-17-2007, 03:11 PM
Maverick, yours looks good enough to leave just like that

orangepassion
04-17-2007, 03:15 PM
Thanks for the instruction on tracing. I don't have ShotoShop (Everyone has PhotoShop these days?), but I am sure the technique is useful to many people. I guess I could trace the patterns shown on the computer with a tracing paper after enlarging the image. If the image has enough contrast, I should be able to do that.

I have seen other demonstration that artists paint in black/grays/white (or sometimes with a hint of color) from the beginning instead of browns/white. What is the benefit to start with browns/white?

Orange

eyepaint
04-17-2007, 04:36 PM
Hi Mark, Grrr this is not working well for me. I've redone the first step (burnt umber) two more times and I'm having trouble making smooth value transitions on such small items (I'm working on 9x12 size). This time I have been glazing layers and layers trying to keep it smooth. And I've been working upside down.

Would you have any suggestions for improving this at this step?

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/17-Apr-2007/96240-IMGP7262-1.JPG

Cheers,

Alison2
04-17-2007, 04:55 PM
Alison - I hope that chair is in front of your easel!!!

You have to work in this classroom :D :d

Lol, Maureen, I will work, honest, but not just yet! Got some exams (in between trying to work for a living!) but have big plans for mid May when the exams are over! In the meantime, I'm riveted and just dabbling between work/revision!

Mark, a question please, and I'm sorry if it's daft :p I know people are asking similar questions but I'm still unsure...glazing in thin layers so the colour is transparent. Does this mean that all the glazing is done with colours only marked as transparent, ie, alizarin crimson etc., or that opaque colours can also be used, provided they are thinned with medium/water to give them transparency?

Thanks so much for the demo, and apologies for my struggling to take things in :p

Alison2:wave:

Dewi
04-18-2007, 01:06 AM
Instead of "winging" it, I traced most of, but not all, the patterns onto the eggplants. I'm somewhat of a perfectionist and I think the patterns are one of the most interesting aspects of the painting.


Hi Mark, could not login to WC for two days and have not started one too :)
I had problem with the eggplant patterns too until I zoomed it to a very big size, not perfect but better then before :lol: (my printer is dry).
Your idea is very good, because when I did not do them right(IMHO), they did not look like this kind of eggplants.
I think I have to paint at least look alike a little, otherwise my friends over here would not recognize them :lol:
There is another semilar round eggplant with very light patterns and in very light green but not as good as this.
With this kind of difficult patterns, I would remember your method, Mark.
Thanks again for your :thumbsup::thumbsup: :thumbsup: lessons Mark.
Your obedient student :D
edit: went back to check my painting again, whoa looks not nice at all.

Polygon
04-18-2007, 10:11 AM
My dead layer is killin' me! (har, har)

But yes, I am having problems with this layer, I think I'm doing something wrong.

So, we did the umber layer to set out where the shadows and highlights go, to serve as a guide for the dead layer, right? But that umber layer has to be completely covered up with the dead layer.

Which means painting opaquely (either at the beginning or in enough glazes that it turns opaque.)

I find when I glaze it's not covering up the brown, and I find when I paint opaquely it's immediately covering up my hard-earned shadows and highlights such that I'm basically starting from scratch, and not liking the result as much as I liked what I had achieved on the umber layer.

I also find when I glaze rather than paint opaquely on the dead layer (so that I don't lose my umber guide), it has a certain "what's the point" feel to it, that ultimately it does screw up the previous carefully-rendered shadow without achieving that opaqueness.

Now, I probably don't have to say that I came into this exercise a dead-layer skeptic, but I was, and am, so willing to be converted to the dead layer cause! I'm just still not getting it, and I think I must be doing something wrong. Any ideas?

TxAggieDarlin
04-18-2007, 11:25 AM
ROTFL....we are ALL getting Fs in this class!:lol:

jan409
04-18-2007, 02:53 PM
I am working on the dead layer. I think I understand it's purpose. I have a little glazing yet to do. Janhttp://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/18-Apr-2007/63545-flemish_tech_1.jpg

Polygon
04-18-2007, 10:07 PM
Mark, I'm heading out on a work trip until the end of the month, I'll return to do battle with the dead layer then! Didn't want you to think I'd disappeared, given up and dropped out... :D

maverick
04-19-2007, 01:37 AM
Sorry everyone, I've been working and painting and taking progress photos. I'll post again and respond to questions by the end of the week.

No problem Polygon.

