Playing with the Angels - WIP - FINISHED!

[allydoodle]

I just started working on this commission today. This is of a beloved wife that passed away suddenly a few years ago. Her husband has asked me to do this portrait for him, and I feel honored to do so. The photo I'm working from is a black and white that he took of her probably 30 years ago. It is a beautiful photo, but as you can see the composition is complicated.

I don't know if you can make it out, but there is a harp sketched in that will have to be included. He did tell me what colors her clothes were, as well as the harp, and I do have some color photos to use for skin tones and hair color.

Size is 11"x14", and the paper is Wallis Belgium Mist. I'm currently using pastel pencils which include Derwent, Carb Othello, Conte and Koh-i-noor Gioconda.

I already see some things that need tweaking, more to get the likeness than anything else. The nose needs a small adjustment to its shape and the shading isn't quite right, and the cheek line needs to be softened and moved a bit.

Thanks so much for looking. This looks to be another journey, I have an intense need to be absolutely perfect (no pressure :eek: ), this painting is very important to my client.

C&C always appreciated.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/14-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels.jpg

[NC-artist]

Not qualified to C&C but so far this looks like the beginning of a masterpiece and I can't wait to see the finale.

[granddad]

The face is beautiful already. Can't wait to see the finished piece. james

[barriespapa]

Wow Chris you courage is equalled only by your talent, this is quite an under taking can't wait for more.

[equinespirit]

How exciting! this is going to be amazing! :clap: :clap: :clap:

I love watching paintings come to life like this and this is already looking like it is going to be one very special painting.

[tulabula]

Stunning so far, can't wait to see the rest!

[SherryC]

This looks like something one of the old masters is doing. Wow

[Dougwas]

You are off to a great start, Chris. I will be watching for updates.

Doug

[catgabriel]

This is going to be wonderful, I can't wait to see how it progresses!

[bluefish]

this gentlemen is going to cherish this painting and it will be a keepsake.....

beautiful job so far.......this has to be a very special work and you are painting it with love....wonderful job.....

[KD Art]

Gosh this is lovely. What a responsibility but you are handling it with finesse. So looking forward to updates. Kat

[LadyMadonna]

This is haunting and quite beautiful already.

[kaylao]

I feel your heart wanting this to please, and that tenderness is jumping off the page, I love your beginning!
Smiles, Kayla

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Lyn. I don't know about a masterpiece, I just hope it is everything he hopes for.

Thank you James. She was quite beautiful, both at a young age and later in life.

You're too funny David. I'm not sure about that, maybe my courage is equalled more by my insanity! Actually, I fell in love with the photo but I knew it was going to be a challenge, I hope I'm up for it :crossfingers: .

Thank so much Sarah. It is fun to watch things unfold, I do have a vision in my head, hopefully it will work out on paper.

Thank you tulabula, I appreciate it.

Thanks so much Sherry, what a nice thing to say!

Thank you Doug, I appreciate it.

Thanks Cat, you and me both!

Thanks so much 'blue. I truly hope so, my goal is to record a moment in time for him in a way the camera cannot. Hopefully I will.

Thanks very much Kat. You nailed it, a big responsibility for sure. I felt it the moment I met him and saw the photo, but I had to do this, I felt compelled.

Thanks Donna, yes haunting in many ways....

Thank you Kayla, it means so much that you see that in my work, exactly what I want to portray, along that moment in time that is captured in the photo.

[Mstechart]

Great start and I agree he will cherish this!! Your heart is in it and it shows.

[Turpintine45]

Wow Chris this is going to be beautiful. A very special painting to be treasured. I love the mood that is coming through already.

[rsmith.1141]

Wow, Chris. This is going to be stunning! Can't wait.

[robertsloan2]

Great start! I love the look of concentration on her face. This one's going to be spectacular.

[barriespapa]

Come on Chris were all waiting and cheering you on
David

[Ruthie57]

I can't wait to see this develop Chris. I feel like the others....it's going to be special! No pressure from us then???..........

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Sandie. I do believe you are right, the client touched my heart and I find myself in a different place when I'm painting it.

Hey Jen, thanks so much. I am enjoying this so far.

Thank you Randy, I really appreciate it.

Thanks Robert, it looks like she was "in a moment" while playing her music in the photo, glad it's coming through.

You are too funny David! I'll have another update, though small, shortly :D.

Thanks Ruthie, Nah....., you guys keep me going and focused, you're all great!

[allydoodle]

Okay, another update here. Just a bit more done, I'm going back to it now so hopefully I'll have more later. The lighting in my studio is a bit different today, I hope the colors come through okay. Still not sure about the nose, may need more tweaking......

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_2.jpg

[JudyG]

Chris, it is stunning already. I can't wait to see it develop. You do absolutely beautiful work. And I think you are very brave to do this. I did a portrait of a 2 year old girl who had passed away and I was terrified that it wouldn't be perfect enough.

[Ruthie57]

Chris, she was so beautiful wasn't she? I'm so interested to see how you are going about this. In a landscape you would never consider doing one area to almost a finish before you started the rest would you? I can see why though. The face is the most important part of this complex painting so you need to get that in first so you can set the rest of the scene accordingly....right?
Now, those strings....I am sure you will not be showing us the whole of every string on the harp. I am so full of anticipation to see how you'll handle that!!!

[John Palmer Fine Art]

This is an incredibly beautiful painting so far Chris and also very moving, knowing the back story. I can see why you have tackled the most important part first and it has made a wonderful portrait. As far as I can see you are on the home run now, as with your skills the rest will be easier now you have the face completed. Just take your time and I am sure the rest will flow naturally.

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Judy. This is a difficult one to do for sure, hopefully I can pull it off. I'm thinking positively :D .

Hi Ruthie, OMG, she was so beautiful, even when she died. This is her about 30 years ago, georgous. I know, I know, I know......... I was wondering if anyone would notice this different approach. I approach portrait commissions so differently from my landscapes and still life. I do tend to get tighter, I actuallly seem to not be able to help it. If I do a portrait for myself I have a different approach and I can get much looser. I guess commissions have to be "just so". I do feel I have to get her face right, otherwise nothing else matters. That is what the client looks at first. No use spending time on other things, to then mess up the face. As far as the strings, well, I'm open to suggestions :lol: , as I have no idea! Part of me is going crazy right now, I'm sort of avoiding those strings for the moment......... Because I'm using pastel pencils for this one, I'm hoping I can pull it off. A ruler may turn out to be my best friend when all is said and done....... Keep your fingers crossed :crossfingers: because I really am not sure how I'm going to approach those strings....

[allydoodle]

This is an incredibly beautiful painting so far Chris and also very moving, knowing the back story. I can see why you have tackled the most important part first and it has made a wonderful portrait. As far as I can see you are on the home run now, as with your skills the rest will be easier now you have the face completed. Just take your time and I am sure the rest will flow naturally.

Thanks John, we cross-posted! Yes, her face is the most important part, got to get that right first. From the beginning I've felt that her face was going to be easier than the harp, that harp has me worried. It's the srings that concern me. I'll just tread slowly, it should all come together somehow (thinking positively :smug: :thumbsup: .)

[Barbara WC]

Chris-

This is stunning- she really is angelic! I love the skin tones you've created. I'm taking note, because I want to do something similar of an old black and white photo of my mom when she was a child...

About her nose you keep mentioning. What I see is that maybe her right eye (on our left) seems to be higher than the left- and given the way you've painted the rest of her face, it doesn't seem the head tilt matches with the level of that back eye. It's hard to tell, it could be the nose, but you might take a look at the reference photo again. It looks to me if you brought her right eye and eyebrow down a bit, the rest of the face would fall into place, including the nose.

I don't envy you the work on those strings!

This is going to be beautiful- with a start like this, your client is going to love it! :thumbsup:

Barbara

[Ruthie57]

Chris. I don't know whether the BG will be dark or light in this. All I can say is don't show every line of every string....it will look contrived and wrong somehow. Maybe in the photo you can see them all but, think about what the eye sees. Looking at a woman playing a harp the eye would focus on the woman. The viewer would be aware of the harp and the surroundings but would not see every string in detail. My feeling would be to have a dark BG and just show glimmers of the strings where light is reflected off them. The viewer will add the missing bits to imagine the strings in their entireity.
Hope this helps! Maybe practice effects on a separate piece of paper.

