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onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 12:06 PM
So I am doing one of Len Hend's online lessons and I think I made my trees too big. Any ideas of how I can make this painting better tree wise specifically or do you feel the trees are ok? This is obviously a WIP (work in progress).
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Mar-2018/974528-River_Chinny.jpg

Ellis Ammons
03-22-2018, 12:34 PM
I think the trees are ok.

If it were me I would put as much detail into them as possible. And make the branches cover up the top left portion of the painting. Make them close to a 1/3 of the painting.

The background is beutiful. A great accent to your trees.

Charlie's Mum
03-22-2018, 01:00 PM
So sorry to disagree with Ellis!:lol:
For me, the trees are too dominant - (I know the colours will change) but their size is acting like a block and stopping us from entering the picture.
The middle distance (forest/mountains) are good but I feel they are weighed down by the sky and that massive heavy cloud.
I'd suggest one main tree, about 1/3 in - painted in detail and with some (not too heavy) branches leading us into the central area... tracery rather than solid foliage ..... you need to see through it to the focal area beyond.

Others may have different ideas, BUT, it's YOUR painting, so read and discard if don't like the suggestions!:)

~JMW~
03-22-2018, 01:53 PM
I feel the trees really overpower the rest of the scene, but will be hard to fix without redoing some back ground..
Is the horizon water? & slanted/ hard to tell for sure...I guess the background seems confusing for me also..not sure on the upper middle area? water, fog, mountain or pointy land??
maybe some glare on the white trees makes it harder to tell what the background is..

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 02:02 PM
I thought it might help if I posted the painting that I am trying to copy as well. Here it is.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Mar-2018/974528-Painting-River-NSW.jpg

Quite a bit different from mine, eh?:lol: I'm not sure what I will do with my painting.

talisman
03-22-2018, 02:40 PM
It could go either way, do what you want and then post again.
I personally think they Ok in size, but the detail is what will make or break them.

~JMW~
03-22-2018, 03:16 PM
Looks like they are different size formats too. tricky to shrink or crop and decide what parts to crop.. when reducing sizes..
The hard edges in your sky made me think that was the horizon line.
I was seeing a rounded lake I thought in yours, but now in his I see a river going off into distance..
This is a pretty complicated scene..lots of elements happening..
I have overpainted & reworked many of mine , still do as learn more..
so all is not lost...
If you can visually imagine a grid or make edge position markers while planning out the scene, that helps get things placed .

~JMW~
03-22-2018, 03:21 PM
did some base shape outlines--maybe that will help?

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Mar-2018/50585-974528-Painting-River-NSW.jpg

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 03:47 PM
did some base shape outlines--maybe that will help?

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Mar-2018/50585-974528-Painting-River-NSW.jpg

Thank you, I see that this would have helped in the beginning!:clap: The thing is with Len Hend whose lessons I am following online is that he just immediately paints on the canvas, no drawing first.

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 03:48 PM
It could go either way, do what you want and then post again.
I personally think they Ok in size, but the detail is what will make or break them.

Thank you, I'll see how it goes and post again.:)

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 03:51 PM
I feel the trees really overpower the rest of the scene, but will be hard to fix without redoing some back ground..
Is the horizon water? & slanted/ hard to tell for sure...I guess the background seems confusing for me also..not sure on the upper middle area? water, fog, mountain or pointy land??
maybe some glare on the white trees makes it harder to tell what the background is..


Thank you! I recently just posted the painting that I was trying to copy. I'll just see how it goes continuing on painting and will post again.

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 03:53 PM
So sorry to disagree with Ellis!:lol:
For me, the trees are too dominant - (I know the colours will change) but their size is acting like a block and stopping us from entering the picture.
The middle distance (forest/mountains) are good but I feel they are weighed down by the sky and that massive heavy cloud.
I'd suggest one main tree, about 1/3 in - painted in detail and with some (not too heavy) branches leading us into the central area... tracery rather than solid foliage ..... you need to see through it to the focal area beyond.

Others may have different ideas, BUT, it's YOUR painting, so read and discard if don't like the suggestions!:)

I do agree about seeing to the focal area. I also posted the painting that I was copying from so that you all could have a point of reference.

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 05:24 PM
I think the trees are ok.

If it were me I would put as much detail into them as possible. And make the branches cover up the top left portion of the painting. Make them close to a 1/3 of the painting.

The background is beutiful. A great accent to your trees.


Thank you. I think I will try to do that.:wave:

cliff.kachinske
03-22-2018, 06:48 PM
Sorry, I agree with Maureen on this one.

It would be very rare for two trees of this size to grow right next to each other like that and would not make sense for the two trunks to grow apart and then converge like that because they would be shading each other from the light.

I agree the background trees and foliage are very good.

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 06:58 PM
Sorry, I agree with Maureen on this one.

It would be very rare for two trees of this size to grow right next to each other like that and would not make sense for the two trunks to grow apart and then converge like that because they would be shading each other from the light.

I agree the background trees and foliage are very good.