Hoofmama
04-19-2007, 05:40 PM
Hi Maverick. Loving your tutorial and everyone's questions and comments. This is great. I decided to go ahead with a landscape I was planning to do anyway. I started it ala prima and botched it so restarted it in this technique. I didn't photo the umber stage. Here I am about half way through the dead layer. It's not as dead as yours, probably because I'm adding some burnt umber just to keep it warmer. If I start glazing and the little bit of brown becomes a problem, I guess I'll go back and cool it off with grays and black, then glaze again. I have a bit left to do, including fixing the reflected houses. I do like this technique...it satisfies my OCD, big time. I'll post again when I start with the color. :wave: http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/19-Apr-2007/32886-DSCN2800.JPG

maverick
04-19-2007, 09:55 PM
I have seen other demonstration that artists paint in black/grays/white (or sometimes with a hint of color) from the beginning instead of browns/white. What is the benefit to start with browns/white?

Good question. I don't know the official technical answer. It's probably a matter of preference. There are many variations on the flemish technique that have been handed down over the centuries. I think most artists that paint in a realist manner start with a drawing and underpainting of some kind. I think the extra umber step helps because each step brings the detail into focus. Perhaps umber is used just because it's a dark color and you can distinguish between your umber layer and dead layer because they are different colors. White is the obvious choice for highlights no matter what your dark color is.

Here is a very nice example that looks an awful lot like the Flemish Technique sans the dead layer. The dead layer's purpose is to be glazed with color. If you don't glaze, then it can be skipped. William Whitaker Painting Demo (http://www.williamwhitaker.com/B_HTML_files/07_demo/clasSteps.htm)

maverick
04-19-2007, 09:59 PM
Hi Mark, Grrr this is not working well for me. I've redone the first step (burnt umber) two more times and I'm having trouble making smooth value transitions on such small items (I'm working on 9x12 size). This time I have been glazing layers and layers trying to keep it smooth. And I've been working upside down.

Would you have any suggestions for improving this at this step?

This is good. The only thing I would suggest is to refine your values in each step as much as possible. The opaque highlights will make a big difference.

maverick
04-19-2007, 10:09 PM
Mark, a question please, and I'm sorry if it's daft :p I know people are asking similar questions but I'm still unsure...glazing in thin layers so the colour is transparent. Does this mean that all the glazing is done with colours only marked as transparent, ie, alizarin crimson etc., or that opaque colours can also be used, provided they are thinned with medium/water to give them transparency?

Thanks so much for the demo, and apologies for my struggling to take things in :p

No question is daft, and struggling is good. None of this came easily to me when I started. If you keep working at it, you will conquer it and it will feel great!

It doesn't matter that much if a color is marked transparent or not. The glazing medium can make any color transparent, and if you learn by trial and error that some of your colors work well without extra glazing medium then you can use it that way. I use fluid acrylics a lot, so I find that helps. Tube paints will usually need to be diluted with something before you can glaze.

maverick
04-19-2007, 10:11 PM
Hi Mark, could not login to WC for two days and have not started one too :)
I had problem with the eggplant patterns too until I zoomed it to a very big size, not perfect but better then before :lol: (my printer is dry).
Your idea is very good, because when I did not do them right(IMHO), they did not look like this kind of eggplants.
I think I have to paint at least look alike a little, otherwise my friends over here would not recognize them :lol:
There is another semilar round eggplant with very light patterns and in very light green but not as good as this.
With this kind of difficult patterns, I would remember your method, Mark.
Thanks again for your :thumbsup::thumbsup: :thumbsup: lessons Mark.
Your obedient student :D
edit: went back to check my painting again, whoa looks not nice at all.

Hi Dewi. Thanks for dropping in. I look forward to seeing your progress...

maverick
04-19-2007, 10:17 PM
My dead layer is killin' me! (har, har)

But yes, I am having problems with this layer, I think I'm doing something wrong.

So, we did the umber layer to set out where the shadows and highlights go, to serve as a guide for the dead layer, right? But that umber layer has to be completely covered up with the dead layer.

Which means painting opaquely (either at the beginning or in enough glazes that it turns opaque.)

I find when I glaze it's not covering up the brown, and I find when I paint opaquely it's immediately covering up my hard-earned shadows and highlights such that I'm basically starting from scratch, and not liking the result as much as I liked what I had achieved on the umber layer.

I also find when I glaze rather than paint opaquely on the dead layer (so that I don't lose my umber guide), it has a certain "what's the point" feel to it, that ultimately it does screw up the previous carefully-rendered shadow without achieving that opaqueness.

