PDA

View Full Version : Pen and Ink


theBongolian
04-02-2019, 11:58 AM
It's always bothered me that this art form is called "Pen and Ink". You don't see other art forms referred to in this way such as "brush and acrylic", "oil and canvas", "hands and clay", "glue and paper" etc. What else do you fill your pens with? Could there be a better term than "pen and ink" to describe your work?

Payne's Grey
04-02-2019, 03:11 PM
Hi Bongolian,

In my mind, "Pen and Ink" is a distinguished and honored name for the magnificent drawings and writings that reach back as far as the reed pens of ancient Egypt and maybe even farther in ancient Asia. Fine line Pen and Ink has been used for under-drawings and finished art by Da Vinci, Cennini, Bellini, Giovanni, Durer, and most other artists since. Pen and Ink calligraphy was raised to a high art by the Aramaic and Hebrew writers in their biblical writings and illuminated inkings. In more modern times, the draughtsmen who illustrated our architecture, our books, newspapers and magazines for many decades were famous and respected men of their era. From fine art to illustrative sketches and cartoons, all this was called Pen and Ink and definitely enhanced human history. No, in my humble opinion, I don't think there is a superior term for the stark and graphic line work we call "Pen and Ink."

laika
04-02-2019, 06:54 PM
I never thought about it, but might it be to distinguish between the brush work style so dominant in traditional Eastern art and calligraphy? I think a practical metal nib would be of fairly recent invention compared to the ancient brush and ink tradition.

Charlie's Mum
04-03-2019, 11:45 AM
You're entitled to your opinion but I think John's answer explains it all!:)

** There are separate arguments for making fewer forums and just saying e.g 'Oils', Acrylics, Drawing, Watercolour, ........ or even simpler, ... Wet Mediums, Dry Mediums ....... or... Drawing... Painting!:)
Sculpture is not very busy here in either soft or hard materials ........ I could get into hot water with some!:lol:

pedlars pen
04-03-2019, 03:21 PM
You're entitled to your opinion but I think John's answer explains it all!:)

** There are separate arguments for making fewer forums and just saying e.g 'Oils', Acrylics, Drawing, Watercolour, ........ or even simpler, ... Wet Mediums, Dry Mediums ....... or... Drawing... Painting!:)
Sculpture is not very busy here in either soft or hard materials ........ I could get into hot water with some!:lol:

Yes, John says it all :thumbsup:

Maureen - I would lose interest here entirely if mediums were grouped together on the basis of linguistic convenience rather than similarity or shared interest, it's quite mad ! :confused:
I would have no paticular interest in watercolour painting , or oil painting nor pastels nor even pencil drawing.
The very reason I like WC. is that I can share,learn about & discuss the minuteai of P&I in the most geeky manner, no doubt :lol:, it is my specialist interest.
Some very serious P&I work has always has been presented here on occasion & this art forms' depths delved into. I'm afraid I cannot see that happening amongst a more generalised group of artists.
Still, we all know that the whole forum format is dying everywhere. Maybe all posts should be dummed down & limited to a couple of lines or even better just a "like" button ?
Come on WC. people are you not old enough to know that what goes around comes around ?
Mike :crying:

Jerry Campbell
04-04-2019, 06:06 PM
Pen and ink, as opposed to brush and ink.
It also implies a pen to which ink is added.
I've never seen ball-point pen work described as 'pen and ink'.

pedlars pen
04-04-2019, 06:51 PM
Pen and ink, as opposed to brush and ink.
It also implies a pen to which ink is added.
I've never seen ball-point pen work described as 'pen and ink'.

Well I've seen plenty of ballpoint here on the P&I forum in the past if that makes a difference ?
You are right though it is absolutely not usually as "pen & ink".
How far to you wish to take this conversation though ? What about brush pens ? What do you mean that's not P&I ? it is a pen & uses ink.:confused:
Let's not get hung up about the definition.
For the purposes of this forum ,if you use ink delivered by any means it is P&I as far as I understand.
Mike

Charlie's Mum
04-05-2019, 10:44 AM
Don't worry Mike - I'd never advocate lumping forums together just because some are done with a brush/water/whatever ....... but these arguments have been proffered by others!

