View Full Version : John Wayne Gacy--------->
06-27-2001, 03:58 PM
Dru..didn't he paint............clowns??
I believe Red Skelton did also. (?)
What can be determined about Red and John...based upon the work that they painted?
One was a famous comedian..one was (is) an infamous murderer.
Contradiction...work that causes viewers to question my content and motives- (and more importantly in my opinion *their OWN*,....HUMOR...satire..ambiguity...and things I may not understand about myself....are ALL part of my work.
I know how much fun it can be to try and pin someone down. But based on their artwork?!?!? :rolleyes: Psychics might have better luck. Most of the time, I think it is viewers projecting their own frustrations on other artists.
Regarding my work. I try to continue to evaluate my intentions..emotions and motivations, (it is on-going).
I can only hope the viewers of my work...will attempt to do the same..regarding their own...perceptions and frames of reference.
06-27-2001, 06:22 PM
I know Jonathan Winters painted clowns - hehe - hopefully you didn't get him confused with Gacy! :D
06-28-2001, 01:56 AM
Scott!!!! Very funny guy Jonathan!!!! Makes me laugh just thinking about some of his *personalities*....( I was also a sucker for Red Skelton!).
I do remember seeing the clown paintings of Gacy. And, I believe he dressed as a clown for children's parties..and various functions. (Talk about "creepy"!!!!!!).
I see so many conflicting things about people, so many incongruities...that some of my work is an attempt to make fun...of all that I see. Again...this is only a small part of my work.
I've read a rather interesting comment in a book recently:
"Rather than claiming Godlike qualities, we might consider instead that 94% of our genetic material overlaps with the chimpanzees, and then wonder how some of us have ever built cathedrals, or computers, or spaceships." ---( I often think chimpanzees display a bit more dignity!!!!)
Some things are just so rediculous to me, that I have a VERY difficult time taking MANY of the things we do...seriously, and I suppose it spills over into *some* of my artwork.
If (I) can't laugh about the goofy/silly stuff we to, I'd be crying.
I'm trying to get people (viewers) to see the nonsense ...in the nonsense!
I honestly believe we *think* we're FAR more important than we really are.
06-28-2001, 09:15 AM
:( I'm sorry...did I miss something, Michael??
06-28-2001, 10:42 AM
I read the other topic about how men and women paint women. It seems to me that you are feeling the need to defend yourself and your art - I cannot blame you and I understand exactly where you are coming from. I just wanted to post in here to support you and share two thoughts I had out of all this:
You don't do "safe art" IMO. I have seen several of your pieces here on WC and they often require some thought and some interpretation - two things that many in the viewing public do not want to do. You're not painting flowers or landscapes that will "go with someone's couch" (not that there is anything wrong with that.:p ) Clearly some misread your art and fill in the gaps with their impressions of your "intentions" in creating this work (often from their own internal prejudices) - those are the hazards of creating art that isn't "safe". You face it, as do many others - it isn't fair, but it is reality.
You can and should paint what calls to you. Should only Native Americans create "native themed" art? (Someone told my wife once (she is an author) that she shouldn't have any Native American characters in her novels because she was white. :rolleyes: )
On the same coin, should you refrain from painting women because you are not one? (kind of got a very slight impression of this from the other topic) Absolutely not. Your art is valid and special - you have a right to create it.
I have tried to develop a "love it, hate it, it's all the same to me" attitude - I am not always successful - it's hard - we want people to like us and what we do.
I kind of rambled here - hope you understood what I meant. :)
06-28-2001, 01:04 PM
Thank you for sharing your perspective. You are quite right about my not creating "safe art". I think if I were to do more "safe art" (which I have..and occassionally continue to do)...more of my work would sell, but I'm following those "internal" directives that other artists seem to follow also.
I suppose I do (at times) feel the need to defend myself, and it usually occurs when someone's response to my work includes negative assumptions and associations about my character. I realize that all people are free to CHOOSE to believe what they choose to believe, regardless of whether or not they lay their hands on any concrete truth or evidence.
I think examples of false assumptions about my feelings about women (and men) will certainly continue to arise. I did mention to my wife, that when I see one viewer doing this..there seems to be a desire in *those* viewers to (hope for?) other artists with views that reinforce their own. Not unusual..another quality that human beings seem to display.
Verdaccio, I am comfortable that many (?) viewers may not like *some*? of my work...or that many may not understand why I make *some* of my work. Do ALL artists know everything about why they make some of the work they do? I doubt it. I know some of the reasons why I make some of my work, and I've discussed it now and then here at Wetcanvas.
Your point Verdaccio, regarding your wife and the inclusion (or exclusion) of Native American characters is a good illustration in my opinion. I'm not naive enough Verdaccio, to believe or even hope that everyone will praise my work..or even like me.
Again, I doubt that I will always have the TIME to defend my work...I do enjoy :) defending it..when I view the criticism as unfounded...and lacking insight.
Thank you again Verdaccio for sharing your logic and thoughts about this.. (It makes sense to me).
Todd, under another thread (and not under the thread that included my work btw) "Corporate Pinup"-(among others), I felt someone was clearly sharing some negative opinions about *my* work, and implying negative associations about my character based on very few examples (of my work) and extremely llimited knowledge about me.
I do however, understand how those false associations and *assuptions* might arise, when only a very small portion of my work is used for evaluations of this kind.
I felt the need to try to clarify a few things..and share my thoughts with this person. :) Have I appeared defensive, maybe
:confused: I felt I was just responding in order to counter some unfounded...erroneous assumptions on the part of the viewer.
06-28-2001, 02:17 PM
We all end up having to defend work at one point it seems.
I'd imagine like in other areas (religion, philosophy) it just ends up strengthening your stance or maybe shedding new light on the subject. This thread is interesting since you bring up the material in the novel as well and I have heard that sort of thing said before. It's a problem posed to all artists, not just us with brushes and pencils. The idealism of putting boundries on art irritates me to no end. If the art pleases (like sweet flowers or landscapes) or makes all the hair at the base of your neck crawl, either way it's done it's job as art (evoked reaction/emotion from viewer).
I appreciate the articulation of the subject here (watching it play out with real subject and not just in theory) though I'm sorry that it ends up potentially putting off people (any users here). I applaud both Michaels here. Very well handled IMO.
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