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across
03-26-2018, 01:41 AM
Hi all! So tonight I tried glazing for the first time. I really loved doing an underpainting with the values, that was a good lesson in itself! But the glazing didn't work out so well.

So I used golden heavy body acrylics and for a glazing medium I used a mix of airbrush acrylic thinner and plain old water. I thinned it down to the consistency of creamy milk. After about 5 glazes, you could barely see my lights any more, which was really discouraging. I was told you should be able to do 10-15. Also the layers of glaze looked kind of grainy. Is this normal? It seems like a waste to just do a single glaze because the result is a grainy painting, but it was hidden with more glazes but then the values were lost. Any other tips? Also when I added a white glaze to bring back the lights it completely ruined it and I had to restart. :(

I'm curious, since I loved doing the underpainting, is there value in spending time doing a detailed underpainting if it will have thick paint placed on top instead of a glaze?

across
03-26-2018, 01:52 AM
Here are the after and before photos.

theBongolian
03-26-2018, 03:14 AM
I use Golden Heavy body too - You may not be thinning the glaze enough leaving it too opaque. For me Golden's retarder works best for glazing. The retarder has a jelly-like consistency which allows you to add a lot without the glaze becoming too runny. If you work the glaze too much it can become sticky and "grainy" better put it on one and done and not run the brush back and forth. If you use a white glaze, use zinc white well diluted and test it to make sure it's not too opaque before putting it on your painting

fedetony
03-26-2018, 03:58 AM
The trick to glazing is layering many times to build color, change must be almost unperceivable between layers.
Nice Image BTW :)

across
03-26-2018, 05:06 AM
There was a noticeable change each layer. I'll thin it down more. I'll try the retarder this time, I'm pretty sure I have some of that lying around. With not overworking- does that mean to not mix it like crazy with the medium? Or is that referring to not overworking it on the canvas? I was feathering it quite a bit because I had lots of brushstrokes.

Thanks! It's a 1969 Camaro. :) I'm hoping I can get the hang of this glazing thing as I mostly paint cars and it's a technique I think could work very well for that subject!

fedetony
03-26-2018, 07:33 AM
You could also help yourself by using transparent paints, not opaque. Then you don't need to use so much medium. Basically You need to make a kind of watercolor with the acrylics, then when you apply a layer it just tones a bit the image. You let it dry and add as many layers until you obtain your desired tone. Yes is tedious! :D You need to wait until each layer dries, that's why using water is not the best option (besides the bonding of acrylics issue), the drying is longer. With the retardant be careful, because it can last days until you have a dry surface for the next layer... You use it only if you don't have enough time to make your layer.

Now, to thin it you can use Acrylic medium, but viscosity is still the same. So you add water. Another option is Airbrush medium, which is better if you need to thin, because it will evaporate faster due to its base in alcohol.

You can use Acrylic medium and some alcohol to dilute instead of water. if the drying takes too long, Alcohol will evaporate faster and has a water part on it, yet you must be super careful 1) to have completely dry surface, 2) use ethanol only (90-95%) (the common antiseptic alcohol, but without additives), 3) apply without pressure or rubbing, you can remove under layers. 4) Not to put excess of alcohol in the mixture, I would say no more than 20% of the total volume.
Works better in absorbent surfaces as paper because alcohol evaporates, but water stays wet in the under surface.
To mix this things I use syringes and then I add by measure the proportions of water/alcohol, paint, medium and retarder. I put a 2-3 washers inside for mixing easily. See this (http://www.wetcanvas.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1414360) for mixing method.

tiago.dagostini
03-26-2018, 07:38 AM
Hi all! So tonight I tried glazing for the first time. I really loved doing an underpainting with the values, that was a good lesson in itself! But the glazing didn't work out so well.

So I used golden heavy body acrylics and for a glazing medium I used a mix of airbrush acrylic thinner and plain old water. I thinned it down to the consistency of creamy milk. After about 5 glazes, you could barely see my lights any more, which was really discouraging. I was told you should be able to do 10-15. Also the layers of glaze looked kind of grainy. Is this normal? It seems like a waste to just do a single glaze because the result is a grainy painting, but it was hidden with more glazes but then the values were lost. Any other tips? Also when I added a white glaze to bring back the lights it completely ruined it and I had to restart. :(

I'm curious, since I loved doing the underpainting, is there value in spending time doing a detailed underpainting if it will have thick paint placed on top instead of a glaze?


Possibly a bit too much water? Also the ratio of glazing and water varies depending on the paint COLOR (some pigments make the paint agglutinate more and get that grainy look). Also when that happens I found that you need to "mix more" the paint in the water/ medium. Use warm (not hot) water makes it easier to break the tiny clumps of pigment when mixing the glazing.

Dcam
03-26-2018, 10:37 AM
The best glazes are those mediums made for glazing such as Golden Acrylic Glazing liquid, or Liquitex glazing medium. I stay away from water when glazing and I use glazing techniques on almost every painting. Good luck.

across
03-26-2018, 11:19 AM
Ok so I redid the background as normal and left the glazing for the camaro. Still need to touch up the lights and darks, but it seems to have worked out! I thinned down a lot more this time. Also yellow was more transparent than the blue to start with, that probably helped.

across
03-26-2018, 11:21 AM
Ok well that photo looks a bit off. The real colors look much better. I'll post a decent photo once completed.

I am heading into town today so will look for some proper medium. For glazing, would it by chance work better with soft body acrylics? I'm currently using heavy body.

cliff.kachinske
03-26-2018, 03:30 PM
As Derek said, your best bet is to use glazing medium for glazing. A layer need to be completely skinned over and not soft before applying the next layer. This is where an inexpensive hair dryer is your friend. Be sure to let the surface cool after using the dryer, though.

Glazing medium has a retarding agent built in so you can work into a wet edge.

fedetony
03-26-2018, 03:38 PM
wow, that looks great...:)... follow Derek's (Dcam) advice, he is most experience in glazing :)

Ellis Ammons
03-27-2018, 01:19 AM
Nice work there..:thumbsup:
Glazing is more about using transparent colors so that you can see the paint underneath. Which is exactly how "candy paint" in the auto industry is done.
It's not so much thinning opaque colors down so that you can see the underpainting. When you thin the opaque colors down you are actually reducing the saturation of the color. Which will leave a dull and grainy effect. Which alot of times maybe what youre going for. But to produce the most vivid colors and preserve the values of your underpainting use transparent paint.

Also I strongly suggest getting some mixing white/zinc white for glazing or painting in layers. It's transparent and is really easy to pull up highlights and subtle value shifts. If you use titanium white over your glazes it's going to be very chalky looking.

Richard P
03-27-2018, 04:32 AM
I'm guessing that you can't really get around the milky look to glazing (either with water, acrylic medium, or alcohol) until it dries transparent?

tmwilliams
03-27-2018, 05:17 PM
Really fine work. Great detail and precision.

across
03-28-2018, 01:16 AM
Sadly no glazing medium in town. I'll have to wait until I head to the city.

I like the candy paint connection! But yeah the base color definitely influenced this. I guess the grey had a blue tunge, so my yellow final coat looks a little green. Not too bad, but in the original it was supposed to be a warm orangey yellow. Perhaps an umber underpainting would have been better?