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dcorc
10-01-2004, 09:27 AM
This month we are looking at the work of Adolphe-William Bouguereau (1825-1905)

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Oct-2004/30792-Portrait_de_lartiste.jpg

I could give you no better biographical summary than is present on the Art Renewal website, so I shall refer you there:
http://www.artrenewal.com/museum/b/Bouguereau_William/bio1.asp

- and there is a very good article on his working methods there too, at:
http://www.artrenewal.com/museum/b/Bouguereau_William/mark_walker1.asp

This is also some discussion of methods and approaches in our preparatory thread, here:
http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219187

Usually, we select one painting each month, so that everyone is working on the same image, and we can directly compare methods and progress, and give each other help from personal experience of trying to achieve similar appearances and effects.

This month, we have decided to try something a little different - to open the project to the widest possible number of participants - we are going to run with 5 paintings simultaneously - I think most will be sufficiently challenged to complete one within the month, though people are welcome to attempt more than one if they wish - the superb, subtle fleshtones Bouguereau characteristically achieved in his paintings are very challenging, but there are clear similarities between them to give some commonality of experience, whichever of the paintings we choose to work on.

So here they are:

L'Amour et Psyche, enfants
1889
47.05 x 27.95 inches
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/29-Sep-2004/30792-cupidandpsyche.jpg
Large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/large/LAmour_et_Psyche_enfants.jpg)
Very large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/LAmour_et_Psyche_enfants.jpg)

Le crepuscule
1882
50.00 x 25.98 inches
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2004/30792-Evening_Mood.jpg
Large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/large/Evening_Mood.jpg)
Very large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/Evening_Mood.jpg)

Jeune fille au crochet
1889
24.02 x 18.27 inches
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2004/30792-Portrait_of_a_Young_Girl_Crocheting1.jpg
Large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/large/Portrait_of_a_Young_Girl_Crocheting.jpg)

Au Bord du Ruisseau
1875
(I can't find size information on this painting - though from other similar single figure paintings, I'd speculate the original may be between 25x39.5 ins and 35x55.2ins)
edit - its 52x33ins, from
http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=RaLvk8WvXu0C&pg=PA38&lpg=PA38&dq=Au+Bord+du+Ruisseau+1875&source=bl&ots=FTNL0yymRR&sig=I-SLMboCoX_KUBPp37hyEJ0H4TQ&hl=en&ei=BF8_S8O3HKb20gSpjrGSBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CBcQ6AEwAzgU#v=onepage&q=Au%20Bord%20du%20Ruisseau%201875&f=false
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2004/30792-Au_bord_du_ruisseau1.jpg
Large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/large/Au_bord_du_ruisseau.jpg)
Very large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/Au_bord_du_ruisseau.jpg)

Le Ravissement de Psyche
1895
82.28 x 47.24 inches
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2004/30792-Le_ravissement_de_Psyche1.jpg
Large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/large/Le_ravissement_de_Psyche.jpg)
Very large version HERE (http://www.artrenewal.com/images/artists/b/Bouguereau_William/Le_ravissement_de_Psyche.jpg)

Hoping we have a large turn-out this month, given how popular Bouguereau is!

Dave

A Few Pigments
10-01-2004, 09:49 AM
Dave the link for Jeune fille au crochet doesn't seem to be working. Just thought you'd want to know.

guillot
10-01-2004, 10:37 AM
:clap: :clap:

Thanks Dave :)

Hmmm ... now which one to start? I still have 2 to finish, LOL Maybe I can get some of that out of my way today!!

Tina

TruEnuff
10-01-2004, 10:48 AM
Actually, several of the links are down at this moment....maybe there's a problem with the ARC site. At any rate, folks should be able to find all the pictures there.

I had already downloaded and printed several copies of L'Amour, but now I'm faced with making a decision! I can't make decisions this early in the morning!

Gads, they're all gorgeous, aren't they. Whew....it will be a challenge this month!

Maybe Jeaune? Hmmmmmm.....

Keep Painting!
Bruce

dcorc
10-01-2004, 11:06 AM
Odd, but I don't have any problems in accessing any of the links I gave (I've cleared my cache files to check - but I may be accessing caches at my ISP etc, I suppose).

The images are all available from pages 1, 10, and 21 of the Bouguereau Gallery at the Art Renewal Center, www.artrenewal.com

Dave

DLGardner
10-01-2004, 11:09 AM
Once again I leaped before I looked. I started this yesterday and then saw the close up photo someone posted in the other thread. I need to go back and redo the eyes, they are way too big and the face is actually not thin enough either. But I'm having fun.

I'm not tracing, nor am I doing an undercoating. Its alla prima for me. I just don't understand the undercoating thing. I tried it once and got stumped and my painting of Cynthia is still sitting there in all sorts of odd colors. Perhaps I should go back to school for it.

Anyway, I'll be the first to post my progress. Go ahead, throw a flag on the field, false start-penalty?

:)
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Oct-2004/8002-Boug.jpg

see what I mean?
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Oct-2004/8002-Boug2.jpg
Dianne

Carey Griffel
10-01-2004, 11:14 AM
HOLY COW, Dianne!! I haven't even started thinking about beginning and here you are, almost done. :D Seriously, though, you've got a great start, though I do see what you mean about the likeness. I think you'll get it, though...good grief, I know that I will struggle with the likeness on mine (I will be doing the same one you chose. ;) )...you do such a great job with people!

By the way, what size is your canvas??

~!Carey

Carey Griffel
10-01-2004, 11:16 AM
FWIW, I've *never* ever *ever* been able to view any direct links to images from teh ARC site.

~!Carey

DLGardner
10-01-2004, 11:18 AM
16 X 20 and I think I am not going to get that one foot in. :(

Dianne

Yokovich
10-01-2004, 11:26 AM
hi Dianne--what a beautiful beginning--!! she is already looking so pretty!! wonderful start!
I just don't know what to do--too many to choose from...well, I usually wait until the last day in the month so I have time yet...(I can paint while the trick or treaters come and go) lol

guillot
10-01-2004, 11:32 AM
Way to go Dianne!!! :clap:

FWIW - I dont' have problems with the links either ?

Tina

dcorc
10-01-2004, 03:52 PM
Great start, Dianne! :clap:

Dave

loop
10-01-2004, 04:02 PM
wow Dave you are quite the slave driver as if doing a boogy isn't hard enough, we have to do 5 !!!

dcorc
10-01-2004, 04:06 PM
wow Dave you are quite the slave driver as if doing a boogy isn't hard enough, we have to do 5 !!!

Well, you can work at one, each of the 5 weekdays, for 4 weeks - and have Saturdays and Sundays off!

:evil: Dave

loop
10-01-2004, 04:40 PM
Well, you can work at one, each of the 5 weekdays, for 4 weeks - and have Saturdays and Sundays off!

:evil: Dave


cool I'll tell my boss you said it's okay. :clap:

It's NO surprize that if you rearrange the letters form SLAVEDRIVER you get

Dave rules I
:evil:

Of course I'm sure YOU see it as I Dave, Rule.

good picks ,by the way, which one are you doing ?

dcorc
10-01-2004, 04:59 PM
cool I'll tell my boss you said it's okay. :clap:

It's NO surprize that if you rearrange the letters form SLAVEDRIVER you get

Dave rules I
:evil:

Of course I'm sure YOU see it as I Dave, Rule.

good picks ,by the way, which one are you doing ?

Err...actually...

but it will give you:
Dr Evil raves
Lard revives
Reds revival
Devil ravers
Avers drivel
Raves drivel

I'm doing "au bord du ruisseau" (first :p )

Dave

Rosic
10-01-2004, 05:09 PM
I'm in too! Finally back in action. Preping a 20x30 canvas for L'Amour et Psyche, enfants (Tami wanted that one for the wall)... :D

Dianne... off to a great start I see!

Bernie

dcorc
10-01-2004, 06:00 PM
hi Bernie!

OK - here's my first stage - board 24x16ins - primed with a couple of thin coats of grey - then, drawing directly in paint, a scrub in with burnt sienna - one round bristle brush with burnt sienna, one round bristle brush with mineral spirits - scrubbed back and forth until placements were reasonable.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Oct-2004/30792-dcabdr1.jpg

Dave

marshallgh
10-01-2004, 08:47 PM
I was reading the above links and came across the colors of his palette. "Bitumen" is in the list. What is this? Is this like Shiva's asphaltum?

The links also talked about gisaille sketches....did he also use this technique in his finished works....or did he just paint it all at one time?

Seems like you would have to use glazes to get those beautifully draped fabrics.

Thanks,
Terry

I might attempt one of these since I finished my first oil painting (nothing fancy...just an exercise from one of Helen VanWyk's books). Buttt I may be getting in wayyyy over my head since all I have painted in oils are two lemons, LOL! :confused:

dcorc
10-01-2004, 09:26 PM
I was reading the above links and came across the colors of his palette. "Bitumen" is in the list. What is this? Is this like Shiva's asphaltum?

The links also talked about gisaille sketches....did he also use this technique in his finished works....or did he just paint it all at one time?

Seems like you would have to use glazes to get those beautifully draped fabrics.

Thanks,
Terry

I might attempt one of these since I finished my first oil painting (nothing fancy...just an exercise from one of Helen VanWyk's books). Buttt I may be getting in wayyyy over my head since all I have painted in oils are two lemons, LOL! :confused:

Hi Terry - yes, bitumen and asphaltum are the same - though I believe that just about all the manufacturers who offer it are actually producing "hue" colours, rather than the real thing, as it's technically problematic.

The short answer, on how WB painted, is - when you find out, please let us know :p - the information I'd posted, and linked to, above, seems to suggest that he painted pretty much directly, rather than with a grisaille underpainting - but...how reliable is that information? what is clear is that he prepared and planned extensively, and that grisaille studies in order to work out the values were part of that - and one of the things which characterises these paintings is very tight control of values, particularly in the fleshtones where modelling is achieved with very fine, close, and precise value control. Personally, I suspect that he painted skin-tones and then scumbled thinly with pale subdued colours, over the top of them, to achieve very delicate transitions. (Frustrated not to have seen one in real life - if anyone knows of the location of one in the UK, I will be extremely grateful!)

I'd encourage you to jump in and have a go - all levels of experience are welcome here, and the more experienced will endeavor to give all the help they possibly can! :)

Dave

Rosic
10-01-2004, 09:35 PM
Terry... I'm with Dave and want to encourage you to try this endeavor with us... a learning experience guaranteed! :D
Bernie

BTW... where are you Jaysen?... I know you have several paintings in the works but I sure hope you can join us on this one. :)

dcorc
10-01-2004, 09:58 PM
BTW... where are you Jaysen?... I know you have several paintings in the works but I sure hope you can join us on this one. :)

Yes, I hope Jaysen isn't going to sith this one out, now he's Emperor :p

Darth..er..Dave

Biki
10-01-2004, 10:41 PM
thinking of doing a cropped version.

what do you think.? - does this work?

marshallgh
10-01-2004, 10:47 PM
Thanks Dave and Rosic for the info and inspiration. Hope to start when I return from Florida (leaving tomorrow afternoon).

Nice crop Biki. I think it will be perfect.
Terry :wave:

CoolArtiste
10-02-2004, 02:58 AM
I finished this over a year ago. It is in acrylic on 24" x 36" canvas. It took me about 120 hours. It was very hard to do the skin tones because the paint kept getting darker after it dried. It was difficult to get a good likeness of the girl's face. But the part that gave me the most trouble was the boy's straight leg because it was hard to match the subtle skin tones in acrylic. I had to paint it like 50 times. I'm learning oil painting now.

Biki
10-02-2004, 05:23 AM
nice effort, cool artist.

the big Boogie, is not an easy one to emulate - so I applaud your efforts. :clap:

dcorc
10-02-2004, 05:50 AM
Biki - that crop works very well - go for it!

CoolArtiste - very creditable version there, in acrylic - much more tricky to do so in acrylic, than in oils! So are you going to have a go in oils now? (A partial, cropped version is quite acceptable here if the thought of 120 hours is offputting). Doing so would be a fascinating comparison - as well as being a lot faster in oils!

Terry - I look forward to you joining us!

Dave

Rosic
10-02-2004, 08:32 AM
Biki... I like the crop... in fact... I thought about doing it almost exactly like yours.

CoolArtiste... WOW... Looks great... 120 hours :( ... so what was the most rewarding part of it?

Terry... hope you have a safe and fun trip.

Here is mine so far. After four layers of gessoe I used a tint of blue and gray acrylic mixed in the last layer. Charcoal sketch fixed. 30"x20"... the biggest canvas I have ever worked on... look forward to it.
Bernie

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Oct-2004/17108-mom10_sketch.JPG

gorie
10-02-2004, 09:28 AM
i think i am going to join in this month and try a cropped version like biki has posted. i have too many blank canvases sitting around as it is , none the correct size for these paintings i want to try!! but i like the crop biki chose and that would work on 16x20 canvas i already have. i can always try something bigger later on, right? :)

i really love bouguereau's work , it should be fun to try and see what i can learn from this :)

i wish i could start right now , but i'm about to go show off my new metal mouth to my family. :D hopefully i can get started tonight or tomorrow.

CoolArtiste
10-02-2004, 10:25 AM
CoolArtiste... WOW... Looks great... 120 hours :( ... so what was the most rewarding part of it?

The most rewarding part is having a big painting on the wall that is really glorious to look at. It looks better in person. I also enjoyed painting the hair on the boy and the face of the girl. I love how three dimensional it looks. To me this painting represents love. I think that's why it's Bouguereau's most popular painting. I've seen it on a lot of merchandise and prints. I'm going to paint another Bouguereau painting in oil sometime, but right now I need to develop my oil painting skills more. I heard Bouguereau spent up to 40 days on each painting. If he worked 10 hours a day, that would be 400 hours.

loop
10-02-2004, 12:11 PM
People sometimes tell me I have a hard time.......following instructions

I am dusting off mine, I started this way before I had any business doing so, and stopped, so that I could learn more. It is basically a block in with another session for the background , and one more for major surgery to the face. the flesh color and tone is horrid don't look at it :wink2: . I think I have the confidence to either paint, or ruin this picture now and am no longer afraid of it (either way)
.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Oct-2004/6307-LoveWC.jpg
.

bjs0704
10-02-2004, 01:39 PM
Diane - Your version is coming along great! The folds in her skirt are looking wonderful!

Dave - It is looking great! The oil ďdrawingĒ phase is looking incredibly good!

General Question - I have a tube of W&N Van Dyk brown that I bought a while back. It looks as if it is a mixture of Burnt Umber and ďBituminous EarthĒ. (I believe they still sell this pigment.)

Would this make a good modern day substitute for the old pigment Bitumen? For the purpose of copying a historic piece, I donít mind trying it once in ďquestionable pigmentĒ.

( I notice that both WB and Caravaggio both used this pigment.)

Terry - It might! What is on the ingredient list of the tube of paint?

Which Helen Van Wyk exercise are you doing? Which book? (Her books have a lot of helpful ideas!)

Biki - That crop is going to make a lovely painting!

Iím glad to see your back with us this month!

CoolArtiste - Itís fabulous! You did very well!

Rosic - Good start!

Gorrie - I usually do the MOMís at 16Ē x 20Ē. You could probably adapt it to whatever canvases you have as long as you are changing the perimeters by too much.

Loop - It doesnít look so bad! It is probably going to take less touching up than you think! The background colors are wonderful. It is going to look great!

I've got mine printed off and I am in the process of sketching it out. I guess I will get to finishing the August and Sept. MOM's when I can.

Barb Solomon :cat:

dcorc
10-02-2004, 02:08 PM
I heard Bouguereau spent up to 40 days on each painting. If he worked 10 hours a day, that would be 400 hours.

Don't tell Loop that! - I was hoping to con him into doing all 5 in the month :p

ahh..er... Loop - well you can finish that one too, now, as well as doing the other 5 (I assume that after you told your boss, he told you to take all the time off you needed :D ) - It looks pretty good though - how long ago were you painting it? It will be interesting to see how much your skill-set has moved on in the meantime.

Bernie - that looks like a good start! What's your previous largest canvas?

Gorie - good to see you joining in too!

Barb - thank you! Van Dyke Brown would be similar to asphaltum (it doesn't get a "good press" from Mayer either, by the way)

Here's a bit of progress on mine (well, not sure about progress, I mean I've done some more on it :) )

I'm using traditional oils for this one, not my usual alkyds, as I suspect the longer "open" time will be helpful (despite the fact that Mark Walker's article makes it sounds like WB painted with siccatives, to which he occasionally added a bit of paint :D )

I'm using Michael Harding Flake White, all others from W&N "Artists" - Ivory Black, Venetian Red, Naples Yellow Light (this is W&N's mix, not genuine Lead Antimonate). Yellow Ochre, Raw Sienna, Burnt Sienna, Raw Umber, Burnt Umber, French Ultramarine Cadmium Lemon (mixed 50/50 with Cadmium Yellow Light alkyd) and Cadmium Red (mixed 50/50 with Cadmium Red Medium alkyd) (as Cadmiums tend to be slow-drying)

I'm diverging here a bit from what I'd read - I'm more inclined to build this as two or three thin layers, and I'm not convinced about the idea of wielding the painting-knife on it at the end either!

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Oct-2004/30792-dcabdr3.jpg

Dave

Rosic
10-02-2004, 03:29 PM
Bernie - that looks like a good start! What's your previous largest canvas?
Up till now... 16x20 is the norm for me. Do have a 20x24 ROUND TUIT painting half way done somewhere.