Our forum title says -
A forum for the discussion and display of work made with pen and ink. Added brush and colour mediums are accepted but must be less than 50% of the work.
.. for me, an ink work done only with brush(es) is a painting not a pen and ink so I only include any of mine here if they are 50% penwork ....... and pen and ink drawings are totally different from paintings in technique and style.

Mind you, 50% is difficult to judge because by virtue of laying an area of colour, it's likely to be more than 50% of the area!!!:lol:

theBongolian
04-05-2019, 07:11 PM
I'm not doubting the bona fides of the venerated pen and ink. Nor am I suggesting a litmus test for posting here. Just musing on the name "pen and ink" and how it differs from plastic and other graphic arts. We typically don't say "hands and clay" - which arguably has as long or longer tradition as pen and ink. Or "palette knife and oil", "brush and guache" etc.

Jerry Campbell
04-05-2019, 08:48 PM
Well I've seen plenty of ballpoint here on the P&I forum in the past if that makes a difference ?
You are right though it is absolutely not usually as "pen & ink".
How far to you wish to take this conversation though ? What about brush pens ? What do you mean that's not P&I ? it is a pen & uses ink.:confused:
Let's not get hung up about the definition.
For the purposes of this forum ,if you use ink delivered by any means it is P&I as far as I understand.
Mike

The tool matters.
Labeling a brush drawing a 'pen' drawing is incorrect.
Brush pens are a recent innovation, but I would think you would list media as 'brush pen' in contrast to 'brush and ink' or 'pen and ink'.

Jerry Campbell
04-05-2019, 08:58 PM
I'm not doubting the bona fides of the venerated pen and ink. Nor am I suggesting a litmus test for posting here. Just musing on the name "pen and ink" and how it differs from plastic and other graphic arts. We typically don't say "hands and clay" - which arguably has as long or longer tradition as pen and ink. Or "palette knife and oil", "brush and guache" etc.

'Pen and ink' describes the tools used, distinguishing it from 'brush and ink', another very common way to disperse ink.

pedlars pen
04-06-2019, 02:23 AM
I'm not doubting the bona fides of the venerated pen and ink. Nor am I suggesting a litmus test for posting here. Just musing on the name "pen and ink" and how it differs from plastic and other graphic arts. We typically don't say "hands and clay" - which arguably has as long or longer tradition as pen and ink. Or "palette knife and oil", "brush and guache" etc.
Brush aside colour, the characterless dots of stippling & ink wash.Dismiss these dilutions of the art of pen & ink !
I think deep in it's soul "pen & ink " is a linear art - it all revolves around the LINE.
That is what gives it , it's own unique & distinctive character. It all grows form that central fact ,the beauty & the challenge ! the frustration with it's limitations & the reward of operating within those limitations.
Just as in any individual artists style, it develops as the result of the self imposed limitations (preferences) which he himself imposes.
So it is with the pen - a pen has it's own rather spiky & idiosyncratic character fundamentally based on line ! So you are starting out as an artist with limitations -perhaps more than any other medium :eek:
BUT! that thin spidery pen line faithfully reflects an artists feelings in exactly the same manner as a oscilloscope records your heartbeat & the exact nature of it.
So I hope you can understand the importance of including the tool in with the medium of ink - it really is a crucial union.
Mike

Charlie's Mum
04-06-2019, 08:41 AM
Discussions are good! :)

Payne's Grey
04-06-2019, 10:32 AM
I'm not doubting the bona fides of the venerated pen and ink. Nor am I suggesting a litmus test for posting here. Just musing on the name "pen and ink" and how it differs from plastic and other graphic arts. We typically don't say "hands and clay" - which arguably has as long or longer tradition as pen and ink. Or "palette knife and oil", "brush and guache" etc.