Also, I agree with Barbara, the eye on our left does look a tad too high for the angle of the face.

[equinespirit]

Beautiful! and such a moving piece already. :heart:
Also probably answers a question that I have been thinking of posting ( dont like to post too many a day :lol: ) about how people tackle hair.
Im thinking you arent doing the hairs over the skin but doing them separately?
That must be difficult and time consuming?
Do you always do it like that or do you sometimes draw over the skin?
Im tending to draw over but its difficult to have enough tooth even on sanded for hair over horse hairs :o

BTW you are brave leaving the bit you are unsure of till last, I tend to do that first ( if theres only one , often its the whole thing :lol: ) so I can throw it away if it doesnt work without wasting hours of hard work.

[John Palmer Fine Art]

You have already made a great job on the strings Chris, including the bends where the fingers are plucking, so all you have to do now is colour them in!
Seriously, whatever straight edge you used has worked fine, the only tip I can offer is to use a straight edge with the lowest profile possible ( i.e. the thinnest material, it doesn't have to be a ruler ) so that you can see exactly where the extremely sharp pencil point you will be using is without a shadow being cast over it which can occur with a thicker instrument.

[allydoodle]

You have already made a great job on the strings Chris, including the bends where the fingers are plucking, so all you have to do now is colour them in!
Seriously, whatever straight edge you used has worked fine, the only tip I can offer is to use a straight edge with the lowest profile possible ( i.e. the thinnest material, it doesn't have to be a ruler ) so that you can see exactly where the extremely sharp pencil point you will be using is without a shadow being cast over it which can occur with a thicker instrument.

Ahhhhh......, I see John. Thank you so much, you probably saved me from a bit of trouble there. Low profile straight edge, that makes sense. My biggest problem after that is the background behind the strings, not sure what color. I do have to keep it very dark I think, as the harp itself is a light blonde colored wood, and the strings (at least most of them) are of a light value.

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger? Isn't that what they say? :lol: :lol: :lol:

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Barbara. I see that, you are right that something is a bit off, and it turns out I think it's the angle of that eye (her right, our left). The angle of the top line of the eyelashes needed a tweak, I think I got it. Measuring came up fine for the location, and when I really scrutinized it, the angle was off. Let me know what you think when I post another update.

Hey Ruthie, that's pretty much what I was thinking. I just don't know how it will look as I've never done this before. I don't plan on showing every string, at least not strongly. Just glimmers of light, hopefully that will work. And I'm leaning toward a dark background, at least at the bottom left section, not the whole background dark.

Thanks very much Sarah. When I do hair, I sort of work back and forth where the skin meets the hair. I tread carefully(I do have a light touch which helps) and work back and forth between the skin tone and hair strands, changing pencils constantly. As far as what to paint first, I really have to make sure this angel looks perfect before tackling the harp. It's really the strings I'm not sure about, but the harp I think should be fine. Keep your fingers crossed :crossfingers: .....

Back to work now.... I put in her hair and now I'm starting the scarf on her head.....

[equinespirit]

Thanks Chris , and you see, you do have the confidence to know that you will make a beautiful job of ths strings really :wink2:

[Barbara WC]

Chris-

I was thinking about the strings- you've had some good suggestions. I also realized, it is a similar problem I had when painting a watercolor painting of the Golden Gate Bridge. I intially painted straight lines for the vertical cables and hated it- too much attention was drawn to them, and not the rest of the bridge.

I redid the painting, and ended up with a "broken" vertical line- not painting the whole line, but "skipping" with the paintbrush so the line was more like irregular "dashes". I varied where the "dashes" were between the cables so it didn't look to regular. It worked well, and actually gave some depth to the cables. This might be something to try on a scrap piece for those strings?

I agree with your comment about keeping the area behind the strings dark- it would set off the harp beautifully!

Good luck with those strings!

Barbara

[allydoodle]

Exactly, Barbara, I called them glimmers of light. To get that I would break up the lines so they're not as obvious, but you know they are there. That is my plan anyway, I'm thinking it will work.

I'm doing her scarf right now, and the husband wants it red and white (that is what is was IRL), I have no leeway on that. I have a question: How do you make red not a focal point :lol: ? Thank goodness it's on her head, so her face is right there next to it. It does look nice though, I have to admit. Hopefully it will all work out.....

[rugman]

wow, beautiful already! Red and white scarf, Im sure you'll figure out how to make it work. (lots of help I am! NOT) Since its on her head, it may work out perfect to add to focal area. Going to be fun to watch this. Now you have more pressure with all of us "watching" you LOL.

[barriespapa]

Hi Chris this is really shaping up I agree that her right eye what shows is ever so slightly hiher than should be The eyelash however looks okay. About The strings I like Ruthies idea but I am quite sure I wouldn't be able to pull that off either. lol. Is it just me but I am seeing her face colouring as looking some what rashy looking. I kind of hate pointing something out to artists that are so much better than myself. But i know how important this is to you and just maybe I am correct.
David

[Kathryn Wilson]

This is going to be wonderful Chris - easy does it, one step at a time, deep breath ... good suggestions on the strings. Bg first, strings last.

Cheering you on.

[Blondgirl]

Gorgeous so far. I would love to see the finished masterpiece.

[SillyBaZilly]

Chris,

As usual, this is great. I like your placement of the cool neutrals. Can't wait to see the progress.

[Ruthie57]

Chris, try using a darker red than you think the scarf should be, or mute it a little with some green. I have done this with red in an otherwise harmonious coloured piece and it still shone out but did not jar the eye as a pure red may have done. The white, of course, does not have to be white............

[the drover's dog]

This is going so well Chris, but what a difficult subject and so many restrictions. Can't wait to see how you solve the problems. Maybe a vignette either dark or light might help solve many of them???

Dale

[ExpressiveAngie]

already takes my breath~

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Ron. I think the red scarf is going to work, you are right about it being on her head. Not really a distraction, it really works well with her very dark hair. No pressure really :eek: , you guys wouldn't do that to me would you????:evil:

Thank you David. Believe it or not I do think it was the angle of the eyelashes on her right eye that was off, it can take the smallest thing to make the biggest difference when it comes to portraits. Hopefully I'm right. Her skin doesn't look 'rashy' IRL, maybe it's the camera picking up all the warm reds and pinks I used. I do tend to use a lot of warm tones when painting portraits. I hope it looks okay now, I think I got a pretty good pic.

Thanks so much for your vote of confidence Kat. Truly appreciated. The best advice I've gotten so far is yours - "breathe" :eek: . I gotta remember to do that!

Thank you Blondgirl, I don't know about a masterpiece, but I'm workin' on it!

Thanks so much Corey. Nice to see you back!

Hey Ruthie, thanks so much! I'm using every red pencil I own, plus violets and blues. And no true white, I rarely if ever use it. Maybe for the last highlight on an eye or a highlight in a still life. Her shirt will be a study in "whites", using no white, it is a white shirt. I cannot deviate from the colors, the hubby told me what color everything was (I'm working from a black and white photo).

Thanks very much Dale. I know it sounds like a lot of restrictions, but the photo itself is old but an excellent composition. Great 'bones', so to speak. And the colors he wanted (what it was in real life actually) of the items in my mind seem fine, which is why I agreed to it (and other reasons as well). I'm not sure how I'm going to resolve this as it goes foreward. Sometimes things just resolve themselves as I plod along, hoping for that same resolution here. Thinking positive!

Thanks so much Angie, what a nice thing to say!

[allydoodle]

Another update. I put in some of her hair, and I have started the scarf. It seems that red is actually a great color for it, I think because it is near her face. Against the dark hair it seems to work well (which is probably why she wore it, she new she looked good!). It's a lot of work trying to get the pattern right. If it weren't so important to get that pattern spot on, I would just paint the scarf and indicate some sort of pattern. But........ not to be with this one, the pattern needs to be spot on. No loosey goosey here. I am finding it a bit of fun and somewhat therapeudic too, relaxing to paint it.

