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View Full Version : New Art Auction Site Poll


ptogel
01-19-2004, 11:21 AM
After beeing encouraged from other members here, I would like to know from you if you would support a new art auction site based on the following knowledge:


The auction site would be for "Art" only.
The auction site sale functions would be for WetCanvas members only.
The site would offer the same base functionality like eBay.
The fees would be lower than eBay.
Sellers would need to help marketing the site.

jocelynsart
01-19-2004, 11:49 AM
Yes, yes, yes, yes and yes.
I would think that it would need to be a sub site to WC, a link available, in order to start off with the contacts and audience that it would need.
I have thought about this for over a year now. WC is already a well known artists' site full of many wonderful artists so a sub-auction venue could really be successfull.
The only probelm is all the legal stuff and trying to avoid all the problems that eBay has. like alot of NPB, Fraudulent Sellers, Listing in Categories not pertaining to one's item, key word spamming, etc. This is due to the huge volume. I doubt with WC users being the only Sellers there would be problems on the listings side. I think there'd be less with an Art Specific auction site anyway.
Hope it can be a possibility one day! Some buyers are serious and they want to easily be able to find the type of artwork they are specifically looking for without searching through hoards of rip offs and factory art. Also,they want to be able to trust the Seller of the artwork totally.
Joss

surreal
01-19-2004, 12:05 PM
Hi,

I voted "no."

I am very much in favor of an "art only" auction site.
This would be simply marvellous!

If someone wanted to start his/her own auction site exclusively for selling art, there would be no problem getting WC artists to sell their art on this site.

If an auction function were added to Wet Canvas exclusively for WC members, the number of WC members would probably increase by at least 500%, after word got out.

The amount of work involved in having an art auction function on WC, would be astronomical and too much for volunteers to handle, IMHO.

If someone were to create his own art auction site, he would have hundreds of artists who would, doubtless, come on board from WC and elsewhere.

jocelynsart
01-19-2004, 12:16 PM
Nina, that is the one reason I never bothered to bring up the idea. But, if someone affiliated with WC, and approved after submitting a business plan and intentions and prototype site, to Scott, wanted to take this on as a business, then I think that could work. Is that what you are proposing as an idea PTogel? I get that impression. It would be affiliated with Wetcanvas but not the responsibility legally of WC owners I would gather.
No, WC volunteers could not do it, there'd have to be a whole staff of people, like any auction site has. Maybe some would have to be volunteer. I don't know how it would be designed and work. However, as a Forum of WC, no, it would be too much of a task.
Yes, totally true. There'd be people joining just to be able to auction artwork. That could really get huge and out of hand. One thign you would not want is things going wrong with Sellers and Buyers effecting WC in general. That is the major problem that I have always known that made me forget ever suggesting an Auction area of WC. It would be impossible to control all listing and transaction activity on the auctions.
Well, if the idea is accepted and ever goes through, then I'd definately use it. I think it would be a wonderful venue.
Joss

timelady
01-19-2004, 12:34 PM
Think about how many artists use eBay. A LOT! Now look at the quality of their art discussion board and then look at the quality of our Internet Sales board. Vast difference in quality, IMHO. We want artists to join Wetcanvas for the wealth of information, sharing knowledge, and a great (though sometimes challenging!) community. Not just because it would be another sales outlet.

My other concern (and I agree with those above) is that Wetcanvas is very well known - *amongst artists*. I think it would be ill-conceived to think that there's some huge audience of buyers here. In other words - for getting the bidders, we have little advantage over starting an auction site from scratch. And I think we all agree that getting the bidders is the important thing, not getting sellers. That's why we've all given up on places like Yahoo and others.

Tina.

jocelynsart
01-19-2004, 12:37 PM
Well, having just looked at 4WC listings on eBay, I guess we already do have a way for people browsing WC to find our artwork easily anyway. There are pages more than I recall seeing a few months ago. So, maybe it is kind of a redundant idea? I don't know. I could see alot of us still staying on eBay because of the huge exposure and established name they already have. There is pages more than I recall seeing a few months ago.

surreal
01-19-2004, 12:44 PM
Think about how many artists use eBay. A LOT! Now look at the quality of their art discussion board and then look at the quality of our Internet Sales board. Vast difference in quality, IMHO. We want artists to join Wetcanvas for the wealth of information, sharing knowledge, and a great (though sometimes challenging!) community. Not just because it would be another sales outlet.............................