To me, this is just nothing but typical slackness in usage of our language. I am personally adamant about the term "pen & ink" which is unarguably defined as a drawing or sketch done with ink dispersed by a pen nib. Tradition, if nothing else, supports this and the history of P&I certainly deserves a succinct name.

What else would you call it? Not just ink. That could be a brush & ink or finger & ink drawing, or painting. It could be made with printer's ink goo and the erasure end of a pencil. It could not be called just pen. That could be a painting or drawing made with a watercolor brush pen, ballpoint pen, or a sliver of wood made into a nib from a pig's pen. :lol:

Other art media definitions are not normally defined with such specifics, maybe to their loss. An "oil painting" can be made with any instrument known to man, and on any surface, as long as an oil base carries the paint pigment. The same situation with "acrylic." The same with "watercolor." Hell, a graphic of water-diluted black India ink on a brick, done with a nice flexible pen nib could possibly be called a watercolor painting!

Joking aside, I would not think twice if I saw an advertisement for hand-molded clay pots. Neither would I flinch if I saw an oil or acrylic called a palette knife painting. It certainly doesn't hurt to refine the medium's definition. However, I am at a loss of what to call a "water-based oil painting" done with any instrument... :eek:

So, I agree with thebongolian that the many media names are certainly something to ponder in their lax naming methodologies, but by doing so, to me, it just solidifies the justification for the term "Pen and Ink."

It's all good! :clap:

pedlars pen
04-06-2019, 11:26 AM
The tool matters.
Labeling a brush drawing a 'pen' drawing is incorrect.
Brush pens are a recent innovation, but I would think you would list media as 'brush pen' in contrast to 'brush and ink' or 'pen and ink'.
Well technically yes there is a difference of course but whilst acknowledging their differences you simply must agree that they are very closely related.
Both use line as their primary tool & both are usually monochromatic , both require the similar sensibilities to use but have different results .
You might even say that brush & ink is a purer form of using ink :eek:
Mike

theBongolian
04-06-2019, 12:27 PM
....So, I agree with thebongolian that the many media names are certainly something to ponder in their lax naming methodologies, but by doing so, to me, it just solidifies the justification for the term "Pen and Ink."...

But - at some point - shouldn't a term be defined by its common usage. This is a list of materials for pen and ink drawing by Artform- pencil, watercolor, brushes and pen and ink.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Apr-2019/1999899-pen-and-ink-materials.jpg

Haven't done any surveys but would not be surprised if a large percentage of pen and ink start with a pencil drawing. Should they be called multi-media? or pen and ink and pencil?

laika
04-06-2019, 12:34 PM
I'm going with Jerry Campbell on this. Pen-and-ink is a distinction between that practice and the ancient and still widely practiced tradition of ink and brush.

I had never really thought about it, and I thought that theBongolian's question was a good one, but given the age and wide spread of the brush work style, the distinction makes sense to me, even if it sounds a little redundant and awkward (as in why not simply "pen?")

pedlars pen
04-06-2019, 02:03 PM
On examination this conversation is boiling down to semantics, not "semantics" in the derogatory sense but in it's literal sense.
John nailed for me when he mentions the meaning of the word includes referencing the historical gravity that that carries (how could it not ?)
"Pen & Ink" means all of that , ie.just exactly what it has always meant !
Ultimately we can't be deviated by the musing of the Bongolian from using the word properly in the manner it has always been understood.
Neither can we rewrite the dictionary according to us !
So "Pen & ink" continues to mean pen & ink,well for now at least :lol: because language does evolve..........
Mike

Jerry Campbell
04-06-2019, 02:17 PM
On examination this conversation is boiling down to semantics, not "semantics" in the derogatory sense but in it's literal sense.
John nailed for me when he mentions the meaning of the word includes referencing the historical gravity that that carries (how could it not ?)
"Pen & Ink" means all of that , ie.just exactly what it has always meant !
Ultimately we can't be deviated by the musing of the Bongolian from using the word properly in the manner it has always been understood.
Neither can we rewrite the dictionary according to us !
So "Pen & ink" continues to mean pen & ink,well for now at least :lol: because language does evolve..........
Mike

"Historical gravity" has nothing to do with it.
It's simply descriptive.
Reed pens, bamboo pens, dip pens, fountain pens- all dry pens with added ink.