I'm using Michael Harding Flake White, all others from W&N "Artists" - Ivory Black, Venetian Red, Naples Yellow Light (this is W&N's mix, not genuine Lead Antimonate). Yellow Ochre, Raw Sienna, Burnt Sienna, Raw Umber, Burnt Umber, French Ultramarine Cadmium Lemon (mixed 50/50 with Cadmium Yellow Light alkyd) and Cadmium Red (mixed 50/50 with Cadmium Red Medium alkyd) (as Cadmiums tend to be slow-drying)
Dave
Thanks for the palette Dave. Your progress is taking shape and looking good.

Loop... :clap:

DLGardner
10-02-2004, 08:25 PM
Dave you are off to a great start!

Loop, you have some really good things going in that painting. Keep on it!

Bernie, excellent sketch!

CoolArtiste-that is a wonderful painting. Congratulations!



Its a little off on the tint side, need some more blue hue, but I mostly have been working on form here. Its really hard to say what colors it leans towards since our monitors are so different and scans change colors etc. Its anyone guess I guess.

I only had a few moments to make corrections the other day as I had my grandson with me.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Oct-2004/8002-Boug4.jpg

bjs0704
10-02-2004, 11:28 PM
Dave - Great, now I have a good use for the Van Dyke Brown! Thanks for giving the rest of the palette!

Youíve got a great start! She is looking very nice!

Diane - I canít believe how much ahead of the rest of us you are! It looks like all you are going to need is a little touch up on the face!

Barb Solomon :cat:

TruEnuff
10-02-2004, 11:53 PM
Loop....it doesn't seem to me like you have that far to go....I love your work on both legs especially.....wonderful form and a real feel of life and mass.

Diane....wow....the look in her eyes. I know...they may be a little oversized.....but if you reduce them, don't overdo it.....they have such soul. Nice.

Bruce

DLGardner
10-03-2004, 12:41 AM
Thanks guys, but really, all I've done is the face and a little sketching in of the rest. I read somewhere in the discourse that Bouguereau may have begun with the face of his subject. I also observed a tutortorial by Morgan Weistling awhile back that showed him beginning his paintings with the face. http://www.morganweistling.com/
As I do this painting, I am amazed with how the rest of the picture just falls into place.

Dianne

A Few Pigments
10-03-2004, 02:58 AM
Iím doing the Jeune fille au crochetÖand so it goes.

gorie
10-03-2004, 10:21 AM
i started this morning... this is hard but i am enjoying it so far ..!

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/35483-picture007.jpg

guillot
10-03-2004, 11:06 AM
Gorie - great start. GREAT START everyone !!!!!! :clap:

Loop!! I like it !! :)

I'm in a dilemna - I don't know whether to try to pick up the old one and finish it - or start one of these other ones? What do ya think Loop? You know - the one I've been working on for what 2 years now? :evil: LOL

Tina

guillot
10-03-2004, 11:34 AM
This is my montrosity :D Loop and I go way back on this one ;) I wonder if it is salvagable? Although I would like to do one of the other ones as well :)

2 ft x 4 ft - charcoal and a little verdaccio work (which I probably should not have done ;) ) Only a little though - so may be able to correct.

Tina

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/5957-October_MOM1A.jpg

gorie
10-03-2004, 01:40 PM
guillot - wow that is really cool, i definitely think you should try adn finish it!!

another little update for mine.. i'm having such a hard time getting the correct expression on the little boys face ! i need a break :)
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/35483-picture016.jpg

guillot
10-03-2004, 03:09 PM
Thanks Gorie - love yours so far!!!! Looking great.

OK, so I figured that if I get all the white canvas out of my way - maybe I can concentrate better. I'm just going to continue with my original thought - except a grisaille instead of a verdaccio. I have to correct the value in her wrap - as it is one of my earlier boo-boo's.

Using the Ivory Black gives a nice bluish tone when mixed with white - and then I'll continue with velaturas and glazes.

Here's an update:

Thanks all!!
Tina


http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/5957-October_MOM_2a.jpg

Rosic
10-03-2004, 04:09 PM
Tina... glad to see you excited and back in action on this one again. How long ago did you say you started it? I'm so glad you decided to stick it out.

Dianne... you are capturing character in that expression.

Gorie... WOW... moving along quickly. Looking good.

Worked on roughing in the BG on mine last night. Will let this dry then start a grisaille of the figures.
Bern

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/17108-mom10...2.JPG

dcorc
10-03-2004, 05:57 PM
Gorie, Bernie - both looking good

Tina - That's a good grisaille you've got going there - good that you've been able to get back to it.

Here's my next stage - I'm a bit reluctant to just slap the paint on - perhaps if it was a bit bigger? - so I'm building gradually - (not a great photo either, taken in room lighting here) - I could stop it at this point, and say it's a copy of a Degas :p

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/30792-dcabdr4.jpg

Dave

guillot
10-03-2004, 07:00 PM
Bernie!! Looking great there. I love that painting. My mom is coming in town next weekend and I would like to do that one for her to take home with her. She loves angels - and I think that is one of the sweetest paintings!! I actually started the one I'm finishing a year and a half ago. I picked it back up at the beginning of this year, but only briefly. As you can notice from the first picture I posted (before I got back to it this go around) I started off with the wrong values - and you can see the corrections below. Made a huge difference. I've almost covered the whole canvas with paint now. That's always a chore especially on a canvas of this size - But I like getting to this point - paint goes on so much more easier afterwards I think. I'm correcting as I go - and then I can go back over some of that if needed.

Dave !!! I love your start! Thansk for the comments :) I'm glad we're doing this MOM - definitely pushes me to complete that one, and hopefully I can do one more - I'm hoping so anyway :D

Here's an update - almost have the canvas covered with paint !!!!!! It's getting there anyway :)

Thanks everyone,
Tina

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/5957-October_MOM_3c.jpg

Rosic
10-03-2004, 07:11 PM
I like seeing yours unfold with this approach Dave... every post from you is like another piece in a puzzle.

What a difference Tina! I can see that blueish cast from the ivory black. Keep up the great work.

I actually got a chance to paint a couple hours today. Hope to have the under-painting done of the heads before I have to quit. Sunday night is my son's garage band night... He plays electric guitar and I play bass. :music: ... well... try to! :D I just call it father/son time. :D

DLGardner
10-03-2004, 07:32 PM
Dave, you definately have a fine start here. Why would you be relunctant to slap paint on that? You know what you are doing!

Tina, that is beautiful!I'm so glad you are going to finish it now!

Bernie, where is it?
That's cool you are playing guitar with your son. He will remember it always.

I worked just a little tonight. I'm going really slow on this.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/8002-Boug5.jpg

I think the eyes are about right now but I'll do another skin tone glaze before I'm done-if not more.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/8002-Boug5c.jpg

Dianne

TruEnuff
10-03-2004, 07:50 PM
I am so impressed with everyones paintings...wow. What an impressive group. It's a little intimidating, frankly...but it sure sets a high standard to shoot for.........

Started a drawing today in preparation.....not sure what the heck I'll do with the drawing once I've taken it as far as I can.....but I thought that it would force me to think about how to approach the painting. I wanted to do it full size too, to facilitate transferring it to the canvas eventually...only I don't know how to do that!! Some sort of carbon process, I guess.....I'll have to do some googling...unless anyone has a suggestion.

Here's some WIP pics of today's sketching....

Bruce

DLGardner
10-03-2004, 07:58 PM
Excellent Bruce! I love this painting too. This is going to be exceptional. Can't wait to see your progress.

Dianne

guillot
10-03-2004, 08:58 PM
Hi Bernie - yes the ivory black is giving me the "blues" I'm searching for !! most definitely. You know - I think too I'm finally at some kind of breaking point - where at the beginning of this year - when I finally laid it to rest yet again - I was so consumed with the outcome that it blinded me somewhat. I've finally come to the point that it's like "whatever the outcome is the outcome". No WORRIES..... I have finally let go of "perfection" and it is a very freeing experience!!

Diane - WOW - looking so wonderful there!! I just love watching you paint!! I Love watching your technique and knowing and expecting the outcome that I know will be "your own" beautiful technique !!!! Love how you just 'go right in' there!! Excellent !!!!!!!!!! :clap:

TruEnuff (Bruce) - OMG - what a wonderful drawing !!!! You have captured the moment!! That wonderful look on her face - somewhat sweet yet seductive!! You're spot ON!! Intimidation?? Oh please!! I find your drawing very intimadating!! You're so close to the final!!!!!!!!! How are you going to proceed? You have it in the drawing!! Look at the link Dave gave for Artrenewal - It talks about how WB transferred his drawings to the canvas !!! What's more intimadating than everyone expecting a wonderful outcome from your drawing - IT'S SPOT ON !!!!!! You have it in the bag my friend !!!!!! And so talented too :D

Thanks everyone !!
Tina

guillot
10-03-2004, 11:13 PM
Finally - paint all over :D

Much easier from this point on - tackling that ol' dry canvas!!

Lots of adjustments to do :)

Thanks everyone :angel:

Tina

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/03-Oct-2004/5957-October_MOM_4A.jpg

whispurr
10-04-2004, 12:12 AM
Hi Everyone,

I'm fairly new to WC (have been prowling around for the past week). I've finally worked up to courage to say hello and offer my first effort. Frankly I think your all crazy (and I do believe that includes me) because copying this guy is hard! I haven't really painted for quite a few years now but I have the time and this site has really inspired me to give it a try. ohhh my camera died so I used a palm pilot to take the picture so it may not be up to par. Anyhow thanks for any comments or suggestions you might have.

Marilyn

TruEnuff
10-04-2004, 12:12 AM
Tina....

First, thank you for the kind comments on my drawing...I appreciate it truely....but turning that drawing into a painting will be the challenge for me. I think I will continue with it for awhile longer....especially trying to get relative values in mind. I probably should have done the drawing in charcoal since it is so hard to get an overall darker value in a large pencil sketch...so much to cover...and this WB painting is surprising 'dark'. Also, I did read the ARC articles on WB techniques and recall something about the transfer process. I need to go back and re-read it, but if I remember, it used some terms I wasn't familiar with. Anyway, a search of Blick and Utrecht sites showed that transfer paper is readily available in several types and is cheap.

Secondly, your painting is coming along wonderfully. I know it's difficult to judge from the small WIP thumbnails here, but it looks like it would be a success even if you stopped now. It's a great 'drawing' and I know it will be an even more impressive painting! It's such fun to watch this emerge!

Bruce

TruEnuff
10-04-2004, 12:18 AM
Marilyn....
Welcome to Painting from the Masters!! I'm new too...this is my second attempt. I just completed the Hopper painting for September. That was a totally new experience for me...and I loved it.

You and I are doing the same WB painting....and yours looks terrific!! And yes, you are right, we are crazy! Completely! But, wow, is this fun or what?! Course I may be singing a different tune by the time this month's assignment is over!

Welcome again....have fun!

Bruce

DLGardner
10-04-2004, 12:21 AM
Marilyn, your sketch is gorgeous! Can't wait to see your painting.

Tina, this is going to be your masterpiece!
Your desert came out ok. You were right about the composition being better before you added the last bush, but it is still a good painting with lots of character. This Borgie is going to be another castle though!

Biki
10-04-2004, 02:22 AM
Everyone is doing so amazing already. I am so impressed - and a pale shade of green too, I might add.

I want to get started, but it is not my way to leave my current painting hanging. My tiny mind can only think of one painting at a time. :eek:

but i love to watch. :)

:wave:

Florian
10-04-2004, 04:06 AM
Great start everyone, this will be an interesting month with all this paintings.

I like the ĄAu Bord du RuisseauĒ, so I decided to paint this one.
I prepared the canvas with 3 layers of gesso, and after the drawing I toned the canvas with a thin grey layer to let show through the drawing.
The size is 60 x 100 cm , ca 24" x 40". For the underpainting I used burned umber, flake white and linseed oil.

Florian

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/04-Oct-2004/39426-Ruisseau__1.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/04-Oct-2004/39426-Ruisseau_1d.jpg

Jaysen
10-04-2004, 01:29 PM
Yes, I hope Jaysen isn't going to sith this one out, now he's Emperor :p

Darth..er..Dave


Well, I am working on it... I've done two preliminary sketches and am having trouble getting that bored/serious look on the girl's face. I should be able to finish and get the sketch outline on the canvas tonight. I'm going with a slightly smaller than original canvas of 36" x 22". That's going to make it hard to duplicate completely, unless I intentionally use smaller brushes. ;)

bjs0704
10-04-2004, 01:37 PM
Carey - It is looking good. I like the skin tones. You are off to a good start!

I know what you mean about the faces. Just getting the least little bit off really changes the face! You are doing pretty well, just hang in there!

Tina - I canít see anything that would prevent you from finishing it. It is really very lovely!

Your painting is going to look so neat when it is done! It is going to be a wonderful present for your mother.

Bernie - They are looking so sweet! You are really off to a good start! Your clouds are fantastic!

Sunday night is my son's garage band night... He plays electric guitar and I play bass.

That sounds like so much fun! I hope that the two of you have a great time!

Diane -Thanks for the link! The demoís on Morgan Weistlingís website are really interesting. He does things just a bit differently.

Your version is turning out very nice! I like your balance of colors.

Dave - You have a really nice block in! Bouguereauís style is so much more careful than many of the styles we work in now adays. It is really a change. You are doing well!

Bruce - Your drawing is fantastic! It deserves to be framed on its own!

If you need to transfer the drawing, you could take a large sheet of tracing paper and make ďhomemade carbon paperĒ with charcoal. Then, either trace over the outline of your drawing. (You may want to protect the drawing with another sheet of tracing paper.)

The homemade carbon paper comes off more readily than bought! If you buy transfer paper check it before you use it on your painting. I had some that repelled the paint as if it were crayon and watercolor.

Marilyn- Welcome to WetCanvas! I am glad that you have joined us!

(Check the vertical alignment of her facial features. The mouth may be just a smidge to the right.) You have a really beautiful drawing!
Florian - I love the skin tones of the sections that you have done! It is a lovely start! The face is beautiful!

Barb Solomon :cat:

bjs0704
10-04-2004, 01:44 PM
It looks like I may be able to catch up to the rest of you! Here is my outline. I am going to try a variation of the method used on the Ron Sanders website.

bravynn
10-04-2004, 06:08 PM
I love to come here, and this is my first time posting. VERY NEWBIE here, and at traditional painting.

hmmm.... I'm going to try this:

"Au Bord du Ruisseau" [Have you seen the picture called, "Scream"??? LOL I'm already doing that. I have only been learning digital painting. I don't know too much about mixing colors to get the color I want 'traditionally'. I thought I would bite the bullet, and TRY anyway. I have all to gain, and nothing to lose, except being publically humiliated by my lack of skill. *smiling* [trying to be as positive as I can] :D

I only had a 24" x 30", and I've already done the cropped sketch on the canvas. I think it fits just fine with the parts that I've placed on the canvas. I managed to get one foot and her hands in. Poor thing will be hopping around for the whole month of October. hehe

I'll try to post the sketched canvas tomorrow. I have the graphic shots now, just need to download them to my computer.

BTW, I spend a lot of my time at MSN 'The Artist's Loft', and some of the time at WC's 'Digital Painting'.

Wish me luck, and I will welcome any help I can get if I need it.

"Be Bold" [Goethe said/partial quote]..... posting here, and starting the canvas proves that I'm doing this...........confident???? *smile* will have to work on that over time.

Barbara :eek: :)

Rosic
10-04-2004, 08:58 PM
Dianne... here it is... :D I love your style.

Bruce... great sketch... can't wait to see it on canvas.

Tina... Great attitude girl! :clap: Under-painting is looking great too!

Marilyn... Welcome to WC, the Forum, and the Project! :clap:
Off to a nice start. Glad to have you on-board.

Florian... What can I say but WOW... can't wait to see this one come to life!

Jaysen... Glad you have thrown in with us!

Barb... Nice sketch... so glad to see you doing the one I picked... now I can ride your coat tails on this one. :D

Barbara... Pleased to meet you! Gald to have you joining in on the fun! ;)

Worked a couple hours on my under-painting. I can already tell this one is going to take some time.
Bern

Close-up (I can see some adjustments I need to make already :o )
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/04-Oct-2004/17108-mom10close.JPG

DLGardner
10-04-2004, 09:37 PM
Wow this is certainly the popular MOM! You guys rock!

I'll see if I can include everybody on my comments but its getting tough!

First off, Bernie that is a passionate kiss you have between those two babes. Wonderful values. Yes it is going to take long. Mine is taking longer than I've spent on a painting close to ever. But isn't it fun? I just wish there were more hours in the day and I didn't have to do anything else but paint. sigh

Welcome Barbara, and join the fun. We are looking forward to seeing your progress too.

Barb, nice sketch. You are off to a great start. I'll have to check out the website if you have the url..?

Florian...beautiful. She has such a classic look. Can't wait to see what you do with this same painting.

Biki, even if you start later, I'll follow your progress and I'm sure others will too. I know what you mean about wanting to finish what you started.

Looking forward to seeing your sketches Jaysen.

Here is mine, what I worked on today. I made a big mistake when I told you it was 16 X 20. It isn't. The canvas measures 20 X 24. I'm such a clutz.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/04-Oct-2004/8002-Boug7.jpg

Dianne

Jaysen
10-04-2004, 09:59 PM
Outline sketch on toned 36x22 in canvas.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/04-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge2.jpg

DLGardner
10-04-2004, 10:08 PM
Jaysen, what a lovely sketch!

Dianne

Rosic
10-04-2004, 10:52 PM
Jaysen... :clap: :clap: :clap:

bjs0704
10-04-2004, 11:16 PM
Barbara - Welcome to WetCanvas! and thanks for joining us!

I rarely use the same size as the original. It will probably look great!

Bernie - They look so sweet! It is going to be great!


Diane - Hereís the url to Sanders Studio. They have some really nice tutorials. He has a lot of good stuff on his website!

http://www.sanders-studios.com/

Your Bougie is looking great - your background is lovely!