I noodled with her right eye (eyelashes actually) by changing the angle. I think it worked. I can still go back to it later if I need to, but for now I'm moving on. The more I get in the more it will all make sense. There are some cast shadows on the left side of her fact that I have to put in. They will help to shape her face and nose, but I'm not doing it yet.

I also just saw something I want to change on her hair (bangs), will tend to that as well. A small thing, I tend to be picky.......

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_3.jpg

[chewie]

already beautiful and her face is showing plenty of emotion.

[Ruthie57]

Yep, the red's fab! picks up the warm tones in her face a treat. Why ever were you worried about that scarf??? lol

[barriespapa]

I think the scarf is perfect just the right tone. Sorry about the rash comment
must be the colouring in my computer, lap top. Really looking great Chris
David

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Chris, I appreciate it!

Thank you Ruthie, the red works well doesn't it? Hubby remembered what color it was, it must have been something she wore often. I don't know why I was worried, :confused: , maybe that pattern had something to do with it :eek: :lol: !

Hey David, no worries :heart: . If you see something, say something, it can't hurt to mention it in case there is an issue. I always appreciate comments, yours was no problem at all. I always find that no matter how much care I take when photographing my artwork, there is always some nuance that does or doesn't show up. Often times I can adjust it on the computer and get it pretty close to the real thing. In the end I have to go with how it looks IRL of course, so I'm always at the mercy of my camera. I do think my camera likes reds and blues for some reason. I'm glad you're liking the scarf!

Now back to painting.........

[Julia Whitenight]

I rated this thread because it looks like it's going to be an excellent learning tool. I really like WIPs where the artist is feeling their way through a new problem (or two!) with a chorus of suggestions. Given the size you're working, the pencils and hard sticks as a medium, and the subject, this WIP is incredibly relevant to me personally. So glad you're doing this!

And it is indeed progressing nicely. I'm with Barbara on the strings -- practice on another paper!

[csumart]

Beautiful start, I can't wait to see it as it progresses.

[allydoodle]

Thank you so much Julia. I'm glad you're enjoying the WIP. For the record, so far all I've used are pastel pencils on this. I'm not really fond of hard pastels, I rarely use them. I usually use pastel pencils and the medium soft to real softies. I know, a crazy combination but it works for me. I may use softies for the background and pencils for the rest. At least that's what I'm thinking right now. Not sure how I'll get the strings in, but I'll figure it out.

Thanks very much csumart, hopefully I'll have another progress photo this weekend.

[equinespirit]

I still love it of course :D
What a treat for us to share this unfolding along with you. :thumbsup:

[lorna12]

This is going to be so beautiful and a treasured keepsake for her husband.

I was brought to this thread by one of the many glitches this site has...the link in an email notification to a thread of my own in the scratchboard forum bought me here instead...but I'm glad I got to see this and will follow along now.:D

[Lynndidj]

Wow Chris - you have a doozy here. It is looking great so far. Can't wait to see your progression as you get the harp in there. All of those strings ... yikes! This is going to be a beautiful portrait - your client is going to love it.

Lynn

[allydoodle]

Thank you Sarah. I'm taking my time with this, working things out as I go. Thanks for hanging in there!

Wow, lorna, thanks so much. That's crazy! I appreciate your following this, it is turning out to be a journey, and I'm enjoying the process.

Hi Lynn, a doozie for sure! But I truly am enjoying it, it's proving to be quite an experience. Somehow she is watching over my shoulder while I paint, making sure I get it right. I swear she is.

[allydoodle]

Hello everybody. I'm back with an update. I posted an update this past Saturday, but it got lost with all the other dropped posts that day :( . Hopefully this one will stick.

I just found out that she never liked the photo that I'm painting this from. Her husband said it was never displayed in the home. He took the photo and always liked it, and when she died he put it in a frame to hang up. It's very strange because ever since I started painting this I've had this 'feeling' about getting it just right, perfect actually (or as perfect as art can be, if you know what I mean). I almost feel like she is making sure I get it right, that it is as important to her as it is to him, because she didn't like the photo. It's a very unusual feeling, I can't explain it, especially since I've had this intense need to get it perfect from the very beginning, before I knew she didn't like it.

Somehow the painting looks both the same yet different from the photo, more life-like somehow. The photo is black and white, and I'm painting the objects the colors the husband said they were.

Anyway, here is where I'm at right now. The scarf is in, I may noodle with it as things progress but for now I'm moving on to the rest of her hair and her shirt. The shirt will be white, but not really "white", if you know what I mean. I'll be using nuances of light tones, probably some neutrals and soft tones. No real white.

As always, C&C appreciated. Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/19-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_4.jpg

[BeckyMc]

Beautiful!

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
the bottom of her nose from the tip back to the nostril is flat
and the arc of the eyelash of her right eye is backwards
- but i only mention that because it looks like there's
serious detail work behind those spots .
> nail down one thing rather fight with two .

bringing the violet from the face into the scarf is just right !

Ed :}

[jknecht]

This is absolutely phenomenal. I'm really enjoying watching this progress.

[allydoodle]

Thank you Becky!

Thanks Ed. I do know about the nose, I just can't work on it until I get to working on what's behind it, so for now I'm leaving it. As far as her right eye, (the far side eye, or our left) I have the arc of the eyelash like a "U" flattened out a bit. I don't think that's upside down is it? Upside down would mean it's like an upside down flattened "U" so to speak? Not sure what you mean there. This painting isn't all that big really, the entire size is 11"x14", which makes the length of her face is only 2 1/8" measuring from the bottom of her bangs (hair) to the bottom of her chin. It's hard to get too much more detail, though I think the arc of the eyelash is there. Maybe I need to add a bit more of an arc so it shows better.

Edit to add: I just put a magnifying glass on it :eek: , I swear I did, and maybe the arc is off a tad. I swear, just a tad. Man Ed, how did you see that? You have good eyes :lol: , I'm gonna have to fix it using the magnifying glass - crazy :eek: ! I don't want to paint this using a magnifying glass, that's just nuts!:lol:

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much jknecht, I appreciate it!

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
thx Chris :)
- magnifyers ...
been there ( tho not with that detail i threaded awhile back :) )
my bad with phrasing .

with this pose/angle , the eye/eyelid/lash is three dimensional
rather than profile or full face ,
so the lashes build on the arc .
- think of a curve of railroad tracks/ties going back into distance .

enough ! :)

Ed :}

[equinespirit]

Chris, put the magnifying glass away! :eek: :eek: :eek: :lol:

There is a chap who occasionally posts graphite work on the A&W board, his work is superb and I asked him how he got such results.
He told me that he took around 300 hours filling the tooth and worked with a magnifying glass to make sure there were no white spots left.
So I had a go at this :cool: was not a good plan :lol:

[allydoodle]

Got it Ed, not sure if my pencil will be sharp enough. Will give it a try though. I think I've got the essence, so I won't kill myself trying to noodle that much.


Chris, put the magnifying glass away! :eek: :eek: :eek: :lol:

There is a chap who occasionally posts graphite work on the A&W board, his work is superb and I asked him how he got such results.
He told me that he took around 300 hours filling the tooth and worked with a magnifying glass to make sure there were no white spots left.
So I had a go at this :cool: was not a good plan :lol:

Too funny Sarah! Don't worry, the magnifying glass is gone, I just can't go there. It takes all the fun out of it, this is about as tight as I want to get. My pastel pencil painting is much tighter than my paintings with the sticks. I draw the line at magnifying glasses though :lol: .

[bluefish]

Chris......it's not easy to paint an angel because they are right there looking over your shoulder......but she is very happy with this, because you are doing a wonderful job and it will please him.......:thumbsup:

[LadyMadonna]

She is beautiful and already is telling me a sad story.

[equinespirit]

Got it Ed, not sure if my pencil will be sharp enough. Will give it a try though. I think I've got the essence, so I won't kill myself trying to noodle that much.