Jerry Campbell
04-06-2019, 02:24 PM
But - at some point - shouldn't a term be defined by its common usage. This is a list of materials for pen and ink drawing by Artform- pencil, watercolor, brushes and pen and ink.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/06-Apr-2019/1999899-pen-and-ink-materials.jpg

Haven't done any surveys but would not be surprised if a large percentage of pen and ink start with a pencil drawing. Should they be called multi-media? or pen and ink and pencil?

Misuse, no matter how common, should not change a term's meaning.

Those are not all pen and ink supplies.
Unless plainly visible, preparatory pencil lines are not included as media.

Payne's Grey
04-06-2019, 02:41 PM
LOL! If I was in the business of selling art supplies, I'd have much, much more items in that Artform "pen & Ink" picture than they do!

theBongolian
04-06-2019, 03:37 PM
Misuse, no matter how common, should not change a term's meaning.
perhaps "should not" but does. i.e. Awful no longer means "full of awe". It would be interesting to know the etymology of pen and ink.
Unless plainly visible, preparatory pencil lines are not included as media.
if you print out an image and then cover it with pen and ink, should the "preparatory" print out be included as media?

Jerry Campbell
04-06-2019, 06:46 PM
perhaps "should not" but does. i.e. Awful no longer means "full of awe". It would be interesting to know the etymology of pen and ink.

if you print out an image and then cover it with pen and ink, should the "preparatory" print out be included as media?

'Awful' still means to 'cause awe'.
Yes, a painted over print should include that information as media.

laika
04-08-2019, 12:46 AM
You're like a dog with a bone, theBongolian ;)

I'll keep playing, though: I've noticed that some comic book artists will pass blue line drawings and pencil drawings on to others who do the "inking," which can include ink delivered by pen and/or brush. And it's amazing how some comic book artists can draw exclusively with fine sable brushes - the ultimate tool for line variation in the hand of one who has mastered the brush - but I don't know what that technique is called.

Speaking for myself, if I use more brush than pen with ink, I would put that piece in the Watermedia forum. And that's another can of worms: so much of what goes on at WetCanvas could simply be lumped into Watermedia :)

theBongolian
04-09-2019, 06:44 PM
'Pen and ink' describes the tools used, distinguishing it from 'brush and ink', another very common way to disperse ink.
Most artwork is described by the materials it's made of, not the tools used to make it. There are no pens in a pen and ink drawing.

If the use of a pen is an important distinction for you, then perhaps "pen's ink drawing" would be more accurate and appropriate.

Payne's Grey
04-09-2019, 07:45 PM
... If the use of a pen is an important distinction for you, then perhaps "pen's ink drawing" would be more accurate and appropriate.

Oh, come on! Then, instead of "oil painting," since oil doesn't paint, shouldn't we say, "It's a painting of pigments, linseed oil and other sundry stuff and we don't care what instrument(s) were used to make it"

"Pen and Ink" has been, and is, a succinct expression for a specialized art work and its process and will outlast you and me. It's right as rain - whatever that means...

theBongolian
04-10-2019, 01:02 AM
Oh, come on! Then, instead of "oil painting," since oil doesn't paint, shouldn't we say, "It's a painting of pigments, linseed oil and other sundry stuff .....

except the word "painting" in oil painting is a noun, not a verb. Oil is an adjective modifying the noun painting.

