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Roan
11-15-2000, 10:19 AM
While finishing up the open stock pastel list, I started making a list of what else I wanted to add to my site for pastelists.

It ocurred to me that a list of materials that a beginner would need, along with the best prices and places on where to buy the entire she-bang would be a great thing to have -- sort of a "Beginner's Pastel Kit". I see these lists in books, but they don't and can't really tell you where to get them, nor can they tell you how much this is all going to cost!

Now, since this list is for beginners -- I've picked Rembrandt and Winsor & Newton as the recommended pastel brands to buy. Why? Because they're relatively cheap, easy to get, mid-range in softness, almost never outgrown, and can be used on a wide variety of surfaces. They are both smart purchases.

Most people, I should think, start painting with an idea in mind of what they want to paint (landscapes, portraits, etc.,). When you buy a set you almost always get pastel colors that you won't use or don't need. That's a bit of a waste of money.

As a result, I'd like to recommend open stock purchases as well as set purchases so that beginners have a choice. What I'm looking for are everyone's recommended colors in pastels and Canson Mi-Tientes papers for each of these subjects.

I have three categories: portrait, landscape/floral, and all-around. If you feel landscape/floral needs totally different colors and should be separate, by all means please post your colors and I'll separate them. All-around is a category for those who don't really know what they want to paint.

Here's what I'd like your input on:

1) The 30 best, listed in order of need, Rembrandt portrait colors
The 30 best, listed in order of need, Winsor & Newton portrait colors
The best Mi-Tientes paper portrait colors

2) The 30 best, listed in order of need, Rembrandt landscape/floral colors
The 30 best, listed in order of need, Winsor & Newton landscape/floral colors
The best Mi-Tientes paper landscape/floral colors

3) The 30 best, listed in order of need, Rembrandt all-around colors
The 30 best, listed in order of need, Winsor & Newton all-around colors
The best Mi-Tientes paper all-around colors

"Listed in order of need" basically means that if someone could or only wanted to buy 15 - 20 pastels to start, that they got the the colors that they really need to do their subject decently.

Oh! And please remember, this is for beginners so maybe we need to stay away from really dark or really light paper colors -- stay with the mid-range types?

Hugs!

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A'bheinn as àirde tha san t́r, 's ann oirre 's trice ch́ thu 'n cẹ --
<FONT size="1"> The highest hill is oftenest covered with clouds.
-- Scots Gaelic proverb.</FONT s>

[This message has been edited by Roan (edited November 15, 2000).]

Roan
11-15-2000, 08:32 PM
Hrm, it IS rather a tall order, isn't it? It doesn't have to be your 30 best, even 15 will do and that includes all tints and shades of each color that you think a beginner should have. Here, I'll start by listing MY favorite Rembrandt portrait colors (which is a feat 'cause I don't use them as much as my other brands):

burnt umber .3, .5, .7, .8, .9
gold ochre .3
yellow ochre .3, .5, .7, .9
olive green .3, .5, .7, .8
burnt sienna .3, .5, .7, .8
raw umber .3, .5, .7, .9, .10
cobalt blue .3, .5, .7
Prussian blue .3, .5
Mars violet .3, .5

Any adds? Subtracts? Do I have too many of each tint? I don't even have caput mortuum in there. Suggestions?

Here are my Winsor & Newton fav colors:

Burnt umber tints 5, 3, 2, 1
Raw umber tints 5, 3, 2, 1
Raw sienna tints 5, 3, 2
Indian Red 5, 3, 1
Cobalt Blue 5, 3, 1
Winsor Violet 5, 3, 1
Olive green 5, 3, 1
Gold ochre 5, 3, 1
Yellow ochre 5, 3, 1
Burnt Sienna 5, 3, 1
French Ultramarine 5, 3, 1

That's 35.

You'll notice I don't list the pure tint 4 in any of these. That's because I really haven't noticed a huge difference between W&N tint 5 and 4 and the 4s tend to be the ones that have binder bits in them.

As for paper, I'm partial to Mi-Tientes moonstone and olive green (that's mid dark?)for portraits and the other flannel-type Mi-Tientes for other work.

------------------
A'bheinn as àirde tha san t́r, 's ann oirre 's trice ch́ thu 'n cẹ --
<FONT size="1"> The highest hill is oftenest covered with clouds.
-- Scots Gaelic proverb.</FONT s>

LDianeJohnson
11-15-2000, 09:02 PM
Dear Roan,
If I had to list the "best" way to go with beginning pastels this is what I recommend to all my students:

PASTELS:

- Unlike wet media where you can mix the colors you need from just a feww, pastel sticks must be purchased in many values and colors. Some mixing is achieved on the painting surface but not in the same way.