Too funny Sarah! Don't worry, the magnifying glass is gone, I just can't go there. It takes all the fun out of it, this is about as tight as I want to get. My pastel pencil painting is much tighter than my paintings with the sticks. I draw the line at magnifying glasses though :lol: .

Phew! :lol:

[lorna12]

Too funny Sarah! Don't worry, the magnifying glass is gone, I just can't go there. It takes all the fun out of it, this is about as tight as I want to get. My pastel pencil painting is much tighter than my paintings with the sticks. I draw the line at magnifying glasses though :lol: .

:lol: I use a magnifying glass almost all the time! But then I'm not as young as I once was. (neither are my eyes)

Are ya done yet?:wink2: :D

[barriespapa]

You are doing just great Chris Don't think for a minute you need a magnifying glass Just relax take a deep breath and exhale. This painting is going to be just awesome.
David

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much 'blue. She definitely is looking over my shoulder, I can feel it. There is a sense of presence when I'm painting this(no, I'm not crazy!).

Thanks very much Donna. There is definitely a lot of emotion in the photo, I'm glad it's coming through in the painting.

Hey Sarah, double Phew ! :lol: :lol:

Hi Lorna, nope, not quite done yet! It might be a while!

Thank you David. I just can't go the way of a magnifying glass, that's taking it too far! I'll just paint the way I do with my own two eyes! And yes, I must breathe!

[ArtsyPatrice]

This is beautiful, Chris! You have lots of patience and this is top quality work!

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Patrice, I appreciate it!

[Turpintine45]

I know I said something before but it is a beautiful painting and I am sure it will give great joy to her husband.

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Jen, I appreciate it!

[SherryC]

Chris, in my dining room I have an oil portrait of a beautiful lady that I met who has no living relatives who wanted the painting. It was painted over 50 years ago in Italy. I found the portrait to be haunting and beautiful and asked to buy it. She ended up giving it to me and I promised I would tell everyone who sees it who she is so she would not be forgotten. It is one of my most prized possessions.

Your portrait has that same haunting beautiful quality! This is the highest praise I can give you on this great work.

[SherryC]

Here is the portrait I mentioned last night. I could not get it to attach. Isn't she beautiful? SHe is in her late 70's now or maybe early 80's. 692614

[Merethe T]

Wow wow wow, Chris - this is going to be an outstanding portrait, excellent work!! I'm late to the party, intentionally as I didn't want to wait for an update... :lol:

I'm not going to give any critique, I'm just gonna sit back and enjoy this come to life - and after that I'll use the inspiration you give to pick up my pastels again. I've been through a little dry spell and you're bringing back the fun and joy of pastels with this work - thank you!

So, update soon.....? ;)

[Dancing Rabbit]

From what I have seen so far, this is going to be a beautiful tribute, it brings tears to my eyes just thinking about it :heart:

[Barbara01]

This is outstanding work, the level of detail is mind boggling...a magnifying glass, oh my goodness! lol

It's interesting how you talk about feeling like she's there with you, helping you sort of. I've had that feeling with certain subjects before, sort of like a greater authority guiding your hand.

I'll be sure to check back.

[Illyan]

It is already a good painting, I can´t wait to see it finished!

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Sherry. What a story, and what a beautiful woman. Keeping that painting keeps her spirit alive, and when she's gone a part of her will still be here. That is such a nice tribute you promised her, something very special Sherry. Thanks so much for sharing it with us.

Thanks so much Merethe. I sometimes think I've lost my mind, saying yes to this commission was both crazy and important. The 'important' took over of course, and as a result I'm enjoying the process much more than I thought I would. I sure hope you start painting again soon, your work is so inspiring. As far as an update, hopefully in a day or two. Life always seems to get in the way (I have a 14 year old daughter, need I say more :lol: ?). I started to put in her shirt, and I want to get more of her hair done, as well as her arm. Tomorrow looks to be a good painting day, I'm going to huddle in my studio with some music and start painting!

Thank you Patrice, this is turning into quite a journey.

Thanks so much Barbara. Oh no, I'm not using a magnifying glass :eek: ! I use one just to try and figure out something Ed (sketchZ1ol) had mentioned, but other than that I don't think I'll be using it again! I've had this type of thing happen before, it almost seems like the painting 'paints itself' somewhat. Things fall into place, I just hope it continues that way.

Thanks so much Illyan, I really appreciate it!

[KariTirrell]

What an emotional painting! Chris, you are doing a fantastic job. I'm so looking forward to seeing this progress.

[luicre]

I always visit this great forum but due to lack of time have not been here for a while.

And I now find this great work, Chris. What a pleassure fot the eyes.

Saludos

Luicre

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Kari, I appreciate it.

Welcome back luicre! Thanks so much, I hope to see you here more often!

[luicre]

Chris, I hope too.

Some monts ago you did what I think are the most beautiful childrens`s portraits that I have ever seen. And this current one of yours is no less than those portraits. Looking forward for updates.

Saludos

Luicre

[chuas2]

Chris, how did I miss this? So lovely! It makes me sad though, this portrait of an angel.
Kris
:(

[allydoodle]

Thank you so much luicre, those girls were fun to paint! I'll be looking for you over here in pastels!

Thanks so much Kris. I know, sad in so many ways. However, I feel happy to be painting this, the client is so very excited. He is very patient, thank goodness. I told him it was going to take a while, there is so much to be done with it. As I go forward, I have to keep checking areas against each other to make sure everything is working. I already see something little on her right (our left) eye that needs a tweak, but I can't do it until I start the harp. It is a crazy way to work, very unlike my approach to landscapes, or even still life. Commission work is different somehow. He even told me the song she was playing when he took this picture, it is absoultely beautiful. I'm not sure if I should play it while I paint, I'm still pondering that.

[allydoodle]

Another update, albeit a small one. I'm now working on her shirt, not yet done. I need to put in wisps of her hair on her shoulder, as well as finish her hair, and the inside of the shirt on her sleeve may be too bright. I think it needs to be toned down a bit and worked on. Also, our left side collar of the shirt might need to be brightened a bit. Not quite there yet.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/26-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_5.jpg

[equinespirit]

:heart: :D :D
Great to see an update thanks for posting :clap: :clap:

Lovely painting you have also, Sherry :heart:

[mij]

Very beautiful lady and equally beautiful painting.
Excellent work indeed.
jimW

[allydoodle]

Thanks Sarah. I'm painting, it's just a bit slow, though I am enjoying it!

Thank you Jim, she was beautiful wasn't she?

[allydoodle]

Hello fellow dusters, I have another update. I started the harp, I had to start it to see how it might come together. It helped her face to read better, and now I have some idea of what colors I might use for it. I will have to go back to paint her arm, I think I may head there in a while. Now that she's pretty much painted, I feel more comfortable jumping around a bit.

I haven't fixed the inside of her sleeve, I think it's not quite right yet.

Thanks so much for looking!

C&C always appreciated.

Added PS on edit: I just looked at this here, and I find it so frustrating that I can never get the photo to be just right. It is a bit warmer IRL, the skin tones are so much softer. I hate when that happens :evil: . Oh well, I think you get the idea anyway.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/27-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_6.jpg

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
i see how the (ultramarine ?) blue works around
the warmth of the face and scarf .

- that right eyelash is driving me nuts !
> fights the curve of the head and features .

i'm very curious to see if the harp frame is gilt
or natural wood .

Ed :}

[allydoodle]

Thanks Ed. I wish I knew what you meant about that eyelash. I've adjusted its angle, and softened it a bit. Not seein' it. I think I'll take the reference photo and scan it, then blow it up and see if anything shows up that can give me more information. The photo is old and grainy, a bit of an issue. That was the only area that was somewhat difficult to make out. I'll let you know what I find.

[allydoodle]

Hey Ed, I scanned the reference into the computer and enlarged it to see if I could figure out the problem with that eyelash. You were right, I didn't know what was wrong so I assumed I must be seeing things (the reference is very grainy with no detail, especially with that eye). Your persistance paid off, I could somewhat make it out when I looked at the enlarged photo on the computer.