A pen and ink drawing imo should more accurately be labeled "Penned Ink drawing". This should be the "Penned Ink Forum"

Kemical Reaxion
04-10-2019, 10:29 AM
I'm going to throw in my 2 cents, for what it's worth (which may only be worth 1 cent :) ). As a bit of a newb, I have to admit when I first considered posting my work in this forum that I thought the term "pen and ink" was pretty straight forward. Did I use a pen? Did it contain ink? Then it's pen and ink. Seemed obvious.

But the more I've perused the P&I forum, it seems that definition is much more rigid for some, and it makes the whole experience of posting here really confusing and intimidating. I've seen some vitriol for certain techniques or the use of color that made me question whether what I did was really pen and ink. And to be frank (and I don't mean this to sound like I'm bashing anyone here), it made me feel like I didn't want to post my work here at all. I've always felt that art should be free and expressive and the artist should be able to experiment, and if I'm constantly worried about whether what I'm doing conforms to a very rigid idea of what pen and ink is, then what am I even doing? It can be stifling creatively to be inside my head that much. I actually put down the pen and didn't do any drawing with it for months because of those feelings of doubt.

So while I think there's certainly value in these types of discussions about what pen and ink is, why it's called that, etc, I just wanted to share my experience, as kind of an outsider looking in. Again, it may not be worth much, but there it is.

Jerry Campbell
04-10-2019, 10:43 AM
I'm going to throw in my 2 cents, for what it's worth (which may only be worth 1 cent :) ). As a bit of a newb, I have to admit when I first considered posting my work in this forum that I thought the term "pen and ink" was pretty straight forward. Did I use a pen? Did it contain ink? Then it's pen and ink. Seemed obvious.

But the more I've perused the P&I forum, it seems that definition is much more rigid for some, and it makes the whole experience of posting here really confusing and intimidating. I've seen some vitriol for certain techniques or the use of color that made me question whether what I did was really pen and ink. And to be frank (and I don't mean this to sound like I'm bashing anyone here), it made me feel like I didn't want to post my work here at all. I've always felt that art should be free and expressive and the artist should be able to experiment, and if I'm constantly worried about whether what I'm doing conforms to a very rigid idea of what pen and ink is, then what am I even doing? It can be stifling creatively to be inside my head that much. I actually put down the pen and didn't do any drawing with it for months because of those feelings of doubt.

So while I think there's certainly value in these types of discussions about what pen and ink is, why it's called that, etc, I just wanted to share my experience, as kind of an outsider looking in. Again, it may not be worth much, but there it is.

Why would the definition have anything to do with your activity?
If you have the drive to create, why would an online forum of strangers influence you?

Jerry Campbell
04-10-2019, 10:46 AM
except the word "painting" in oil painting is a noun, not a verb. Oil is an adjective modifying the noun painting.

A pen and ink drawing imo should more accurately be labeled "Penned Ink drawing". This should be the "Penned Ink Forum"

I don't believe you are giving this much thought.

Charlie's Mum
04-10-2019, 11:50 AM
Kemical Reaxion - I'm so sorry you feel like that - but please, please never feel intimidated about posting in this forum!
Some of us have tried hard over the past few years to be inclusive and welcome all comers.
Yes, occasionally there are some who post work which may be more of a painting with a little pen work - or on one occasion (I think) digital work with a little pen work but as for style, there's a wide variety and all styles are welcome!:)

Payne's Grey
04-10-2019, 02:53 PM
Kemical Reaxion: Hi Amy, I remember your artwork of the roller skate from this past winter. I've been waiting to see more of your drawings.

Don't give up on us!

pedlars pen
04-10-2019, 03:48 PM
I'm going to throw in my 2 cents, for what it's worth (which may only be worth 1 cent :) ). As a bit of a newb, I have to admit when I first considered posting my work in this forum that I thought the term "pen and ink" was pretty straight forward. Did I use a pen? Did it contain ink? Then it's pen and ink. Seemed obvious.