Now, I probably don't have to say that I came into this exercise a dead-layer skeptic, but I was, and am, so willing to be converted to the dead layer cause! I'm just still not getting it, and I think I must be doing something wrong. Any ideas?

There's a place between too thin and too thick that is just right. It just takes some practice. I've done a lot of glazing before this. I learned it by trial and error. Remember though that this so-called layer might be two or three layers in some places, so if you find the glaze is too thin, you can go over it more than once.

maverick
04-19-2007, 10:19 PM
ROTFL....we are ALL getting Fs in this class!:lol:

You better paint me an apple then!

maverick
04-19-2007, 10:24 PM
I am working on the dead layer. I think I understand it's purpose. I have a little glazing yet to do. Janhttp://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/18-Apr-2007/63545-flemish_tech_1.jpg

Good job. Finish the dead layer to the point where you might want to leave it that was as a finished painting.

maverick
04-19-2007, 10:27 PM
Hi Maverick. Loving your tutorial and everyone's questions and comments. This is great. I decided to go ahead with a landscape I was planning to do anyway. I started it ala prima and botched it so restarted it in this technique. I didn't photo the umber stage. Here I am about half way through the dead layer. It's not as dead as yours, probably because I'm adding some burnt umber just to keep it warmer. If I start glazing and the little bit of brown becomes a problem, I guess I'll go back and cool it off with grays and black, then glaze again. I have a bit left to do, including fixing the reflected houses. I do like this technique...it satisfies my OCD, big time. I'll post again when I start with the color. :wave:

This is a fine looking landscape. I think you've got a good handle on the concept!

maverick
04-19-2007, 10:32 PM
Here is my final dead layer photo.

On to the color!

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/19-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplant_dead_layer_4.jpg

idcrisis55
04-19-2007, 10:55 PM
Mark, I've been reading through this thread and viewing everyone's work. I have thoroughly enjoyed everything you are teaching. Just want to remind everyone to rate this thread as it is truly a goody. I want to reread everything because it hasn't sunk in the reasons for each layer.

Cheers, :)

maverick
04-19-2007, 11:09 PM
Here is my first progress photo of my color glaze layer(s).

I glazed Sap Green on the eggplants, covering everything except the brightest highlights. That's only one color and the eggplants already look very close to being finished. Then I started on the background with some Sepia which is a dark brown, darker than Burnt Umber (which I would have used if I didn't have Sepia). You can see the difference between the left side and right side of the background. With the full dead layer finished, I'm not really concerned with value at this point, just color. I will need more colors and a couple more layers before I'm finished.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/19-Apr-2007/10671-thai_eggplants_glaze_1.jpg

maverick
04-20-2007, 12:17 AM
Mark, I've been reading through this thread and viewing everyone's work. I have thoroughly enjoyed everything you are teaching. Just want to remind everyone to rate this thread as it is truly a goody. I want to reread everything because it hasn't sunk in the reasons for each layer.

Cheers, :)

Thanks Ann, I'm glad you're enjoying it. I've really enjoyed sharing this and learning quite a lot myself.

The basic reason for each layer is to support the one before it. Each one is made easier by the previous. Shape, basic tones, values, and color. Each step becomes increasingly involved, and each step works towards more detail.

MysticMonk
04-20-2007, 12:45 AM
Just started reading this thread and the images are great. Can some one tell me more about this skill of glazing? Is this just putting on layers of thinned transparent(ish) paint? Perhaps thinned with either water (like watercolor) or a glazing medium?

idcrisis55
04-20-2007, 04:50 AM
Thanks for the explanation, Mark. I did go back and reread the beginning with your explanations. Sometimes, things just don't want to filter through my thick head on the first go. :lol:

MysticMonk, there is another great class by Maverick on glazing that will give you lots of information about the techniques. Here is the link: http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=376292
Enjoy! :)

MysticMonk
04-20-2007, 07:54 AM
Thanks, looks perfect.

Alison2
04-20-2007, 04:51 PM
No question is daft, and struggling is good. None of this came easily to me when I started. If you keep working at it, you will conquer it and it will feel great!

It doesn't matter that much if a color is marked transparent or not. The glazing medium can make any color transparent, and if you learn by trial and error that some of your colors work well without extra glazing medium then you can use it that way. I use fluid acrylics a lot, so I find that helps. Tube paints will usually need to be diluted with something before you can glaze.

Thanks so much Mark, that makes it much clearer - and as I like fluid acrylics, that's great news! I'm rating the thread and giving you a mentor point - you're a star! thanks again.