Anyway, an eyelash adjustment was in order, I'm hoping this reads right now. I took her right (our left) eyelash and moved it up and worked the angle a bit. I also darkened the area a little (the value was a bit darker in the reference), and made the eyelash a bit smaller.

I think this looks much better:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/27-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_7_eyelash_adj.jpg


I may need to tweak values a bit more, maybe indicate more of the eyelid on that eye, or maybe not because it is in shadow. The shape of those eyelashes might need a tweak also, but at least the placement is better, and the shape as well. At least I think it is.

Thanks a lot Ed, I appreciate it :D .

[SherryC]

Ed, for the benefit of those of us who are new can you explain what is wrong with the eyelash. Is it too high on her face, too low, too straight, too curved. You have an amazing eye but I am stymied on what you mean?

[Turpintine45]

I too was not sure what was bothering Ed but I can see the difference now you have changed it. I obviously have a long way to go. Great job Chris and I love how you are doing the harp.

[allydoodle]

Ed, for the benefit of those of us who are new can you explain what is wrong with the eyelash. Is it too high on her face, too low, too straight, too curved. You have an amazing eye but I am stymied on what you mean?

Hi Sherry,

The eyelash (her left, our right) was too low, and the angle wasn't right. I may need to add a bit of a curve as well, but not much. I also changed the way the lashes curved, and brought them in a bit. All these changes were minute, and I mean minute in size and placement. But, when working on a portrait, even the smallest changes make a big difference. It's even crazier when you work small as this is, the face is only 2 1/4" from the bottom of her bangs to the bottom of her chin. Not much space to make adjustments.

For the record, I was fighting the issue in my mind because I couldn't figure it out from the reference. In my heart I knew something was wrong with it, but my brain was saying "nahhhhh", because it looked close to the reference. Upon further inspection (and I mean 'inspection' :eek: ), I was able to figure it out.

A big thank you to Ed for his persistence!

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Jen. Yeah, Ed was right, and I knew it, I just had a hard time figuring out what was wrong. I sure hope I got it right now.

I'm now waiting for his eagle eye inspection...........:lol:

[Tracy Lang]

I love watching her come to life in this beautiful painting. Colors in the harp are perfect. I think you nailed the eyelash :)
Can't wait for the next update.

Tracy

[bluefish]

Chris......it is truly beautiful......you are doing a magnificent job......angels are beautiful (I have personal experience in this area) and you are bringing out all the beauty of this angel......it's such a pleasure to follow your work....

'blue....' :thumbsup:

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
Chris - thVm :)
i set close ups side-by-side ;
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/203336-summary.jpg

going to illustration by Andrew Loomis , there is this :
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/203336-planes_of_the_head.jpg
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/203336-planes_of_the_head_1.jpg
and considering eyes :
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/203336-working_eyes.jpg
this is a profile of eye with lash :
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/203336-profile_eyelash.jpg
and a lowered eyelid (note the arc and think of it reversed for the right eye)
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/203336-left_eye_w_lash.jpg
this is the best example i could find where the lash follows the orb of the eye/lid
http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/203336-_lowered_lid_w_lash.jpg

too much info ?

there is a free download of Andrew Loomis's book on the Web ,
" ...Heads and Hands... "
so i'm assuming these images don't violate copyrights
or the rights of heirs .

hope that answers questions .

Ed :}

ps. i've worked at your scale w/o pencils, and it's a bear .

[allydoodle]

Thanks Ed. The angle of the model you're showing is quite different from what I'm working on, I think Loomis' view is from the top of the head and is showing more of that right eye. The view of what I'm working on is from the side and much lower, showing much less of the eye. The curve of the eyelash would be different than Loomis' view because my view is coming from the side I think.

What I had was wrong, and I believe I'm pretty close right now. I don't have much detail because of the size, and I don't think I want to put much more detail in as it may be too much information for the size of the painting. So long as the placement of the eye is correct, and any indication of the curve is correct, I will be okay with it. If I were painting it the size of your close-ups, I would have to put much more information in, it would be necessary actually.

Again, thanks for your keen eye and persistence, I appreciate it. It forced me to face the music so to speak, and address the issue (as much as I was denying it :lol: ).

P.S. I will go to Loomis' book and see if anything else jumps out at me, just to be sure.

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Tracy, I sure hope so. I'll keep looking at that eyelash as I move forward to be sure I've got it right, but I think I'm close.

Thank you so much 'blue, you're so nice. I think we all have an angel or two in our lives, and I'm feeling privliged to paint this lady.

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
Chris - not a matter of denial , but a visual point of reference from Loomis's detailed studies of structure .

if your software can flip the lowered eyelid (with lash) ,
you will see what i was getting at .
- i don't have the tech toys , but i can imagine it .
> it was an issue i had to deal with as a builder
in assessing/visualizing architect's elevations (2-D)
in 3-D .

a bit cold .

anyway ... looking forward here :)

Ed :}

[allydoodle]

Good idea Ed, I'm gonna flip it and see what it tells me, thanks!

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
yvw :)

Ed :}

[allydoodle]

I'm baaaaack Ed.........:lol:

Flipping helped, I usually use a mirror, but didn't think of it this time, don't know why..... The computer was actually even better because I enlarged the photo reference, then flipped it, then enlarged my painting and flipped it. Compared both, and the difference was minute, yet significant. Yikes!

Anyhoooo, here is another eyelash version. I'm now calling it eyelash version number, oh I don't know, how about number 20? :lol: .

Even better, I think now. when I flip this painted version, it reads correctly, at least I think it does :eek: .

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_7a_eyelash_adj.jpg

Close-up:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_7a_eyelash_adj_2.jpg

and flipped:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_7a_eyelash_adj_3.JPG

Better, huh?

[luicre]

OMG, Chris. She looks so beautiful and so alive.

Saludos
Luicre

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Luicre!

[allydoodle]

Another update. I knew the harp was going to give me grief. I'm not sure if the dark part is too dark, I need to put more of the harp in to gauge it. I do think I need to put more of the golden colors into the dark to make it read better. When I convert this into black and white on the computer, the values to read right. I'm comparing it to the black and white reference photo I'm working from. So maybe I'm wrong. I'll just have to put more in I guess.

I'll probably start to put her arm in next, and finish the back of her shirt. Then I'll go back to the harp and see what happens. Thank goodness this is pastel, so forgiving. If I need to I can use a small bristle brush to remove some of the harp and put it in a smidge lighter. Not sure yet though.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/28-Sep-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_8.jpg

[Dougwas]

This is looking fantastic, Chris. And no alcohol involved.:wink2:

Doug

[John Palmer Fine Art]

This is a really beautiful work Chris with a classic feel to it, I am enjoying the thread very much.

[kentiessen]

It will be beautiful! If you keep your focus on the goal, and use care in each step you will be fine.

I like the color in her complexion and your work so far. Without the reference, it is a guess, but the nostril seems too visible from this angle. Also, I strongly suggest a number of drawings to refine the hands more- they are so much of this moment and should reflect her beauty and grace as much as her likeness.

[equinespirit]

Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful. :heart: :heart: :heart:
There, that was a helpful critique wasnt it? :lol:

[barriespapa]

This is going to be one fantastic painting Chris.
David

[purpleheather]

Clearly spectacular! This is exquisite!

[lorna12]

I love the feeling of this...beautiful work!

[water girl]

This is so lovely. I can't wait to see it finished. I particularly like the way you adressed her blouse. The fabric is exceptional.

[allydoodle]

Thanks Doug! Nope, no alcohol whatsoever :lol: , just me and my pastel pencils (so far anyway). The background will probably be done with some sticks, though no alcohol. I'm staying pretty conservative for this one, no crazy experiments.

Thanks so much John, I really appreciate it.

Thanks very much Ken. You might be right about her nostril, I've been looking at that and tweaking it for awhile now. Might need another tweak. I feel pretty focused on this one, just jumping from area to area very calmly, not getting too hung up or uptight. The hands right now are not toally correct, but they are close. I will be approaching them with caution and care, I agree that they are an important part of the painting. I sure hope I get it right.

