Examine your motives

[erik_satie_rolls]

I want to qualify this by saying post by saying that I'm 46, I've gotten my BFA and MFA, and that I haven't been particularly successful in making art into my first career.

What I do have to offer, is to suggest to the young people here to really examine your motives for majoring in art in college. Those motives will help you decide what kind of school you want to go into.

The field of 'fine' art, - as in gallery placements, teaching placements, and grants,- is extremely competitive. Many of those who are 'successes' are the lucky ones who have used their prestigious schooling to forge contacts and carve a place for themselves at the upper rungs of a long, extremely narrow ladder.

On the flip side, maybe you are going into art because you are passionate about it. You don't care if you become a 'success'. You just want great instruction and to be around other people who share your passion.

If that sounds like what you want, then my suggestion is to go visit those places that you can afford and might have a chance of winning admission to. Talk with students , especially seniors and graduate students, about the program there, and what they like about it, as well as what they dont like.

There is no substitute for personal research like this. But first, know your motives.

I hope this saves you some time.

Dan

[MikeN]

Originally posted by erik_satie_rolls
I want to qualify this by saying post by saying that I'm 46, I've gotten my BFA and MFA, and that I haven't been particularly successful in making art into my first career.

The field of 'fine' art, - as in gallery placements, teaching placements, and grants,- is extremely competitive. Many of those who are 'successes' are the lucky ones who have used their prestigious schooling to forge contacts and carve a place for themselves at the upper rungs of a long, extremely narrow ladder.

There is no substitute for personal research like this. But first, know your motives.

I hope this saves you some time.

Dan

Wonderful post Dan.

I have heard people ask young students what they will do for a living after school is finished. Many times the student replies "teach" and boasts that at least they are making money. NEWS FLASH! There are too few teaching jobs. In many cases there are HUNDREDS of MFAs competing for one job.

Think about how you will repay the large debt you accumulated while in art school.

As I have mentioned before an MFA in graphic design might be an execption. Otherwise I would recommend art education. The highschool network might not be soo saturated but I dont know this for certain.

Think are research!

Mike

[mame]

Ya never know.....
A corporate drop out I finally listened to the muse and began my formal art education in my 40's. I chose the degreed route because I had to catch up technically, fast. I chose to return to my "home town" not prestigious university for the BFA because my mother lived there and I could attend as a resident (cheaper tuition, fairly low cost of living).

I had no "career" motive other than I wanted/needed to make art and wanted the foundation academia provides re the basics, knowledge/application of materials, opportunities to experiment within various genres, i.e., sculpture, ceramics, painting, printmaking, etc., studio space 24 hours a day, and of course contacts and avenues for growth.

I then applied and was accepted into a highly competitive MFA program in a very good university

I learned over time that those who chose to teach art don't make it (art) much. I have several school friends who now teach in universities and high schools and their own art plays second fiddle to the commitment to the teaching of it.

I decided to do whatever it took to "work" at the art. I have worked and still work at low level, minimum wage part time jobs to get through the dry times (right now, with the economy, things are tough).

I decided to not worry about it, make my own art, live frugally if I needed to, be stubborn and stay committed, play it out and let the cards fall where they may.

I'll never be a "star"/New York hot shot, be in a fancy art mag or in the history books.

I'm currently in a couple of higher end galleries. I do all right. I don't worry about it. I just make art and the universe takes care of the rest (and sometimes I clean hotel rooms or scrub toilets for a few months to keep the school loans paid up). I have no regrets.

[Doppelganger]

Personally that's why I haven't switched my major to art. Right now I major in Computer Science, but I will eventually get an art degree. However, it's very hard to earn a living as a traditional artist, most of whom do so based on their luck. Some of the most talented artists I've seen are struggling, while others who are less talented/educated are making a very nice living.

So unfortunetly I can't base my career on luck. Whether I make money from art I can still make art (or the closest I can get to art). I was raised in poverty, I had a horrible childhood (not solely because of poverty), and I was homeless at 13. Although I have learned not to put a high value on material possessions I eventually want to have a family and I don't want them to experience the childhood I have.

So the bottom line for me is that I can still make art, still learn about art, and still be creative even if I'm not making money from it. I'm also not the strongest artist in the world, so it's probably best that I stick with computers.

