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Antoine
01-16-2004, 09:56 PM
Hi everyone,

I suddenly found myself in a mud fight today with my impossible client. I’m saying this in a new thread cause the previous got so long and story toke a new turn. Previous thread: (http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=152449)

As she threatened me, she also gave me my negative, eventually after many letters to ebay decided to leave one back this morning … got another neg myself… LOL. Although tempting to leave another, it would just end up in me getting another and I have said what I wanted to… so I’ll leave there for now.

What I was wondering is regarding square trade. Do they only remove negs if the other party agrees? I know some here have dealt with them, are they worth a shot?

Otherwise perhaps I should offer to buy any extremely small & affordable works you have available in order to collect feedback & move my negs down to the next page a.s.a.p. Anyone have some 1 x 1” drawings on auction? :D

prtpix
01-16-2004, 10:23 PM
I would save it for later. I think you might appreciate giving her another one to brighten her day a while from now. Sorry you had to put up with this awful person. I hope she get what she deserves in the end.

CarlyHardy
01-16-2004, 11:52 PM
I had to go back and catch up with the older thread....but I knew she would leave a negative. Even if you had met all of her demands....she as much as told you that she was going to leave a neg.

I really admire how you've handled this situation with a professional attitude. Looking at her feedback sure reveals a story! I know that this won't effect future sales for you because you're a "class act"!

carly

arteitaliana
01-17-2004, 12:12 AM
You should respond to her negatives and give her the second one.
By the way all negatives left by the same person only count as one.
Square Trade will remove the negatives if both parties agree. It will cost you $20. That's how I got my negative removed.

R

dorith
01-17-2004, 12:18 AM
hi antoine,

it was to be expected - but don't worry about it at all: you handled everything perfectly, so really, those negs are kind of like a badge of honor for not totally losing your wits because of this nasty person...:)

since they are both from the same idiot, people will surely be able to tell who you were dealing with: with all the spelling errors and contradictions (3 times shipping, then 8 times shipping?? :p ) it's quite obvious who's at fault there - and since the shipping costs seem to be her only nitpick, people will probably doublecheck your shipping costs closer, before bidding, and that's about it. so no real loss there, i think. could've been a lot worse...
yay! for you, for handling this unpleasant experience so well. your talent is exceptional, both artwise and businesswise!

nanabanana
01-17-2004, 12:51 AM
Antoine,
ouch sorry to hear you had nightmare bidder. Wow it's coincidencefunny you mention buying tiny affordable artwork ..I have exactly such project, actually it was on my "to do list" for a while - minis 1x1 --3x3 selling from .99 - $1.99 a piece. I have to have annual sales otherwise I'd be buried in art. probably mixed media, digital etc all mixed in...

I'm thinking of putting it in a dutch auction format and winners will get a random piece out of total of 50-75 advailable ones. otherwise it's too much work and ebay fees to be listing it individually.

Time: I will list this promotional sale on thursday 1/22/04 --> under the clearance tab in my ebay store. It's going to be an auction item. ... sorry can't list any earlier .. I have exams on wed. feel free to bid :)

surreal
01-17-2004, 01:13 AM
Hi Antoine,
I agree with Rita in that you should leave her a 2nd neg.

:)

imaginethat
01-17-2004, 07:47 AM
Antoine - definitely leave her a second negative - she can only leave you as many negs. as she purchased items from you - I didn't check but am assuming it was two auctions?...so she can't leave more.

One idea for you should you wish to up your feedback is to list some small, inexpensive art with BINS - tell us all about the auction listings - and we'll come buy everything up from you so we can leave you glowing feedback!!! I'm sure we'd all be thrilled to get a little art from an up and coming ebay artist who one day we will never be able to afford!!! :) A very simple idea would be to purchase some plain greeting cards and envelopes and paint some simple Valentine's pictures on each - then sell each individually at auction....cheap to ship too. "Don't give your loved one a store bought card this Valentine's Day - give them original art that truly says I love you. The memory of this special day can be framed as a keepsake for years of enjoyment." Just an idea!!! :)

TeAnne
01-17-2004, 08:30 AM
You could also make her sweat. Drop the other boot on the 90th day. :evil:
Really, it's up to you. :)

Hey I got some cheepies going :D I give good FB :D ;)

kiwicockatoo
01-17-2004, 01:39 PM
As a sometimes buyer, I do check out feedback, and when I see a neg like this I will check up on the person who left it. Anyone who checks out this lady's feedback will see right away that she's a total raving loony. I would just buy a few things to get some more feedback. Almost everything you can think of is up for sale on ebay at really good prices. I buy books, art supplies, toys for my kids - things I can't afford to buy otherwise because I'm flat broke. Why don't you look for something you'd buy anyway off ebay?