Alison2:wave:

idcrisis55
04-22-2007, 07:35 PM
Bumping this back to the top. :)

dribear
04-23-2007, 02:57 PM
sorry for my late start. Haven't had much time to paint other than today. May not the rest of this week either. But I will eventually do all the steps. Anyway, I'm finally in the game.

Here is my drawing

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Apr-2007/103507-flemish_drawing.jpg

dribear
04-23-2007, 04:05 PM
And now here is my umber layer. Now I find out I was called into work tonight so after thinking I had all day to paint, I have to go to sleep. This work stuff really interferes with my painting :mad:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Apr-2007/103507-flemish_umber.jpg

orangepassion
04-23-2007, 07:15 PM
Maverick, thanks for the link to the Willian Witaker's site. His paintings are amazing. I will be checking up on the site again.

Your dead layer looks great. I thought mine was done until I saw yours. So I worked on my painting a little more and here is the result. During the process, My Japanese side of the brain says that I have to follow all the steps precisely but my Americanized side of the brain says my painting looks good enough and is ready for color. I just don't have patience.

I am not completely covering my umber painting even though I understand the process. I don't think I can do better painting covering what I have. I am worried that if I lose what I have now, I may not be able to get it back.

I wonder if my dead layer has enough details or I am going to regret when I start adding colors. I imagine my painting is not going to be perfectly smooth but is going to have some brush strokes.

Orange


http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Apr-2007/78808-mark500.JPG

eyepaint
04-23-2007, 07:38 PM
Hi everyone, I've applied the opaque highlights and started the dead layer. I've got more to go for this layer but wanted to check in with the teacher (who may think I'd run away from the class never to return!) :)

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Apr-2007/96240-IMGP7381.JPG

Quick question - where approx. did you apply the raw sienna in this dead layer? The lighter reflections on the table?

Cheers,

purplepansey
04-24-2007, 02:28 PM
:clap: :thumbsup: Maverick marvelous tutorial on how you did this painting. I used this very same ref. photo and painted the scene on a canvas carryall bag. I added a red apple to it just for a splash of color and to compliment the green.

Can you apply same principles to oil painting?

dribear
04-26-2007, 09:20 AM
question. When we are doing our underpainting with burnt umber, are we suppose to block in the values of our final painting or just get them covered?

Thanks for this demonstration. Very fun.

Paulafv
04-26-2007, 12:35 PM
Mark,

Thank you very much for a clear, concise (as possible) tutorial. Five stars for sure. Will try it soon.

Paulafv

idcrisis55
04-26-2007, 12:58 PM
Dr. ibear, I'm not Maverick but from what I understand the Imprimatura is toning the canvas very lightly with a mid-value Umber or Sienna then, the Umber Layer is where the darks are blocked in. The Opaque Layer puts in the highlights or lights. The Dead Layer then refines all the values and elements. Hope this is of some help until Maverick gets back. :)

Purple, I think it was oils that were used when the Venetian technique first started and is still used in oils today.

dribear
04-26-2007, 06:33 PM
Thanks Ann. So it sounds as if I really don't have to worry about values until I get to the dead layer.

idcrisis55
04-26-2007, 07:43 PM
Dr. ibear, each layer is about values as I understand it. The Imprimatura establishes the mid-value, the Umber Layer establishes the dark value, the Opaque layer establishes the light values. In each of these layers, you are refining the form of each of the elements in the still life. The Dead Layer which is in gray values refines the the forms and values giving you a finished painting except for the color layers. I hope I haven't steered you wrong on any of this. :)

dribear
04-26-2007, 08:29 PM
Ann,

Doh! I misread your post. You were crystal clear and I had brain gas for some reason.

Now I get it :)

eyepaint
04-27-2007, 12:18 AM
I finished the dead layer and began adding colour. Now waiting for the next instruction from Maverick :)

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/26-Apr-2007/96240-IMGP7461.JPG

Cheers,

maverick
04-27-2007, 01:42 AM
I'm here. I'm just consumed with work and spring cleaning (my yard looks like a dump and I can't stand it). I will pick things up from where I left off, probably Friday evening. Sorry for being away so long!

stoney
04-27-2007, 02:02 AM
You know, I have always wondered if the "Flemish Technique" was limited to oils only. Since oils are not opaque, light passes through them. But, what about acrylics? Your study is helping me to see how it can work. I have lots of tubes of oils, but, I can't stand the smell of the turpentine and other spirits. I wish I could find someone local who loves oils that would take them off my hands! LOL! I want to enjoy my acrylics, and I think you have brought life back to them and me. Thanks so much for pursuing this and sharing it.