Jaysen - Is your sketch transfer charcoal? It looks wonderful!

Barb Solomon :cat:

TruEnuff
10-04-2004, 11:53 PM
If you need to transfer the drawing, you could take a large sheet of tracing paper and make ďhomemade carbon paperĒ with charcoal. Then, either trace over the outline of your drawing. (You may want to protect the drawing with another sheet of tracing paper.)

The homemade carbon paper comes off more readily than bought! If you buy transfer paper check it before you use it on your painting. I had some that repelled the paint as if it were crayon and watercolor.

Barb Solomon :cat:

Barb....thank you so much. This is just the help I was looking for. I wondered about the transfer paper and its acceptance of overpainting. I think I'll just go with your suggestion and not risk it. I also appreciate the hint about overlaying another sheet to protect the drawing. Some of these things seem so obvious, but for those of us who haven't done them or been exposed to the ideas, they are little gems. Thanks also for the link to the Sanders site...I haven't read everything there, but I can see it will be a real help this month. Finally, have fun on your own WB effort....looking forward to watching it develop!

Bruce

Jaysen
10-05-2004, 08:22 AM
My sketch is with a charcoal pencil. I got about 10 of them in an art drawing kit I got when I was about 16, and still haven't used them all. I like them a lot because it's so easy to sharpen them and then very easy to transfer thought to paper/canvas. After finishing the sketch and cleaning it up quite a bit with a neaded eraser, I applied a heavy coat of krylon workeable fixative, let it dry overnight, then last night I applied a pretty thick coat of medium/light gray mixed from zinc white and ivory black. I applied it using a throwaway lint-free art rag dipped in turpentine, then smeared in the paint. After getting it put on as smooth as possible, I used a fan brush to smooth out the brush strokes. It looked pretty thick last night, but this morning I could clearly see the drawing.

I'll start on the girl's skin tonight, working from face out. The background should wait till last.

RuiFromUK
10-05-2004, 08:39 AM
Being a fan of Bouguereau I am particularly interested in seeing the works that are going to come out for this month's MOM.

So far, my goodness but you guys can paint!

Well done everyone. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Kind regards.

Rui

ps. :clap: Go Barb, Go :clap:

Carey Griffel
10-05-2004, 11:08 AM
This is a lot of fun, watching everyone come out! So far, there have been some *really* spectacular beginnings! Kudos to everyone!!

Jaysen, you said that you were doing yours slightly smaller than the original; were you able to find the size of the original somewhere?

I got my canvas this weekend--oddly enough, this is the first time I've ever bought a canvas with a particular painting in mind for it! But I've been doing quite a bit of painting lately and I've almost exhausted the pile I'd gathered. :) I'll be using a 24x36 as that's at least close to the ratio from the digital image. I'd be willing to bet that the original is larger, but I think that this'll do fine.

I've got some other painting to take care of before I begin this, but I'll be toning my canvas today (which I usually don't do because I'm in such a hurry to begin, so I'm glad that I have the chance here) and working on some preliminary things for it this week, sketches and also hopefully some color studies. I figure that most "masters" did a lot of preliminary work for their masterpieces and, while mine will be galaxies away from a masterpiece, I might as well take the opportunity to take my time and do my best!

In the meantime, I'll be watching all of you and cheering you on!!

~!Carey

Jaysen
10-05-2004, 12:54 PM
Well, no... I did email the owners of the painting to ask it's dimensions, but who knows if they'll answer. From looking at the size of the brush strokes and comparing those to other simular paintings of known size, I'd guess it to be almost life-size. So, around 48-52 inches tall.

Carey Griffel
10-05-2004, 01:25 PM
Thanks, Jaysen. Let us know if you get an answer, would you? :)

Your guess is close to what I think, too. I've got one going (well, sort of :p ) that's a good four feet tall and I'd bet that this one's pretty close to that, too.

~!Carey

Jaysen
10-05-2004, 06:56 PM
From the staff of ARC (The president of which actually owns this painting)...

Itís 34 x 52 inches
Please consider a donation to help with ARCís tax exempt and not for profit programs.

JoAnn
Executive Assistant
Art Renewal Center, 100 Markley Street, Port Reading, NJ 07064
Http://www.artrenewal.org/index.html

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, October 03, 2004 8:02 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject:

Hello, my name is Jaysen. I'm doing a study of William
Bouguereau and am about to attempt a hand painted copy of
Au Bord du Ruisseau
Translated title: At the Edge of the Brook.
1875 Oil on canvas
Collection of Fred and Sherry Ross, USA.

However, I can't seem to find the original's dimensions anywhere. Could you possibly shine some light on it? I'm guessing it's around 35x48 inches, but really don't know.

The project is located at the following link:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=219852&page=1

dcorc
10-05-2004, 07:18 PM
Good going, all - and well done Jaysen, with the size info!

Dave

dollardays
10-05-2004, 09:00 PM
Hi Everyone,

I'm fairly new to WC (have been prowling around for the past week). I've finally worked up to courage to say hello and offer my first effort. Frankly I think your all crazy (and I do believe that includes me) because copying this guy is hard! I haven't really painted for quite a few years now but I have the time and this site has really inspired me to give it a try. ohhh my camera died so I used a palm pilot to take the picture so it may not be up to par. Anyhow thanks for any comments or suggestions you might have.

Marilyn

Just want to say "hello- and welcome, Marilyn!"
Your drawing is excellent! You'll fit right in here.

Just wanted to say I love what EVERYONE is doing. I don't think I'll be joining in - I just finished mine and I am "Bougereau'd out" for the time being. He is a tough act to follow but I learned a lot of good stuff when I did mine and I am soooo glad it's done.

I will, of course, be watching all the "Masters" here. :)

________________________________
Nora

DLGardner
10-05-2004, 09:20 PM
Nora, Please cross post your Borgie over here! We would love to see it.
I believe I have fulfilled the requirements of a Bourgeareau wannabe. I add my little token to the files of oblivion. Critiques are quite welcome. Perhaps it might help those who are still struggling to mimic the master's hands.

What did I learn? If I did it over I would paint my canvas grey first and see if that helps get that gorgeous life like flesh tone that he mastered.
I would also use a bigger canvas so I could get both her feet in.

Thanks for looking guys. I'll keep an eye on yours even though I'm done.

Dianne
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/05-Oct-2004/8002-Boug8f.jpg

bravynn
10-05-2004, 10:23 PM
Thank you all for the welcome to join in the fun. Lots of great paintings begun here. *thumbs up*

I've been putting off the inevitable of reformatting my computer. It's been groaning more then usual, so I guess I'll be off for a bit. Couldn't upload my sketched canvas today like I wanted, since this is one of the foul ups occurring at the present. I'll begin working on the painting very soon, but need to get the technical woes cleared up first. Will check back in as soon as I get everything running smoothly again. See you all soon!

Barbara :-)

whispurr
10-05-2004, 11:43 PM
Evenin' everyone. Thank you all so much for the warm welcome! I've got updates on the painting, canvas size 11X14 I'm just loving this project! However I had to take two photos. I swear I'm aweful with a camera. How do you guys take photographs of your paintings and have them come out so well? Honestly, it's easier to paint the blasted thing....ok I'm calm now.

Marilyn

bjs0704
10-06-2004, 12:48 AM
Thanks Bruce!

Jaysen - It sounds great! I am looking forward to seeing how it looks.

Rui - Thanks a million!

Nora - Thanks for stopping by! The Bouguereau that you have in the Classical forum is absolutely wonderful! Though I can see that it is good to occassion do other things.

I hope that you do cross post your work - a lot of people would enjoy seeing it.

Barbara - It sounds like a frustrating day. I hope that things work out better. It will be great to see your work!

Marilyn - Your painting is looking great! The colors in her hair and skin are really nice!

I take my photos with a cheap digital camera, the work is on my easel and I have two studio lights on it. When I get the photo, I adjust the lights, darks and other colors in photoshop.

Barb Solomon :cat:

whispurr
10-06-2004, 01:10 AM
Ok per your advise I adjusted until it looks like the one on my easel. But my camera is glaring at me maliciously. It is! honest!

Marilyn

Carey Griffel
10-06-2004, 01:24 AM
Whispurr, there's some great info in the oils forum about photographing your paintings...I always take them outside and do not use the flash; mine still never turn out looking like the painting, but *shrug* I do my best. :) Your painting is looking *excellent*, by the way!!

Jaysen, thanks for that info! That's cool that you got a response.

~!Carey

RuiFromUK
10-06-2004, 02:49 AM
Hi Dianne,

Congratulations on your interpretation of Bouguereau's painting. I love it.

It is only the 6th of the month and you have worked very fast and very well.

Kind regards.

Rui

Biki
10-06-2004, 05:08 AM
Dianne - simply superb work.!! You are so fast.!
You must have the time to keep going.

Marilyn also - wonderful start - very impressive.

I wanted to point you all to a post i saw on nellearte forum - but the server is down. It was a lady named Bessie who was showing her WB copies which were stunning.
I hope i remember tomorrow when it is up again.

hoping to catch up with you soon. :rolleyes: :wave:

Florian
10-06-2004, 07:31 AM
Great work everyone. :clap:

Dianne, you are so fast will you do more then one this month. I like what you have so far, itís great.

Marilyn, WOW excellent!

Hereís a little progress. I worked on the flowers and the blouse.

Florian

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2004/39426-Ruisseau_2.jpg

Squib
10-06-2004, 08:22 AM
Hi All, :wave:

I decided to join you on this one - although I still have a "faceless" merry drinker on the shelf above me. A constant reminder of my need to FINISH things ! I have always loved Bouguereau's work, so couldn't resist this. Time is my big problem - I have so much on the go.

AMAZING work from everyone so far :clap: :clap: . I can't comment on each one individually at the moment, but will later. Well done Jaysen on getting the size of the Au Bord - BIG painting, and its always been one of my favourites of his, so here goes.

I made a start last night - 20 x 30, just a turpsy wash, burnt umber and burnt sienna. I need to work a bit more on this before I start with colour. I always seem to make a good start with an underpainting, and then mess up when it comes to the face. So I'll be watching you all closely to see how you've done it. Dianne, your girl is looking beautiful already.

Back later when I've done more, and have more time to comment on everyones work.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2004/35948-AB.JPG

Rosic
10-06-2004, 10:06 AM
Jaysen... You Da Man! :clap:

Dianne... Congrats! Excellent work! Love the BG too! :clap:

Barbara... Maybe today will be better. :wink2:

Marilyn... You are doing a great job!

Florian... Love those folds!

Squib... Looking good!

Hope to paint some more today...
Bern

TruEnuff
10-06-2004, 10:23 AM
I simply can't believe the quality of the work in this thread....and particularly this forum. And it seems like every day, yet another fantastic WIP drops in out of the blue. For cryin' out loud you people! Give a guy a break! I'm still working on my drawing!!!

Squib.....it's just plain depressing to think you did that in one evening. Wow.

Florian...I am watching yours with special interest. You are using a technique that I have never tried. I'm fascinated to watch your painting emerge. Wonderful work and a day by day lesson for me.

Dianne....I simply love your finished painting. It's exquisite....anyone would be thrilled to have that hanging in their home. I don't have the training or experience to be able to say what it is that works so well, but it seems to me there is a real harmony of color and value..the painting just comes together as a complete and integrated whole. There's a mood too..... I like this one....no other way to put it. Congratulations.

There's so many others to comment on too.....but if I dwell on this too long I'll go into a funk and quit on my own! (Just kidding....I'm determined to push this to the end...the bitter end probably!)

Keep Painting!

Bruce

Rosic
10-06-2004, 10:52 AM
....I'm determined to push this to the end...the bitter end probably!
Bruce
Now that's the SPIRIT Bruce! :clap:

dollardays
10-06-2004, 12:40 PM
Nora, Please cross post your Borgie over here! We would love to see it.
I believe I have fulfilled the requirements of a Bourgeareau wannabe. I add my little token to the files of oblivion. Critiques are quite welcome. Perhaps it might help those who are still struggling to mimic the master's hands.

Here it is- it took me over 30 hours- aaaghhh! So you can see why I wouldn't want to do another right away. Your interpretation is truly beautiful, Dianne- the eyes especially- have that Bougie look. :)

Jeunnes Bohemiennes- cropped to 18 x 24

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/05-Oct-2004/3589-jeunes-bohemiennes-copy-17.jpg

Jaysen
10-06-2004, 01:13 PM
Excellent work, Nora. Now that's a painting I would want hanging in my house. You really created something beautifull with that painting and I for one believe that it was worth the 30 hours. Now, imagine doing some 700 very simular paintings in a row....

bjs0704
10-06-2004, 01:16 PM
Marilyn - I am guessing, but check if 1) are the lights of equal strenghth, 2)are they about 45 degrees from the painting 3) equal distance from the painting.

Iím not really a photographer, but I hope that this helps.

Your painting is looking really lovely today! It is going to look so neat!

Bicki - That does sound like an interesting web site! I hope that you will post it.

Florian - I love your lights and shadows! You are really off on a good start!

Lorraine - Your underpainting is really beautiful! The girls expression is very good!

I had to laugh when you mentioned your half finished MOMís. I need to finish my ďmerry drinkerĒ and my Hopper house is looking as if the poor old abandoned house has lost half of its windows. When I finish that, there are probably five other painting to finish. (This can be a really bad habit! ;) :D )

Dollardays - Your colors are incredible! Your skin tones and facial expressions are also marvelous! You have done a really wonderful job!

Bruce - It sounds as if you are doing pretty good! I always have to stay patient when I am drawing out my paintings. There is so much temptation to jump in and paint, but the time spent drawing carefully usually saves time in the long run. It is good to hear that you are giving it a good shot! I am looking forward to seeing your painting.

Barb Solomon :cat:

Carey Griffel
10-06-2004, 03:41 PM
I've been working on some preparatory schtuff for my painting today and looking at everyone's beginnings here in detail; we've got some really good work going here!!

Florian, your works are all pretty darn incredible and this is no exception!

Squib, you've got a *great* start on yours; I hope that mine can look half as good. ;)

Bern, yours is going great, too...I just have one small suggestion to watch the girl's nose. As it is now, having her nose so defined (and I think it's a bit too big), she looks more like an adult. I've noticed in my own work how hard children can be to get them to look like children. ;)

Bruce, I'll be interested to see yours!

Barb, you've got a great start with yours, too, looking forward to more!

I've got my canvas all toned and ready to go; it'll just be a matter of starting sometime, though it may not be until well into next week as it's a long weekend! Yay! :) :clap:

~!Carey

loop
10-06-2004, 04:11 PM
I havenot done anything to mine, but NEEDed to chime in and let everyone know how awesome these are already... I agree quite intimidating this bunch of painters are... GOOD Going ... BOY oh BOY are his value transitions subtle or what. half steps mabey ??

Rosic
10-06-2004, 04:23 PM
Bern, yours is going great, too...I just have one small suggestion to watch the girl's nose. As it is now, having her nose so defined (and I think it's a bit too big), she looks more like an adult. I've noticed in my own work how hard children can be to get them to look like children. ;)
~!Carey
Thanks Carey... I've been wondering what "just wasn't right" about it. A little off angle too. Worked some more today... mostly on the boy and will attend to that sweet little girls face soon. Great thing about under-painting... you can work it until you get it right.

Is anyone else (besides me and Tina) using an grisaille underpainting? The reason I ask is I wondering what colors you plan to glaze in to get these exquisite Bouggie skin tones.

Bern

Jaysen
10-06-2004, 08:20 PM
I can never see my mistakes till I post the pics here, so here goes...

I know I still have "a long row to hoe."

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge3a.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge3b.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge3c.jpg

Yep, as I thought, I already see several problems with the nose and lips. Of course, I still have a lot of work to do on the eyes... or more specificly, the ocular cavities. Basically, I struggled all night trying to get the skin tones to even remotely match the picture. I struggled a lot till I remembered my original game plan, and then things seemed to fall into place. Still have a lot to do, but I think I've figured out the coloring.

Rosic
10-06-2004, 10:07 PM
Jaysen.... :clap: Looking good my friend!

I got to paint some today... :D
latest update...

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2004/17108-mom103.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Oct-2004/17108-mom103close.JPG

Biki
10-07-2004, 06:37 AM
Bicki - That does sound like an interesting web site! I hope that you will post it.


Barb Solomon :cat:

the site is back up again Barb - so here it is:

http://nellarteforum.com/index.php?showtopic=26&st=30

i don't know how this will show up, but look to page #3 for the reference from Bessie.

loop
10-07-2004, 08:14 AM
Dianne, you are so fast will you do more then one this month.[/IMG]



I thought we had to do all 5 ??


Florian, yours is looking like you are using the same technique that the big B used himself, no underpainting, start a the face, not layered, are you looking to go back or is this "ali-prema" . it looks really super,

dcorc
10-07-2004, 08:27 AM
I thought we had to do all 5 ?

No, but we're all expecting you to do all 5 ! :D :evil: :p

Dave

Squib
10-07-2004, 08:44 AM
LOL

loop
10-07-2004, 09:51 AM
No, but we're all expecting you to do all 5 ! :D :evil: :p

Dave

actually, I thought I had to do 6 :p

dcorc
10-07-2004, 10:00 AM
actually, I thought I had to do 6 :p

Yes, but that one's almost finished anyway, so it doesn't really count! (think of it as being like the 6th replicant in BladeRunner ;) - how's that for movie-nerdy :p )

Dave

DLGardner
10-07-2004, 10:19 AM
:wave: I seem to have missed some posts way back when. Thanks everyone for commenting on my finished piece. This thread is so active a few hours away from the computer puts you way behind!

If I am finished with the portrait I am doing before the end of the month I'll try and do another one. I'm not doing five I know that. Dave...your nuts!

