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chrismoose
11-24-2006, 08:36 AM
hi.

something that has been bothering me for a while now? How do you guys attach your papers to the backing board so that you can do your painting?
I used to use masking tape to to secure the paper to the board, but because the paper are 'basically' sandpaper (art spectrum colorfix, smincke sansfix, ersta etc...) the masking tape starts to peel off away from the pastel paper. It did it to such a degree once that im sure the painting moved a bit! and was no longer held tight!
So i decided to try and find different ways to attach paper to board;

Started with; masking tape to board; it peels off it in time - time being a day or so...
those metal clips you can buy; no good because sometimes my paper is a bit smaller than the drawing board....
A staple gun!!! bought a cheap one - but the staples didnt penetrate into the mdf drawing board!!:( staples just bounce off and flew about the room!!;)

Blue tac; lots of little balls/rolls of bluetac spaced out on each side - works quite well, holds the smincke paper in place, but i worried about trying to get the finished painting off of the board; though i managed by useing a scalpel to cut through the bluetac, leaving a small amount on both paper and board. Was worried about any oil transfer aswell.
Duck tape; the tape that can hold anything!! - seems to hold the paper quite well so far, just minimal lifting off of the paper in places - but no where near as bad as 'artists masking tape'! - but i worry about any 'contamination' that could occur from using ordinary ducktape on my 'archival' papers.

I plan to treat the ducktape painting the same way i would with a watercolor when used with gum paper tape ;i.e. just cut the painting off of the board, leaving a border of ducktape around the painting, which would be hidden by the use of a mount board anyway when it comes to framing.

So, whats your thoughts on how to attach pastel papers to drawing boards?
cheers,
chris.
p.s.
it just occured to me; what about using wetted gum paper - in just the same way as preparing a watercolor piece? as long as it sticks to the pastel paper for all time - though the pastel paper has to be suitable for water techniques, see next thread for that Q:):) - i.e. no using la carts!!:evil:
bye.

Paula Ford
11-24-2006, 09:39 AM
LOL...sounds like you've done everything!!

When I do a painting and want it to be "permanently" attached to a piece of foamboard, I use doubletack. I think that is the same thing as bluetac.

When I just want a piece of paper stuck to the surface of foamboard just to paint on, I use low tack tape, such as painter's blue tape, but that is, as you said, a constant struggle to keep it attached.

Will be interested to hear what everyone else says and how they handle this situation.

LOL...be careful with those staples!!

Paula

chrismoose
11-24-2006, 09:54 AM
cheers Paula.

The staple gun has been 'retired':) due to its uselessness!
Do you think that tape left on the painting forever can be harmful in anyway?
i judt dont know.
chris.

BruceF
11-24-2006, 09:57 AM
Kitty Wallis has a great double taping method that works great, IMHO.

You place a piece of wide masking tape on the back of each side leaving about 1/4" or so hanging over the edge. Then you take another piece of tape and attach it to that tab you made and then tape it to the board.

For a better explanation check out this thread in Kitty's forum:
http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187305

Paula Ford
11-24-2006, 10:01 AM
Gee, I really don't know Chris. Have only been an artist for about 6 years and only 3 yrs. in pastels. Most of my paintings are attached to acid-free foamboard with the blue tape at the corners and covered with tracing paper and stored away. Once in a while I look through them all and they don't seem to have any damage.

Paula

Paula Ford
11-24-2006, 10:02 AM
Kitty Wallis has a great double taping method that works great, IMHO.

You place a piece of wide masking tape on the back of each side leaving about 1/4" or so hanging over the edge. Then you take another piece of tape and attach it to that tab you made and then tape it to the board.

For a better explanation check out this thread in Kitty's forum:
http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=187305

Oh WOW, what a great idea!!! She's a smart lady!! :thumbsup:

Paula

Piper Ballou
11-24-2006, 10:16 AM
I learned this from Dianna Poniting. Might be the same thing Kitty was explaining, I need to go and read her post too.

1st photo, use masking tape and place half way on the back of the paper, half of the sticky side is showing. It is not attached to the board at all yet, I am just holding the paper up to the board (try doing with the camera in the other hand. :lol:

2nd photo, take another piece of masking tape place on over the first with half of it sticking to the sticky side and half to your board. only need to do this to the top and bottom of the paper.

I like this method, no tape on the surface of the paper at all.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/24-Nov-2006/8539-mounting_paper_to_a_board_001.jpg http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/24-Nov-2006/8539-mounting_paper_to_a_board_002.jpg

DebbieGS
11-24-2006, 10:45 AM
Piper...thanks for the photos! This looks like a great way to tape the paper to the board.