But the more I've perused the P&I forum, it seems that definition is much more rigid for some, and it makes the whole experience of posting here really confusing and intimidating. I've seen some vitriol for certain techniques or the use of color that made me question whether what I did was really pen and ink. And to be frank (and I don't mean this to sound like I'm bashing anyone here), it made me feel like I didn't want to post my work here at all. I've always felt that art should be free and expressive and the artist should be able to experiment, and if I'm constantly worried about whether what I'm doing conforms to a very rigid idea of what pen and ink is, then what am I even doing? It can be stifling creatively to be inside my head that much. I actually put down the pen and didn't do any drawing with it for months because of those feelings of doubt.

So while I think there's certainly value in these types of discussions about what pen and ink is, why it's called that, etc, I just wanted to share my experience, as kind of an outsider looking in. Again, it may not be worth much, but there it is. I'm sorry you feel this way :crying: ,I think you've got the wrong end of the stick.
I hope this will clarify what is going on here - Over the years a certain culture has grown in the P&I part of wetcanvas, instead of it being a bland compulsory "mutual pat on the back society", a sort of shallow social media set up.
Real discussions on P&I aesthetics can take place & obviously different people come in from different angles on a subject ,plenty of diverse opinions can be expressed - passionately if you wish ! (but civilly please :lol:) great, no problem.
Also the valuable concept of constructive critique is encouraged among us if you feel you have something to add - so that we can learn from each other& hopefully grow as artists, both as a group & individually.
Is this not exactly the culture in art collages & amongst various gatherings of committed artists for hundreds of years ?
So it is a gathering of people with a shared interest ,who wish to deepen their understanding & stoke the fires & enthusiasm of their chosen medium in this very forum.
This should be any kind of surprise or problem to you.
If you feel someone (like me for instance !) has ideas which you find "rigid" or if I have spoke against the use of colour in P&I or anything else - just say so , & why you think so. At the end of the day it would boil down to a difference in what we find beautiful or meaningful to ourselves personally ! We differ there - fine :) It's a subjective thing art & there is no right & wrong, just different but equally valid points of view amongst equals.:wink2:
Cheers Mike

theBongolian
04-10-2019, 07:45 PM
I don't believe you are giving this much thought.
hmmmm.... thinking..... perhaps just calling it an Ink Drawing would be the best alternative. I know the guys that use pens are extra-special but the magnanimous inclusive 21st century thing to do would be to end the purity test, go big tent, accept all inkers. You could still have your secret handshake and do tongue clucks but by letting the plebs in you might get some converts.
... just a "thought".

Jerry Campbell
04-10-2019, 08:42 PM
hmmmm.... thinking..... perhaps just calling it an Ink Drawing would be the best alternative. I know the guys that use pens are extra-special but the magnanimous inclusive 21st century thing to do would be to end the purity test, go big tent, accept all inkers. You could still have your secret handshake and do tongue clucks but by letting the plebs in you might get some converts.
... just a "thought".

You are free to describe your own work in any way you like.
Quibbling about descriptors is close to the bottom of the list of importance to making art.
Keep thinking, though.

Payne's Grey
04-10-2019, 09:54 PM
hmmmm.... thinking..... perhaps just calling it an Ink Drawing would be the best alternative. I know the guys that use pens are extra-special but the magnanimous inclusive 21st century thing to do would be to end the purity test, go big tent, accept all inkers. You could still have your secret handshake and do tongue clucks but by letting the plebs in you might get some converts.
... just a "thought".