Thanks Sarah, yes that was very helpful :D !

Thank you David. I sure hope so.

Thanks purpleheather, I appreciate it!

Thanks Lorna, nice to see you back!

Thanks so much Karen. I wasn't sure about the shirt at first, but I'm thinking less is more, to keep the attention focused on her face. It is really white IRL and I didn't want it to look too stark, I wanted it to be colorful but soft, so I tried to avoid too many crazy colors, used more neutrals and soft tones, but no white.

[IMaybe]

:) Wow- - - what a beautiful job you are doing, Chris I am just so surprized!! This young lady is just beautiful, you are doing so well on this, even with the small penicl points you are using! I wish you continued succsess with this amazing painting!

[etman]

nice

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Ida. She was beautiful, wasn't she? This is going to take a while, but I am enjoying the process. Believe it or not, I often times use the side of the pencil, not just the point. When I start to go crazy because I'm missing my sticks, it makes me feel like I'm using them.

Thank you etman.

[tulabula]

Wow! this absolutely gorgeous!

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much tulabula, I appreciate it. Hopefully I'll have another update in a day or so.

[mclmd]

beautiful work! This inspires a newbie like me. Seeing what is possible. Thank you. Marta

[Orchid Lady]

The skin colors and the colors in the "white" blouse are exquisite! I think that the emotion connected with this girl's story really adds to the appeal of the painting.

[allydoodle]

Thank you so much Marta, I appreciate it.

Thanks very much Orchid Lady. I was concerned the white blouse might not work, so I'm very glad I was able to figure it out.

[Merethe T]

Going so well, it will turn out just right - if someone can pull this off it is you! I'm looking in on this thread several times a day, eager for an update - you have touched me with it already....

[allydoodle]

Hi Merethe, thanks for stopping by, I really appreciate it. It's touched me as well. Still painting.....

[allydoodle]

Another update. I needed to take a mental break from this for a few days, but now I'm back into it. I've started her arm, though the subtle shadows and colors are close they're not quite there yet. I'm still working them out. I did convert this to black and white and compared it to the reference (which is black and white), and I think I've got the values right, or really close anyway. Just playing with the skin tones on her arm right now.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/05-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_9.jpg

[IMaybe]

:) So beautiful!! Amazing life-likeness, every thing is just coming along so wonderfully! Really can't wait to see the background work that you do, and how it all comes together. Will you be able to use this image for a show, perhaps?? You do deserve that , I would think, after putting all of "this" into it!!

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much IMaybe. I'm not sure what I'm doing with the background, though I may start fiddling with it soon just to see what happens.

Maybe I could use the image in an online show, something that doesn't need the actual painting displayed. I'm not sure I would ask to have it physically hang in a show though. I'd have to think about it.

[equinespirit]

The arm looks perfect already to me! Can I ask what colours you used for the skin?

[John Palmer Fine Art]

The arm is shaping up really well Chris and the skin tones are perfect.

[Dougwas]

The arm looks right on to me, Chris. This is going to be an amazing painting when it is done. It's already amazing. :thumbsup:

Doug

[Ruthie57]

Oooh, it's so exciting to watch this develop! Chris, you must start thinking about the Bg soon!!! The arm is looking great. The only thing which doesn't read right to me is where it disappears into the sleeve. I think the curve you have there may be a little too pronounced. Also I assume you'll be darkening the inside part of the sleeve.
I love this sort of WIP!

[allydoodle]

Thanks Sarah! Oh, what pastel pencils am I using for the skin? Would you believe maybe 28? I swear, it's that many. Here's the list, yikes!

8 - Carb Othellos: 722, 642, 311, 305, 310, 335, 325 and one really old one that has the number worn off - a really dark cool red

3 - Conte: 20, 48, 49

4 - Gioconda: 11, 30, 45, 3

13 - Derwents: 66f, 64b, 65b, 78d, 15b, 66d, 64d, 65f, 20f, 65d, 70d, 78b, 15d

If I have some time, I'll make a color swatch for you.


Thanks John, it's getting there slow but sure.

Thank you Doug, you're so nice!

Thanks Ruthie! I am thinking about the background, though I'm still not sure yet. I have some ideas though. I guess I'll have to start putting it in soon to see where this whole thing is headed. As far as the arm, there is a cast shadow to the right of the top of her arm, sort of inside the sleeve (where where the light hits, though it does need to be toned down a bit). I may have to lighten the arm in that spot a bit more so the cast shadow is more obvious. I've tweaked that area a couple of times now, but I know it's not right. I think I'll attend to it soon as well as the inside of the sleve (darkening it a bit) so I don't forget it. Thanks for reminding me.

[allydoodle]

A small update, worked on the arm a bit more. I still need to tweak her arm where it enters the sleeve, there is a cast shadow that is not reading right, and the inside of the sleeve is still a bit too bright. The dark area by her elbow, actually to the right of the elbow needs tweaking also, it's a bit too dark and not quite right yet. Work in progress..........

Thanks for looking!

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/07-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_10.jpg

[1onsite]

allydoodle; What an excellent and elegant start ! I too look forward to seeing the completed project.
Eliel

[luicre]

Beautiful, Chris!!!

Saludos

Luicre

[KariTirrell]

It's looking great, Chris! I love how you get so much color into the skin. Really nice work.

[Turpintine45]

Chris you are doing so well with this. I love watching her emerge.

[chuas2]

Chris, absolutely beautiful. Just beautiful...:)
Kris

[equinespirit]

Oh my goodness!! 28 colours?? :eek: :eek:
I knew skin was tricksy but that is really tricksy!
It does look absolutely superb though :heart:
Thanks for taking the time to write that out Chris. :thumbsup:

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much 1onsite, I appreciate it :) !

Thank you very much Luicre, nice to see you here :D !

Thank you Kari, I guess I'm officially a color junkie :lol: .

Thank you Jen, I really appreciate it :heart: .

Hi Kris! Thanks so much :heart: .

Hi Sarah! I know, 28 colors, isn't it crazy :eek: ? I really think I could have used others as well, but I'm pretty sure about these. Sometimes I just grab a color and try it, so long as the value is okay. So there may be some stray colors as well, just grabbing and painting and sometimes not "thinking", just painting.

Here is a copy of the colors, I put them on a piece of Canson gray paper, it's pretty close in color/value to the Belgium Mist Wallis that I'm painting on.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/09-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_skin_colors.jpg

[lorna12]

That arm reads much better where it goes into the sleeve as does the cast shadow. The brightness inside the sleeve doesn't bother my eye at all, but if it bothers you, perhaps if you added a few brighter hi-lights on the outside of the blouse it would appear be more natural?

She's looking so lovely and your colors are beautiful!

[robertsloan2]

Wow! It's coming on so beautiful!

[equinespirit]

Oooh! thank you Chris! that is really interesting to see! :thumbsup:

[Colorix]

Chris, this is fantastic! Um, I haven't read the whole thread, so I don't know if it has been talked about, but I'd like to check the hight of the far eye, brow and lashes, they seem to sit a bit high, considering the angle. I may be totally wrong, faces do funny things in perspective and with tilts and turns.

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Lorna. I seem to tweak and change things as I go along, sometimes things look fine one day, and the next I feel I need to change it. I'm moving slowly on this because things become apparent sometimes only after looking at it for a few days. I may still brighten the whole shirt just a little, it really isn't finished yet, though I know it looks like I might be. The whole thing is a work in progress even though it seems that each section is finished when they're really not.

Thanks very much Robert, I appreciate it.

Your welcome Sarah. Like I said, there may be more colors, I'm just not sure.

Thanks Charlie. If you read way back a bit in the thread, that eye has been the bain of my existence. I've adjusted, tweaked, and moved it no end. The size of her face is only 2 1/2" from the bottom of her hair bang to the end of her chin. Not much space to move in, if you know what I mean. A really small change makes a really big difference. I'm still looking at that area, as it still may need yet another tweak. I'm getting a bit frustrated with it, as you can imagine. It's so close. It is much better than it originally was, so at least I'm getting there.