- If you are purchasing stick by stick:
Purchase the sticks you need AS you need them by going to a local store with open stock and buy for the paintings you are working on.

- If you do all-around painting:
First purchase full Rembrant or Girault set (perhaps splitting the cost with a friend then split each stick with an xacto knife so each person has a full set). Rembrant and Girault are the mean of all the pastels. In other words, they are a "soft pastel" but with a middle-firm feel. No matter what you end up using most of the time, you'll probably use some Rembrants or Giraults whether you are a landscape or portrait painter.

- No matter what, purchase even a small set of NuPastels. They have a bright color range but are great when you need them. Next to pastel pencils, they are the hardest of soft pastels good for most beginners, whether using paper or prepared boards. In addition, get a set of black to white--the gray range NuPastels.

- Every pastel manufacturer has a different range of colors in saturation and hue. Eventually, you'll have some of most manufacturers in your cadre of pastels.

- Get catalogues of all the pastels that are available, from Jerry's to Dakota, as well as custom made pastels. Even if you are landscape painter, you'll need some portrait colors and visa-versa. Even though I have full sets of 3 major pastel manufacturers, and don't use yellow often, I have yellow when I need it in several values and hues.

- When new pastel brands come on the market, buy a stick or two in the colors you like/need for testing to see if you like them or not. For example, I love blackish greens, many blues, and roses which are hard to come by. So when advertized, I try out newly manufactured sticks to test. If I like the feel and the integrity of the colors, I buy more and eventually purchase a full set. Then just add back in the colors I use most.

- If you are either a portrait painter or landscape artist, you can buy the "portrait" or "landscape" sets. These are ok, but they don't usually include several colors you will need. Some "landscape" sets are created mainly for seascape areas and have much blue and cool blue-greens, when you may require many yellows, rusts or other colors for what you are painting.

Books:

- Before buying pastel sticks really learn what to do with color to maximize your purchases. Know that to use neuralize or gray down a pastel color...that you can lightly or heavily apply the compliment, a grey of same value, etc. Books can help so much in learning and intelligent buying of materials.

- Take workshops. If at all possible, take a workshop from a reputable pastel painter, either locally or nationally. With a good instructor you'll save money on pastel and paper purchases in the long run.

Paper:

- Start with the least expensive route for you. Canson paper is sturdy and an inexpensive, yet archival paper paint on. Even if you use inexpensive newsprint paper, you'll want to try other papers to know what the pastel can do. Canson is up to $2+ per sheet, but you can cut it easily and save, getting up to 4 nice sized pieces.

- If you are "well to do", try other papers as well, but don't spread yourself too thin. Find a couple of papers/pastel combinations you like and learn to paint WELL before trying too many things at once. Don't feel pressured to use "this or that" paper or pastel. Use what is comfortable for you. Find your own way. It seems nowadays, you have to know everything at once and do all things perfectly...just as with software and computers. Not so!! Take your time, at your own pace, study the masters and with your teachers/books. FOCUS and you will succeed.

This matter of painting, whether in pastel, oil, acrylic, casien, etc. is NOT a race. It is you expressing yourself in your own way in your own time. Play, experiment and enjoy along the way.

Diane

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Paintings by L. Diane Johnson (http://www.LDianeJohnson.com)
Workshops for 2001 (http://www.LDianeJohnson.com/workshops)

4vincent
11-16-2000, 01:55 AM
Wow, Roan, that's quite an order! http://www.wetcanvas.com/ubb/smile.gif
I'll have to get back with you on that one.

I remember years ago when I started working in pastel, my first set was one of the Grumbacher half stick sets, which had a good variety of colors for a specified subject matter. If available now, they're only in hobby shops. While not as good as Rembrandts, they were probably the only ones available in "pre-arranged" sets for a particular subject.
I was also wondering since in landscapes for instance, should there be maybe a color and a lighter and darker value of that color to go with it in the set. Of course, this could add up and I know you want to keep it basic.
But you know how you can get "over zealous" with color in pastel painting! http://www.wetcanvas.com/ubb/wink.gif

billyg
11-16-2000, 05:16 AM
Hey Roan,
I'll have to get back with my colours as I have such a mixture from Mungyo to Unison, Schminke,Rembrandt and W&N plus some Conte'. I also have some of Terry's pastels which look good too, I like the earth colours
Paperwise I like Mi Tentes and have the 407 Cream plus some of the Greys.I also like Art Spectrum Paper including their Rich Biege and Grey, they do have a strong tooth and you have to work in hard pastel first. That posting I did of "Memories of Audrey" was on Art Spectrum.Mainly yummy Schminke.
Billyg