Tina.

I agree with you completely!

There is a strong potential for the quality of the WC forum to be severely comprised by the addition of an art auction site.

surreal
01-19-2004, 12:53 PM
The more thought I put into this auction site idea, the more negatives I come up with.
Negatives:
*complaints about auction listings
*potential for lawsuits

I think I will do some artwork now.
;)

jocelynsart
01-19-2004, 01:27 PM
Lol! I know. You can't totally control what people choose to do business wise and it would affect WC naturally. It would have to be a total independant art auction only site I guess. Then it would be barren for a long time, like the other new sites.
Alot of the regular people on the eBAy A&A board are great. It is the anonymous bad apples, some of the general eBay lurkers I am sure, and anonymous trouble makers that ruin it. There are many long time regulars that are great and a couple very knowledgeable people. It is the anonymity that is possible there that is not here. That is the difference. It is too bad. I have actually learned alot of things at the beginning of selling art on eBay from people there, before I was on WC.
Was taking a break but going back to paint too! lol
Joss

blondheim12
01-19-2004, 03:19 PM
My other concern (and I agree with those above) is that Wetcanvas is very well known - *amongst artists*. I think it would be ill-conceived to think that there's some huge audience of buyers here. In other words - for getting the bidders, we have little advantage over starting an auction site from scratch. And I think we all agree that getting the bidders is the important thing, not getting sellers. That's why we've all given up on places like Yahoo and others.

Tina.

I agree completely. Most buyers are not artists, so you cannot presume that WC would bring in buyers.
Love,
Linda

jocelynsart
01-19-2004, 04:02 PM
I guess that is probably true. That was one reason why I never bothered to use 4WC in my auctions on eBay. I never considered other artists prospective clients or buyers. I would not want to be advertising to other artists either.
I don't see the point in having banner ads on here then if that is the case too; if visitors to the site are mostly artists. I just came to the assumption, through various comments as well as the presence of people's banner ads, that there were people that visited WC who were not maybe artists but interested in art, finding artists, etc. If not, then the point above is a very valid one that I did not think of.

surreal
01-19-2004, 04:16 PM
HI,
I know from personal experience and the experience of other WC members, that there are many artists on WC who are art collectors, too!

There is an audience of art buyers amongst WC members.
:)

timelady
01-19-2004, 04:25 PM
Not saying we aren't collectors. I'm a collector, though I tend to buy at galleries. I do own a few WC members' work. But I don't think there's enough of us to make up a large buying audience. Or to buy in enough quantity and raise the bids high. :) (and my instincts about the banner ads are along the same lines, much as I'd like to support WC)

Tina.

ElizaLeahy
01-19-2004, 04:41 PM
I have a few ideas that might make it a little less scarey.

1. Don't make it for WC only. That will take the "oh my god they are only joining so they can sell" away

2. DO! have it juried!!!! This means that we could have a say in who can sell - and keep those $1 reproductions away!

I have a mailing list of a few hundred customers. I can't say that all of them would buy there, but at least I could tell them about it.

surreal
01-19-2004, 05:10 PM
Not saying we aren't collectors. I'm a collector, though I tend to buy at galleries. I do own a few WC members' work. But I don't think there's enough of us to make up a large buying audience. Or to buy in enough quantity and raise the bids high. :) (and my instincts about the banner ads are along the same lines, much as I'd like to support WC)

Tina.

I am still against an art auction site on WC for the reasons I mentioned above.

But if any one or more folk here at WC, would like to try to set up an art auction site, I think they might achieve success.

Firstly they would have hundreds of art sellers at WC who might want to give it a whirl.

Secondly, many of our WC artists have followings on ebay and many artists, similar to Eliza, have mailing lists which include avid buyers of theirs.

I am certain that many buyers would follow their artists to whatever venue they decide to sell their art at. And then there is the word of mouth phenomena - buyers telling their friends where a great place is to purchase art. :)

CarlyHardy
01-19-2004, 05:27 PM
The auction site sale functions would be for WetCanvas members only

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An art auction site just for WC members would be too limiting. And would completely change the makeup of our 4WC group as it stands today. The history of this forum can be seen in how the members all pull together when someone runs into a problem with buyers or with Ebay.