Thank you Cliff. Darn I don't think I can do anything with those trees. If I try to scrape off the paint, I think I'll mess up the rest of the painting. And I don't think I can paint over the trees as I have many coats of paint in the trees.:(

DreamSketcher
03-22-2018, 07:21 PM
Well using my very simple program and finger I just blocked in what I thought you can do. I had very limited colours to use, and didnít develop the trees much, I will let you decide on branch canopy.The other greens correspond to the existing forest, lake reflection, or mountain. I straightened out your cloud so it makes sense to the eye...
Ps. There are lovely qualities to this painting, so keep going!:)

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Mar-2018/1892029-4C58784E-7E2B-478A-8D8C-D15B85083226.jpeg

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 10:39 PM
I feel the trees really overpower the rest of the scene, but will be hard to fix without redoing some back ground..
Is the horizon water? & slanted/ hard to tell for sure...I guess the background seems confusing for me also..not sure on the upper middle area? water, fog, mountain or pointy land??
maybe some glare on the white trees makes it harder to tell what the background is..

Actually I thought yes this is too pointy for the mountain. But I googled Mount Chincogan, and guess what, the mountain is pointy. See here:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Chincogan

onestrokeartist
03-22-2018, 10:40 PM
Well using my very simple program and finger I just blocked in what I thought you can do. I had very limited colours to use, and didnít develop the trees much, I will let you decide on branch canopy.The other greens correspond to the existing forest, lake reflection, or mountain. I straightened out your cloud so it makes sense to the eye...
Ps. There are lovely qualities to this painting, so keep going!:)

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Mar-2018/1892029-4C58784E-7E2B-478A-8D8C-D15B85083226.jpeg

Thank you for this! Actually I have gessoed over half of the painting....sigh....we will see what transpires after I try painting that half.:cat:

Ellis Ammons
03-23-2018, 12:25 AM
Thank you. I think I will try to do that.:wave:
I like your painting better than the original. The perspective warp and feeling like your on another mountain looking over the lake and ocean is great. It doesn't have that cut out look of the original.

Also using heavy tree foliage in the top corner kind of forces the viewer to look into the background. It looks like the original artist had much the same idea.

onestrokeartist
03-23-2018, 01:02 AM
I like your painting better than the original. The perspective warp and feeling like your on another mountain looking over the lake and ocean is great. It doesn't have that cut out look of the original.

Also using heavy tree foliage in the top corner kind of forces the viewer to look into the background. It looks like the original artist had much the same idea.

Thank you, unfortunately, I should not have gessoed over the trees. Not a good idea! :eek:

onestrokeartist
03-23-2018, 01:10 AM
Ok, this is what I have done. I have cut and kept part of my painting, a very small part. I will have to do the same painting again taking in all of your comments - thank you all. Below is the part of the painting I saved.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Mar-2018/974528-Land_and_Water2

DreamSketcher
03-23-2018, 01:48 AM
It looks gorgeous. You did a beautiful job in that piece. Glad you salvaged some. Highlights the best.:)

Ellis Ammons
03-23-2018, 04:56 AM
nice work:thumbsup:

cliff.kachinske
03-23-2018, 10:14 AM
That's really fine work. I especially like the fact that the strong edge in the clouds resembles the horizon - it means more engagement with the image.

LavenderFrost
03-23-2018, 10:32 AM
I like the part that you saved!

I may not be a pro at composition but my impression is that Len is even worse at it. lol I think the tree he put further in ruins the painting, the water should be the focus and that tree is too demanding for attention. Having one near the edge is nice, but not so bright.

Charlie's Mum
03-23-2018, 02:03 PM
That's a good crop and a really nice painting.

Sorry to say this, but I think there are better teachers here than the one you're following!!!:lol:

onestrokeartist
03-23-2018, 03:09 PM
Thanks everyone! I really appreciated all of your comments!

onestrokeartist
03-23-2018, 03:23 PM
That's a good crop and a really nice painting.

Sorry to say this, but I think there are better teachers here than the one you're following!!!:lol:

Hi Maureen,:wave:

Well, Len Hend did teach me how to do the trees, etc. that you see in the cropped painting, so he did teach me some good stuff, right? Also I love taking an actual course which Len does offer - for free through Open Learning. I can't afford to spend money on courses, unfortunately. I certainly do look at other youtube videos online, but it is the lesson by lesson approach that I really like. That is why I am also enrolled in the Wetcanvas drawing course which Arnoud teaches. It is a course - lesson by lesson.

Christina

cliff.kachinske
03-23-2018, 08:17 PM
Christina, I think you have taught yourself how to do that kind of work. Len Hand's exercises may have been points of departure for your paintings, but it's you who deserves the credit for your progress.

Charlie's Mum
03-24-2018, 02:06 PM
Absolutely! :)

onestrokeartist
03-26-2018, 12:51 PM
Christina, I think you have taught yourself how to do that kind of work. Len Hand's exercises may have been points of departure for your paintings, but it's you who deserves the credit for your progress.

Thank you Cliff! I truly appreciate your comment.

onestrokeartist
03-26-2018, 12:52 PM
Absolutely! :)


Thank you, I do appreciate your comment!