Roan
11-16-2000, 09:32 AM
Diane,

This is wonderful and I thank you for posting! I hope you don't mind if I use some of the ideas in your post on my site? I will rewrite a lot of it -- streamlining it towards my target audience (see below) -- and with the appropriate "thank you" credit link to your site, of course?

Speaking of which, I think I do need to clarify who my target audience is, hrm, okay, let's pretend this is a short manual and it's entitled:

"Beginning Pastels for the Artistically Disinclined"

Not that I'm going to name it that! :P

What it really means is that my guide will be aimed at either young kids or people who have never painted before -- or even dealt with color -- but really have a desire to try it. Like me, last year :P

There are tons of books and sites that go into pastels very heavily and it can be very scarey and confusing -- and expensive. The goal of my guide is to provide an inexpensive way for people to gain a foothold on the medium. To get them into it. Then send them on their way to other sites, books and workshops like yours :P

So, my initial recommendations for a beginner will be: one "set" of medium-soft pastels, 10 sheets of Canson paper (common min lot size), newsprint, bulldog clips and/or tumb tacks, some sort of drawing board, a pastel pencil or some Saral transfer paper for drawing, kneaded eraser, a stump or two and one or two books.

Which brings me to my comments and questions:

Originally posted by Artistry:
Dear Roan,
If I had to list the "best" way to go with beginning pastels this is what I recommend to all my students:

PASTELS:

- Unlike wet media where you can mix the colors you need from just a feww, pastel sticks must be purchased in many values and colors. Some mixing is achieved on the painting surface but not in the same way.


Wonderful! I'll expand this with a simple explanation of how basic colors, tints and shades are acheived in wet media and compare it to pastels.

- If you are purchasing stick by stick:
Purchase the sticks you need AS you need them by going to a local store with open stock and buy for the paintings you are working on.

But what colors should they start with? This is the question that boggled the heck out of me when I first started and I had no guidance at all. Assume I want to try painting a few portraits. What are the basic skin, eye and hair colors that work best?

Landscapes too? What colors should I start with? What do you feel are the "must haves"?


- If you do all-around painting:
First purchase full Rembrant or Girault set (perhaps splitting the cost with a friend then split each stick with an xacto knife so each person has a full set). Rembrant and Girault are the mean of all the pastels. In other words, they are a "soft pastel" but with a middle-firm feel. No matter what you end up using most of the time, you'll probably use some Rembrants or Giraults whether you are a landscape or portrait painter.

Ack, the full set? Gosh, that's a major expense, Diane. A full set of Girault runs around $800. Even split that's $400. Rembrandt is around $300 for a full set, so that's $150 each split.

Is there a smaller set of 30 or so pastels you can recommend for someone to start with?

- No matter what, purchase even a small set of NuPastels. They have a bright color range but are great when you need them. Next to pastel pencils, they are the hardest of soft pastels good for most beginners, whether using paper or prepared boards. In addition, get a set of black to white--the gray range NuPastels.

Nupastels are relatively inexpensive at around $65 for the full set of 96, too. Hrm, to be honest -- and trying to keep initial costs down -- I think I'd recommend them as a secondary rather than primary purchase. Reason I think this is because of the initial expense, pastel softness, and coverage range. IMHO you can do more with a mid-soft pastel than with a harder one. Ie: cover Nupastel with Rembrandt, work on softer surfaces like velour. Even tho it's not really a good surface, it appeals to a lot of artists and a beginner will want to try it out. I know I did and I was warned about it too! I loved the look until I realized that my pastel was falling off it. Bah, I still like the look of velour :P



- Every pastel manufacturer has a different range of colors in saturation and hue. Eventually, you'll have some of most manufacturers in your cadre of pastels.

- Get catalogues of all the pastels that are available, from Jerry's to Dakota, as well as custom made pastels. Even if you are landscape painter, you'll need some portrait colors and visa-versa. Even though I have full sets of 3 major pastel manufacturers, and don't use yellow often, I have yellow when I need it in several values and hues.