Everyone is doing remarkably well. I wish we had a real gallery. Wouldn't it be fun to put all these up in their own room on the wall so you can see them side by side?

Dianne

Florian
10-07-2004, 10:38 AM
Rosic, Bruce, Barb, Cary, Loop, thank you for your comments and interests.

Loop, I donít know if itís the same technique that used the big B., with this painting I just tray to find a technique which work for me and which I will use for my own future paintings. Itís not finished what I have so far, I have to go back and work on shadows and lights.

Squib, this is coming along very nice it looks really good.

Nora, excellent work I like the skin tones and the childís expression. Very well done, you can be pride of it.

Jason, good start, I like your skin tones.

Bernie, looking good so far. Iím watching yours with interest spatially the glazing.

Florian

TruEnuff
10-07-2004, 10:50 AM
:
Everyone is doing remarkably well. I wish we had a real gallery. Wouldn't it be fun to put all these up in their own room on the wall so you can see them side by side?
Dianne

You know Dianne...that's a fascinating idea. I do get frustrated that WIP postings quickly get lost in all the messages. Don't get me wrong, I love the activity here, but it sure would be nice to be able to see the work in one spot uninterrupted. Would it be possible to have a thread where only the WIP's were placed? It would have to be something that only the guides or moderators could post to...essentially moving the pictures from the posts here to the WIP thread. Probably not practical...but wouldn't that be great?

Bruce

bjs0704
10-07-2004, 12:58 PM
Loop - I totally agree with you! The value scale in this is incredibly tight!

I may just go ahead and post my latest, even though it is in a ungainlly mid way stage. I tried to do a grisaille of the clouds. The lightest light isnít a white, but a light gray, it is also very easy to get too dark in the shadows of the clouds. The value range is very tight and subtle. It is very tricky to mix!

Bernie - I am sort of following the Sanders website which does a modified grisaille, they add touches of brown and blue to the grisaille. The more I look at this painting, the more it looks like that is what Bougie did originally.

Your painting is looking so good! It looks like you are ahead of me!

Jaysen - You are off to a good start! I really like your skintones!

Biki - I never did suceed in finding Bessieís painting, but thanks for letting me know about a really good forum!

Diane - Should we try to set up a ďgallery viewĒ (a photoshop 4-up composite view of the project?)

Barb Solomon :cat:

Jaysen
10-07-2004, 03:35 PM
For a really awesome gray, especially for skin tones, try a pellet of raw umber with a dab of prussian blue. Mix that well, then add a little of it to a pile of lead white. With varying degrees of blue, you can get a pretty nice looking tan/gray color to use as a base for skin tones.

Carey Griffel
10-07-2004, 07:28 PM
Thanks for the suggestion, Jaysen! I'll definitely be trying that out, I think. :)

~!Carey

Jaysen
10-07-2004, 08:26 PM
Wow... have you ever had the feeling when you start painting that your just spinning your wheels waiting for that magic moment when the goddess of art touches your soul and turns on your creativeness?

Well, that's what I was doing tonight.... waiting, and doodling, and generally just messing up my painting...

Then, along comes my 18 month old son and he stuck his hand right on the painting and started to rearrange the composition for me while I was in the bathroom. I came back and after about 10 minutes of moping around started scrubbing the paint off with a rag....

Low and behold.... (and here my neck hairs stood on end) the resultant hue was very very close to what I had been trying to do. Then it hit me!! [email protected]!

I've been trying to paint a grayish/flesh tone all night, failing to mix it up right when it was right there in friggin front of me!!! THE CANVAS IS GRAY [email protected]!! DUH! Using this gestaldt I applied my brain a little and mixed up a pinkflesh with a greyflesh and sorta drybrushed it onto the canvas with no medium. BAMM BAMM SLAMM, there was the color I had been looking for!! I finished the base of the arms and feet and went back and redid the face some. Man, the muse works in mysterious ways, this time with my Rembrandt in a diaper.

I was so excited that I decided to right this up before finishing tonight's session. Here's a quick pic.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/07-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge4A.jpg

DLGardner
10-07-2004, 09:36 PM
Goodness Jaysen, that sounds like quite the revelation! Sometimes it takes the simple to confound the wise, doesn't it?

I came back and after about 10 minutes of moping around started scrubbing the paint off with a rag....

I hope some of that included what your little tyke walked away with. Sounds like he might have changed the color of his skin as well.

You do have a nice flesh tone here. Congratulations. I'm definately going to try the grey background on my next portrait.

Bear in mind also that flesh is relevant to its surroundings and even though someone looks a certain color in once place, there is going to be subtle differences with outside changes. Clothes reflect color on skin, weather changes it, sunlight, lack of sunlight. I think that is why people have such a hard time getting a good flesh tone-because there isn't just one flesh tone. Even your hands are different color than your face. And the cheeks on your face are different than your nose. And even then at different temperatures. You can say a lot by changing the hues on the skin. So be careful looking for the 'perfect' flesh tone.

I'm glad you were able to get past that block though Jaysen. Do post the whole picture soon. I'm curious.

Dianne

DLGardner
10-07-2004, 09:52 PM
You know Dianne...that's a fascinating idea. I do get frustrated that WIP postings quickly get lost in all the messages. Don't get me wrong, I love the activity here, but it sure would be nice to be able to see the work in one spot uninterrupted. Would it be possible to have a thread where only the WIP's were placed? It would have to be something that only the guides or moderators could post to...essentially moving the pictures from the posts here to the WIP thread. Probably not practical...but wouldn't that be great?
I don't know if its possible. We'll have to ask our moderator friends. That's the one thing that the Project forum has an advantage with-being able to post a "gallery" for the images to be viewed side by side all on one page. It'd be nice.

Dianne

Jaysen
10-07-2004, 10:37 PM
Okay, done for the night. I've reached the point of deminishing returns.

There's still something fundamentally wrong with the drawing of the face, and I can't place it. It'll come to me eventually.

Comments and critiques welcome as usual.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/07-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge4B.jpg

Carey Griffel
10-07-2004, 10:59 PM
Jaysen, looking good! Nice skin tones and I like what you've done with her blouse already. I'm probably not the one to be handing out advice :rolleyes: and I don't know how much of it is the picture/monitor/whatever...but her face does seem to be...askew. I rather think that her lips need to be tilted more to be in line with her eyes. Or something. I think that you've got a good likeness in each feature, but the features just aren't quite lining up right. This may have a lot to do with the shadows, etc... Also, maybe her face is too wide? The eyebrows/eyes should be extremely close to her hair. And her eye on our left should be closer to the eyebrow (or maybe the eyebrow should be closer to the eye?). Like I said, I'm not the best to give such advice, but I hope that it helps maybe kinda sorta a little...because I know for a fact that I'll need this same type of help when I approach mine!! I'm *horrible* at achieveing likenesses.

Actually, I began my sketch tonight, but I'm not sure how far I want to take the drawing. I doubt I'll work on it until next week, though.

~!Carey

Jaysen
10-07-2004, 11:16 PM
Jaysen, looking good! Nice skin tones and I like what you've done with her blouse already. I'm probably not the one to be handing out advice :rolleyes: and I don't know how much of it is the picture/monitor/whatever...but her face does seem to be...askew. I rather think that her lips need to be tilted more to be in line with her eyes. Or something. I think that you've got a good likeness in each feature, but the features just aren't quite lining up right. This may have a lot to do with the shadows, etc... Also, maybe her face is too wide? The eyebrows/eyes should be extremely close to her hair. And her eye on our left should be closer to the eyebrow (or maybe the eyebrow should be closer to the eye?). Like I said, I'm not the best to give such advice, but I hope that it helps maybe kinda sorta a little...because I know for a fact that I'll need this same type of help when I approach mine!! I'm *horrible* at achieveing likenesses.

Actually, I began my sketch tonight, but I'm not sure how far I want to take the drawing. I doubt I'll work on it until next week, though.

~!Carey

Thanks a bunch for the help. Lord knows I need it.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/07-Oct-2004/46838-collage.JPG

TruEnuff
10-07-2004, 11:33 PM
Jaysen....
I don't think the face is that far off....If I may, I would suggest just a couple minor tweeks....

--her right eye is not looking at the viewer...it is drifting down and to her right. If you bring the pupil up and to the center that should help. You might have to restructure the area surrounding the eye a little at the same time, bringing everything slightly up and toward the center.

--the right side of her face continues downward a little farther - to the shoulder/neck intersection almost - before it begins the slope of the jaw toward the chin. The jaw line in your painting starts just below the eye.

--the line through the eyes and the mouth needs to be at a right angle to the line vertically through the nose and center of the face. Right now it seems like each is on a slightly skewed line.....the mouth especially.

None of these strike me as big fixes....I think they will bring the likeness right back...which really is close right now.

Nice work so far...and I like your story about the skin tones and your studio helper!

Keep going...you are giving me inspiration!!

Bruce

guillot
10-08-2004, 12:00 AM
Bernie ! Yours is coming along very nicely!! (I think we are alone with the grisaille thing :) ) I'm waiting for mine to dry so that I can go back and key up the lights. ;)

I've been sick ALL WEEK and have been peeking in here and there but come back tonight and WOW look at you guys and gals!!!!! What a tremendous effort on everyone's part. Just wonderful !!!

Dianne - love your finished piece and congrats on the portrait commission!!

dollardays - lovely!! 30 hours, wow. I know I've spent more than that on mine (that's of course counting from the time I started the thing about a year and a half ago) - but thanks for this MOM for the push I needed.

Jaysen - don't fret - just paint :) It's coming along nicely and I don't think you're far off the mark myself ;)

Barb - you have a nice beginning on yours as well!

Gees - I can't keep up with everyone !! I'll have to go back and see who I've missed. Must be the Nyquil :evil:

FANTASTIC EVERYONE!!!! :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

Tina

DLGardner
10-08-2004, 01:03 AM
Jaysen, thanks for putting those altogether! Was it hard? Can you do it with the completed ones too! Cool!

And your gal looks great. You'll get it right. The trick to getting a likeness is getting the shadows right. Once you get where the light hits and the reflective light hits on the face, you will get a likeness. You are really close and I know you're not done.

Good job! Ditto what Tina said.

Dianne

TruEnuff
10-08-2004, 01:12 AM
So while all the talented painters in here are turning out beautiful work, I labor on my drawing. I think I've gone as far as I can....time to quit stalling and start painting. Actually I have never made such a thorough sketch for a painting before, and I think it was worthwhile. Of course, the proof will be in the painting, but right now I feel like I know where some of the challenges will be because of the time spent on the drawing....

Here's the full size drawing.....18" x 24" .....close to the original WB. I'll use the suggestion I got here to transfer it to canvas as the next step...

Bruce

Jaysen
10-08-2004, 01:16 AM
Thanks for the critiques everyone, I greatly appreciate it. I've done a little knife work with your suggestions in mind and I can see the likeness peeking through again.

Nice drawing True... That was my second choice of subjects. I love the playfull expression and you have captured it well.

Carey Griffel
10-08-2004, 01:55 AM
You're more than welcome, Jaysen, I hope that it helps. I think that Bruce is right. The thing that always amazes me with likenesses is that just the *slightest* fix can make *huge* differences. I think that's what makes it so gosh darn hard! Oh, and that's just so darn cool to see all those progress shots together!

Bruce, that is such a beautiful drawing! How long did that take you to do? I'm sure that it will make a difference in your painting, if only because you've already spent all those hours looking and getting familiar with the original. That's been the basic point of my own sketches, etc.

~!Carey

Florian
10-08-2004, 03:52 AM
Bruce, your drawing is really beautiful, I never did such a detailed drawing before I started a painting. Looking forward to see this in colours.

Jaysen, nice skin tones. Very interesting to see all works together.

Now, I worked on the blouse and the pinafore dress. The colour of the pinafore dress seems to be blue in the picture, but in the painting it isnít, itís violet. My digital camera shows the violet colours in a bluish ton, I donít know if itís a problem with my camera or itís a general problem of digital cameras.
Does anyone have the same problem?

Florian

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/08-Oct-2004/39426-Ruisseau_3.jpg

Squib
10-08-2004, 04:00 AM
Thanks for all your nice comments. Wow, everyone is doing so well. :clap: :clap: But what a wonderful choice of paintings to copy. I LOVE Bouguerou, and it has always been one of my lifelong wishes to see one of his paintings "in the flesh". My painting might be the nearest I ever get - LOL.

Jaysen, great start. I had to laugh at the thought of your precious babe with his fingers on the masterpiece ! I'm going to try your colour mix for the grey - LATER ! I'll leave the face till last, as usual. I'm always too scared to do it. I keep telling myself to paint faces in the same way I paint anything i.e. look for shapes, blocks of colour, darks, lights, etc. and NOT see it as a face - but I get stagefright as soon as I start mixing flesh colours.

Nora, your work is beautiful.

Florian - amazing.

Bruce - wow, what a drawing.

Dianne - I love your style of working. Something I'm aiming for.

As Dianne says, its so hard to keep up with the work going on here, but everyone seems to be making excellent progress. :clap: :clap: :clap:

My update - roughly painted in the background - more to do on that today. Then started her clothing. My values are a bit off at this stage - I need to darken some areas and lighten others. I need her blouse to dry then I can lighten the left side. A long way to go. Don't want to rush it, but I'd like to do another one this month. I have to FINISH this one !!!! She will NOT be another faceless painting left on my shelf. (I have a LOT of those).

The colour may be slightly off in this photo. I'll try to get a better photo later when the day brightens up a bit.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/08-Oct-2004/35948-ab2.JPG

Just had to show you the beautiful sunrise we had this morning.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/08-Oct-2004/35948-sunrise.JPG

Yvettochka
10-08-2004, 05:23 AM
Folks

Thank you all for these projects and letting the newbies like me to look at your WIPs and learn

Well, I braced myself and decided to participate this month. Le Crepuscule has always been one of my favorites of Bouguerau. If I don't mess it up would also like to try La Tricoteuse.

The photo needs 2 degree rotation which I haven't been able to master somehow...

Well... It is a 1.5 hour value study. Oil on 30 x 55 cm canvas. Would be very greatful for your comments and critique...

Yv

Yvettochka
10-08-2004, 05:26 AM
the file attached this time

y

Rosic
10-08-2004, 08:35 AM
Bernie ! (I think we are alone with the grisaille thing :) )
Tina
I think you are right Tina... :D

WOW... Impressive everybody... :clap:
Yesterday must have been a busy painting day for us all!

Lorraine... thanks for the beautiful sunrise.

Yv... glad you joined us... with your pick... we now have the complete set! :D


Latest update... still haven't re-worked the little girls face yet (began on that last night)...
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/08-Oct-2004/17108-mom104close.JPG

Rosic
10-08-2004, 08:41 AM
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/08-Oct-2004/39426-Ruisseau_3.jpg
Florian... I would love to see you give a demo on fabric folds someday... these are exquisite! Actually the whole piece is!
Bern

Jaysen
10-08-2004, 09:52 AM
Yes, please give us some insight on how you made your dress look so awesome.

Carey Griffel
10-08-2004, 10:37 AM
Florian, it's amazing how you make what you have painted look entirely three-dimentional, popping out of the two-dimentional canvas! I couldn't imagine getting such precision!

Nice to have you, Yvettochka!

Squib, yours is coming along splendidly! I know what that fear is, believe me. :D But I also know that it's best tackled by jumping in paint brush first!

~!Carey

dcorc
10-08-2004, 01:00 PM
I thought this would be an active month! :)

There's lots of great work going on here, and it's interesting to see the various different approaches being adopted.

Here's a further update on mine - first chance I had to paint all week - just building gradually - I don't think this is how WB did it :rolleyes: - using W&N Artist oils, and Michael Harding Flake White.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/08-Oct-2004/30792-dcabdr5.jpg

Dave

Rosic
10-08-2004, 02:01 PM
Looks great Dave!
Yes... great participation and variety this month!
I for one... am glad to be back!
Bern

Worked a little more..
Re-worked the little girl's face.
About ten hours into this one so far.

Jaysen
10-08-2004, 02:41 PM
One more update. My picture makes the girl look a little more happy than in the original, even with the corrections. There's still a problem with the lips, but I'm tired of it now. I worked for a while on the skirt trying to match the medium tone. I think I'll have to add some blue to the highlighted areas. The flowers were fun, first time I've used cadmium red.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/08-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge5.jpg

Rosic
10-08-2004, 02:46 PM
Looks like the Boys from Jacksonville have been busy! :D

FYI... Jaysen and I live in the same town. :wave:
Bern

Looks good Jaysen!

Jaysen
10-08-2004, 03:10 PM
Yours too. The grissaile is looking very detailed and realistic. Are you ready for colors yet? Going to wait for the gray to completely set before glazing?

When we're done, we need to meet up somewhere to compare notes.

Rosic
10-08-2004, 04:28 PM
Yours too. The grissaile is looking very detailed and realistic.
Thanks.

Are you ready for colors yet?
Gotta finish the girls body and fabric first.


Going to wait for the gray to completely set before glazing?
Yep.. that drying time I plan to work on the BG more. In between glazes I plan to work on my Jesus portrait.


When we're done, we need to meet up somewhere to compare notes.
Sounds great! I look forward to it.
Bern

guillot
10-08-2004, 05:14 PM
Florian - your painting is just remarkable!!!! I'm enjoying watching her emerge from the canvas, and the foldwork in the clothing is superb!!

Bernie - Looking fabulous!! That's OK - we'll just be a little different :wink2: Will be interesting to see the outcome, and another learning experience behind us :)

Jaysen - wonderful job so far!!! She's coming alive right before our very eyes. Pat yourself on the back and keep going!!

Bruce - what's going on?? :) How is your's coming along? Excellent so far!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dave, dave, dave ! :clap: Love how your painting is coming along. How many of these are you going to do? I would like to do one more - wish I could do two more :D .