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
from you post , the D pencils have a great range for flesh tones .

sticks are a pre-mix , and figuring out from there is part of
the issue with pastel , along with the surface .

i'm guessing that you have used a blue-ish cast for fabric and limbs
so that the harp frame colour(s) will compliment the focus on the face .

good input , good progress .
i'm rootin' for ya !!

Ed :}

[Pippa]

This is incredible. I am very much enjoying seeing your process! I'd also love to see the original photo when you're done. I think it's amazing that you can make the colours feel so lifelike from a black and white photo!

[allydoodle]

Thanks Ed, still plodding along. I've got some of her hand in, not quite there yet. Hopefully I'll have an update by the weekend.

Thank you Pippa. Yes, can you believe it, I'm working from a black and white photo. I'm finding it almost better, I'm not locked into colors, I can paint what I feel, which is nice. I'm not sure if I will post the whole black and white photo, maybe a small piece of it so you can see. I don't have permission to post the photo as a whole, I did not take it someone else did many years ago. I don't really want to ask permission, I don't want to put the person "on the spot", so to speak. Maybe a small section of the hand or arm, so you can see the values I'm working with, as well as the lack of clarity in the photo (not a great resolution I have to say, which does make things difficult in areas like the face and hands).

[santosi]

It’s coming very very well. I like it a lot.

[allydoodle]

I think people are curious to see the reference photo I am working from. I do not have permission to post the photo, nor do I feel comfortable asking, but I think it's probably okay to post two small sections, so you can see what I have to work with.

The first one is of her arm and hand:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_1.jpg

The second zoom is of her scarf:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/13-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_2.jpg

As you can see, the resolution is not good. I probably have just enough information to make it work, any less and I'm not sure I could have pulled it off. Okay, back to the easel, I'm working on the hand now. Hopefully I'll have an update by the weekend.

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Pedro, I appreciate it.

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
that hand/finger thing could get tricky .
the forefinger may have had rosin on the tip which would have shown up strongly with a flash .
> suggest staying with the arc of the first joints against the black .
imho ...

Ed:}

[equinespirit]

Wow! I missed that you were working from a B/W photo! ( I know I never read properly :rolleyes: )

So that means you only needed one colour for the skin afterall :evil: :lol:
Seriously, I cant even quite imagine how I would begin to bring colour into a B/W pic so even more kudos for that. :clap: :clap:

[allydoodle]

Thanks Ed, took a two day break, my head needed it. An update is not far away though.

Thanks very much Sarah. Working from a black and white is kind of neat. I guess I figured, if I can make a color photo into a black and white sketch, why not the opposite? It does give you the freedom to try some crazy things to make it work. I do like working from a black in white in landscapes, that is really a fun exercise.

Here is another small section, the eyes. This is an area which some people have questioned, and I have revised my painting because there were some issues. I think I've go it pretty close, but you can see how I don't have much to work with. To make it even more frustrating, it is hard to find a photo of something else that is similar.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_3.jpg

Okay, back to painting, I will have an update soon.

[allydoodle]

Here is another update. This one sure is going slow. I have to admint I took a few days off, this is taking a lot out of me and I'm at that point now where I don't want to rush it, bad things could happen if you know what I mean.

The arm and hand aren't done yet, there are still some specks of paper coming through and I think maybe I want to reduce that a bit more. I'm not opposed to having the paper work for you and have some bits show, but I think I need to refine this just a bit more. Some shadows need to be softened in the arm, and I might need to tone down some of the reds. The camera seems to like them, so I'll look at it IRL as well to see if they really need some softening.

Thanks for looking.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_11.jpg

[prashant11]

it's coming along very nicely...slowly but surely. :)

[Etoiledusoir]

I really like to see the progression of this pastel. The face is very well done and the colors are beautiful. It's wonderful what you are doing especially from a black and white photo. I long to see it finished, I'm sure it will be great!

[luicre]

It is like looking somebody getting alive from the paper, Chris.

Just take your time.

You are so commited and involved with this magnificent work that you surely need some rest.

Saludos

Luicre

[KariTirrell]

Her hand looks awesome! Fabulous.

[Ruthie57]

Fantastic work on the arm and hand! just check out the inner bend of her arm. see where I've indicated. It may be fine but I feel that the little crease should turn down a bit, or maybe just not go up so far.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/16-Oct-2011/189061-93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_11.jpg

[LadyMadonna]

That looks so real I am in awe of your talent.

[John Palmer Fine Art]

Another great update Chris, the flesh tones look so realistic.

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Prashant. I know it's very slow, but I am moving forward.

Thanks so much Etoiledusoir, I appreciate your nice comments!

Thanks Luicre. It really is turning into quite a project, sometimes a day or two off is just what is needed. I come back into it refreshed.

Thanks very much Ruthie. You are right, that still isn't quite correct. I actually may need to soften that area a bit more. I've been noodling with the arm for a bit, but it's almost there.

Thanks so much Donna. You're so sweet, I appreciate it.

Thank you John, with all the colors I'm using I'm glad it's coming across correctly.

[lorna12]

Great work takes time and this is great work! Still watching and enjoying.

[Colorix]

Here is another small section, the eyes. This is an area which some people have questioned, and I have revised my painting because there were some issues. I think I've go it pretty close, but you can see how I don't have much to work with. To make it even more frustrating, it is hard to find a photo of something else that is similar.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/15-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_3.jpg

Okay, back to painting, I will have an update soon.

Oh, I see now, and I think you are as close as a human hand can make it, it's brilliant for such a small size. It is probably so that she is tilting her head in two ways, slightly down, and slightly to the side, which would make sense.

This is such an amazing painting, and it is so filled with spirit and beauty, it is already a masterpiece.

[barriespapa]

You are doing a fantastic job Chris just love it.
David

[equinespirit]

I am in awe, what more can I say? :heart:

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Lorna, I really appreciate it!

Thank you Charlie, I appreciate your support. I do think you are right, her head is tilted down and over so to speak. It really makes for a difficult pose to capture.

Thanks for stopping by David!

Thanks Sarah, you're so nice!

[tulabula]

this is amazing! especially from the photo you have to work with. WOW!

[Joan T]

Chris - It was so great to meet you at the Wet Paints show on Sunday. Your landscapes there were gorgous, but this is stunning. I enjoyed going page by page to see what you did so far. It is almost like watching it be created. It must be hard to work from a black and white photo and then have it come out with the correct coloring. Very nice job on this! I will be back to see it again. Maybe I'll force myself out one Tuesday night and see you at sketch night.

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much tulabula. The photo is so beautiful, even with the low resolution and grainy look. Because my client really wants this done, it's so worth the extra effort.

Thanks so much Joan! I appreciate your stopping by to have a peek. I sure hope you come by on Tuesdays, we have a lot of fun. Sketching people is the best, especially from life.

[allydoodle]

I have another update. I've now put in her right hand. What a weird angle, there is absolutely no view of her arm. The photo shows just what I'm showing and nothing more. I think once I put the harp strings in it will send the hand back even more and it should work. I've checked the values in black and white on the computer by comparing it to the reference, and its all good, so I do think the harp strings will make a big difference.

The thumb on her right hand still isn't quite right, I'm going to tweak that next. The shape of the pinkie on that hand isn't right either (it looks a bit pointy at the top), I'm tweaking away here........

Then on to the harp near the hands. If I get that in, then I can put in some strings to see how they look with the hands. BTW, her last two fingers (pinkie and ring finger) are curled in a really strange position. The end of the fingers go back and you can't see them. Musicians can do some crazy things with their fingers. (My daughter plays guitar, and I don't know how she plays those chords, my fingers would break!)

The background is coming to me as I paint, a weird thing. I hadn't spent too much time thinking about it until today, it seemed the right time to play with it. I guess because I had so many colors in place, I could now start thinking about what to do with the background. I think I work backwards :eek: , so many people put their backgrounds in first, I just can't seem to do that. I need to see where I'm going, and how the painting is evolving before I commit to a background. In my mind the background supports the portrait, and I don't want the background to tell me what colors to use. I want to tell the background what colors I want to use (does that make sense, or am I crazy :lol: ?).