- When new pastel brands come on the market, buy a stick or two in the colors you like/need for testing to see if you like them or not. For example, I love blackish greens, many blues, and roses which are hard to come by. So when advertized, I try out newly manufactured sticks to test. If I like the feel and the integrity of the colors, I buy more and eventually purchase a full set. Then just add back in the colors I use most.


Very wise words!


- If you are either a portrait painter or landscape artist, you can buy the "portrait" or "landscape" sets. These are ok, but they don't usually include several colors you will need. Some "landscape" sets are created mainly for seascape areas and have much blue and cool blue-greens, when you may require many yellows, rusts or other colors for what you are painting.

What minimum size set do you recommend here?



Books:

- Before buying pastel sticks really learn what to do with color to maximize your purchases. Know that to use neuralize or gray down a pastel color...that you can lightly or heavily apply the compliment, a grey of same value, etc. Books can help so much in learning and intelligent buying of materials.

Good points! I was going to recommend the purchase of two books to start: The Pastel Book, by Bill Creevy and Pastel Painting Techniques by Guy Rodden. Although I found Mr. Rodden's book to bounce all over the place with surfaces, he gives 17 step-by-step pastel projects to work on. I've done about 5 of them (different surfaces) on Canson and I found they really helped me get started.


- Take workshops. If at all possible, take a workshop from a reputable pastel painter, either locally or nationally. With a good instructor you'll save money on pastel and paper purchases in the long run.

Definitely! And some pointers on how to find out if a painter is reputable or not. My local community college had some pastel classes being offered but when I called to ask some questions I found out that the instructors had no web sites for me to view, didn't bother to give a list of galleries they have paintings hung in, and wouldn't give out their phone numbers. I DID get their personal qualifications, however I was put off by not being able to see their work.


Paper:
- Start with the least expensive route for you. Canson paper is sturdy and an inexpensive, yet archival paper paint on. Even if you use inexpensive newsprint paper, you'll want to try other papers to know what the pastel can do. Canson is up to $2+ per sheet, but you can cut it easily and save, getting up to 4 nice sized pieces.

Where do you get your Canson, Diane? I know a reputable vendor (I order paper from them a lot) that sells it in lots of 25 per color at .99 a sheet. Not that you'd what to buy that many, but you might. I also know of a few places with low min order quantities that are a lot cheaper than that :P

What Canson colors do you recommend? I prefer moonstone for all-around painting. And the other "flannel" type colors too.


- If you are "well to do", try other papers as well, but don't spread yourself too thin. Find a couple of papers/pastel combinations you like and learn to paint WELL before trying too many things at once. Don't feel pressured to use "this or that" paper or pastel. Use what is comfortable for you. Find your own way. It seems nowadays, you have to know everything at once and do all things perfectly...just as with software and computers. Not so!! Take your time, at your own pace, study the masters and with your teachers/books. FOCUS and you will succeed.

This matter of painting, whether in pastel, oil, acrylic, casien, etc. is NOT a race. It is you expressing yourself in your own way in your own time. Play, experiment and enjoy along the way.

Very sound advice!

Thank you!

Pray
11-16-2000, 02:01 PM
Wow! You are really kind and helpful people. Thank you.

Roan
11-16-2000, 09:22 PM
<U>Billyg:</U>

Sorry I missed your post earlier! I'm still working on the web site and waiting for the [insert favorite expletive here] DNS to filter down. My [insert another one] primary is still in Michigan. I'm doing as much as I can do until then. I have to change all my scripts once it filters down.

Hrm, ah, what the above means is that I have a new web address and in order for anyone to access it, it has to "get out onto the web". Since it originates in Michigan and I'm in Virginia, I can't even access it myself to test my scripts. So we wait. And wait :P

<U>((((Diane))))</U>
As I was web surfing today I noticed that MisterArt.com has Mi-Tientes for .94 each and NO minimum order quantity!

<U>Pray:</U>
Thank you!

Hugs to all pastelists!

Roan

Roan
11-16-2000, 09:27 PM
I've been giving this some thought and I think that it would be far easier for newbie pastelists (for me too!) to just buy a boxed set of landscape, or portrait, or assorted pastels to start. Then buy the other colors they need. I just wish I knew/remembered what was in the basic Rembrandt sets so I could make recommendations on which other colors to start with!

How do you guys feel about easels? Do you think they are absolutely necessary? I'm thinking table top, they run around 23$ or so. I started without one and smeared most of my stuff. I bought a table top about a month later and wish I had bought it first.

What other supplies do you think a newbie should start with?