I really think this will just be a small bump in the road for you, although I can imagine this is devistating for you now just starting out. I don't think this lady will be long for ebay. Very soon I don't think anyone will be selling to her. As a seller, I always check out a buyer's negs. Luckily I haven't come across someone bad enough to retract a bid.

Ebay sucks sometimes - if she threatened you and you have proof (her emails) ebay should not have allowed this neg to stay on your record. I guess us small fish are just at their mercy. :mad:

Antoine
01-17-2004, 06:46 PM
Mariann, Carly, Rita, Dorith, Nana, Nina, Susan & Kiwi many thousands of thanks for all your comments!! I’ve been feeling like I’ve been complaining about this whole situation for so long you must be tired off by now LOL :D

Last night & this morning I’ve really felt down about all this. I’ve been considering starting over with a new ebay ID but to do it on the same email I’ll have to close the old & let all clients know bla bla…
But after reading all your comments I’ve felt so so much better. I’ve been wanting to collect some of my favorite artist’ work for a while & this is the perfect opportunity. Nana, I’m in! I’ll be on the lookout on Thursday.

Susan, your idea is excellent. I’ve been thinking about it and desided to do something similar. I’ve recently done 5 paintings for a valentines exhibit in London. I’ve decided to sell some prints of them probably from Monday. So my id I’ll keep. ;)

surreal
01-19-2004, 07:28 PM
Hi Antoine,
Your "impossible client" now has 2 negs.

It would be marvellous, imho, if you would grace her with a 3rd neg, which she so rightly deserves!

:)

prtpix
01-20-2004, 07:32 AM
The person who left her the other neg has -1 as their feedback record.
Looks like one of her previous victims got so pi$$ed that they got a new E-Bay ID just for the purpose of negging her. Possibly one of the people she neggd even though they gave her a positive early and had no ammunition to shoot back.
I say "Good For Them.
We gotta have a way to fight back with jerks like emob.

TeAnne
01-20-2004, 08:00 AM
emob spelt the other way is bome =bomb. grrrrrrrrr

Antoine
01-20-2004, 08:58 AM
LOL!!! I saw the negative and could not help giggling. :p

What I really found interesting about this transaction of hers is the feedback she then left for ‘gls321’ (who gave her her 2nd neg) : “seller wanted cheapest shipping-no insurance! loss is not my fault!CAUTION!”

In another recent transaction she sold a jersey to ‘andshewas99’. This client of hers left her a positive saying “pkg damaged; sweater was XL, not L as described, still very nice” (all that but still a positive!) ebmob1 replied in a neutral: “demage of the package not my fault! sorry for wrong sizebut runs like a large!”

So if the packages she sends gets lost or gets damaged it is not her problem but if she buys something and she claims it was damaged (I still doubt it was but anyway) even after being offered a full refund she still throws her toys out of her cot. –how’s that for double standards???

Regarding leaving her another neg… my instinct somehow tells me to leave it there. I have said what I wanted to and I believe in karma. I think all the wrong she throws out there will come back to her. (if it’s not already) She has made herself so many enemies it unbelievable...

prtpix
01-20-2004, 09:12 AM
:crying: Oh Antoine, Please, Please leave the other neg.
It won't hurt you at all. The more negs she has the more urgently people are going to do research on her before they purchase or deal with her.
I can't believe I am begging you. Please Please. She really deserves it.
The only reason the others are not leaving the negs is because they already left positives or are afraid she will leave them a neg in return. She has already zapped you and others how many times.
It makes me sick to think about it. I can't even stand to freaking read this any more. You have the damn power to give her another one and you sit on it. I'm gone. :crying: :mad:

TeAnne
01-20-2004, 09:14 AM
So if the packages she sends gets lost or gets damaged it is not her problem but if she buys something and she claims it was damaged (I still doubt it was but anyway) even after being offered a full refund she still throws her toys out of her cot. –how’s that for double standards???

...
Exactly. the b*tch.

surreal
01-20-2004, 09:16 AM
..............................................
Regarding leaving her another neg… my instinct somehow tells me to leave it there. I have said what I wanted to and I believe in karma. I think all the wrong she throws out there will come back to her. (if it’s not already) She has made herself so many enemies it unbelievable...