Thank you Bongolian. After your several persistent postings, I believe even this troglodyte understands your position that an ageless definition of an art process is wrong. :rolleyes:

vhere
04-11-2019, 06:15 AM
I do use pens but actually LOVE to draw with twigs for the larger scale and freedom it gives. I use acrylic in and wash as it dries slowly enough to allow lots of pushing it about.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/11-Apr-2019/53888-esgair_wen_from_other_side_of_bridge.jpg

This one was drawn with acrylic ink, with twigs and a brush with water to bleed out the washes while the ink was wet, plein air sketch

and I enjoy traditional pens as well (Lamy with Lamy ink) but again with a wash for subtle tonal changes and lively marks

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/11-Apr-2019/53888-e__urban_sketchers_day_museum_houses_ink.jpg

Maybe if the forum was simply INK there would be a wider variety of work shown? but maybe members aren't interested in looser work using other tools and prefer to keep to their format? I only occasionally visit because my work doesn't really fit in here. I tend to put it in Watermedia as I usually use washes.

pedlars pen
04-11-2019, 11:25 AM
Maybe if the forum was simply INK there would be a wider variety of work shown? but maybe members aren't interested in looser work using other tools and prefer to keep to their format? I only occasionally visit because my work doesn't really fit in here. I tend to put it in Watermedia as I usually use washes. Well that is a great shame Vhere as your work would be not only very welcome here but also highly appreciated - I feel sure.:)
I like to use twigs & cocktail sticks etc. sometimes too :thumbsup:
I'm not sure where quite a few people have picked up the mistaken impression of a narrowness in the definition of the pen & ink forum :confused: using a wash is certainly part of it & is much used here,as is acrylic ink. Just don't do a painting & put the pupils of the eyes in & call it a pen & ink !
Cheers Mike

theBongolian
04-11-2019, 12:40 PM
I'm not sure where quite a few people have picked up the mistaken impression of a narrowness in the definition of the pen & ink forum
.........hmmm...........maybe because it's called "pen and ink forum" You might as well put up a sign "no twigs and cocktail swirls allowed".

pedlars pen
04-11-2019, 06:13 PM
Let me explain theBongolian.
The official "rule" at the top of the forum is: " Pen and Ink - A forum for the discussion and display of work made with pen and ink. Added brush and colour mediums are accepted but must be less than 50% of the work."
Now OK. it is not easy to quantify 50% but you get the gist of it.
In vheres post above she used diluted acrylic paint but hey - that's all that acrylic ink is anyway!Such work is entirely in the spirit of pen & ink wash drawing & I wish she had felt totally free to post it here without a second thought.
Then too here is a pen & ink that was displayed here -Great ! but when all traces of ink were covered in pastel or paint Christel judiciously judged it it best not to post it here http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?p=21575083&posted=1#post21575083 in oil pastels.
In that very post you can see some comments like " Actually they are rather strict with the use of different media in their forum." & "They do sometimes come across as purists, but at the same time seem open to bending the rules."
What you have to understand here is that in the past pure water colours have been slipped in amongst friends from other sub forums & people have posted work in a totally unreleted medium but put the pupils of the eyes in pen ! etc. etc.
So it is not some backward looking restrictive purist outdated policy but instead an attempt to have PEN & INK on the pen & ink forum when you click on that tag - then that's what you get. Simple - isn't it ?
What pen OR ink works do you think is excluded ? Absolutely none that I am aware of. OK. digital but that is something totally different ballgame.
Mike

vhere
04-12-2019, 06:42 AM
no it was actually diluted ink - washed out from the drawn lines whilst wet - so all ink :) I really like acrylic ink for its slightly longer drying time and the ability to do this a lot.

I find I really don't like Indian ink because it dries too quickly and I can't do that, and the colour is so harshly black it doesn't suit the way I work.

Thank you for the nice comments :)

pedlars pen
04-12-2019, 08:07 AM
There then , you now have no excuse not to post your drawings here !:lol:
No indian ink does not appeal to me for wash work.The best ink I know for this kind of wash work is Pelikan fount indian ink. No (confusingly)it is not shellac based indian ink at all ! it goes though a Lamy very nicely & is carbon based too, so is permanent .It does not clog your pen either.It works very well in line & wash giving a nice neutral gray.
Mikehttp://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/12-Apr-2019/1267204-_good_wash_ink.jpg

vhere
04-12-2019, 01:11 PM
sounds good :)