Thoughts?

Roan

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A'bheinn as àirde tha san t́r, 's ann oirre 's trice ch́ thu 'n cẹ --
<FONT size="1"> The highest hill is oftenest covered with clouds.
-- Scots Gaelic proverb.</FONT s>

Terry
11-21-2000, 09:24 AM
Roan, 4vincent and Artistry,
I have been looking over your color purchase guidlines and am very interested. I am in the process of putting together 'sets' of landscaping, portrait and darks in 24, 48 and 96 colors besides my 500 piece set.
Can I be of any help on this project? or am would I be interferring?
Terry Ludwig [email protected] http://www.makepastels.com

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www.makepastels.com (http://www.makepastels.com)

Roan
11-21-2000, 10:00 AM
Oh my gosh, Terry. "Interferring"? You jest! Of COURSE we want your input here! I'd like to get you listed as a vendor too. I have "make your own pastels" and pastel sets vendor lists in the making, too.

I reiterate, please contribute!

Hugs,
Roan

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A'bheinn as àirde tha san t́r, 's ann oirre 's trice ch́ thu 'n cẹ --
<FONT size="1"> The highest hill is oftenest covered with clouds.
-- Scots Gaelic proverb.</FONT s>

bk7251
11-21-2000, 12:53 PM
Originally posted by Roan:

How do you guys feel about easels? Do you think they are absolutely necessary?


I don't like using an easel at all for pastels. I prefer to work flat, or nearly so. I find that with an easel, pastel dust drifts down the page and muddies the colors. (This would probably be a good topic for a new string). When I work outdoors, I just hold the pad on my lap. Indoors, I use a drawing table tilted at a slight angle. Periodically, I turn the pad over and dump the dust into a large, rectangular Tupperware bin.

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Barry Katz

4vincent
11-22-2000, 01:22 AM
I myself prefer easels; I tilt the top edge of the work forward to let the dust fall away from ther surface. There have been some that make a "tray" along the wall in a room for an support in painting.
..Terry, no problem....
As far as beginning papers, there are some like Ingres that's cheaper than Cansons, but not as good. I would say use what would give a newbie the best advantage, and abeit more confidence in starting out.
This is probably going to be a "do as I say, not what I do", but dust masks and/or gloves could be stated. (and tell them don't blow the dust off)
As far as the pastels go, half stick sets have been coming out from several mfgrs; maybe that's a good way to start with more colors for the same money.
Enough good suggestions have already been given here by the others; I'm outta here. http://www.wetcanvas.com/ubb/smile.gif

LDianeJohnson
11-22-2000, 04:45 PM
Roan,
Just had a chance to stop back by to see all your questions:

PASTELS:

"What to buy if just buying stick-by-stick?"
If someone is taking a class, see what colors will most likely be used and purchase a few at a time based on the class. If someone is on their own, get a small set based on what they like to paint.

"Assume I want to try painting a few portraits. What are the basic skin, eye and hair colors that work best? "
This is a difficult one to answer if someone has no portrait training. If you've studied portraits (which I know you do) select sticks based on how you've used other paint colors, or purchase a small basic portrait set to get you started. There are no set "basic" portrait colors per-se, although there are certain expectations with the use of certain colors in portraiture. Everyone has different coloring, so many colors are really needed. However, there are a few good sets on the market to kick-off portrait painting in pastel. I started in portraits with just a handful of sticks based on the type of people I was painting, then added as I went along. I could suggest a stick listing, but it may not apply to what you need. I agree with another post that at least getting the lightest stick, pure local color stick, and darkest version of each color is a good idea.

"Landscapes too? What colors should I start with? What do you feel are the "must haves"?"
Same as with portraits...hard to say. I can suggest a list, but there are seascape colors, garden colors, mountainscape colors, you get the picture. If you send me a photo or tell me what kind of landscapes you'd be painting of I can be more specific.

"Ack, the full set?"
Ack is right. But, if you are going to be a pastel painter, eventually you'll want to have a full set of something or at least have a very broad range of sticks for every subject you want to paint. I never suggest running out to buy a full set right off the bat. Work your way up to it, at your own pace, at your own budget.

"Is there a smaller set of 30 or so pastels you can recommend for someone to start with?"
Again, start with Rembrant, a middle of the road, basic set, or other well-known brand. From there you can get softer and softer as you gain control. Avoid very hard, "school" pastels, which are not pastels at all but purely chalk. Another good alternative is to have Terry make up a small set for you based on the subject you'll be painting! (Terry Ludwig [email protected] http://www.makepastels.com ) Plus Terry will give you more personalized service than just purchasing a set outright.

