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Honeyhue
11-13-2005, 07:36 PM
Hello everyone. Recently I have been asked to be a featured artist at a local gallery along with 2 other artists (for pet portraits). I have always done by oil paintings on already-primed canvas board (Fredricks brand), but am not sure if this is good quality to actually do possible commissions on or to display with a frame in a gallery. Does anyone here use canvas board? I find that it's cheaper and easy to work on and comes in a variety of different sizes. Do you think this is an appropriate material??

Euphonic_Pencils
11-13-2005, 07:45 PM
Personally, I would say that it would be make your painting more professional looking if you did it on stretched canvas. It's up to you, I mean good art will look good no matter what it is on. I use stretched canvas because it adds a little something and it doesnt seem to warp as canvas board can do.

A Few Pigments
11-13-2005, 07:56 PM
When displaying ones work in a public venue it’s always best to use a more appropriate support. One alternative to stretched canvas made by the vender you mentioned is a canvas covered wood panel by Fredricks. These are more expensive then the canvas covered cardboard, but provide a more professional type of support whilst allowing one to avoid the riggers of stretching canvas.

Another entirely appropriate type of support would be a wood panel, if your painting style is apropos for a smooth working surface.

rroberts
11-13-2005, 08:09 PM
Fredrix Canvas Panels are canvas on what amounts to cardboard. They are excellent for color studies and experiments.

A gallery-quality canvas panel should consist of canvas on hardboard (masonite), at the very least, or a better-grade prepared wood support.

If you intend to sell a painting, the buyer deserves a proper canvas panel, wood panel, or stretched canvas support.

good art will look good no matter what it is on.

Think of it this way ...
When you put pearls on a goat, you still have a goat.

cheers!

A Few Pigments
11-13-2005, 09:53 PM
Fredrix Archival Canvas Boards http://www.fredrixartistcanvas.com/frameproducts.html

AndreS347
11-14-2005, 07:32 PM
Painting “a diagonal cross” on the back can solve warping problem with a canvas board.

Customers definitely deserve the best when it comes to everything. The question is, do they really care as much as we think they do about whether it is cardboard or hardboard? I started painting several months ago, before that I was just an observer. I always admired art and attended many exhibitions and art shows. Maybe I am not a typical “consumer”, but whenever I saw quality artwork, I did not care much about whether it was on stretched canvas, canvas board, canvas hardboard, or paper.
So…
as Robert put it :)
If you put pearls on a goat... they are still pearls. :)

Andre

rroberts
11-14-2005, 08:59 PM
So…as Robert put it ...If you put pearls on a goat... they are still pearls

The trouble is, pearls probably won't stay on the goat for very long, and you would still have the goat.

Aphorisms aside, an artist is certainly free to paint on anything one could nail to a wall (and many artists have).

The question is, do they [customers] really care as much as we think they do...?

A buyer has a reasonable expectation that what s/he buys meets accepted standards, whether they buyer is aware of those standards or not.

Such an assumption is the legal basis of many lawsuits and subsequent settlements - infant auto seats is one example. It's not really any different in the art world. While it's true that there are no extant enforceable laws covering such things as what kind of support is valid, there is the matter of public trust and an artist's willingness to meet implied standards.

By way of analogy ... if you go to the fine restaurant of a famous chef, you would certainly (and justifiably) feel cheated if your vintage wine is served in styrofoam cups, your food is served on cheap, leaking paper plates, and you must eat with plastic utensils, yet you are still charged famous restaurant prices. But hey - you got your culinary "pearls".

Unfortunately, the analogy doesn't adequately address the concept of pride of craftsmanship. I guess it boils down to how seriously one wants to take it.

my 2 cents.

BlackFox
11-14-2005, 10:07 PM
How can you tell the difference between cardboard and masonite when its covered with paint?

dbclemons
11-14-2005, 11:11 PM
How can you tell the difference between cardboard and masonite when its covered with paint?

If someone buys it, it won't be hard to find out. A simple inspection, they discover they just bought crap, and the artist better find a good hiding place. Meanwhile their reputation is a joke. Although, if they bought it on eBay for spare change, they may not be too surprised.

I think Honeyhue already knows to give them the best. I personally do not think canvas mounted to cardboard, even if it's claimed to be archival, would be proper for a show of my work at a gallery. I treat such an opportunity as a chance to put my best foot forward, so to speak. Even hardboard is not perfect, but there's some out there that is well constructed. I like the simplicity of the Ampersand cradled board boxes, for instance, and Art-Board has a linen stretched over wood panel that looks nice. In the end, a good presentation is worth every penny. Do a few studies even on paper, and spend your money to do the final piece on something you can be proud of selling.

-DBC

WFMartin
11-14-2005, 11:43 PM
How can you tell the difference between cardboard and masonite when its covered with paint?

By how long it can be expected to last!

Bill

rroberts
11-15-2005, 12:06 AM
I personally do not think canvas mounted to cardboard, even if it's claimed to be archival, would be proper for a show of my work at a gallery.

A reputable gallery isn't going to think so, either.

housecatnick
11-15-2005, 01:15 AM
Hi Guys -

As a framer/Restorer and artist - you'd be surprised what I deal with for NY Galleries. Just today I had to unframe a piece of art that was taped to mat board with packing tape. The art was on canvas (cardboard) board and was selling for $5,000.00. The same gallery director brought in a painting on a dog eared sheet of masonite that retailed for 10k.

The art was good with historical significance - but that's the "pearl" spoken about earlier.Those artists paint pearls because of their name - we don't have the luxury.

My tip? I have a friend who is an appraiser. She doesn't look at the front of the painting - SHE LOOKS AT THE BACK! Her stance is, she needs to prove to the client that the art painted is a good investment because of the artist's sales history, quality of the image (the pearl) and WORKMANSHIP. She appreciates artists who stretch and prime their own canvas/linen as well. It adds to the value (although not in an incredible amount) as well. She de-valued a Russian artist I knew even though his sales were good and images strong. He just happened to use house paint.

If you want to paint on canvas with a stiff backing - better stretch that baby on masonite and build your own cradle for it!

This brings on the age old question about the responsibilty of the artist to his/her work during creation and AFTER the sale. It's still an on going debate!

How long are we responsible for our works?

Sorry - this is a can o' worms for me -

Nick

Marc Sabatella
11-18-2005, 09:22 PM
How can you tell the difference between cardboard and masonite when its covered with paint?

Wait a few weeks, see how badly it warps, then if there is still any doubt, wait a few decades and see if the whole thing just disintegrates.

The conservators I've discussed things with are quite convinced that (archival) boards are better than stretched canvas - stretched canvas is much more likely to eventually cause the painting to crack. So I'd lose the notion that panels are inherently less professional. But you do want professional panels. In addition to the Fredrix ones, ASW sells ones called "Pannelli Telati" and "Pintura" which are both very good and cost rather less than the Fredrix archival panels.