Squib - Look at you!! She's coming along wonderfully. Remarkable sunrise too !!

I know I've forgotten someone :D

What a wonderful collection of paintings so far. This is an active month!!! Great stuff!!!!!!!

Now - I need to make up my mind what #2 will be while that underpainting is drying and get started on it. Hmmmmm ..... which one?

Thanks,
Tina

Jaysen
10-08-2004, 06:42 PM
Jaysen, great start. I had to laugh at the thought of your precious babe with his fingers on the masterpiece ! I'm going to try your colour mix for the grey - LATER ! I'll leave the face till last, as usual. I'm always too scared to do it. I keep telling myself to paint faces in the same way I paint anything i.e. look for shapes, blocks of colour, darks, lights, etc. and NOT see it as a face - but I get stagefright as soon as I start mixing flesh colours.


This is how I paint/draw faces... I start with a vague picture, basically what you said, painting shapes and colors just like painting an apple or anything else. Then, after adjustments like I'm doing now, you start to see the person emerging from the sketch. If you've studied the subject enough, you will start to SEE the face superimposed onto the canvas in your mind's eye. Then, you start making very minor adjustments to make the canvas match your mental picture until they are in sync. Then, you can really stare at teh picture more than the subject. I've just gotten to that stage with the girl, but it could fall back to a previous stage with one mistake.

bjs0704
10-08-2004, 07:53 PM
Jaysen - That is a really nice sounding color combination for the cooler skin tones. What do you usually use for the warmer skin tones. I have been using yellow ochre, red ochre and white (leaded or unleaded depending on my preferences that day).

Your skin tones are looking good. I would necessarily worry too much right now, but the skin tones look all of a similar value. Is there a slightly darker dark in the original? I know that Mr. Bís value range is close together!

The folds in the blouse are beautifully done!

Thanks for showing the gallery view! It is SO interesting to see them together and see the variety of approaches!

Tina - Iím sorry to hear that you have not been feeling good! I hope that you get better soon!

Bruce - That is a truly wonderful drawing! Very well done!

Florian - The folds in her clothing are fantastic!

Lorraine - Your painting is coming along beautifully - her skirt looks great!

That is such a lovely sunrise! Thanks for letting us see it!

Yvettochka - Your painting is lovely! I love your colors!

Bernie- They are both looking great!

Dave - Your painting is progressing nicely! Your background looks wonderful - I love the colors!

Barb Solomon :cat:

bjs0704
10-08-2004, 07:59 PM
Everybody's work has been looking so good!:cool:

I have been busy trying to get a grisaille of the clouds in the background. The values are so very close together! Next I will get the wings and the purple drapery.

Barb Solomon :cat:

whispurr
10-08-2004, 08:01 PM
I've negelected to mention how great all the work in this forum has been. I'm so blown away by it all. My kids are sick of me saying , come look there an update! hehehe

here's the next installment of the painting. Still have a lot of work to do on her most especially her right hand I've considered toning the highlights , cheeks and brows, but I do kinda like it bright... what do you guys think?

guillot
10-08-2004, 08:28 PM
whispurr - I like it!!! You really captured that seductive smirk thing she has going on, LOL !!!

Barb - Thanks, feeling better. Your painting is coming along quite nicely too!! I feel like I'm saying the same thing to everyone :o Everyone is just doing so wonderfully!! I'm blown away at everyone's work!!!!!!

Tina

Jaysen
10-08-2004, 08:28 PM
Oh wow, very nice. Ensure that your pic's right hand is of correct dimensions. The heel of the palm looks a little too wide, but that could just be a trick of the shading. Otherwise, the drawing is exquisite. You've also done a great job on coloration of the skin. The original has some Very complex shading throughout the painting and I applaud your efforts so far. How are you planning to pull it all together? Blend while still wet or glaze?

Jaysen
10-08-2004, 08:39 PM
Jaysen - That is a really nice sounding color combination for the cooler skin tones. What do you usually use for the warmer skin tones. I have been using yellow ochre, red ochre and white (leaded or unleaded depending on my preferences that day).

Your skin tones are looking good. I would necessarily worry too much right now, but the skin tones look all of a similar value. Is there a slightly darker dark in the original? I know that Mr. Bís value range is close together!

The folds in the blouse are beautifully done!

Thanks for showing the gallery view! It is SO interesting to see them together and see the variety of approaches!


Well, this is only my third color painting, so I really don't have a repoitoire of skin tones, hehe. I've been going off a book's color charts that I scanned a while back. Basically, for light skin tones, it had suggested starting with a base of burnt sienna and zinc white, then adding one other color from a long list, making a pile for each different one. What I found is that I ended up having to mix these separate piles to get any good results, so I started my own combos. Of course, that color chart wasn't meant to be thinly painted onto a cool gray canvas, it was meant for white canvas. So, I had to completely rethink everything. I found that paint that looked bluish gray on my pallete looked sorta tan on the canvas and any red at all tended to multiply on the canvas.

As to your question about dark values, your absolutely correct. I wanted to get the tones down before I started to add the darkest values. I've read in several sources that it's always best to hold the darkest and very lightest values until the end of the painting when everything else is perfect. That makes sense to me, because those values need to be put down and left alone, not fiddled with or glazed. So, I have no really darks on the face. As for the arms, I haven't gotten to shading or working the fingers yet. I was so excited about the base color, that I left it at that. I'll add in some modelling shadows and some extra colors for the purplish/rouge hands and fingers in the future.

Did you happen to see the portrait WIP I posted in WOYE? Doesn't my brother look like Freddy Krueger? hehehe.

whispurr
10-08-2004, 08:57 PM
I think glazing is the way to go on this one. But I have all these corrections to make. whine. Actually I found the whole thing deceptively complex. funny how you don't LOOK at a painting until you have to paint it!

bjs0704
10-08-2004, 11:54 PM
whispurr - Your color and sense of light are wonderful in this painting! It is very good!:clap::clap:

You may be right, while it may be brighter than the original, goes very well together!

Tina - Thanks! It is always good to get some encouragement!

Jaysen - I like the combination of burnt sienna and white for skin tones too. (I think that I once read that it was one of Rubenís favorites for skin tones.)

I have had many days like the one that you are describing! :)

I havenít yet checked the WOYEís yet! But now I am going to HAVE to SEE THIS! It sounds as if you had a blast doing the portrait! ;)

Barb Solomon :cat:

dollardays
10-09-2004, 09:18 AM
Just had to show you the beautiful sunrise we had this morning.

Lorraine: That is truly a beautiful sunrise. thanks for posting it. I love the intensity of your colors- your painting is turning out wonderful!

Florian: Your painting is beyond great- the fabric is especially lovely, but I bet her face will catch up soon. (Watch her right eye- appears just a tad bigger than the left)

Dave: Lovely- coming along wonderfully. I am going to run out of adjectives, I think.

Bernie: You're going to have a very special reproduction here- it's very true to the original. I love it.

Bruce: What can I say? If the painting turns out as well as the drawing you are home free. What an eye for detail.

Jaysen: Lovely beginning- can't wait to see the end.

Hope I didn't miss anyone - they are all all coming along wonderfully! I am sooo hooked on this thread. Thank you all for taking the time to post your progress pictures.

And now, on a less successful note: What happens when you copy a Bougereau and you hate it so much you decide to work on it for another three hours? You give up and "clownize" her! Oh -- and add a conservative sweater so she appears less angelic, although I might have just accomplished that with the less than pretty flesh tones. :evil:

Well this is what happened to me. Please don't try this yourself, folks, unless you have a good supply of violet and turquoise paint.

_______________________________________
Nora

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/09-Oct-2004/3589-compare.jpg

TruEnuff
10-09-2004, 11:39 AM
And now, on a less successful note: What happens when you copy a Bougereau and you hate it so much you decide to work on it for another three hours? You give up and "clownize" her! Oh -- and add a conservative sweater so she appears less angelic, although I might have just accomplished that with the less than pretty flesh tones. :evil:

Well this is what happened to me. Please don't try this yourself, folks, unless you have a good supply of violet and turquoise paint.

_______________________________________
Nora

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/09-Oct-2004/3589-compare.jpg

Nora.....I surely understand the frustration that can overwhelm you...I've wiped off more than one WIP! But, honestly, I can't imagine what you found lacking in your study. You were totally successful in nearly every aspect. You captured the facial expression perfectly and, unless it is held beside the Bougereau, there is little or nothing to criticize. Everyone struggles to duplicate the way WB painted flesh color and tones....if we set that as the pass or fail standard, we'd all be in trouble! I also saw the other WB that you did, and it blew me away....again a completely successful painting. You are too hard on yourself. Nice work in my humble opinion.

Bruce

TruEnuff
10-09-2004, 11:43 AM
Whispurr...
As you might know, I selected this same Bougereau to attempt....after seeing how yours is developing, I'm starting to wish I hadn't. Really nice job! Wonderful colors. I was also struck by how dark the original really is when you study it. I like the lighter approach....seems almost more lifelike. Great job!

Bruce

Jaysen
10-09-2004, 12:03 PM
10 pages of 150 posts and almost 2,400 views and we are only on the first week of the month. I have to say this is the most popular MOM yet, and it's all because of the vast wealth of talent here. I just scrolled throught the whole thread again and looked at the work and comments. I think we're really working on some good synergy, learning from each other and becoming better as a group.

DLGardner
10-09-2004, 01:22 PM
Nora, these are both gorgeous. You are too hard on yourself.
Next time you are frustrated, turn the painting around and walk away and don't come back for at least a day. Then when you do come back don't look at the reference photo, but just look at your painting and see if it has any worth standing on its own. These do.

I think you are very passionate in your painting. Perhaps you are trying too hard to do photo realism. Your style is different. You don't need to copy exactly. You interpret. Its beautiful!

Dianne

Rosic
10-09-2004, 03:10 PM
Tina... thanks... I'm looking forward to the glazing process too.

Barb... Looking great... thanks for your kind words and support.

Whispur... You have just fallen right in with us... yours looks great! Shows plenty of talent. :wink2:

Jaysen... definitely been a busy thread... I'm so glad I got back into it this month.

Nora... You are to kind... your encouragement is so uplifting to me. Let me do the same for you by saying... "Quit beating yourself up"... yours looks great and has been a learning experience for you and ME... a success in my book.

Got a busy weekend planned... hope I can paint some... :D

Bernie

Florian
10-09-2004, 04:27 PM
Hey friends, thanks for all your comments.



Florian... I would love to see you give a demo on fabric folds someday... these are exquisite! Actually the whole piece is!
Bern
Bern, Iím glad you like it. Yes, if some people are interested I will do a demo how I paint fabric folds, just have to find a painting which will be ideal.




Florian: Your painting is beyond great- the fabric is especially lovely, but I bet her face will catch up soon. (Watch her right eye- appears just a tad bigger than the left)
Nora, Iíll start with the flesh tones on Sunday, because I mostly paint in the evening under neon light and I like to do this soft flesh tones under natural daylight . You are right about the right eye, Iíll fix it on the next layer.

I like your WB copy, the flesh tones are great. I agree with the others, you are to hart to your self. I followed all of your WB- paintings and I like all of them.



10 pages of 150 posts and almost 2,400 views and we are only on the first week of the month. I have to say this is the most popular MOM yet, and it's all because of the vast wealth of talent here. I just scrolled throught the whole thread again and looked at the work and comments. I think we're really working on some good synergy, learning from each other and becoming better as a group.
Yes, definitely it is!!!


Great work everyone. :clap: :clap: :clap:

Florian

Rosic
10-09-2004, 10:35 PM
Bern, Iím glad you like it. Yes, if some people are interested I will do a demo how I paint fabric folds, just have to find a painting which will be ideal.
Florian
Florian... this sounds great... I eagerly await the demo... anything would be fine... you pick! :D
Bernie

guillot
10-10-2004, 04:39 AM
10 pages of 150 posts and almost 2,400 views and we are only on the first week of the month. I have to say this is the most popular MOM yet, and it's all because of the vast wealth of talent here. I just scrolled throught the whole thread again and looked at the work and comments. I think we're really working on some good synergy, learning from each other and becoming better as a group.

I know Jaysen - isn't it great !!! I love the camaderie in these events :) Everyone is just fantastic! :angel:

OK - the one for my MOM. Well, she should be here in about another 8 hours, she will be here for a week - but at least I have my sketch down - Yes - slap my hands - doin two :) What am I THINKIN? :eek:

on a 24 x 36 - just a charcoal quick 10 minute sketch.......

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2004/5957-sketch1.jpg

:clap: EXCITED :clap:

Bernie - I think you will enjoy working on larger canvases!!! It will set you free my friend :)

Tina

Thanks,
Tina

dcorc
10-10-2004, 07:18 AM
I've got another update here of mine - this is all just thin layers of paint, broadly applied, and dry-brush blended at edges. Having put in the initial indication of the eyebrows, she's now reached the Pacino-Gallagher stage :p

I'm going to give this 3-4 days to dry now, prior to oiling out and continuing late next week.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2004/30792-dcabdr6.jpg

Back again in a few minutes with a coffee, to have a look at everyone's work! :)

Dave

Squib
10-10-2004, 10:11 AM
Wow - this is such a great thread. :clap: :clap: :clap: Thanks to all of you for sharing - I am learning so much. I think we ALL are. It is SO great to be able to communicate with others who have the same interests, and share the same passion that we have for our art. We ALL have that same drive - that same feeling that its never enough, could ALWAYS be better - try harder, learn more, keep pushing. I love it, I love it, I love it - this wonderful feeling I have when I read all the posts. Keep 'em coming ! :) :) :) :) :)

CoolArtiste
10-10-2004, 10:45 AM
Dcorc, I didn't know you were a fan of Frida Kahlo :)

dcorc
10-10-2004, 11:19 AM
Dianne - this is going very well - going for another?

I'm not doing five I know that. Dave...your nuts!

I'm not doing 5 - I'm just trying to get Loop to! :D

Florian - coming along beautifully - your approach of working on just the figure, and in stages, seems to echo WB's practice. Lovely crisp work on all the fabric! Digital camera colour renditions even when correctly white-balanced and exposed, can leave quite a lot to be desired, alas :( - curves and levels, on a channel by channel basis in Photoshop can be very useful to tweak them.

Bernie - your grisaille is developing nicely

Bruce - the time spent on the drawing is, I'm sure, well spent, and is similar to the sorts of preparatory work we are told WB did - it could be thought of as a sort of rehearsal for the painting

Barb - a good start - and a solid understanding of the anatomy comes across in your drawing there!

Carey - going to show us your drawing stage?

Loop - where have you got to? No point in doing them all if you don't post your progress too ! :evil:

Nora - you are definitely too hard on yourself - and we have all benefitted greatly from seeing your own WB copies just before this month!

Jaysen - I think between yourself and your son, you've ended up doing something similar to what I'm trying here, just building very thin layers on the grey base. With regard to likeness, I try to avoid pinning down "in focus" bits as long as possible :)

Tricia - made a start on your crop yet?

Lorraine - a good start - so, no leaving it on the shelf! :)

Tina - two paintings started - good going!

Yvette - looks like a good value-study of "Le Crepuscle", there!

Whispurr - looking great!

Dcorc, I didn't know you were a fan of Frida Kahlo
LOL ! - it is very "monobrowed" at the moment - hoping to kick it back into shape next session though :p

Hope I haven't forgotten anyone! :o

Dave

Mikey
10-10-2004, 11:49 AM
Dave,
I just noticed your question if there were any WB's in the UK. I don't know if you had any answers, but here's Charity at Birmingham.
http://server1.minisisinc.com/minisa.dll/5574/1/0?SEARCH&SHOWSINGLE=Y

I've checked the link and it only takes me to search. I found just typing Charity works. Bouguereau however its spelt doesn't for me.

Mikey

Florian
10-10-2004, 04:16 PM
Dave, thank you! Your painting is coming along very good. Oiling out, interesting I never tried this technique.

My update, I finished the pinafore dress and did the first colour-layer of the flesh tones.

Florian

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2004/39426-Ruisseau_5.jpg

And a closed-up

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2004/39426-Ruisseau_5D.jpg

whispurr
10-10-2004, 04:51 PM
Hi everyone,

I've been re-reading all the posts with some interest.
All the paintings are awesome and I'm learning so much.
Have decided to start another painting while the gal dries. Since I've got Bouguereau on the brain thought I'd try to do it in his manner. It's a Caribbean gal with a fan but she's in the same general position of the girl Crocheting (the head and eyes that is) I'm hoping to be able to translate all the stuff I've learned and all the hints I've picked up from you guys. Wish me luck!

Florian: I can't get over that foot. It's so solid and grounded.

Marilyn

bjs0704
10-10-2004, 04:52 PM
Tina - Youíve got a nice start! They look really sweet! Your mom is going to love it!:clap:

Dave and Bernie - Thanks bunches for the encouragement!:)

Florian - She is looking fantastic. The dress is particularly good!:clap:

Barb Solomon :cat:

dcorc
10-10-2004, 05:26 PM
Thank you, Mikey!

The direct link is:
http://server1.minisisinc.com/minisa.dll/5729/1/1/178/BMA_DET_REP_FULL_IMAGE?RECORD

I can feel a day-trip coming on :)

Dave

Rosic
10-10-2004, 06:05 PM
My update, I finished the pinafore dress and did the first colour-layer of the flesh tones.
Florian

Looking great Florian... what colors did you use on your first skin tone glaze?
Bern

artinoil
10-11-2004, 04:42 AM
Florian i am in awe of your painting it is amazing do you have any plans on doing a step by step on the technique you used as i find it very interesting.

Biki
10-11-2004, 06:12 AM
Wow - you guys are rockin' & rollin'.

