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View Full Version : Stony Creek (Third attempt)


Tom Brown
10-06-2016, 12:09 PM
MY IMAGE(S):
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Critiques/upload_spool/10-06-2016/1986439_IMG_8316.JPG


GENERAL INFORMATION:
Title: Stony Creek (Third attempt)
Year Created:
Medium: Oil
Surface: Canvas
Dimension: 11x14
Allow digital alterations?: Yes!

MY COMMENTS:
My third try at this. I'll eventually get it.

MY QUESTIONS FOR THE GROUP:
Hit me hard.

Yvonne Keogh
10-06-2016, 01:13 PM
You know it's a very well done painting. It's just sad sad sad with a lot of muddy sky and muddy water reflecting it and needs some cheer somewhere, a spot of yellow or gold or pink to give the scene a glimmer of hope. Maybe in one window??? Be happy when you paint it. Ask a young child - they are naturally happy people.

Tom Brown
10-06-2016, 03:34 PM
But I don't want it to be happy. I wanted it to evoke calm, peacefulness, a time to be pensive. I still need to put 6 pilings on the right side, with their reflections. Have to wait until this layer is dry, then I'm going to glaze the water a bit darker.

BeckyKidus
10-07-2016, 06:29 AM
I think this is very well done, and I really like it. But don't forget the reflection of the moon!

Tom Brown
10-07-2016, 09:12 AM
Finished. I don't think the reflection of the moon would be visible, I believe it would be obscured by the trees.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/07-Oct-2016/1986439-IMG_8332.JPG

Yvonne Keogh
10-07-2016, 09:26 AM
Lovely. This dramatically draws the eye along the triangle of perspective giving movement and punctuation to the painting. Perfect choice. :clap:

t1barkode
10-08-2016, 10:25 PM
Yea I really like this painting. The reflections are beautiful and composition great. Maybe moon a bit too bright for me but it still looks great.

melindaxyz
10-19-2016, 09:19 PM
Well painted as I am sure you already know. Nice emotional capture. With that being said, I almost liked it with the moon a little less reflective: darker and spoke more towards solitude to the viewer, but I usually lean towards that in a art. Very well done.

maryinasia
10-20-2016, 11:29 AM
beautiful, but I also thought the moon reflection was missing

~JMW~
10-20-2016, 12:47 PM
I've seen some artists "measure" from an object to the water, then use that distance to measure how much & if something would be reflected in the water.
I found images with only the moon reflected and some with the added soft line of light..
https://www.google.com/search?q=moon+reflected+on+water&biw=1351&bih=620&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwiPsv3t2unPAhUms1QKHcMuBTAQ_AUIBigB#imgrc=ZXWrkpi44Ly34M%3A

here is a basic idea.. the color & size is a bit off..

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/20-Oct-2016/50585-1986439-IMG_8332.jpg

Tom Brown
10-20-2016, 03:38 PM
That's not how it works. To gauge where a reflection would begin you must imagine yourself as far below the water surface as you are above it. Then draw a line between yourself and the object reflected. If the is something much closer to you that would obscure the the object you want reflected then it would not be seen on the surface. Imagine that you were on the roof of a ten story building looking at this exact scene. Well clearly you would see no reflection. It's complicated.

~JMW~
10-20-2016, 11:22 PM
I agree, a high viewpoint would make a big difference with reflections, or lack of..

Big Al 444
10-22-2016, 12:53 AM
First off, I think this painting came out very nice. I like it, but I agree with @tj84 on the moon question. True, the moon may not be in the exact same spot in the reflection, but this difference would be very small and I believe you would see a reflection in that view. I quickly found dozens of photos on the web showing a similar angle and in fact, the distance was almost the same from the horizon up to the moon as down. Here's my version of how I would see it. The moon is so far away that you don't really have much parallax-type effect.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/21-Oct-2016/34986-MoonWater.jpeg

An another note, am I the only one noticing that this site won't upload images as .jpg, but will see .jpeg?

~JMW~
10-22-2016, 02:37 AM
[An another note, am I the only one noticing that this site won't upload images as .jpg, but will see .jpeg?]

My pics are jpg - I just checked , and they have been uploading normally.
My OS is Linux Mint Mate, I use Picasa & Linux image editing programs.


Your moon version looks fabulous..

Tom Brown
10-22-2016, 08:14 AM
Ok, I'm sold, I'm adding the moon reflection when I get home. Thank you folks.

Starrynight
10-22-2016, 04:38 PM
ok did we solve the moon issue? meanwhile...its a nice painting. In the future maybe a few less windows and mirrored reflections. It would be a stronger image with less. And your clouds (nice color and value) would be better if they were less "pointy". You did a fine job with value throughout.

Pinguino
10-23-2016, 02:47 PM
Seems to me that the moon reflection would be higher (farther away from the viewer) than shown by Big Al.

Visualize the plane of the water continued to the viewer's horizon. I imagine that would be at about the level of the ground-floor windows in the buildings. Then, the reflection would be as far beneath that level as the moon is above it. That would mean that the moon's reflection clears the reflected trees, but not by very much.