"What minimum size set do you recommend here (referring to basic sets)?"
It's not the number of sticks, it's what you can do with the sticks you have. That is, knowing which sticks do what in terms of intensity, coverage, neutralizing, etc. Basic sets are just that, "basic". To the basic, add stick-by-stick the colors you need to control and achieve the look you want. Learning to use color well is directly related to knowing how to purchase sticks of pastel.

"Take workshops..." Plus your great comments on teachers:
Read my article titled <A HREF="http://www.ldianejohnson.com/article_class.html">So You Want to Take an Art Class...</A> also here at <A HREF= "http://www.wetcanvas.com/Articles/DianeJohnson/artclass.html"> WetCanvas </A> for tips on how to select an instructor.

PAPER

"Canson"
Colors to use:
I recommend using tinted colors. For beginners, the medium grays, such as Moonstone, etc. for most subjects. There are many ways to select the paper color:

1. Using warm colors for cool color paintings.
2. Using cool color papers for warm color paintings.
3. Using like color paper for like color paintings (but these are usually very dull looking but can create the most harmony)
4. For child portraits, I sometimes start with a light pink or light blue, eventually covering most of the surface.
5. and on and on...it really depends on the subject and the look you're trying to achieve.

The thing I least recommend is using white. It takes so much pastel to cover the paper just to reach the value you want and cover the stark, harsh whiteness. Better to start with a toned paper so your paints will 'read' immediately.

I have used this for years, and have purchased from many places. I look for sales locally as well as from catalog companies. Look especially at Jerry's, and the like when they have 20% off their regularly discounted prices. If you purchased the sheets for $.94 at MisterArt that's very good. Anything under a dollar is good for Canson.

If using Canson, I recommend using the felt side, not the machined-looking, dimpled side. But this is just a matter of preference.

I also recommend Canson for beginners rather than the Strathmore papers. The Canson holds up better.

EASELS:
I use an easel to work upright and a tad forward to let the pastel fall straight down. But beginners who can't afford an easel can paint against a wall or drawing board. Just be sure to pad with a few sheets of the same type of paper they are using.

That's it for now http://www.wetcanvas.com/ubb/smile.gif
Diane


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Paintings by L. Diane Johnson (http://www.LDianeJohnson.com)
Workshops for 2001 (http://www.LDianeJohnson.com/workshops)

LDianeJohnson
11-22-2000, 04:48 PM
Terry,
Absolutely! Your imput is invaluable here. You work with these pigments every day and are our resident expert on pastel creation. Please feel free to contribute your suggestions and thoughts here.
Diane

bk7251
11-22-2000, 07:52 PM
I think the best way to find out what colors you need is by trial and error. Whenever I've purchased boxed sets, I found that there were some colors I never used at all, and some I used up quickly and needed to replace. (And some I thought I'd never use that eventually turned out to be indespensable)

I live not far from New York, so there are good art supply stores where I can see and touch the colors for myself. Seeing them first hand is really the best way to figure out what you need - the right colors will 'speak' to you. (If, like me, though, you have low resistance to the siren call of so many gorgeous colors speaking at once - well, it can end up being rather expensive. After my last trip to New York Central Art Supply, my wife said to me, "I don't want to hear another word about how much I spend on shoes").

But if you don't live close to such a store, you can get hand made color charts for several brands from Dakota Art Pastels. I find them quite helpful when I don't have time to go into the city.

There is one advantage of buying a boxed set, however. You can end up with a really nice box that you couldn't get any other way. My favorite is the wooden box from Senellier's sets of 100 pastels. It's very light weight - perfect for traveling. The fact that some colors are not what you might want is offset by the savings of buying them in a set, rather than open stock.


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Barry Katz

Dano
11-26-2000, 08:29 PM
Also as far as Boxes go, Schmincke makes a 45 60 and 90 set "Empty" boxes, I believe we can order them from Dakota also. Web sites: http://www.schmincke.com/
go to Products, then pastels, then boxes way down about middle of page for info on boxes

Dano

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bk7251
11-26-2000, 11:49 PM
Good point. I bought a couple of those empty Schminke boxes, myself, from Dakota in different sizes. I use one to keep my Diane Townsend pastels in. Actually, I think I'll start a new thread on pastel storage. It would be interesting to hear how others deal with this.

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Barry Katz