Florian, yours is just stunning already.
Nora, they are both beautiful in their own right.
Bernie, I am thrilled at how you are souring ahead.
dianne - well, what can i say - you just6 kill 'em, girl.
Dave? - i know you are gonna kick a goal any minute, but right now, she looks cross eyed. :eek:

me? - i did my drawing, but went to take a piccy & my batteries are flat.
( well, that's my excuse, anyway :p )

kinda green tho that i cannot, once again, join in just yet. but still, i am enjoying the show.

bravo, all. :clap: :clap: :clap:

dcorc
10-11-2004, 07:46 AM
Dave? - i know you are gonna kick a goal any minute, but right now, she looks cross eyed. :eek:

It's a nice example of why bigger is easier- the head on this (my) painting is about 4ins high - too small, really :( - it's about 9ins high on the original.

Dave

loop
10-11-2004, 09:45 AM
I'm not doing 5 - I'm just trying to get Loop to! :D


Loop - where have you got to? No point in doing them all if you don't post your progress too ! :evil:




you do all six of them and tell ME how much time you have left over to post :evil:

actually, I have not started this month yet.. I think I just finally almost finished my Thayer :eek:

you guys are outta control with these, is ANYBODY doing the suspected technique that WB used ? , you know no layers, just do it ?? I wanna try that.

dcorc
10-11-2004, 09:56 AM
Hi Loop! since you haven't started yet, we'll have to ease off on you a little :) - how about doing, say, 4? :D

I think probably Florian's working closest to the suspected WB technique, Loop.

I am tempted to start a second one, and try to do it more directly - it would be a good idea to do it closer to actual size.

Dave

Jaysen
10-11-2004, 12:45 PM
Nah, florian's using underpainting and glazes. I'm trying my hand at ala prima on a gray-toned canvas, which is supposedly how he worked. I'm being bogged down with other requests though, so the going is slow.

Squib
10-11-2004, 01:07 PM
Hi All :wave: - a quick update.

You are all doing so well here, can't wait to see the next installments.

Dave - the link you posted is not working - is it right ?
Florian - I, too, am waiting for a WIP. :)

Well done to all of you :clap: :clap: :clap:. There is some amazing work going on here. :clap:

Yes, Dave, bigger face next time. I've just measured mine and its 4" long - too small and too fiddly. I went out and bought an 'incy wincy' little brush this afternoon for her eyes. In typing that, I remember a wonderful man I used to paint with - I watched him paint a small face with a HUGE round brush. His detail was incredible. Guess HE knew what he was doing whereas I don't. But...practice makes perfect - right ?

I finished her skirt, (sort of) and started on her face - but feel I am losing it (deja vu), so I've stopped. I'll work on the background later this evening - and come back to the skin tomorrow. Is it me, or are her eyes too big for her face ?

As usual, I can't get a decent photo, and I'm not too good at tweaking them. I really need to take her outside tomorrow and take a few photos.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/11-Oct-2004/35948-ab3.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/11-Oct-2004/35948-ab4.JPG

I wanted a "porcelain" complexion, but it looks like I am getting a "robust" French peasant look. - Ah well.....

A Few Pigments
10-11-2004, 01:30 PM
Originally Posted by loop
is ANYBODY doing the suspected technique that WB used ? , you know no layers, just do it ?? I wanna try that.
I know I havenít started working on Jeune fille au crochet yet which is the one I said Iíd do this month, but I have to ask this question. Where did anyone say Bouguereau didnít paint in layers. I thought he always painted in layers. :confused:

loop
10-11-2004, 03:15 PM
I have to ask this question. Where did anyone say Bouguereau didnít paint in layers. I thought he always painted in layers. :confused:

I gleaned that from the "painter in oils" and other info over at the ARC site, however, I see that YOU can at least spell the man's name, so you are probably more correct than I. :wink2:

loop
10-11-2004, 04:08 PM
Hi Loop! since you haven't started yet, we'll have to ease off on you a little :) - how about doing, say, 4? :D

I think probably Florian's working closest to the suspected WB technique, Loop.

I am tempted to start a second one, and try to do it more directly - it would be a good idea to do it closer to actual size.

Dave

Really ONLY 4 ?? I was thinking these would be real easy, since, pretty much most modern art thinks of him as a nincampoop, derivitive, academic, too easy, and sometimes smelly. :rolleyes:, and that's not even talking about his subject matter .

seriously, I hope you DO try another one Dave, using a direct technique. That was my goal, but as you can see it did not work back then, so now I am FORCED to paint over it. I tried a little sketch and attempted the "knife at the end" aspect :eek: holy crap-ola, on the one hand it did create a smooth texture, and the blending WAS awesome AT PARTS, which seemed to occur at random, leaving it to look like crap at most other areas. I am curious though since his paint was reportedly 'drying almost as the brush touched the canvas' if the effect for him was far more subtle. ??

SQUIB I have read many the advice to use BIG brushes (bigger than you would expect), I have forced myself to try that on a few occasions and they are right. Now I try to do it all the time... I DO forget a lot though :D
Try it sometimes, you may LOVE IT

TruEnuff
10-11-2004, 05:06 PM
I finally worked up the courage to begin the painting process. I transferred my full size drawing to an 18" x 24" canvas and started the layin. It's certainly a humbling experience...not only because of the realization of what Bouguereau accomplished, but also because of the wonderful work done by others in this thread already. Whew. I've never attempted anything like this....what a challenge.

Below...my final drawing and my first session painting....

Bruce

Biki
10-11-2004, 07:13 PM
It's a nice example of why bigger is easier- the head on this (my) painting is about 4ins high - too small, really :( - it's about 9ins high on the original.

Dave

yeah - that's why i cropped - so i could do it more to size on a smaller canvas.

Jaysen
10-11-2004, 08:11 PM
I am curious though since his paint was reportedly 'drying almost as the brush touched the canvas' if the effect for him was far more subtle. ??


This is why he could use the knife. He did paint very thinly, but I suspect that he would have rough spots where he had overworked or gotten blobs of paint. I think that the paint had already pretty much dried when he used the knife.

I've been using the wet-on-wet technique described in the articles and it really was an eye-opener. I suspect many times he would mix his colors on the canvas instead of the traditional use of the pallette, if you know what I mean. Sort of a glazing while the paint is still wet technique. It only works when you have either no medium, or a very little quick drying medium such as liquin. That way, the layer you are painting into resists being drawn off the canvas when you paint into it.

bravynn
10-11-2004, 08:37 PM
Hi everyone,
Just checking in. I've finished my reformatting the day after I told you I needed to do it. I thought my camera would work...
everything else is fine. So I can't upload any pictures of my progress. However, I am taking pictures so I can upload them when I do finally figure out what's wrong technically.

I started doing underpainting today on Au_bord_du_ruisseau, after the two coats of grey paint dried. I've never done a portrait in oils before. Talk about stretching out of the comfort zone. The only thing I've ever done was a large tiger, and I've never finished it. I have since decided to work/play my passion, and this 'Masters' painting was just the right beginning for me. Why not just jump in with both feet right? :D The weather is cloudy, and rainy today. Not much light to work with. Do any of you use the OTT lights for days like this, or if you want to paint at night? I would like to know exactly what to buy so I'll have this option. Anywayyyyyy...I hear thunder in the background, guess I had better wrap this note up. I feel my painting is coming along, but I'll try to hurry and fix my settings so my camera can upload to the computer, b/c I'm sure I can use some advice along the way.

You all are wonderful painters.

Barbara :clap:

dan9000
10-11-2004, 09:25 PM
My first time partipating in one of these mass painting sprees. Been admiring everyone else's work in the thread.

I picked "Le Crepescule" (means "Twilight", I found out... given the composition, subject and longish dimensions, thought the translation might have been "le centerfold" :) )

Loosely blocked in color of the surroundings and the drapery swirling around her. More detailed grisaille on the figure.

Main problems I see at the moment are that the left breast (her left) is too oblong, and parts of the drapery have a more violet hue (I've done it in a kind of uniform blueish green.)

Dan

WV.Artistry
10-12-2004, 12:48 AM
It's certainly a humbling experience...

Bruce

yeah it is.

and there's a gazillion incomplete Bouguereau renditions on WC to attest to that.

but even so, there's always something to be learned, even if it's only . . . I'm never doing that again :)

I'll be interested in your approach and progress on this. have fun with it.

Richard

WV.Artistry
10-12-2004, 01:47 AM
This is why he could use the knife. He did paint very thinly, but I suspect that he would have rough spots where he had overworked or gotten blobs of paint. I think that the paint had already pretty much dried when he used the knife.

I've been using the wet-on-wet technique described in the articles and it really was an eye-opener. I suspect many times he would mix his colors on the canvas instead of the traditional use of the pallette, if you know what I mean. Sort of a glazing while the paint is still wet technique. It only works when you have either no medium, or a very little quick drying medium such as liquin. That way, the layer you are painting into resists being drawn off the canvas when you paint into it.


Jaysen,

Here's my two cents for speculation.

Some, if not all of it, is in paint selection.

If I use a high viscosity paint (i.e., lead-based) for the foundation, I can immediately glaze over it with another paint because of the nature of both types of paints, and the brush technique when glazing -- the paint I've previously mixed for layering on top of them, or the paint I'll then mix "on-canvas" for edits, makes a 1,2,3 approach, done, and dry. The medium supplements, but it's not the basis. It's the nature of the paint that makes instanteous layering possible.

I think to the casual observer his approach was incomprehensible, invisible, and misunderstood that he was in fact, layering.

I've never done the knifing, but it's plausable, and in probability, creates an anomoly color because of the friction. I've seen this color when I brush too fast.

Here's my failed attempt at copying a Bouguereau.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/48784-Bouguereau_Study_C.jpg

Yvettochka
10-12-2004, 02:56 AM
full time humbling experience it is! i started a copy of Les jeunnes bohemmiennes about 2 months ago, and put it aside until I get brave enough to continue. The only reason I got optimistic enough to start a second attempt on WB was this thread and the professional friendly community here.

Took me a while to read all the posts and look at the great work posted here. Totally agree on the canvas size - the larger the better, although I did trhe same mistake again - picked up tiny surface for such a difficult task as full human figure

Great work everybody :wave: :clap:

Well... here is some progress of my Crepuscule. ...taking my time and not discouraged to continue yet - total 5 hours of work and at least 5 more planned

Florian
10-12-2004, 06:32 AM
Thank you to all for the nice comments. :)

Looking great Florian... what colors did you use on your first skin tone glaze?
Bern

Hi Bernie, glad you like it. I didnít glaze over the underpainting, I painted rather thick, and without any medium. I mostly paint wet into wet and blend a lot, start always with the darkest part and work toward the lightest. Quite often I mix the midtones directly on the canvas blending with a soft brush ( size differs from the painting ). Then, spatially on the folds I add lights and shadows and blend very careful to reach this three-dimensional effect. But Iím not so happy with the skin tone, itís too bright actually. :( I have to work on it, this time perhaps glazes. :confused:

My palette for the skin tones Naples yellow light and reddish - cad red light Ė yellow ochre - burnt and raw umber - ultramarine light - Titanium white, all from Maimeri.



Nah, florian's using underpainting and glazes.

Jaysen, underpainting yes, but I wonít call this technique glazing. The underpainting helps me to do shadows and lights better in the colour layer.



artinoil

Florian i am in awe of your painting it is amazing do you have any plans on doing a step by step on the technique you used as i find it very interesting.

Artinoil, thanks and welcome! I see you are new to WC, Iím glad you like it.


Florian - I, too, am waiting for a WIP.


I didnít think to do a step-by-step demo, because Iím quite new to oil-painting (one and a half year) and this is the first time I tried this technique.
I was also ask do to a demo on fabric folds by others, so I think will do it. But first I have to finish this one and an other painting I started 3 weeks ago. I`m thinking to do another Buoguereau.
But Iím a bit worried to do a demo, because Iím not a professional painter and as you see my English is horrible.

Unfortunately Iím away for business the rest of the week and donít have time to paint, will be back on Saturday.

Happy painting to all, Florian :wave:

Rosic
10-12-2004, 08:52 AM
Florian... Thanks http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/17108-25_coolguy.gif
Bernie

You are more than qualified to give a demo! ;)

Looking good everyone! :clap:

dan9000
10-12-2004, 11:43 AM
Totally agree on the canvas size - the larger the better, although I did trhe same mistake again - picked up tiny surface for such a difficult task as full human figure

Yvettochka,

Was wondering what size your surface is, and what size brush you used for her face. I am doing it at 16 x 20 inches. Didn't find it tough working at that size, except for the face. You seem to be doing a pretty good job on the face (better than mine!), so I was curious how big your surface is.

Dan

Jaysen
10-12-2004, 12:35 PM
Hi All :wave: - a quick update.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/11-Oct-2004/35948-ab3.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/11-Oct-2004/35948-ab4.JPG

I wanted a "porcelain" complexion, but it looks like I am getting a "robust" French peasant look. - Ah well.....

Squib, congrats on a very well drawn and painted portrait, so far. It's looking marvelous. The balance of color throughout the painting is very nice. Also, the skin tones are looking very realistic, especially on the face now that you've glazed it. Also, I'm very envious of the rich colors you've achieved in the dress and background.

One small critique, however. Take a look at the proportion of eyeball size to the iris/pupil size. Most human irises are about half the diameter of the visible eyeball, centered. Yours are slightly too big, although very nice in color and shape. Also, look at thickening the eyebrows some.

I think we're all doing very well, coming up on the halfway point of the month.
Here's an updated collage of everyone's work.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/46838-bourg_collage.jpg

One of these things is not like the others.... :wink2:

Carey Griffel
10-12-2004, 01:11 PM
Hi all! Awesome work, everyone!! I'll get around to mine one of these days. :rolleyes:

I've been thinking about painting techniques in the back of my mind lately, specifically Bougereau's...the evidence is that he painted "directly", though that needn't mean that he did everything in strictly *one* layer. Of course, no one *really* knows as he left no notes, etc. But I'm always puzzled at those people who have to insist that he glazed or painted in many layers, as if one couldn't get such perfect results otherwise. :confused:

It seems to me that there is a definite mystique built up around the concept of glazing...beginners puzzle over it, wonder what it is, believe that it's some magic formula that will create great works of art.....

There's no doubt that glazing can produce some amazing affects, etc, and many masters used it to great effect, for sure. Leonardo Da Vinci, for example, produced breathtaking things this way...

...But I have to say, in general, I hate the way glazes look. Of course, I have to condition that statement...I've seen a Leonardo Da Vinci; it was clear that he used many many glazes and I loved the effect that he achieved. But I've also seen several famous works that were clearly glazed, achieving what is often referred to as "that luminous effect"--and I thought that it couldn't look worse. In one particular (wish I had the artist and painting specifically, but I don't), part of a woman's dress was painted "opaquely" while the rest of it was glazed...I thought that the unglazed part was gorgeous while the glazed part looked so entirely fake. Yet I know that this is the very "jeweled" look that many people are searching for in their art. I'm not saying that they are wrong; I'm simply saying that I don't care for it personally.

In my opinion--and I'm quite aware that this is only my opinion and could very well be and may be absolutely wrong--I don't think that Bougereau painted in glazes generally speaking. But I think that there are quite likely several layers. Painting in layers does not always mean painting in glazes. A completely opaque layer can still allow an underlayer to show through, as I've well discovered on my own.

Just my two cents; thought I'd share what was going through my mind today, is all! :)

~!Carey

dan9000
10-12-2004, 01:46 PM
Painting in layers does not always mean painting in glazes. A completely opaque layer can still allow an underlayer to show through, as I've well discovered on my own.
~!Carey
Carey,

Although I've seen different definitions of "glazing", I've always thought painting so that an underlayer shows through was a key aspect. The definition of "opaque" is that you can't see what's underneath it, isn't it? It seems to me sometimes you can put on a very thin glaze, that essentially just tints what's below it, and sometimes you can put on a thicker glaze (or a thin glaze using a more opaque hue, or more white), that shows less of what's beneath... but if the intention is to have a layer react optically with what's beneath it, isn't it all still glazing?

I guess when some people say "glazing", they are referring specifically to the application of numerous thin, highly transparent layers, but I guess I'd call that "lots of glazes" rather than the very definition of glazing.

Dan

Squib
10-12-2004, 01:56 PM
Hi All :wave:

Jaysen, thanks for pointing out the problem with the eyes. I've been looking at her eyes for days, thinking they were too big - but you're right - its the irises. Will work on that tomorrow. You said you like the balance of colour - thanks. The purple is everywhere in the painting, in the rocks, foliage , her clothing and her face, and I think it has created a nice harmony. Just hope I don't mess it up as I go further.

Carey, I'm giving some thought to your post on glazing and layers. I can't say I dislike a glazed effect - I've seen some beautiful paintings that were done in glazes. But for myself, I really prefer a more direct painting method - (that's another way of saying I'm NOT very good at glazing - LOL!!!!) I have also seen paintings that were glazed and they looked terrible. I don't think the time it takes to complete a painting in this way is always worth the effort (for me that is). I know others feel differently - but I prefer to view spontaneity and lively brushwork. A spontaneous effect can be achieved, I think, by painting many layers, which, as you said, is not the same as glazing. That is what I'm aiming for in my painting. (Not in this one though - her face has more layers than I ever imagined I would paint).

I managed to get another couple of hours done today - is this slow going or what ??? I'm lightening her complexion, slowly but surely. Also trying to define the shapes of her features more. I think the nose and mouth are not quite right yet, but will keep at it. I did a bit more on the background, started on the hair & the flowers in the hair. I feel it is finally coming together ! Excuse the glare in the photos.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/35948-ab5.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/35948-ab6.JPG

loop
10-12-2004, 01:59 PM
I thought glazing was what kept the glass in the window frame ???