I paint in oils and acrylics. With oils I've never used stand oil, or turps, linseed oil, or whatever.

What I utilize is Galkyd/Liquin or sometimes a drop or two of walnut oil. Most of my oil paints are M.Graham & Co., which are made with walnut oil. I clean my brushes with baby oil/mineral oil.

If you really want to get rid of the oil paints, ship them to me and I'll reinburse costs or let me know what the shipping price will be and I'll send the money first.

TxAggieDarlin
04-27-2007, 11:23 AM
No problem, the dead layer is killing me LOL

Sometimes, life gets in the way of painting. See you soon Maverick

La Diabla
04-27-2007, 02:42 PM
WOW! these are all so terrific! I just drew the beginings of a portrait on a canvas last night, do you think this technique will work with a portrait? after reading 7 pages of this classroom I'm all ajitter to try this.

dribear
04-27-2007, 03:21 PM
finished my umber layer and opaque. Now on to dead layer. C&C please.http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/27-Apr-2007/103507-flemish_opaque.jpg

LavenderFrost
04-27-2007, 07:41 PM
Hi all. I'm a little late getting started because I had to finish another project first. I can't leave anything undone, lol. But starting late was probably good because I was able to work the last few afternoons on this, and read everyone's questions before each step.

I'm self taught and have never really done an underpainting or glazing, so this is all new and it has been a fun experience. Thank you so much for doing this Maverick.

I'm using Folkart paints on an 8x10" piece of masonite.

Here is my progress so far.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/27-Apr-2007/104871-ThaiEggplants1.jpg
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/27-Apr-2007/104871-ThaiEggplants2.jpg
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/27-Apr-2007/104871-ThaiEggplants3.jpg
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/27-Apr-2007/104871-ThaiEggplants4.jpg
My pitcher is still kind of streaky but maybe that's not a bad thing? I don't know if I'll ever get the hang of blending acrylics in a large area.

I'm going to give this to my mom for Mother's Day along with the step by step photos.

One question before I start colouring. The pitcher in the photo seems to have a brownish tint. Is that reflecting from the walls? If I change the wall colour, should I change that tint too?

dribear
04-27-2007, 08:00 PM
wow! looks really nice so far lavenderfrost. I'm on the dead layer now and I'm not sure how I will get the patterns on the eggplant to look. But trying :)

stoney
04-27-2007, 08:18 PM
Orange...I enlarged the reference photo in PhotoShop to the size of my canvas. Then I cut the eggplants with the patterns out of the image and printed them. Each one fit on letter sized paper. Since the squaring method I used to draw on the canvas is pretty accurate, everything lined up well when I positioned the paper over the painting. You can rub charcoal on the back and trace with a hard pencil or even a pen to transfer the lines to the painting.


You can also use transfer paper. It isn't carbon paper and doesn't create a mess. Then utilize a fine tipped pen rather than a pencil-unless it is a mechanical pencil-as as the pencil dulls it introduces errors based on increased line width.

LavenderFrost
04-29-2007, 06:57 PM
Thanks Dr. ibear. I guess it looks good from far, lol.

Has anyone else tried to finish yet? I tried but not sure how I feel about it. Where's our teacher? You ok Maverick?

TxAggieDarlin
04-30-2007, 10:18 AM
Ok, here is where I am. LOST :evil:

Am I in the dead layer? Why do some of you go from this stage to almost black and white? How do I get there?:confused:

LavenderFrost
04-30-2007, 12:46 PM
I think you're starting your dead layer. That's when you do paint everything in black and white, and gray. At least that's what I did. That was the longest stage in the painting. Like Maverick said, you want to get it to the stage where it looks like a finished black and white painting.

LavenderFrost
04-30-2007, 07:18 PM
Well, here it is. I enjoyed it for a while, then that jug drove me crazy, lol. I had to just stop already. I think I spent just as much time on the colour layer as I did on the dead layer. Is that normal? I still had problems with my clumsiness but otherwise this was a good experience.

I didn't change the colour much after all.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/30-Apr-2007/104871-ThaiEggplants5.jpg

Like I said before, it looks good from far.

TxAggieDarlin
05-01-2007, 10:10 AM
Lavender, I think you did a fantastic job. Those eggplants are just fantastic. Reflections are awesome.

Now, my question is.....Could you have just painted this and got this look without doing all the underpainting? I am learning so this is an honest question. It is very rich looking and that may be from all the work before.

LavenderFrost
05-01-2007, 01:16 PM
That's a good question, and if I was patient, I would try this picture again in my usual way. But I'm not and I'm already eager to start something new, lol.

