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brushmarx
11-09-2004, 01:32 PM
howdy!!! it's seems that i have asked so many questions lately and not helped anyone!!!! iwill someday!!!!so i'm framing my canvases and so far it's going great! angles are perfect. i just bought one of those jigs that wrap around the frame to hold it snug and am now wondering whether ishoud glue the frames all at once and then nail. my husband says that if we glue and let that dry and then nail it could possible break the glue. i would love to glue it , clamp the jig around it then nail it before the glue dries but am not sure if that's good. any comments are welcome!!! maria :cool:

Marc Hanson
11-09-2004, 01:44 PM
howdy!!! it's seems that i have asked so many questions lately and not helped anyone!!!! iwill someday!!!!so i'm framing my canvases and so far it's going great! angles are perfect. i just bought one of those jigs that wrap around the frame to hold it snug and am now wondering whether ishoud glue the frames all at once and then nail. my husband says that if we glue and let that dry and then nail it could possible break the glue. i would love to glue it , clamp the jig around it then nail it before the glue dries but am not sure if that's good. any comments are welcome!!! maria :cool:
I've worked in a number of frame shops and we always glued the 'wet' joint. Remember that the nails don't hold the joint, the glue does. So you want to use the nails to 'snug up' the glued joint when it's wet. Having said that, some do glue a dry joint so you do have a choice. Your husband is right too that you may 'pop' the glue joint if you nail it dry. The best and safe way is to glue wet.

brushmarx
11-09-2004, 01:48 PM
I've worked in a number of frame shops and we always glued the 'wet' joint. Remember that the nails don't hold the joint, the glue does. So you want to use the nails to 'snug up' the glued joint when it's wet. Having said that, some do glue a dry joint so you do have a choice. Your husband is right too that you may 'pop' the glue joint if you nail it dry. The best and safe way is to glue wet.
hi thanksfor the quick response. to clarify i should glue the corners ( and sides?) and before they dry put the finishing nails in? one or two nails? what type of glue? elmers wood glue? also what do you mean by "glue a dry joint " sorry i seem to be a confused bird today! maria :eek:

Marc Hanson
11-09-2004, 02:27 PM
hi thanksfor the quick response. to clarify i should glue the corners ( and sides?) and before they dry put the finishing nails in? one or two nails? what type of glue? elmers wood glue? also what do you mean by "glue a dry joint " sorry i seem to be a confused bird today! maria :eek:
Hi Maria,

I mis-typed that...it should have been'NAIL a dry joint, and nail a wet joint', sorry for that.

With the type of clamp you are using I would apply glue to each end of one piece and put it into the clamp but don't adjust the clamp yet. Then glue both ends of the piece that join it, then the 3rd and finally the 4th piece. Line up the corners so that they are flush(no raw edges showing) and the frame is flat and then start to slowly tighten the clamps evenly around the frame. The idea is to put equal pressure on the frame all around, not just tighten one side and then another. That will 'warp' the frame.

When the clamps are tight (and only tight enough to squeeze excess glue from the joints), it's time to nail.

Is this a clamp that has four corners joined by either rods or a strap? If it is then I would place the frame in a bench vise if you have one and nail the corner that way. To do this, place the side of the frame in the bench vise that you are nailing into (the side that ends up with the point of the nail in it), and then nail through the end of the other piece into the side in the bench vise.

ALWAYS pre-drill with a drill bit that is slightly smaller in diameter than the nail itself. If it is soft wood(not oak or a wood like that) just drill about half the length of the finish nail. If it is oak or a similarily hard wood, I drill the entire length of the nail, but make sure that the drill bit is a smaller diameter or the nail won't hold tight.

If the moulding is say 2" or less, then 2 nails will probably be fine. Remember that it's the glue that is the main ingredient holding the frame together, so make that job a good one and the nails are secondary.

If the moulding is larger then I sometmes use 3 nails stagered in the shape of a triangle. 2 just inside the edge of the end of the moulding and inline vertically, and 1 on the lower part of the moulding, placed inward on the moulding.

Elmer's wood glue is just fine. It's going to give you enough 'open' (workable) time to make sure all of the joints are just right before nailing and in order to clean the wet glue off before it dries.

Here's a quick diagram on nail position and how to place in a bench vise for nailing. (Real quick drawing! :D )
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/09-Nov-2004/37743-framing-diag.jpg

brushmarx
11-09-2004, 02:46 PM
thanks piant box! i'm glad that you showed me that diagram becasue i'm actually framing differently. i have 1 5/8 thick canvas and am nailing slightly thicker than 1 5/8 flat wood to the sides of the canvas. there will be 45 degree corners. so it's not frames that are for say watercolor on paper with mat board and then frame. however alot of what you wrote is going to help me through this! so i don't think that putting it in the vise bench would work. the strap have four plastic moveable corners that are connected together by strap and there is a crank to tighten it up well. thanks for the advice. if there is something different that i shoudl do for this type of framing i'd love to hearit !!!! :clap:

colin
11-10-2004, 12:00 PM
Great description, Paintbox !

If I could add one little thing -- dont forget to set the heads of the nails in with a nailset ... later when you sand they will stick up proud of the frame otherwise ...

Einion
11-10-2004, 02:32 PM
Thanks for the posts Marc, great to have your input on questions like this.

Einion