I think that if you can see some aspect of the underlayer, painting dark over light, you are glazing, you can, glaze with opaque paint, you just need to scrub it a bit to spread it thin enough to see through it.. a glaze.
... that's my guess and I'm sticking to it..for now

glazing .. often misunderstood , seldom done correctly.. this ain't watercolors.

Jaysen
10-12-2004, 02:28 PM
Hi All :wave:

Jaysen, thanks for pointing out the problem with the eyes. I've been looking at her eyes for days, thinking they were too big - but you're right - its the irises. Will work on that tomorrow. You said you like the balance of colour - thanks. The purple is everywhere in the painting, in the rocks, foliage , her clothing and her face, and I think it has created a nice harmony. Just hope I don't mess it up as I go further.
I managed to get another couple of hours done today - is this slow going or what ??? I'm lightening her complexion, slowly but surely. Also trying to define the shapes of her features more. I think the nose and mouth are not quite right yet, but will keep at it. I did a bit more on the background, started on the hair & the flowers in the hair. I feel it is finally coming together ! Excuse the glare in the photos.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/35948-ab5.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/35948-ab6.JPG

Wow! What a job you did in two hours! It's really starting to come alive. Those shadows on the face are really defining the countenance.


I see what you mean about the nose and mouth. I think the original's nose's nostrils where somewhat (straight? flat?) less flaring in the openings, less arch, if that makes sense. I see that you already fixed what I was going to say about the lips, but I've noticed another thing. Try making the lips a little thinner, with just a tad bit less curvature. Then, when you get the pink glaze in, they'll be perfect. One more thing and I'll shut up... the upper eyelids (that black eyelash line looking thing) should be touching the tops of the pupils of the eyes.

Loop - I thought glazing was that sweet stuff you put on cakes?? Also, I remember my mom using some sort of "glaze" to make her pots look shiney from the kiln.

dcorc
10-12-2004, 02:32 PM
I thought glazing was what kept the glass in the window frame ???

No - you're thinking of "putti" (not to be confused with cherubs!) :p

Dave

Carey Griffel
10-12-2004, 04:10 PM
Although I've seen different definitions of "glazing", I've always thought painting so that an underlayer shows through was a key aspect. The definition of "opaque" is that you can't see what's underneath it, isn't it? It seems to me sometimes you can put on a very thin glaze, that essentially just tints what's below it, and sometimes you can put on a thicker glaze (or a thin glaze using a more opaque hue, or more white), that shows less of what's beneath... but if the intention is to have a layer react optically with what's beneath it, isn't it all still glazing?

I guess when some people say "glazing", they are referring specifically to the application of numerous thin, highly transparent layers, but I guess I'd call that "lots of glazes" rather than the very definition of glazing.

Yes, Dan, I suppose that you're right. Technically any of that would be "glazing"...but I'm talking in terms of not "meaning" to glaze, I guess. Or something. :rolleyes: But consider...through my own experiences, I have found that a cool verdaccio underpainting will make the end results appear *quite* a bit different than using a warmish brownish underpainting, no matter *how* many layers I'm putting on. True, I don't paint that thickly and maybe in light of that, I could call it glazing, but I really don't think that it technically *is* glazing. I plan for my underpainting to show through to some extent...but only in bits and pieces here and there and in many different ways, for example, it may show through in part simply because it wasn't entirely covered by subsequent layers, etc. But if, say, I was teaching a beginner my method (which I am not at the moment qualified to do, in my opinion, but just for the sake of argument), I'd never call the process "glazing", just painting in layers because I'm not *concerned* with how thick or thin the paint is, I'm just doing it as I see it needs to proceed.

Perhaps it's a silly point. In order for the sake of a definition of a term, I'd say glazing is layering thin layers where you are intending for the whole underpainting (or a good part of it) to show through. Ie, you model the form in verdaccio (or whatever), then add color on top of that. When I "paint in layers", I guess that I'm basically painting the whole picture "over" again (though in higher detail than the previous layer), but that's not quite the right way to put it, either, because the lower layers, while not showing through exactly like a glaze, are still making their impact known and I may not (probably not) be covering the *whole* thing micron by micron or it may be thicker in some areas, thinner in others...

:confused: Am I making any sense? Prolly not. :p Either way, I know for SURE that I'm not any type of an expert on it. I probably ought to just shut up. Nonetheless, that's how I see it... *shrug*

~!Carey

bjs0704
10-12-2004, 06:21 PM
Lorraine- She is looking so beautiful! Her dress and the background is really lovely! She is just getting better and better.

Bruce - She is incredible! I love the warm colors that you are using! You are doing well!

Barbara - It is good to hear that you are hanging in there! I donít have Ott lights, but I do have quite a bit of artificial lighting in my studio.

Dan - I love your colors! Your painting looks so mysterious and magical. It is going to be a wonderful painting.

Richard - Your painting looks very gentle and beautiful. I love the hint of color on her white blouse. The skin tones are lovely and very well done.

Yvettochka - Itís lovely. I am so glad that you went back to it and tried finishing her. Good job!

I have always liked the effect of glazing. But it is good to learn to work in a variety of styles.

Barb Solomon :cat:

dan9000
10-12-2004, 07:45 PM
Dan - I love your colors! Your painting looks so mysterious and magical. It is going to be a wonderful painting.

Barb Solomon :cat:

Barb,

Thanks, I'm glad the colors look good so far. Wish you could see the real thing, the colors kind of get washed out in the photo (same problem for everyone, I'm sure).

Barbara, re your Ott Lite question: I use them because with a full time day job I pretty much am painting at night, except on the weekends. I've found them easier on the eyes than other lights I've used, and it does seem pretty color-neutral (or however they advertise them). Like any artificial light, you deal with the issues of uneven lighting across the surface (I use a light on either side, which helps some) and reflections off the wet paint.

Dan

Jaysen
10-12-2004, 10:17 PM
He who is without sin, cast the first stone...

Well, after picking at other people's paintings today, I started to feel kinda guilty, so I went to my Boug in progress and took a closer look.

It had been 4 days since working on it, so I had a fresh perspective. Wow, guess what? The eyes on my painting were all messed up. Specifically, the girl's left eye (our right) was too high in the picture and too close to the nose. It was also slanted the wrong way. So, I took out the mighty pallette knife and went to work. I just love scraping 2 hours of work away in 10 seconds. Well, I thought I had fixed the eye, so I moved on to the skirt and did some more work on it.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge6.jpg

Well, guess what? The friggin eye is STILL wrong. It's still too close to the nose and both eyes are slightly too large. Too large is an easy fix, but placement is not. It'll envolve more scraping and more repainting.

See if you see what I see....

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/46838-face3.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Oct-2004/46838-face4.jpg

Yvettochka
10-13-2004, 06:15 AM
Gee, this is a very popular thread! Takes quite some time to read the posts!

Barb, thanks for finding my Crepuscule lovely

Jaysen, I see what you see, except that the outer corner looks just right. I think that opening the bottom part of the outer corner just a tiny bit and "closing" the inner one at the lacrimal fold would do the trick.
But otherwise I love the girl's air

Florian your mastery achieved in just 1,5 years is amazing. Please do a demo!

Dan, your girl and colors scheme look like a great start - it has a contemporary feel to it. My canvas is 30x50 cm, 12x22" - just about the size of yours. I regretted having it so small as early as in the process of the shape block-in, but I decided that I would do it anyway... The brush I used for the face is filbert #2. I am so glad you like the face - it looks like the technique i used could be the one for me. I just read a great book by John Howard Sanden "Portaits from life in 29 steps". The author emphacizes importance of working very quickly and not blending the brushstrokes at the first stage. I really like his brief light manner and he completes his portraits in just 2 hours (!!! ) he builds his face as a puzzle made of variously lit planes. Cool light against warm medium, ... against darker cool again... So, I pre-mixed all the colors I saw in the body and face and did just as he recommended. I have to tell you - my mind revolted at the idea of using a dark olive green at the girl's forhead and light blue at the neck.... but it looked just right when all the colors I saw at the original were laid together. And I was surprised to see the resemblance to the original after just 10-15 min of work.

Very much looking forward to the progress of all the WIPs in the forum! Will not have much time to work on mine this week ...

dan9000
10-13-2004, 08:18 AM
Dan, your girl and colors scheme look like a great start - it has a contemporary feel to it. My canvas is 30x50 cm, 12x22" - just about the size of yours. I regretted having it so small as early as in the process of the shape block-in, but I decided that I would do it anyway... The brush I used for the face is filbert #2. I am so glad you like the face - it looks like the technique i used could be the one for me. I just read a great book by John Howard Sanden "Portaits from life in 29 steps".

Yvettochka,
Glad you like my version, and thanks for sharing all the details about your technique. I will have to look for that book.

Dan

guillot
10-13-2004, 09:05 AM
and there's a gazillion incomplete Bouguereau renditions on WC to attest to that.

Richard

:D

Hopefully mine will no longer be a part of that group, LOL

I still have some corrections to make to the faces, and I need to key up the lights on the Abduction of Psyche,

On the kissy babies - I need to just start painting on that one ;)


Everyone is doing wonderfully.

Welcome to the new folks in here - I see there are quite a few :clap:

Tina

TruEnuff
10-13-2004, 10:40 AM
What a thread this has turned out to be. Not only great participation with wonderful paintings, but lots of tips and tricks too. I would like to comment on everyone's work, but I'd have to scan back over two or three pages and make notes to do it! Maybe tonight!

Barb...thank you for your comment on my first painting day attempt. As I said when I posted it, it's a humbling experience. I spent another hour or so on it, correcting errors that I saw in the posted picture, and now I'm letting it dry. I'm determined to finish it....what a learning experience!

John Howard Sanden's book "Portraits from Life in 29 Steps" is well known over in the Portraiture Forum - my only other regular haunt on WC. I have dozens of art instructional books, and I have learned something from most of them...but no book has had more of an impact on my painting than this one. I have two portraits I did using what he taught me posted in the Portrature Forum under a "Jane Squared" thread. Obviously, as a beginning oil painter, I still have a long way to go...but I owe this book thanks for where I am now.

Great work everyone. What an amazing tribute to M. Bouguereau.

Bruce

bjs0704
10-13-2004, 08:50 PM
Dan - I have always had to do a lot of painting in the evening. My current studio is also a converted garage - no windows! I have to use artificial light. And you are right, when someone has to use artificial light in a studio, they have to be very careful where the lights are placed.

Jaysen - I hate days like that! I am sorry to hear that you had to re do so much!

Check eyes on your girl - Mr. B didnít really paint them even. I think that the pupils are the same in the original, but look at the eyelids. Maybe that is why you keep wanting them different.

Tina - I am looking forward to an update! It would be neat to see how your painting is coming along!

Bruce - You are doing a really good job!

Barb Solomon:cat:

Jaysen
10-13-2004, 10:16 PM
Verily, it is truth.... The knife is greater than the brush...

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge7.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Oct-2004/46838-face5.jpg

Rosic
10-14-2004, 08:42 AM
Jaysen... you've got to be pleased with your re-work.

Dan and Yvettochka... I almost chose that one too... you both are doing a great job with it.

Lorraine... :clap:

WIP Latest Update:
Just finished the under-painting and will need to let it dry thoroughly before I begin adding the glazes. About 13 hours into it at this point.
Bernie

Full length (30"x20" stretched canvas)
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2004/17108-mom106.JPG

Close-Up
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2004/17108-mom106close.JPG

guillot
10-14-2004, 09:19 AM
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: WOW Bernie !!! :D

It's coming along beautifully !!! The wings and everything look great!!

Jaysen - Looking great !!!!!! Dress and all looks wonderful !!!

Tina

bjs0704
10-14-2004, 09:40 AM
Bernie - Your painting is looking so cool! I particularly like the curls in their hair! Good going!

Barb Solomon :cat:

dan9000
10-14-2004, 10:01 AM
Rosic,

Beautiful modeling of the figures, that 13 hours of work really shows. I'd only comment that the faces, of the girl in particular, look a bit too adult. I think the bridge of the girl's nose is harder and more defined than in the original, and her jawline appears a bit too loose and fleshy, as opposed to smooth and round. The boy, I think the area of the jaw adjoining the chin maybe just has a hint of jowliness.

Dan

Jaysen
10-14-2004, 10:17 AM
Well, if you look at the original closely, you can see where old Bougie reworked a few areas himself. Now, it probably wasn't because of drawing errors, but it's still nice to know he had second thoughts too.

Bernie, I commented in the WOYE thread, but wow I just noticed the closeup. The Torsos are really outstanding work. I especially like the girl's knee that looks so realistically projected.

dan9000
10-14-2004, 10:54 AM
Well, if you look at the original closely, you can see where old Bougie reworked a few areas himself. Now, it probably wasn't because of drawing errors, but it's still nice to know he had second thoughts too.


Jaysen,

I do always find it encouraging to see evidence that even the greats had moments of indecision or at least changes in direction. Reminds me of when I was talking to a local artist in my area whose work I really admire, a guy who does wonderful portraits in Old Master style, and he mentioned that every time he starts a commission he fills a certain dread about whether he can pull it off. I found it oddly reassuring that someone like that would feel the same anxiety I feel whenever I start a painting.

Dan

Carey Griffel
10-14-2004, 02:23 PM
Now, it probably wasn't because of drawing errors...

What? Do you *really* think that even Mr. Bougereau got it perfectly right the very first time? Like Richard said (I think that's who said it :p ), he's only human.

"...The artist is continually producing things good, mediocre, and bad. But what makes us artists is our power of judgement. Highly practiced and sharpened, it rejects, selects, rearranges until we are content."

I forget who said that, but I believe it to be true of everyone. *Everyone*

~!Carey

Rosic
10-14-2004, 02:34 PM
Thanks for the encouragement and the advice everyone! :clap:
I value each one you more than I can express in words.
Bernie



"...The artist is continually producing things good, mediocre, and bad. But what makes us artists is our power of judgement. Highly practiced and sharpened, it rejects, selects, rearranges until we are content."
~!Carey

Carey... this is so true.

guillot
10-14-2004, 02:44 PM
OK, here's an update for me. I still have to go back over some areas on their bodies. The initial layer I put in (grisaille) was to actually get the canvas covered with something so that the rest is a bit easier to manipulate. I got a bit carried away with the blending brush and almost cleared their faces off :p so, I've got to go back over their faces and a couple of other areas before I do their bodies. Just layed in some color in the mountainous areas, laid some color in the background and sky. Need to put some violets in !!

So much work left to do !!!

But here's an update anyhoo ...

Picture is coming through a bit bluer than it actually is ....

Thanks guys,
Tina


http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2004/5957-laying_in_color1a.jpg

Rosic
10-14-2004, 02:55 PM
So much work left to do !!!
Tina

Looking good Tina. I'm so glad to see you staying with this one and seeing it through. Gonna be a masterpiece before you know it.

Gotta keep painting this month cause I know that "painting the town" is the only painting you will do next month. :wink2:
How many days left? I know you are counting! :D
Bern

Squib
10-14-2004, 03:37 PM
Jaysen, Bernie & Tina - coming along great. :clap:

I haven't had any time to paint today - looking after my baby granddaughter for the day ! But will be back at it tomorrow (I'm just too tired tonight to pick up a brush). I am busy working on my girls hands and feet, then I'm going to call it done ! I hope. Maybe I'll just let it sit for a few days and see. I will post a photo tomorrow. Thanks for all your encouragement folks - you are great. :) :) :) :)

Rosic
10-14-2004, 03:56 PM
:D ... And just think... we get to start all over next month... with a SARGENT! :clap:

Jaysen
10-14-2004, 04:32 PM
I don't know about next month's painting. It's a very difficult piece. It ought to look very beautifull hanging over my fireplace though....

Jaysen
10-14-2004, 04:39 PM
What? Do you *really* think that even Mr. Bougereau got it perfectly right the very first time? Like Richard said (I think that's who said it :p ), he's only human.
~!Carey

Well, one advantage they had was time. Ole Bougie had all day every day to paint. When he got a commision, he would spend hours upon hours doing drawings, studies, etc... until he had his subject mastered. Then, he would workup a full-sized drawing, working it until it was absolutely perfect. Then, and only then, would he transfer it to the canvas. Put all those practices, unlimited working time, 20-30 years experience in painting, the best art training in the world, plus his enormous talent and I don't think he had to totally rework an eye as late in the game as I did.

guillot
10-14-2004, 06:29 PM
Another update - continuing with the glazes - will have to refine some areas.
Thanks Bernie and Squib :)

Tina

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2004/5957-laying_in_color2a.jpg

bjs0704
10-14-2004, 07:11 PM
Tina - Itís looking really good! Keep it up the good work! It is going to be such a beautiful painting when it is done!

Barb Solomon :cat:

loop
10-15-2004, 10:25 AM
I don't know about next month's painting. It's a very difficult piece. It ought to look very beautifull hanging over my fireplace though....


oh man, I forgot about this one... I have a feeling mine will look it's best IN the fireplace :p

loop
10-15-2004, 10:34 AM
Another update - continuing with the glazes - will have to refine some areas.
Thanks Bernie and Squib :)

Tina

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Oct-2004/5957-laying_in_color2a.jpg


:clap: I am sooooo glad you are picking this back up. It is going to be super. Are you going to post a close up or two of the areas you have been adding color too ??

bravynn
10-15-2004, 10:57 AM
Dan - Thank you for telling me about the Ott lights that you use.

Barbara - I'm definitely hanging in there. The underpainting I did makes the young girl look like death warmed over. lol Appropriate for Halloween. :-)

After troubleshooting the technical aspects of trying to get my camera working on my computer. The only thing I can deduce is that my serial port is messed up on my new computer. My camera works fine on the older computer which has XP Pro also. *shrug* I have the same settings/port et al on both computers. I'll have to write my computer manufacturer about this. That being said, though off topic, I went ahead and downloaded my pictures of the painting in progress on my IBM, then transferred my pics on this computer so I can upload them to WC.