[KamaraDesigns]

HI Mame,

Good for you!! Corporate dropout here too. I'm planning on attending my 'hometown' local school as well for an MFA. It's not prestegious but respectable and affordable. The most important part is that I will be able to pursue what I am passionate about...painting. I have tried for 10 years not to be an artist because I was so afraid of not being able to support myself. All careers are competitve...there are NO fields you can go into where a job or lifestyle is guarenteed. I've chosen finally to do what calls me, what I'm passionate about, and take my chances. I've tried the other path and was miserable. I hope to teach anywhere I can find a place or to get involved in art advocacy and promoting arts as a necessity in our society. I think our culture is turning away from art (theater and dance as well as painting and sculpture) at an alarming rate in the pursuit of reality TV (the world of fluff). I was shocked to find out that my old High School had cut it's art program from its curriculum. I was also shocked to find a number of schools around the country had done the same. I suppose I shouldn't have been because this has been going on for awhile. Before I get off topic though my point is I plan on going out there and carving out my living any way I can with my art in any aspect I can create. If I can teach, I'll teach. If I can write, I'll write...but I will always paint and I will always be involved in art.

My sig. other recently reached a pinnacle in his career. It took him 20 years but he's made it to the top of his specialty. Now that's he's made it he's looking around and doesn't like what he sees. He's poured twenty years of his life and himself in pursuit of a goal that is turning out not to be what he believed it to be. So what's he doing...he's changing his environment. He's taken some risks, reached out to some of his associates, and he's trying to turn things around. I know I'm being a bit vague here but what I'm trying to say to anyone reading this post is make your career (don't let it make you) and make sure you're passionate about it. There isn't a place you can go where it isn't competitive..and it's not going to get any less competitive in any field (except maybe healthcare...but you won't get paid there either) as long as there is a global economy...but that's an entirely different topic ;) !!!

[kare]

Over here in Oz, most teachers and lecturers at art college stress that a degree in fine arts to become a teacher, has nothing to do with art. It is about teaching.

They learn technique in the class, but don't do much on the practical side of things.

A friend of mine who got her MFA only did it to have the certificate, so she could show those interested in her art that she had been to college.. I don't think this idea is bad altogether, though I wouldn't do it to please other people like that.

So what can we study, if we don't want to be teachers??

Alot of artists around the world managed just fine teaching themselves. I'm paying a few hundred to attend an art course, one night a week for four months.. they teach you all about technique, application methods and it's all hands on work too!

That's all I want to do :)

~ciarrai.

[Classical Vince]

<---------Future Corporate Drop-Out. Until then...Im a whore.

[KamaraDesigns]

Originally posted by Classical Vince
<---------Future Corporate Drop-Out. Until then...Im a whore.

Nothing wrong with being Corporate. My husband is a writer at heart but Corporate everyday. He has been able to mingle the two and found ways to make his career worth getting up at 4am for a daily two hour commute. I admire and respect my husband for that, being able to create an environment he's happy in eventhough it wasn't the path he started on or envisioned (he was a journalism major). He's carved out a satisfying role for himself..and continues to do so everyday. I, on the other hand, was not so successful at being happy in my corporate career..whew I'm glad I'm outta there!! ;)

Kim

[Classical Vince]

Kamara.

Nothing wrong is absolutely CORRECT! I get reminded of that every two week$.

Although its rough sometimes to work fooltime and go to school, I find much more peace at the end of the day than I ever did simply doing the grind everyday.

I'd rather sell-out on my day job than my art. I consider myself fortunate enough to have a job that affords me this liberty.

I would hate to be forced to work on fashion-trendy images - just couldnt pay me enough (well, maybe - send me a bid!). If my work sells and I can one day give up that day job it will be because I remained true to myself and my art. People will be attracted to it for this very reason.

Your husband sounds like a creative man and I admire his passion.

[KamaraDesigns]

If my work sells and I can one day give up that day job it will be because I remained true to myself and my art.

Stick to that!! To many people pay this lip service and rationalize there actions into some shadow of the truth.

BTW - I read your posts about the classical teaching and I have to agree with you. I think some artists today, in a search to do something new and groundbreaking for recognition, have abandoned the structure on which all art was built....and they're turning out garbage. They are making art for the art dealers, gallery owners, and every other middle man who is not an artist. They are not staying true to their art...it becomes about recognition.....and in that process they are giving up their power to those middlemen who are not artists (by artists I mean those who only read about art not create it...I think everyone has an artist in themselves but most people choose to ignore that part of themselves)

....and on I ramble!! :) Kim