I like your thinking.
Nice philosophical approach!
:)

prtpix
01-20-2004, 09:25 AM
How does one stop getting updates in E-Mail about a certain thread they are subscribed to?

Antoine
01-20-2004, 09:31 AM
I would save it for later. I think you might appreciate giving her another one to brighten her day a while from now.

Please leave the other neg.


I am seriously considering what to do... ??? :confused: :(

prtpix
01-20-2004, 09:43 AM
I am just so upset about this whole thing. I feel like I want to stomp on this emob person myself. But, I have no power to do so. But, You have one more and are reluctant to use it even though she deserves it. Even though like Rita says above "all negatives left by the same person only count as one".
That only means that it will only cause one minus in her overall feedback rating. If she gets 2 negs from one person it will still show as 2 negs in the chart.

jocelynsart
01-20-2004, 09:51 AM
Hi Antoine: I would not worry too much and just go forward. Your work is beautiful and earthy and you should do fine. Your responses and your negs sound sane compared to hers. Anyone who is interested in your auctions and checks out the circumstances of those negs will see her for the nut that she is.
I just happened to notice all the Retracted bids she has had too. She has retracted 14 bids. She really is something. Everyone goes through quirky periods, this one seems to be permanently off her rocker.
Leave her a second neg if you feel she deserves it and it will help others be certain who Not to deal with.
Good luck Antoine.
:) Joss

Antoine
01-20-2004, 09:52 AM
Even though like Rita says above "all negatives left by the same person only count as one".
That only means that it will only cause one minus in her overall feedback rating. If she gets 2 negs from one person it will still show as 2 negs in the chart.

And exactly the same will go for me … I will get another myself (at this moment we have one feedback each left). So exactly as much as I will harm her with another red ‘-‘ I will harm myself with the one she’ll give me.

Receiving her 2nd negative hurt more than I thought it would. I did expect it when I left her her neg. Yes, she does deseve every single neg she could get!!!! …. But do I really deserve a 3rd ?

Antoine
01-20-2004, 09:56 AM
Everyone goes through quirky periods, this one seems to be permanently off her rocker.

Thanks Joss :)

jocelynsart
01-20-2004, 11:05 AM
Hi Antoine: In this case, I would, if it were me, probably leave it now. Unless you feel there is some point that you further need to have seen on her FB, that has not been made yet, your negs pretty well sum it up now.
It is your call. You are the one that will be getting the neg so it is up to you how you feel. If you feel that you want to leave it and move on now, then do that.
Letting someone really upset you to the point that your painting and your demeanor suffers is not worth it. I have let that happen in the past and it really is detrimental. I have made the decision myself to refuse to let hurtful people bother me as much as possible anymore and go about my business. There are many great, nice and repsectful Buyers out there who we love dealing with.
Do what will give you the best benefit for your peace of mind.
Joss :)

vklum
01-20-2004, 03:36 PM
Antoine,

My $.02 here...if you were to use your remaining feedback to leave a neg., as long as you're doing it in the spirit of warning other people about what she's like to deal with, you shouldn't need to worry about karma. On the other hand, the way that miserable witch is dealing with people on eBay, she most definitely should worry about her karma. And if I were a part of her everyday life, I'd make sure I wasn't anywhere near her when her karma finally barfs all over her! :eek: :evil:

You have to follow your gut on this one. Hold onto it for now...maybe it's a nice enough feeling for you to just know you can leave her a neg.

Of course, whatever you decide, we're all right behind you...no, make that right beside you. Shoulder-to-shoulder, to make sure miserable people like this woman don't ruin eBay for everyone.

Antoine
01-20-2004, 06:16 PM
When I started out on ebay in mid Nov I was as excited as could be. I’ve been riding the roller coaster of being a full time artist for over 8 years and like you all know, having one great exhibition and then having months without a cent income. The prosperity of having a kind of regular income no matter how small was something to get all excited about.

In Des when this nightmare with this person began I was stunned, how could people like that exist? I was lucky to have the support of everyone at WC & although I kind of expected it, when I saw that first neg. I was really very upset. The second neg upset me more than I ever thought it would (that one I knew I’d get). I really felt like giving up / starting over with a new ID. With the support I got from here I decided to pick up my chin again & simply work harder and try to move those negs into the distant past as soon as I possibly could.

I know all the negs from one person counts as one on the percentage but it still shows on your profile & very clearly on your feedback page. Is it so wrong to just want to move on? Marianne, I know you are upset with me and I’m really sad about that. Besides for one lost bidder ebay have already basically died for me & I do not feel I could take another red slap on my profile. Does this make any sense to you?

