Getting the correct age of a child

[Abu Haidar]

I had posted this in Pastel forum too. The model is my son when he was 4 yrs old, but you'll see the picture was older than 4 yrs old
To catch the real age of a model is my problem.. Give me your advices please

Derwent pencil on W&N paper

Abu Haidar

[djstar]

We all see things differently but in itself this is great.
I can only impart the stuff they told me long ago:
Little people have larger eyes, longer foreheads and the features are on the lower part of the head.
You may be drawing from your intellegence, not your insticts. You may even be measuring and wondering why it is not right. I was looking around to see if there is a posting about the dimensions of the head of the child.
You could have a career in age progressing lost children! I will keep looking for the rules of kids, but it is an amazing picture and I am sure your young man will grow into it!
dj*

[Leslie M. Ficcaglia]

I agree with dj* that this is very nicely and sensitively done. Good use of shading and colors, and his eyes are really expressive.

Getting the correct age of a child can be tough; it's something I've wrestled with as well. Try dj*'s pointers; your son perhaps has too little forehead and hair for a child of his age. But another thing I've also found, although I've never seen it written anywhere, is that very young children have less pronounced chins and their cheeks and jaws are rounder and softer-looking than older children. Sometimes moving the line of the jaw on either side of the chin downward slightly to make it fuller can be dramatic. Such changes can make the difference between a child who looks four and a child who looks seven. Check out your reference drawing and see whether those suggestions seem to make sense in your case.
Leslie

[Abu Haidar]

DJ Quotes :
You may be drawing from your intellegence, not your insticts. You may even be measuring and wondering why it is not right.
DJ, isn't it hard to interpret the theory into the real works ? I am always find a big problem... firstly I did my pre-drawing by using some points we used to do but when I moved the model's image to the paper..it didn't work. I will be waiting for your support to find the post you mentioned.
BTW, thnx DJ for ur comment...your works is my idol

DJ Quotes ; You could have a career in age progressing lost children! :D :D :D I will be one of NYPD's guy..

Thanks Leslie...
You gave nice comments. Chin, cheek and jaw..hmmm maybe u r correct. I will pay attention on those things and head shape of course...I will write your comments on my head..
Both of you and DJ .. thanks guys

[djstar]

Love those new personal messages!
I just showed this to Abu and he said POST IT:
djstar wrote on 10-10-2001 05:11 AM:
I played with your picture.
I looked for the rules and can't find them, but I was watching a little 6 year old girl today and thinking about this so I got home and did this little experiment:
First, I copied the eyes, nose and left the mouth.
Then I smudged all of the features but the mouth off the face.
Then I cut the poor boy in half below the ears and moved the head down so it would be rounder.
I smudged again and rounded the cheeks, skinnied the neck to make the head look rounder.
When I pasted in the eyes, I kept them the same size. Everything fit so well, I had to post it and see if it looks anything like your son.
You had all of the pieces right, you just need to measure WHAT YOU SEE, not what you think!
Ah, when we learn all the rules it is THEN and only then, we get to break them!!
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2001/Haidaryounger.jpg

AND I THINK HE LIKED IT!!!
dj*

[Abu Haidar]

Thanks DJ for your effort ..
Ha ha ha you are almost close to the real image...except for eyes, nose and mouth. But avaragely, at last, I can see the discrepancy view between my works and yours.
So, we forgot to put eyes, nose and mouth in our previous discourse...

I think it's better for us to put this post in discussion forum so we can invite our colleagues to talk about painting child's portrait..

BTW, you did it DJ.
I'll post my next work....and I need your work on it too.

Abu Haidar

[wendee]

abu Haidar...this was given to me by a portrait teacher...as you can see the line across the middle of the face on an adult goes through the eyes...on a young child there eyes are well below the middle line....hope this helps you...:D :D :D
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2001/adult.JPG http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2001/baby.JPG

[Leslie M. Ficcaglia]

Here are two versions of the same child. She's about two, and in the first picture I had her chin slightly more pronounced and her jaw not so full. After leaving the portrait for a few days and then comparing it with the reference photos I dropped the jawline slightly and made it softer and fuller, and also raised the hairline in the center a bit, to give her a higher forehead. And I made her eyes a little bigger, which is another typically childlike feature. The differences are subtle but I think they make her look more her age.

Leslie

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2001/erica1.jpg

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2001/erica2.jpg

P. S. Thanks, Wanda; it worked! This is much better!

[djstar]

Abu, I am sorry. It may be the language thing, but I think you said "the model is your son AT 4....but he is four years OLDER now!"
you ARE TRYING to age progress him!
Because we are sitting here trying to bring him back!
I see...
you want to know how to MATURE the features, not reshape the head...DUH
Last night was to late, this morning is too early... I will try again later.
THIS is a fun post... Definately challenging!
dj*

Anyone with a Mac that can talk Leslie through?
Here is my try at a bit older....http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/10-Oct-2001/Haidarolder.jpg

any better???

[wendee]

Leslie....I up load the pi..then i copy it..then paste it in the reply..then i go and up load the second pic and paste it underneath the other one.. then I submit it...hope this helps...:D :D

Djstar....I think that abu painted the portrait of his son fron a picture when he was four..and I think that he is not happy with it as he made him look older in the picture he painted...I hope this is what you are trying to say Abu...:D :D :D

[Abu Haidar]

Hi Wendee,

I see now. I'd got chin, jaw and head's shape from DJ. And now i'd got eyes from you...hmmm it's almost complete. But, you see..it's more easier to work without a model. We can put some lines, measure the distance between eyes technically. But we'll find a problem when work with a model, won't we ?
BTW, Thanks for your post. It's really help Do you think we should have a deep knowledge in anatomy first before drawing a portrait ??

Leslie, nice comparative drawing... your post had added my knowledge now. I need support from all of you since I never have any workshop or course in painting/drawing.

Thanks

Abu Haidar

[Abu Haidar]

DJ quotes :
Abu, I am sorry. It may be the language thing, but I think you said "the model is your son AT 4....but he is four years OLDER now!"

Wendee quotes
Djstar....I think that abu painted the portrait of his son fron a picture when he was four..and I think that he is not happy with it as he made him look older in the picture he painted...I hope this is what you are trying to say Abu...

DJstar Wendee is correct. She spoke for me.. Thanks Wendee. You did a great job DJstar. I took my son's photo as my reference and it was a year ago. He was 4 years old but the result of my work is disappointed me.. he looks like 7 or 8 years old. That's my problem...and I need the forum's help

DJstar Quotes :
THIS is a fun post... Definately challenging!

You see... This is really fun post. And yes, definately challenging

DJstar, Wendee and you Leslie... Thank you ...:clap: :D :D