I'm wondering if this technique is good for any kind of painting, or is it a matter of choosing the right technique for the right subject?

Polygon
05-01-2007, 04:56 PM
Well, I think I'm officially a Flemish Technique dropout. ;) I went back to the dead layer today (I've been away on a trip) and all this repainting is just not my thing, especially when I felt I had done pretty darn well on the umber/opaque layers. Turning it from brown to grey is just not doing it for me, particularly the fact that it keeps getting worse and worse as I do so. I can see the benefits of underpainting though from doing this exercise, but if I do underpaint in the future I think I'll be reaching for the colour once I have the shadows and highlights worked out.

One thing that's driving me a bit crazy is that it seems impossible not to have my edges move back and forth a bit, and it means things are becoming less precise as I go forwards instead of more so.

If anyone who often does the ordinary type underpainting, does this exercise and comes out as a dead layer convert, can you post more and tell us how it has improved things for you to do the extra prep layer? I'm not skeptical so much as puzzled. I understand that colour depth improves through underpainting concept and I believe in it, I just don't understand why the dead layer has to be recreated over perfectly good shadows and highlights, rather than just introducing the detail onto them (and perhaps doing them in grey in the first place, if the layer under the colour needs to be grey.)

I'll still be watching and learning as the rest of you go- great work everyone has done so far!!

Thanks Maverick for all the instruction and answering of questions! It's a great exercise.

edtree
05-01-2007, 09:29 PM
Hi Polygon,

Well, I've been trying this technique for the last couple of days, deciding to do something simple to start with so I chose a single apple. Right now, I'm glazing, and glazing and glazing. Someday, hopefully, I'll get to the final colors. :) I'm actually enjoying the process though, and learning much. What do I think of the previous layers? Each one made me look and and see a bit more in the subject. Each layer brought out a little bits of shadow or light, a curve, a line. I've noticed this even more with the glazing. By the way, I'm enjoying the glazing most of all. Like Maverick said, at that point, the hard part is done - though I have done some adjusting with white and brown as I went along. (took out the circle shadow from my reference photo).

I'd like to try this again once I get some glazing medium. I'm using just water and the subject still seems flat. I may just need more layers though. Overall, the process is much, much more time consuming than the way I'm used to painting-- lots of drying time between glaze layers, but I'm hoping it will be worth it in the long run. Here are some pictures:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-May-2007/94944-DSCN49120001.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-May-2007/94944-DSCN49130001.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-May-2007/94944-DSCN49140001.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-May-2007/94944-DSCN49150001.JPG

And here's the reference picture:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-May-2007/94944-DSCN48190001.JPG

Elizabeth

Polygon
05-01-2007, 10:15 PM
Wow, that apple is gorgeous. So crispy! It's not flat at all.

Rose4U
05-02-2007, 02:12 AM
Thank You Maverick for taking the time to teach this.

Here is my attempt so far


http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-May-2007/105753-flem1.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-May-2007/105753-flem2.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-May-2007/105753-flem3.jpg

TxAggieDarlin
05-02-2007, 12:43 PM
Question: The black, gray and white...are they glazed many times too?

LavenderFrost
05-02-2007, 01:27 PM
I don't know how often I would use this technique, but it was interesting to try it. I do see the point of the steps... first establishing mid-tones, darks, and lights, then refining them in the dead layer. And yes, I spent three afternoons on the dead layer. I think it may be the most important step. I also spent a lot of time on the colours. I hope Maverick comes back soon to give some more insight.

Polygon, things move around for me too. That's a problem I always have. Can't colour within the lines, lol.

Why go from brown to gray? I think was was answered here before, wasn't it? Look back over the posts. He said the umber is good for showing the different values. The dead layer is for glazing colour over. If you're not glazing, you can skip it.

That's a yummy looking apple Elizabeth.

I think you're doing well Rosanne.

orangepassion
05-02-2007, 05:36 PM
This is my latest. I still have more to go. I spent most time on the pattern of the eggplants. I started to add colors without totally finishing dead layer as I mentioned in my previous post. I had to add the pattern on the eggplants from the scratch because I did not finish it in the dead layer. I think the shading in B/W on the eggplants still helped me when I put the pattern.

I am having difficult time getting smooth transition from light to dark for the background and pitcher, and I am not so excited about going back.:mad: I went over the pitcher many times and it looks the same.:evil:

Orange

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-May-2007/78808-wde.JPG

TxAggieDarlin
05-03-2007, 10:43 AM
This has turned out beautiful, Orange. Those eggplants look great.

Is Maverick ok?