I have already left her a neg saying what happened & referring to her ‘feedback for others’. There is not really much more I could say so why through another piece of mud her way to just receive one back that will hurt just more? (more ‘cause I’m sure I’m way more sensitive than her)

Joss, you are very right. I should not let it bother me but sometimes things are easier said than done ;) . This is part of why I just want to put it all behind me a.s.a.p. This dreadful person has already stolen way too much of my energy.

Victoria, thank you so very much for the support.

kjsspot
01-20-2004, 06:35 PM
. –how’s that for double standards???...

:::ahem::: I believe the word is Hypocrite! :mad:

CarlyHardy
01-20-2004, 06:35 PM
I am seriously considering what to do... ??? :confused: :(

If you do leave the third negative, wait awhile so that all three won't be stuck right together.
carly

dorith
01-20-2004, 07:30 PM
hi antoine,

somehow, i can understand your sentiments about this - especially since you're just starting out...
so my suggestion to you is: leave her the neg feedback, and then close your account and open a new one - cut your losses and start over....

your art is beautiful and honestly i think you will do really well on ebay - just make sure you block her from your new auctions.
it would be quite different if you already had hundreds of fb's, but since it's still within "starting range", it might be wiser to just start over, especially if it bothers you so much.

jocelynsart
01-20-2004, 08:09 PM
Actually, Antoine, starting with a new ID is not a bad idea. You'd be totally free of worrying about this. You could email any interested buyers and let them know even before you do it.
If your work was being noticed before, it'll soon be noticed again.
Block that one before you even list! lol
Joss

prtpix
01-20-2004, 08:23 PM
I just want to put it all behind me a.s.a.p.
This is never gonna be behind you.
As long as you have this ID you will be reminded of this everytime you look at your feedback.

I have E-Bay ID's that are almost as old as E-Bay is.
I have a bunch of ID's with E-Bay that I do different things with.
And I know how easy it is to aquire a new ID.

Ebay has never given me any problems about having multiple ID, I have all of them registered with my real name, and they all have the same credit card and bank account attatched to them. E-Bay doesn't seem to care at all. The only thing they do is remind me at my first and original E-Mail address that someone has just registered using my credit card number and they say that if this is OK with me, I should just ignore the message.
It's as easy as that.

The couple of negs that I have on old ID's still bother me when I go look at those memberships. But, I can happily say that those negs do not bother my current and future customers.

I'm not trying to hide anything from them. I am just setting myself as far away from them as I can so it does not bother me as much.

surreal
01-20-2004, 11:17 PM
.....This is never gonna be behind you.
As long as you have this ID you will be reminded of this everytime you look at your feedback.....


Hi Mariann,
I wouldn't assume that Antoine would feel the same way about having a neg as you do. :)
Our personalities are all very different. :)
Knowing myself, I would probably dwell on the neg for quite awhile. ;)
But after the wonderful positive feedback comments start streaming in, I would just see the neg for what it is - a neg from a crackpot!

I have a friend who has 1 or 2 negs and is now a power seller on ebay. She has never once discussed her negs with me.
As far as ebay selling goes, she just tells me about how much money she is earning on ebay!

I guess what I am saying is, "different strokes for different folks."
:D

prtpix
01-21-2004, 06:38 AM
The negs must bother her. What is this thread about.

Nina, You are right that people can feel different about negs. But, It is obvious that Antoine is disturbed by it other wise this thread would not have started up again. I was just trying to help her the only way I know how. :eek:

We all knew that once she left her neg she was going to get another one in return. It really does upset her. I don't blame her for being upset. I can't make her feel different. I can only offer her information on how to truely move on. Myself, I am not one to be able to ignore it. Some people, NOT ALL, like things to be perfect. And having even 1, 2, or 3 negs on a feedback rating of over 400 positives can make some people feel sick. I don't know why some of us are effected this way. We just are. I'm not saying Antoine definataly feels this way. It seems to me like she does. So, It doesn't hurt to know how others who feel this way deal with it. It might sound rediculous to leave a feedback rating of 400+ positives and only 1 or 2 negatives in the past. To be honest. It felt good for me to start anew. And if I can do it at 400+ I thought it might be doable for Antoine with 17 positives.
It might be better to move on now than wait until the feedback rating is much higher.