Debbie

chrismoose
11-24-2006, 11:09 AM
Piper.
also, thanks for the pics and a great idea! i will definaltly try it!:)
tell me though, you dont get any trouble removing your painting from the bottom piece of tape do you? i wouldnt want it to buckle or 'pop' the paper out at me as you are takng the last bit off. But i suppose if you are using artists masking tape, with it being so unsticky in the first place, it should come off easy enough.
thanks for that.
chris.

Piper Ballou
11-24-2006, 11:25 AM
chris, I have not had any trouble removing the tape from the paper...but, my husband complains that some of the back of the paper comes off when he removes it (he frames my paintings), so I take the painting off the board now when it is time to be framed....

I read Kitty idea, and it is just about the same as this one...either one is a life saver.
piper

Deborah Secor
11-24-2006, 12:21 PM
Just to add to the discussion, REMEMBER that different masking tapes have different tack to them. Go get a good brand (not the 25-roll pack in the value store and NOT painter's tape--it's made to have less tack!) I use Scotch (3M) 1" wide masking tape #202. It costs a bundle but it sticks to a dusty plywood board without letting go! I spend about $6 a roll for it, although sometimes I get it for less on sale in bulk. It's worth it, trust me.

I find that I have no trouble removing it from the Wallis paper, although it will occasionally pull off some of the sandy surface of La Carte if I'm not careful. I always leave about 1/2" around the edge of the paper so it won't be an issue, because that will always be matted over or cut away before framing.

Deborah

Deborah Secor
11-24-2006, 12:35 PM
I know the tape I use sounds expensive, right up until a painting you've nearly completed curls up and rolls off the board as it sits on your easel, so in the morning you wake up to find it smeared on the floor at your feet! Aaargh!

Deborah

dionaea
11-24-2006, 02:34 PM
Hi ! Just use simple spring clamps to hold your paper on to your board. You can find these most anywhere from Staples to Office Max.
They come in all sizes and they are cheap. I have used them for years now.I don't fool with tape of any kind.
Later, Carl

AnnieA
11-24-2006, 03:27 PM
I was having problems having tape sticking. The problem for me was not only getting the tape to stick to the paper, but also getting the tape to stay stuck to the board (masonite). I finally bought a roll of white "Artist's tape" at Aaron Brothers, and it's worked just great.

Some of my earlier problem may have been that I was working on a larger sheet of Colorfix, which, because it was heavier, exerted more of a pull on the tape. I think if I were to try that again, I would first wipe the masonite with alcohol to remove any traces of dirt or oily stuff that could interfere with the adhesion, and I'd also use gator clips at the top, just to help it stay in place.

I hope some of what I said might help somehow...

Just to add to Deborah's list of tapes that don't work, don't try drafting tape either; it's also made to be less adhesive.

Edited to add: I'd be nervous about duct tape, as it is very adhesive, and I've found that the adhesive is frequently left on the surface that's been taped, even when the duct tape is removed. The tacky adhesive that's left is very hard to remove from hard surfaces, so I imagine it would never come off something like paper. One other concern is whether you could remove the duct tape without tearing the paper itself. You say you're going to leave a border of duct tape on there, but gee, I just don't know, surely there's a better way... I say this but also admit I tried it myself with one particularly difficult painting (Colorfix) that just wouldn't stay on my board.

You're absolutely right though - it sure does hold! Have you tried going over the edge of the paper (on those that can tolerate it) with a cotton ball soaked lightly in alcohol (letting it dry thoroughly before trying any tape)? Maybe there's a little oiliness from people's fingers, from when the paper's been handled, that's preventing a good bond.

chrismoose
11-24-2006, 03:53 PM
Deborah,
and you are happy leaving the scotch tape on the paper forever (asuming you matt over it, not cut it away) ? scotch tape is not the same as duck tape is it?
your 'nightmare scenario' is what is close to happening here!:( - but the silver ducktape is holding the work down, i just hope it doesnt discolor the paper or anything like that or worse!

I cant use clips as there is too much board space around the paper - unless there were some type of massive clip to use! but then it would get in the way of working -like i found when trying to use pushpins! - there not exactly flush with the board!:)
cheers guys,
if noone has found any problems using ducktape then i shall continue with that and try pipers method!!
chris.

PeggyB
11-24-2006, 05:10 PM
Reason not to use any old tape:

Most of the adhesives are not archival. Artists tape costs a bundle as Deborah stated, but the adhesive on it won't yellow over time, and it can be removed from the artwork if necessary without tearing the paper.