LavenderFrost
05-03-2007, 11:08 AM
Looks great Orange. I had problems with the pitcher too, and ended up putting the paint on too think. So it's streaky and rough. Sometimes things work, sometimes they don't.

I'm getting worried about Maverick.

orangepassion
05-03-2007, 02:30 PM
Thanks TxAggieDarlin and LavenderFrost!

White covers up more than other colors, so I think you have to thin white more to go slow. I am going to try that and see.

I left a message to Maverick's eBay account, so hopefully we'll hear from him soon.

Orange

TxAggieDarlin
05-08-2007, 11:39 AM
Just checking on Maverick...Hope all is ok

Viuhti
05-09-2007, 05:47 AM
Hello! Stumbles in with brushes and paints spreading around... :o
I am new to this part, just bought my first set of acrylics. I am wondering about glazing with white. That is if you get a part too dark, how can you keep the transparent quality and get the part lighter? White in the mixture just makes the whole thing totally dull to me. What happens with glazing media with white?? I will get to the store and buy some today at least to use with colours.

Charlie's Mum
05-09-2007, 10:56 AM
Welcome Viuhti :D

When at the store, buy some zinc white - this will allow you to lighten without the chalkiness of tit. white :D

Als take a look in the Information Kiosk, our sub forum at the top of the main page - lots of classroom threads and quite a few on glazing :D

LavenderFrost
05-17-2007, 11:35 AM
Does anyone know what happened to Maverick?

On a brighter note, my mom really loved the painting when I gave it to her. She even wants to frame the progress photos and thinks I should making prints of them. Well, I wouldn't go that far, but I'm glad she liked her gift.

How is your picture going Viuhti?

orangepassion
05-17-2007, 01:15 PM
It is great your mom likes your painting so much. I appreciate your positive comments and suggestions for this class.

Orange

Viuhti
05-18-2007, 10:39 AM
If I dare and ever finish, I will post a WIP. I have been taking pictures along the way, but I am not happy yet. I must be really mad to start with a canvas 70x100 cm that is about 28x40".
It is frustrating not to be an instant master. You get used to some results in a familiar medium. Huh!
I am really struggling with glasing and the white. Got some zinc white just today. But it may be too late for this one.

LavenderFrost
05-20-2007, 03:46 PM
Thanks Orange.

Wow, Viuhti, that's big! I hope you manage to finish it to your satisfaction. Though you're probably just being too hard on yourself. I think we all do that.

Nedaaa
06-23-2007, 05:20 PM
wow

howyadoin
06-23-2007, 06:20 PM
What a fantastic thread. Think I'll be trying this technique on my next painting.

howyadoin
07-06-2007, 12:55 AM
Any excuse to bump this thread up - here're the beginnings of the opaque highlights on my latest:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1118/733165427_b783562d22_o.jpg

I'm really diggin' this technique so far. Hopefully I won't rush through the dead layer in a rush to get to the glazing.

LavenderFrost
07-06-2007, 12:34 PM
Keep posting, this looks really good so far.

howyadoin
07-07-2007, 02:36 AM
Keep posting, this looks really good so far.Thanks. I've refined the lighting quite a bit tonight:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1274/744677647_9fecbe3b9d.jpg

idcrisis55
07-07-2007, 09:40 AM
It is looking good and I am enjoying your work.

howyadoin
07-07-2007, 05:21 PM
It is looking good and I am enjoying your work.Thank you so much. I'm planning to start the dead layer in the next hour or two. I'm hoping I can do the whole thing today, so I can start glazing tomorrow.

jgary1
07-07-2007, 10:40 PM
Did anybody figure out what happened to Maverick? His website has been replaced by a commercial site. I hope we haven't lost his inspiration and insights.

howyadoin
07-08-2007, 12:38 AM
Did anybody figure out what happened to Maverick? His website has been replaced by a commercial site. I hope we haven't lost his inspiration and insights.From the looks of things, his domain has expired. Beyond that, no idea.

Café LoLa
07-08-2007, 01:54 AM
It is now MarkWoodland.com - but his last blog entry seem to be around the same time as one of his last posts here. I do hope he's alright.

howyadoin
07-08-2007, 11:27 PM
Okay, here's where the dead layer stands at the moment:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1129/757606905_ac7ff1cf35.jpg


There's still fine-tuning to do, but I think I need to step away from it for a bit before I revise it too much.

Plus I have to go eat.

stoney
07-09-2007, 12:31 AM
Okay, here's where the dead layer stands at the moment:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1129/757606905_ac7ff1cf35.jpg


There's still fine-tuning to do, but I think I need to step away from it for a bit before I revise it too much.