I am uploading the sketch I started with, which I later adjusted due to cutting off her foot midway before applying the grey coats. Had to place one foot in this 24x30. I didn't have the kind of charcoal I wanted to use, so... I used a Rembrandt black pastel. *gasp* It worked though. I sprayed fixative evenly over the canvas, then after it dried, I used a soft cloth to wipe off the excess. I didn't want to use pencil. I wanted something dark enough that I could see it, since my vision isn't the best these days.

I think perhaps the two grey coats of wash I applied to the canvas might have been a bit darker then I wanted. Live and Learn!!
I used paynes grey and a touch of ultramarine blue for this.

After the grey dried, I began underpainting with brnt sienna, flake white. The ground around the back of her, and the rocks were painted in turpy grey and white. I hope I'm doing this right. I started filling in the darks on the skirt area, but haven't started painting that as an underpainting. I figured when I began painting in 'color', I would just do that with the color directly as it is in the original reference.

So here I am......and I suppose the next thing is to begin laying in COLOR. I will adjust the facial features and values if needed as I go since I know they are off some/ a lot. LOL

Please tell me what you would do as the next step? Remember this is the first portrait in oil that I've ever done. I know the stage I have it in right now is ghastly. I'm open to learn here, so don't spare the constructive comments. :-)

Thank you
Barb
graphics below:

SallyAnn
10-15-2004, 04:08 PM
After watching this thread and seeing all the fantastic talent, I felt I had to at least attempt 'something'.. just to push myself. (Im still learning). Well... errr, I decided on just a cropped head/shoulders. I have no idea what I am doing, or if this will ever be finished ... lol ... but thought I would join in on the fun! Printer ran out of coloured ink a while ago.. so am trying to do this directly from the puter screen.. arrrghhhh.....

You have been very inspiring!!!!!!!!!!!! :clap:

loop
10-15-2004, 04:17 PM
Please tell me what you would do as the next step? Remember this is the first portrait in oil that I've ever done. I know the stage I have it in right now is ghastly. I'm open to learn here, so don't spare the constructive comments. :-)

Thank you
Barb
graphics below:


I don't think ghastly is the correct term, mabey ghostly :evil:
I think you are on the right track, are you trying for an underpainting to glaze over ?? Since you are at the monotone stage, I would work out how you want everything to be BEFORE going to color (since you started that way), meaning (I) would keep working with the same BS and FW until the values and placement were to my liking, let it dry then ATTACK with color .
So far SO good, and ... keep hanging in there.. it looks like it will turn out fine.

loop
10-15-2004, 04:20 PM
SALLYANN
this looks fantastic, I wish you guys would use the image uploader, so I could see it while typing. I hope you DO finish this, I have a feeling it will be well worth the effort

hey that looks like that singer, Shana' O'conner ? I thinbk her name is, you know, she was/is as bald as this smilie :D

Jaysen
10-15-2004, 04:36 PM
After watching this thread and seeing all the fantastic talent, I felt I had to at least attempt 'something'.. just to push myself. (Im still learning). Well... errr, I decided on just a cropped head/shoulders. I have no idea what I am doing, or if this will ever be finished ... lol ... but thought I would join in on the fun! Printer ran out of coloured ink a while ago.. so am trying to do this directly from the puter screen.. arrrghhhh.....

You have been very inspiring!!!!!!!!!!!! :clap:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Oct-2004/46838-Boogie.jpg

SallyAnn, very good start. I was tempted to crop and just do the head and shoulders when I first started, since I wanted to complete it in a week and do it full size. I wish I would've now, hehe.

Very good start, such confident and solid colors. I really like the look already. It won't take you many glazes to finish, I think. Great likeness on the first try!

Rosic
10-15-2004, 04:43 PM
Barb... you are progressing nicely.

Sally-Ann... Reminds me of the Bougie face study he (and Nora) did... looking good!

Bern

SallyAnn
10-15-2004, 04:49 PM
Gee.. thank you all for the nice comments!

Loop This may well up end as Sinead O'Connor... lol.. I have NO idea how to paint hair.. thats why there is none there now.. lol!

Jaysen Glazes? What??? LMAO ! I did read some threads on glazing, but Im not sure Im confident enough to try it out... we shall see !!!! I couldnt try a full size.. it would be too overwhelming at this stage :D I just sat there and whacked the paint on and added bits here and there... real technical eh?? You can even see where I stuck my hand in the wet paint! :eek:

guillot
10-15-2004, 07:09 PM
:clap: I am sooooo glad you are picking this back up. It is going to be super. Are you going to post a close up or two of the areas you have been adding color too ??

Hi Loop :) - my friend in "expanded" 'borgie-time', LOL :p

YOU, of all people know - how long I have struggled with this painting!!! You've always been there by my side when this painting came up. Sure thing, you point out which areas you would like for me to attempt a closeup on and I'll be glad to post it.

I can say that I'm not too happy with the "color" - I've used here, in the drape around her, and the drape around him, cobalt violet and cobalt blue respectively- yes - more opaque in nature (a velatura) but thinned enough to give a transparent glaze - just enough to trap the color into the underpainting (scumbling kinda?) and wiping off as neccessary (!) and I'm having a feeling that there will be areas on top of these initial glazes that I will have to refine and go back over. In the sky - I've used cobalt blue + naples yellow + flake white (or a type of lead white substitute) ; more or less colors that he used. I'm frustrated there - because I'm one that loves to have my skies POP! I truly believe that anyone can look back on my skies and see that I try to truly capture the "mood" of the painting in the sky. Can't seem to get too happy there - but can still go much-much fatter, so not worried there!!! I have added some violets there - but still unhappy with my sky! AND, I think it's important to note here that on this one - I've always wanted it for my wall. I started this painting for ME. I feel a strong pull on this painting - it MOVES me... and have always wanted to do this for me. I think that a lot of my procrastination on this painting has come from learning experiences - and feelings of unworthiness to actually be able to "pull it off". A lot of my growth as an artist is actually in this one painting!!!!! And this may not actually be the way that good 'ol Borgie pulled it off - but you know what? I've learned a tremendous amount from looking at this one painting every day for the past year and a half - working on it, working on the sketch, and KNOWING that I myself, in the current states of my progress in learning, all those times that I set it aside I was waiting for the moments that I came across the "A-HA's" - know what I mean? WHAT a learning experience! (not to mention a LONG learning experience) - But I'm still committed to pulling of the 'what I call' "kissing angels" within this months' MOM time frame - so YEAH - I'll be pushing that one but most likely going down a quicker avenue to try to get that one done. What WB would've possibly done. BERNIE is above me on that one, LOL :D And I truly believe that CoolArtiste had/ and still does, it going on with that one too!!!


SallyAnn - welcome to the activity and hope you will enjoy it. We're all still Learning!!! It never ends!!! That is what is so wonderful about wetcanvas!, We all learn, we all go through all these tribulations together, we share our insights and what we have learned on these things - and we all come together!! Truly amazing stuff from all over the world, and you know what's best about that - no politics!!

bravynn (Barb2 - I'll call you that because we have Barb Solomon AKA oils forum guide bsj704 : or Barb1) :) My advice to you is just to keep painting - your eye will work it out!!! You can also see from your drawing that you went from that cute little girlish smile to a frown - just a matter of corners :D You're doing fantastic!!!

Sally Ann - welcome to the project!!!!! Looking forward to your progress.

Jaysen - you worry too much :p

Love to all,
Tina

Jaysen
10-15-2004, 11:26 PM
Not finished, but I'm done for now. I'll put on the final touches Monday consisting of extreme highlights and shadows and I'll be done with this one. I've dedicated the weekend to my christmas portraits.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Oct-2004/46838-attheedge8.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Oct-2004/46838-face6.jpg

SallyAnn
10-15-2004, 11:43 PM
WTG Jaysen! Looking good! I think if I had attempted the entire pic, it would take me til next Christmas! I started on her blouse tonight.. still fretting about the hair!!!!!!! SOOOoooooooo if anyone can enlighten me as to how to even attempt the hair.. please do!

Was looking through some of Boogies works.....is it me, or does he tend to use the same "face"????? in some of his portraits???

bjs0704
10-16-2004, 12:05 AM
Tina - Itís looking really great!

Barb - You have a nice start!

I would go back and try to make sure that her facial features look right!

You could proceed one of two ways. 1) Treat this as a brown monochrome and get the lights and darks as correct as you can.

2) Continue on with the color. Correcting whatever you have to as you go.

I found the tutorials (there is one for ďBougieĒ) on this site helpful!

http://www.sanders-studios.com/instruction/demos/intro_d.html

Sally Ann - That is a nice choice for a crop! You have got a really nice start! Your details of the face are nicely done!

Jaysen - Itís looking really nice! I particularly like the way that you did the folds in her skirt!

Barb Solomon :cat:

Squib
10-16-2004, 05:42 AM
Hi All :wave: ,

Sally Ann & Barb2 - great start on your paintings. Keep going !!!

Jaysen - it looks great - amazing what a little tweaking here and there will do. :clap:

Everyone else :clap: - Although I'm finished this one, I will still be checking in and following progress (and learning as I go). I am also wondering which of the others to start this coming week.

So...she if finished (I think). I just don't feel as though I want to work any further on this piece. It has consumed an awful lot of my painting time this month - most unusual for me - the fact that I actually did take SO much time. I keep thinking to myself "What's the rush", but I always feel that I need to get a move on, get the next one done, not enough time. Its like a race that I never actually finish. I just have to keep running - :confused:

What did I learn from this one ? Mostly patience, patience, patience - and a great appreciation for Boogie. He makes it look so effortless. I wonder if it was ? Was he agonising, painting and repainting as we do ? Was he happy with the end result (as we mostly never are) ? Thanks for all the encouragement. So..

Au Bord du Ruisseau - after Bouguereau
20" x 30"

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Oct-2004/35948-ab8.JPG

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Oct-2004/35948-ab7.JPG

dan9000
10-16-2004, 09:53 AM
Lorraine,

I think you're stopping at the right point, it looks done to me. You've really caught her expression, and I also really like the vividness of her skirt, and the mysterious quality of the woods in the background. Great job!

Dan

Jaysen
10-16-2004, 11:36 AM
Very good job, Lorraine! The painting really turned out well. The colors are rich and fantastic to look at. The expression and likeness are very good. I'm always amazed at the different steps paintings take, that's why I love this forum. You get to see all the pains taking intermediate steps people go through, which is the real learning point.

I know exactly what you mean about wanting to move on, Lorraine. That's why I'm quitting the Boug for now and working on something else. I'll probably go back to it next week, but now I'm so tired of working on it. It's so hard! hehe.

SallyAnn, did you ask about hair? I can't find it without going back. Anyway, I started by painting the entire surface of the hair with a thinned down wash of burnt umber, which turned out pretty light over my gray toned canvas. Then, after that had dried over night, I painted all the non-highlight portions with burnt sienna. Then I added burnt umber into the med-dark areas. Then, finally, I painted the deep shadows with a mix of burnt umber and prussian blue (almost black). Make sure you leave highlights on the crests of the bends, and have darkes where the hair folds down close to the scalp. To blend the hairline in with the forehead, I first painted my flesh tone on, then mixed in some raw umber, then wiped about 90% of the paint back off with a rag, which left a shadow/skin tone over the gray of the canvas.

JamieWG
10-16-2004, 04:43 PM
Oh, you are all soooo light years ahead of me and looking great! But just in case y'all think I've been slacking off.....

I spent two days shopping for a violet skirt. Grrrrrrrr......They are not to be found. I went to the fabric store, bought a drop-dead gorgeous violet velvet fabric and gold rope, and made the skirt last weekend. Now I have the girl, the skirt.....
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Oct-2004/13766-Sarah_holding_skirt_450.jpg
and a nearly identical scene outside my side door (She'll be sitting on the left side of that rock, just off the photo boundary, with the deep shadows and water behind her, just like in the painting. Flowers are from spring...now gone):
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Oct-2004/13766-blue_spikes_500.jpg
With a little luck from the weatherman above, tomorrow will be the day for sketches from life and a photo shoot for the painting. It's unlikely that I'll finish before the end of November, but I am on my way!

Jamie

SallyAnn
10-16-2004, 04:53 PM
JAYSEN! Thank you for that!!!!!!!!! Im letting what I have done so far dry.. and want to thicken it up a bit.. i painted very thinly....... but yes the hair for me is like OMG.. I dont know how to do it.. I guess I would have just painted dark bits and wondered why it looks like a wig! I have never gone to a class, so have no idea as to the "how to", and the books I have read have not really helped.. so having someone explain how they actually DID it has been most helpful ! I have only ever painted ONE portrait... and even though the face looked ok.. the hair was again lacking in realism....... sooooooooo.. tomorrow....... I shall tackle some of the hair. yay!

Im still in awe of everyones talent though.. :D

paintthepast
10-16-2004, 06:27 PM
Hello all,

This is my first posting to wetcanvas! I saw this thread and it peaked my interest. It also gave me something to test some new techniques on. I chose Le crepuscule to work on. My support size is about half the original at 12"x24". It is a canvas covered pintura wood panel. The first pic is a graphite sketch that I did directly on the panel and is attached.

CB.

paintthepast
10-16-2004, 06:34 PM
This next pic is of my sketch painted over with diluted ink.

CB.

JamieWG
10-16-2004, 06:37 PM
Butka, your sketch is beautiful! Can you tell us why you paint over it with ink? Does that set the graphite in some way?

jamie

Florian
10-16-2004, 07:02 PM
Bernie, WOW WOW WOW the under-painting looks fantastic and just in 13 hours. Looking forward to see your glazes, which colours will you use?

Tina, this is going to be a great painting, I like what you have so far.

SallyAnn good start, it looks fantastic!

Jason, it looks really great!

Lorraine, very good job, the skin tones are great as the whole painting is!
You are right, you need a lot of patience on this painting.

Jamie, Iím sure this will be a nice painting.

Butka, welcome to WC, your sketch is looking really good.

Great work everyone. :clap: :clap: :clap:

Unfortunately I didnít have time to paint this week, :( I worked two hours today and will paint tomorrow. So I should be able to post an update on Sunday evening.

Florian :wave:

WV.Artistry
10-16-2004, 09:37 PM
What? Do you *really* think that even Mr. Bougereau got it perfectly right the very first time? Like Richard said (I think that's who said it :p ), he's only human.

"...The artist is continually producing things good, mediocre, and bad. But what makes us artists is our power of judgement. Highly practiced and sharpened, it rejects, selects, rearranges until we are content."

I forget who said that, but I believe it to be true of everyone. *Everyone*

~!Carey

I've been misquoted :)

Your forgotten quotee might be Friedrich Nietzsche.

It's a small fact with significant consequences, but to raise money for his entry into art school, he painted the attendees of his church. I could make general predictions in my own skill improvement (and the effect on my approach) if I painted twenty-five portraits back-to-back, or even ten . . . five, fifty, one hundred -- there will be results.

Perhaps some artists are born, an anomaly, but others are created through circumstance. As for me, I can only hope that it's going to be a little of both.

Richard

TruEnuff
10-16-2004, 09:37 PM
Hi all you gifted and talented painters!
Another couple hours on Jeune fille au crochet.....and more insights about how little I know about oil painting! I have an mess of techniques...and as a result...a mess. But it is fun, and it is slowly taking shape. My normal medium is an alkyld type for fast drawing....but the gloss it leaves just doesn't work on a painting like this. So now, I'll have to start learning about mediums, something I've meticulously avoided til now! Hopefully, I'll be able to put in another two or three hours tomorrow. So far about five hours or so, I think.

Bruce

dan9000
10-16-2004, 11:38 PM
My next round of Le Crepuscule. I think I'm pretty close to done, except maybe for some touchups on the drapery, maybe adjustments to skin tone in some areas. (And does that bright green wave on the right look more like grass than water?) About 14 hours of work so far.

Dan

dan9000
10-16-2004, 11:44 PM
My next round of Le Crepuscule. I think I'm pretty close to done, except maybe for some touchups on the drapery, maybe adjustments to skin tone in some areas. About 14 hours of work so far.

Dan

dan9000
10-16-2004, 11:49 PM
Another couple hours on Jeune fille au crochet.....and more insights about how little I know about oil painting! I have an mess of techniques...and as a result...a mess.
Bruce
Bruce,

I don't think it's a mess at all. I like the warmth of the colors, and I think you have some nice dynamic brushwork going, especially on her arm and hand, that maybe gives it a more "modern" feel. (Whether that is good, bad or neutral you can decide for yourself. :) )

Dan

Biki
10-17-2004, 06:05 AM
i have been away for the weekend - but am itching to join you all.

Tina - your start is so very beautiful - & looking absolutely amazing.
Squib - i love the colour of the skirt you have chosen - it is so vibrant. What is that .?
butka - Welcome - lovely sketch. Looking forward to more from you
Dan - you the man.!!!!

Bruce - your drawing was awesome. I hope you can match it in paint. I don't know what to say to advise you coz i know nothing. but i think it must be just a little blockage you need to clear. You obvoiusly have a talent that needs transferring to a different medium. Don't forget you can just paint over .... & over & over & over in oils - they are so forgiving. I am really looking forward to watching you master this, as i am sure you will.

paintthepast
10-17-2004, 09:04 AM
All - thank you for your kind welcomes.

Jamie - the diluted ink doesn't set the graphite but does create a more permanent drawing for which to start from. I dilute the ink just enough so that the drawing will not be dark enough boldly show through the next stage which is the imprimatura.

-cb

Florian
10-17-2004, 02:09 PM
Bruce, I donít think itís a mess you did a god work so far, this is coming along very nice.

Dan, great work I like the skin tones well done!

Hereís an update of mine, still a lot to do.

Florian