I seriously doubt alcohol would disolve most adhesives.

Peggy

chewie
11-24-2006, 05:41 PM
you could also try 'bankers clips' those are very long flat, made of metal. they dont' have a spring, just think of a bobby pin, only flat, about 3/4 inch wide. they slide right over the edge of both paper and board. i use them pleinair-ing alot! on a larger piece, i use those on edges, and tape on the middle sides.

Mary Brigid
11-24-2006, 05:58 PM
Hi Chris. The Scotch Masking tape that Deborah suggested is very good indeed. I use it and have no bother with it. It comes off easily also when the painting is finnished. I get it in an art store in Cork. Roughly about 4 euro a roll and it goes a long way. They have a website and this is the link to it

http://www.corkartsupplies.com/store/product/9725/Tape-Masking-%C3%82%C2%BD%22x60-Yard/

Mary Brigid

mauricar
11-24-2006, 06:04 PM
I recommend Piper's method. It works very well for me. And never - no never, ever use staples on your working boards. Those holes will ruin a good painting.
Midge

AnnieA
11-24-2006, 06:45 PM
Reason not to use any old tape:

Most of the adhesives are not archival. Artists tape costs a bundle as Deborah stated, but the adhesive on it won't yellow over time, and it can be removed from the artwork if necessary without tearing the paper.

I seriously doubt alcohol would disolve most adhesives.

Peggy: I was certain it isn't a good idea to use duct tape - I sensed it is a mistake; thanks for supplying the reasons. Also, as I don't think anyone else mentioned alcohol, I imagine your comment was directed at what I had said about it earlier. I was suggesting wiping off the board and the edge of the paper (if it's one like Colorfix that can take it) with alcohol before trying an artist's sort of tape again, as I thought that might help in obtaining a good bond. It's recommended to wipe hardboard with alcohol before priming for just the same reason; the alcohol will remove any dust or oily fingerprints from the surface. My hope was to aleviate the problems so that the use of duct tape wouldn't even need to be considered, not that alcohol would remove the tackiness left by the adhesive in duct tape, or any other tape. We just didn't communicate on that one, I think... I'm glad you said something; it gave me a chance to clarify.

Dot Hoffman
11-25-2006, 10:17 AM
I use Art Spectrum Colorfix paper for the most part. I tape it down on all four sides, covering the unsanded border. When I am finished with the painting and want to remove the tape, I pull it off at a 45 degree angle which minimuzes the amount of paper tearing. I like to have a bit of border along each edge if I'm framing with mats. If I were using a paper without a border, I'd use the Diana Ponting method above, and I wouldn't even try to remove the tape from the back of the painting, but use it to stabilize and attach it to the back of the "under" mat. Except, I think I'd use tabs of tape instead of one long piece top and bottom. Has anyone tried that??

Kitty Wallis
11-25-2006, 04:38 PM
Years ago I cheaply framed a few drawings to give to friends at christmas. I used masking tape on them; they were on thin bond paper. When I saw one years later, the masking tape had made a brown stain on the drawing. The sticky stuff had bled thru the paper to the front. Now I always remove all traces of any kind of tape.

Dajh, I pull the tape off at a very acute angle, almost 180 degrees, I find I have better success at not tearing the paper.

One more point: I use 4" lengths of tape, rather then tape the length of the work, to fasten my paper to the board, because I do a wet underpainting and I have had the paper corrugate and dry on longer lengths of tap, leaving a rippling ridge that I couldn't flatten.

prettytulips
11-25-2006, 09:37 PM
Reason not to use any old tape:

Most of the adhesives are not archival. Artists tape costs a bundle as Deborah stated, but the adhesive on it won't yellow over time, and it can be removed from the artwork if necessary without tearing the paper.

I seriously doubt alcohol would disolve most adhesives.

Peggy

Since an artist is not painting ON the unarchival tape, does it matter if the tape is archival?

prettytulips
11-25-2006, 09:39 PM
Oh.. I just read Kitty's memo... ok.

Dot Hoffman
11-26-2006, 12:11 PM
Kitty, after reading your post, I realized sent wrong info; I pull the tape off at a 90 degree angle (a right angle) to the paper. I don't do wet underpaintings, at least not to this point, but if I do, I'll keep your experiences in mind. :)

katsarecool
11-26-2006, 12:28 PM
This is great info. I have already learned to do this the wrong way all by myself. Thanks for the tips on doing it the right way!

Bringer
12-02-2006, 06:10 PM
Hi,

Try the masking tape from Tesa : 4344
I use it and I've been doing ok with it.

Kind regards,

Josť