Tom Brown
10-23-2016, 08:16 PM
I'm still not convinced the moon reflection would exist, but it looks good so I'm going with it.

eggydreams
10-24-2016, 08:39 PM
Hi Tom,
I am brand new to wetcanvas. Infact, this is my first post! I felt compelled to join the conversation. I agree that the moon added would be the right way to go. I like the watery version that Big Al added above. It adds life to the scene.

Also, I was wondering if your paint palette is a take-home container from a restaurant. If so, what a great idea for re-purposing them!
Best to you,
Adrienne

Tom Brown
10-24-2016, 09:24 PM
Hi Adrienne, what an honor to inspire your first post. Yep, that's a take home container. I clean my palette at the End of each session and put it into one of these. Then I cover the paint with water and save it for weeks in case I need it again
Best to you as well,
Tom

Andrewcody
10-27-2016, 03:04 AM
What sort of fish do you catch there?
;)
Regards
Andrew

Tom Brown
06-28-2017, 03:20 PM
OK, after looking at this for months. I added the moon reflection.
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Jun-2017/1986439-IMG_2915.jpg

Pinguino
06-28-2017, 03:36 PM
The moon reflction does the job. It balances the foreground posts, and adds a sense of motion to the entire composition.

Good job using color on the lake. I had to think about it, but indeed I would expect the reflected trees, buildings, and clouds to be somewhat lighter than the backlit originals.

Kathy1234
06-28-2017, 04:19 PM
Love your painting Tom. It is wonderful to have help from the group in this site.

sl60
06-29-2017, 01:33 PM
Moonlight is decidedly cool (blue), not warm (except for a ring just around a full moon, which can be reddish). The composition of the clouds needs to be worked on--it would better to have more clouds clustered around the moon and with the brightness of a full moon (which is bright enough to cast very distinct shadows on the ground), the clouds would be far more modeled than what you have. The same with the background trees and buildings (increasing with their proximity to the moon)--the tops of the roofs, for example, would be glinting with bright light. The window light would be more yellow (and often edged with orange to a greater or lesser degree) and the light reflection more "snaky" as they are affected by water currents.

Pinguino
06-29-2017, 03:07 PM
Moonlight is decidedly cool (blue), not warm (except for a ring just around a full moon, which can be reddish). ... The window light would be more yellow (and often edged with orange to a greater or lesser degree)...

The actual color is irrelevant. Color harmony is important. Don't forget that the painting is (presumably) intended to be hung on a wall somewhere. My guess is that the existing color scheme is more harmonious with likely wall colors.

...the clouds would be far more modeled than what you have. The same with the background trees and buildings (increasing with their proximity to the moon)--the tops of the roofs, for example, would be glinting with bright light....

Good observations. Since the clouds are backlit, some more indication of where they are thick or thin would be useful. But not really necessary. Glints on the roofs, and the upper edges of trees, might be a good addition.

sl60
06-29-2017, 05:04 PM
Color harmony is of course important and value is more important than color. But to say that color is irrelevant is absurd--it just isn't true and color can make or break a painting.

Tom Brown
06-29-2017, 06:21 PM
The shape of a reflection is not caused by current. It is caused by the irregularities in the surface of the water. It could be disturbed by wind, current, a wake, a frog jumping in for a swim. Whatever. The rooftops would only reflect light to the viewer if the moon were much higher in the sky than what we have here ( notice that the building on the far left, which has a very shallow pitched roof, is reflecting the Moonlight, while the others with steeper pitches are not ). The painting is all done in cool colors. Yeah, I'm not sure about the clouds, but my issue is more with their shape than their numbers. Not sure what you mean by "more modeled", I don't speak "art", I just paint for fun, as a hobby.

sl60
07-02-2017, 11:27 AM
The shape of a reflection is not caused by current. It is caused by the irregularities in the surface of the water. It could be disturbed by wind, current, a wake, a frog jumping in for a swim. Whatever. The rooftops would only reflect light to the viewer if the moon were much higher in the sky than what we have here ( notice that the building on the far left, which has a very shallow pitched roof, is reflecting the Moonlight, while the others with steeper pitches are not ). The painting is all done in cool colors. Yeah, I'm not sure about the clouds, but my issue is more with their shape than their numbers. Not sure what you mean by "more modeled", I don't speak "art", I just paint for fun, as a hobby.

The moo is high enough in the sky (and bright) to glint off the rooftops and create values in the trees nearest to it (as you can see from the attached photo). And the moon would certainly be carving a path of light out on the water directly below it. As for modeled--this means values of light and dark. The brightness of a full moon like this is going to create definite value contrasts within the body of the cloud (which are not flat in nature) formations--those nearest the moon would be darker than those farther away. The closer the clouds are to the moon, the more double-lit they are (again, check out the photos).

Tom Brown
07-02-2017, 05:33 PM
"And the moon would certainly be carving a path of light........" . Is simply not true. It COULD be carving a path of light, or it could be carving nothing at all, there are too many variables to make such rules. The moonlight reflected off the surface is totally dependent on the surface condition. There is no "correct way" of portraying it. Here is just one example:
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/02-Jul-2017/1986439-IMG_3017.JPG