But, On another hand. One never knows when another emob can show up and ruin things again. There is no way of telling and noway of protecting ourselves from unreasonable people popping in on us like that. They are definatley out there. And it might really seem silly to run away when one shows up. But, If it bothers us. It's the only way I know that satisfies me to put it behind me. :)

madmum
01-21-2004, 07:00 AM
Antoine, you should do whatever you feel is best! It's wrong to let this lunatic affect you to the point where the rest of your life is affected. Moving on might be the best option for you.

I have to say how beautiful your copper plate nudes are, I am so tempted to bid, they're both bargains at that price (and framed!) I wish my sales were better :(

Ruth

impressionist2
01-21-2004, 07:14 AM
Let me switch into buyer/bidder mode for this one. I don't think I've seen 100% feedback lately on almost all the auctions I've bid on. As long as I see 97% or above, I'll bid, especially if there's a Lot of feedback. It's difficult for sellers to avoid the crackpots All the time, and some "pots" slip through the "cracks". :p

Any of us who sell know this, and most buyers understand that. I read the sellers positives as well as the negatives. Especially is there's been no problem for a year, I understand that one of the "pots" got to them.

I still have 100% feedback, but that could change if a totally unreasonable person comes along. I have little patience for trouble and I have a healthy blocked bidder list. Some are from tales of woe heard in this forum. It's good to share.

Renee

prtpix
01-21-2004, 07:24 AM
Renee,
It is true. Buyers do understand. And it is good to point that out.
I do a lot of purchasing on E-Bay and even though I know how awful a neg on my own feedback makes me feel. I have never held even few against a seller who has a good amount of positives.

Antoine has to do what she can best deal with. We all do. And what Nina says is true to."different strokes for different folks."
We can only offer her advice.

But, If I could I would send emob and all those like her to the dogs. LOL :evil:

Antoine
01-21-2004, 10:14 AM
I really and truly appreciate all the advice I’m getting here. To hear everyone’s point of view really helps to takes everything into consideration. :)

Firstly it is not really the negs what bothers me. It’s there effect. I have not been on ebay long enough to know the trends. But form what I have done so far, I had a feel of what was working for me. For instance, I have not done one single drawing on black paper that did not sell. In fact the average bid between 20 of them was 3. Now suddenly they are expiring without bids. That gave me the impression that regardless of how I feel of the negs it does have an influence on my clients. I felt pushing the negs down would help in time, but simply did not want to add a third one to them.

I decided I will see how it goes with my current auctions and then decide. Regarding opening a new ID, it is right that I’m still pretty new. To push the negs of the first page of my current ID will take another 22 positives – more that I even have. I know if the negs move on, their effect will just about disappear, but it would almost make more sense to put the effort onto something clean. Yes, another loony person could come along again, but since I had my share, I think the odds are on my side :D .

Should I decide to start using a new ID, I’d obviously leave her another lovely neg.
I will NOT close my old ID. As far as I know it will mean it will be so much easier for Ebmob (the ebay-mob) to have the negs taken off & I think it appear by them that the id does not exist anymore.

Everone, thank you ;)

jocelynsart
01-21-2004, 10:18 AM
Hi Antoine: I was thinking....she may even give you a third neg later on anyway, regardless of you not giving her a third. She may be waiting till the last moment already. It's just a thought I had realizing she still has a FB comment available, having bought 3 paintings?
What you could maybe do is open a second Seller ID and list some on that, to see if the lack of bidding is truly a result of your negs.
Joss

Antoine
01-21-2004, 10:33 AM
What you could maybe do is open a second Seller ID and list some on that, to see if the lack of bidding is truly a result of your negs.

Good idea! I think I might very well do that.

You are also right about the chance of her leaving the neg later, I thought of that but figured this woman have such a long list of enemies she would probably be busy spoiling someone else’s day later or perhaps since I also have one left she might prefer not getting another herself… then again never ever underestimate someone like her ! :evil:

Antoine
01-27-2004, 10:20 AM
Just for the record – Bianca / Ebmob1 have just received another neg. (from me :evil: )

surreal
01-27-2004, 10:23 AM
Just for the record – Bianca / Ebmob1 have just received another neg. (from me :evil: )

Excellent News!!!
:D :D :D

TeAnne
01-27-2004, 10:24 AM
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: Good girl ~^..^~ I don't like what she replied though :(Excellent News!!!
:D :D :D

nanabanana
02-02-2004, 01:22 AM
Antonia - .. just a note: I just listed a bunch of cheap minis at .99 each. in earlier post i promised to list some cheap items to help push that neg down so here it is! Originally I think you or someone with bidder id very close to your's had bid but I had to cancel cuz didn't have my items ready.