Some of you may not remember, but EBSQ actually did begin an art only auction site in conjunction with their website group. I listed a few pieces on it before it was pulled....and the site was beginning to have some decent sales!! Ebay offered a deal to EBSQ for a prominent advertising link from the Arts category front page to ebsq and set up the Self Representing Artists category in return for removing the auction site. Since those were two of the main things EBSQ wanted to accomplish...the auction site bit the dust. Sometimes I wonder how well it would have gone if the deal had gone differently!

I do believe there is a market out there for a site which offers only art thru an auction format, but I also know that it would take a lot of effort on the part of all concerned to get it up and running and make it worth the effort.....and then I think Ebay would probably make an offer that the owner couldn't possibly refuse, and it would get gobbled up! LOL

carly

prtpix
01-19-2004, 05:53 PM
E-Bay's Motto - mINE mINE miNE
and so the monopoly goes on.

TeAnne
01-19-2004, 05:57 PM
I voted, "I don't know" due to the fact that I don't know enough about these things. Ebay is scarey enough!

JoyJoyJoy
01-19-2004, 08:29 PM
... Ebay offered a deal to EBSQ for a prominent advertising link from the Arts category front page to ebsq and set up the Self Representing Artists category in return for removing the auction site. Since those were two of the main things EBSQ wanted to accomplish...the auction site bit the dust. Sometimes I wonder how well it would have gone if the deal had gone differently! carly

Carly... thanks for that information. Very interesting.

The fact that eBay "gobbles up" any possibly viable competitive art auction site is THE VERY REASON why we artists need to consider supporting, as a group, a new art auction site. Obviously, eBay made an offer because the EBSQ site was going to be successfull! That means that, with the support of Wetcanvas artists, a new art auction site could certainly be successful. After all, we have almost 35,000 active, working artists here!

Like many Wetcanvas artists, I have been looking for a good internet place to sell art... other than eBay, which has become so much more difficult for us with the mass-marketers crashing in this summer and fall. I realize there are many questions and problems to consider... but, no business would ever open if someone did not take the risk, despite the possible problems. Someone took a risk to start eBay!!!!! If someone took the initiative to open a new art auction site now, they have more knowledge than that eBay originator... and can use the positives of eBay and avoid/solve most of the problems of eBay and small, unsuccessful auction sites.

Until someone takes the risk, all we will ever have is eBay... which is failing us now. I cannot help start or manage the site, but will certainly support it to the best of my ability by listing and by marketing the site as "THE PLACE FOR ART ON THE INTERNET."

I believe it can be done. Nance

jocelynsart
01-19-2004, 08:51 PM
Wow , Joy, it makes one totally get excited about this again! True, people that are willign to take risks are usually the ones who achieve things.
I do agree that eBay would not have bothered with getting rid of an EBSQ art auction venue if it was not a serious threat of competition for selling art on eBay. Though, I know little about EBSQ or about the occurance of that buy out.
I really wish that there was a better site for auctioning art too and have for a long time. I wanted to see this possible on eBay but I have sadly come to the conclusion that it is not really possible. Artwork needs a venue of a more specific flavour and attitude than eBay. It needs it's own identity and marketing campaign. But, I will continue to remain on eBay as I do really enjoy the opportunity for alot of people to find my work that is possible with the Web.
I too would be willing to support an art auction site affiliated with WC. Definately would be willing to pay commission fees that went to WC instead of eBay for sure, for auctioning.
Enjoyed reading your words Joy.

dorith
01-19-2004, 09:11 PM
hi everyone,

thanks for your continued input on this - we're still looking into our options and possibilities at this point, as well as collecting input for the whole thing.
please keep your comments coming.

any auction site specific wishlists, requirements etc. you can mail to me or peter, and we'll see, if it is feasable.

CarlyHardy
01-19-2004, 10:53 PM
Just for clarification....Ebay did not pay EBSQ to stop the auction site....they made a trade which was benificial to both themselves and to EBSQ.

I would definitely support another art auction site...even a small one in its beginning stages if it could lead to a portion of the activity on Ebay from the art category! I believe there are buyers who would follow their favorite artists as long as the service and the quality of the artwork remained the same.

carly