Plus I have to go eat.


Looooooooooooooooonnnnnnnnnnngggggggggggggg whistle.

Galloping Carrot
07-09-2007, 10:58 AM
I am loving this thread! Howy, I saw your work on the other thread, great result so far! I will be trying this technique for sure! :) thanks maverick!

howyadoin
07-09-2007, 12:20 PM
Thanks, folks. I'm really havin' fun with this so far. I've been meaning to try this technique for awhile now, but it was definitely this thread that gave me the push I needed.

So yeah, thanks to marverick, wherever he is.

stoney
07-09-2007, 01:47 PM
Thanks, folks. I'm really havin' fun with this so far. I've been meaning to try this technique for awhile now, but it was definitely this thread that gave me the push I needed.

So yeah, thanks to marverick, wherever he is.

I had intended to try this technique both in acrylics and oils with the supplied reference. Acrylics first. I did it partway then simply didn't have the patience, so I'm using my normal methods.

Li'l Brown
07-09-2007, 02:57 PM
Howyadoin, that is one sassy little pic you have goin on there! Looking great so far!

Jesslyn

howyadoin
07-12-2007, 09:46 PM
So, the past couple days have been fruitful - fine-tuned the dead layer, added some self-levelling gel to smooth some of the surface out, and finally started the actual colour glazing last night:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1435/788165547_eb36f0f33e.jpg

It's already so glossy that getting a good photo is beyond my meager photographic skills. Hopefully this still gets the point across, though.

Bob Rooney
07-12-2007, 10:08 PM
Lookin good. One thing I have learned about this method is that you have to exaggerate the value range of your dead layer a little, because when you apply the color glazes it will narrow the range. You can always strengthen them in the end if you miss your target a little. Yours is looking good for a first attempt at this method.

howyadoin
07-13-2007, 01:24 AM
Lookin good. One thing I have learned about this method is that you have to exaggerate the value range of your dead layer a little, because when you apply the color glazes it will narrow the range. You can always strengthen them in the end if you miss your target a little. Yours is looking good for a first attempt at this method.Thanks, Bob. I'm so glad you said that, because I was wondering if maybe I should've toned that range down before I started glazing.

Bret

Johnnie
07-13-2007, 08:50 AM
Great demo Maverick

Thanks for doing this I learned a lot

Johnnie

Lettersalad
07-13-2007, 09:56 AM
Ooops?
And why do I see this thread only now? :D
I had do paint a commission in acrylics AND color, and it scared me no end. I don´t do portraits in full color and acrylics, since it is so hard to keep the paint wet while you are working on the tonal variations for the skin.
So I decided to work just like with oils: start with a dead layer and glaze it.
Seems I´ve not been the only one to think of that - my, there goes my patent holding and all the millions of dollars... :cat:

Mind if I show?
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Jul-2007/106378-dscn2570.jpg
Photo ref
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Jul-2007/106378-dscn2577.jpg
Dead Layer
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Jul-2007/106378-mann1.jpg
After glazing.

Salad

Charlie's Mum
07-13-2007, 01:33 PM
Howya - it's looking good!

Salad - check out our Information Kiosk - link in my signature - and see all the goodies on offer!!!! :lol:

Lettersalad
07-13-2007, 03:49 PM
Thanks, Charlie´s Mum, off go my dreams of being rich... Honest, most of the links I know already, but I´m working through the tips right now... hard work if you´re no native speaker... *sweat*

Salad

howyadoin
07-15-2007, 03:15 AM
Here are the latest developments on the Piña Colada painting:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1423/815831084_85428bbf79.jpg

Finally starting to get the hang of the glazing, I think.

idcrisis55
07-15-2007, 08:22 AM
You certainly do have a handle on the glazing. Looking good.

Tracie1973
07-27-2007, 11:37 PM
I found this thread tonight, and am inspired to try this technique this weekend. You all have done an awesome job and I admire you all :) Question is....has anyone heard from Maverick?? A saying comes to mind....Where's Maverick?...as in "Where's Waldo"? Don't mind my quirky sense of humor! lol

stoney
07-28-2007, 02:07 AM
I didn't have the patience to follow through with this technique, although it was started. Gessoed hardboard 11 x 14, I think. This is where it stands now.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Jul-2007/33705-DSCI2085_crop_sm.JPG

LavenderFrost
07-28-2007, 11:23 AM
Looks good stoney.

stoney
07-28-2007, 12:36 PM
Looks good stoney.

Thank you, kindly.