I have one crazy rule for all commissions, and I won't be swayed: "I decide on the background color based on the painting". I don't give the client much leeway with it. If they really "hate green" let's say, then I would try to steer away from a pure green, but there might be some green in there (you know me, color addict and all......:evil: ). I never even bring up the background other than to say the background will enhance the portrait, and I just have to see where it goes. I tell them I never know what I'm going to use until I get started. Those email updates are great, they get to see what I'm thinking, and so far everybody has been happy. Enough about my philosophy on backgrounds.

Okay, I gotta go fix that hand now, that pinkie is too pointy on top, it's driving me nuts!

Thanks for looking :heart: .

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/20-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_12.jpg

[Kathryn Wilson]

The person who commissioned this is going to get a treasure - I love the background, and, no, you are not nutz to do it that way.

[KariTirrell]

I love the background, too. It's coming along beautifully!

[Ruthie57]

I'm liking the background too. And you'll get the fingers sorted out to your satisfaction I know. It's going to be just stunning!

[equinespirit]

The hands already look amazing to me :clap: :clap:

And nope, I dont think you are crazy, the BG has to support the picture not the other way round so it wil come to you when it comes, sometimes that may be early sometimes late.

[chewie]

geesh i know nothing of harps, nor of this person, but I'd most certainly want this painting myself! wow this is a real treat to watch. you are doing a brillant job

[pointy]

ok so I know everyone has already stated the obvious, this is unbelievably good, but for me this goes beyond photorealism, you have managed to capture the depth of a beautiful moment that no camera could and given someone an irreplaceable gift:)

[adigal]

Chris,
This is absolutely gorgeous. The face is just beautiful and you captured her spirit already.
Nancy

[barriespapa]

Chris it has been all said You are doing a magnificent job I most definetly don't think you are crazy,maybe a teeny bit OCD:D
David

[equinespirit]

Chris it has been all said You are doing a magnificent job I most definetly don't think you are crazy,maybe a teeny bit OCD:D
David

Just a teeny bit? :confused::evil::lol:

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Kat. I sometimes get questions about not putting in my backgrounds first, it's nice to know it makes sense to someone like you.

Thanks Kari, I appreciate it!

Thank you Ruthie, yes sorting out the fingers......:lol:

Thank you Sarah, good to know you get the background aproach!

What a nice thing to say Chris, thanks so very much :heart: .

Thanks so much pointy, that is exactly what i'm going for, I am so pleased it's coming across.

Thanks so much Nancy, I appreciate it.



Chris it has been all said You are doing a magnificent job I most definetly don't think you are crazy,maybe a teeny bit OCD:D
David



Just a teeny bit? :confused::evil::lol:


Hey, what do you mean David & Sarah? I'm no where's OCD, just trying to accomplish something very difficult I think. There is more to this painting than just a "portrait painting". I didn't approach this one any differently than I do for any other commission I've done. Somehow along the way though, I believe this has turned into a healing process for someone. This is a person that has touched my heart somehow with his sorrow. If I can, in some small way touch someone with my art and make a difference, well, then I'm having a good day. If something's not right, it's not right, and I aim to make it right. I wouldn't call that OCD, in my book it's more like perservence and tenacity, both traits I seem to be generously gifted with. I accept nothing less than the best I can do, whether someone is paying or I'm painting for myself. In this case not only is it not about the payment (because it never is), it's even more about what my art can do for someone else. I see it as a privilege to be able to paint something for someone knowing I maybe made a difference in their life. What an opportunity, and I intend to embrace it.

I hope you can see that.

[equinespirit]

Sorry Chris, only kidding you :grouphug:
You are such a perfectionist I find you absolutely inspiring. :thumbsup:

[JudyG]

I can relate. I have CDO. That is OCD but with the letters in the correct order like they are supposed to be.:evil: (I can't remember where I read that):lol:

[bnoonan]

OMG - Chris!!!!:eek: WOW - I totally missed this and yet I think it's AMAZING!!!! How do you have so much patience? YIkes!

the arm the fingers the hair the face... it's all working. If you left it as is I'd buy it in a heartbeat...... Why do any more?

Wow - so much to learn!!!! Barb

:clap: :clap: :clap:

[*Deirdre*]

I've been wowed by this one and following your progress for a long time now Chris....and this is every bit as fabulous as I first thought it was...just realised I hadn't actually said so yet!!:o

[barriespapa]

Hi Chris I thought it over for a very long time before i stuck that in there as a joke not knowing if it would be taken as just that. please accept my apologies
David

[LadyMadonna]

Every single time I view this ,it takes my breath away.

[chuas2]

Woo Hoo Chris! This is absolutely stunning. A really difficult subject, grainy black and white photo, hard hand positions and a client who wants a memorial to his beloved wife. Yowza! You're just the person to do it though, and it's coming along absolutely beautifully! Yay you!!
:clap:

[allydoodle]

Hi Sarah, apology accepted :).

Thanks very much Barb, I really appreciate it. My husband asked me if I thought I might finish this before Christmas. I had to tell him not to rush me, it will be finished when it's done :lol: !

Thanks very much Deirdre, I appreciate your stopping by :heart: !

Hi David, apology accepted :).

Thanks very much Donna, you're so sweet :heart: !

Hey Kris, thanks so much. Yeah, just a few difficulties to overcome :eek: , Yikes! I know, crazy isn't it? I am enjoying the process though, it's turning out to be quite fun :D .

[robertsloan2]

After your last update, I'm still awed and stunned. Don't bother with a deadline. Do it at its own pace because you have a piece of finite perfection going here. It's wonderful.

[mollerman]

This is really coming along quite beautifully and indeed very touching. I would have gone bonkers weeks ago! I can certainly appreciate when an artist takes such care to detail and emotion as you have rendered thus far. I do have one question... did you plan to cover up the palm of the right hand? Right now it seems to read a bit peculiar but I may be wrong?

[allydoodle]

Thanks Robert. I guess some things have their own sense of time, and this one certainly fits the bill.

[allydoodle]

This is really coming along quite beautifully and indeed very touching. I would have gone bonkers weeks ago! I can certainly appreciate when an artist takes such care to detail and emotion as you have rendered thus far. I do have one question... did you plan to cover up the palm of the right hand? Right now it seems to read a bit peculiar but I may be wrong?

Thanks very much Marcus. The palm of her right hand is almost level with the floor, so to speak. I think she has her elbow raised very high on that arm, which would make the palm of her hand almost not visible, and forshortened. Take a look at this closeup of her right hand and you'll see what I mean. I think when I put in the strings it will send the hand back a bit and then it will all make sense. Keeping my fingers crossed that I'm right.....

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/22-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_4.jpg

I do still have to fix the pinkie finger's shape, as well as the thumb, which still isn't there. I also just caught a small portion of her palm which is forshortened that might need a tweak:eek: . Everytime I look at this I see something else. Her hand is small, the distance from her pinkie to her forefinger is less than 1 1/2", and the length of the forefinger is just a little more than 1 1/2". It's a small area to be working, so these adjustments will be very small, but make a big difference I think.

Thanks very much for taking a look Marcus, I appreciate it.

[deeliza]

Hi Chris,

I just got back from Florida and when I checked your progress on this, well it is just amazing. I even showed it to a friend down there and she was floored.

You're absolutly right that her right arm would have the elbow up. I had a dear old friend, gone now, who was a harp teacher. When I would watch her play, her arm was just like that also.

Beautiful, stunning work.

[bnoonan]

Promise us you won't rush this.... your ability to take it carefully is what's most impressive Chris!!! WOW!!!!!

[Merethe T]

Still looking totally awesome, the fingers look great to me, not much tweaking needed there as far as I can see...musicians do tend to put their fingers in the most awkward positions dont' they... :lol: It can be a pain to paint, but I think you have nailed this!

I just wanted to comment on the lack of arm.....are you sure that the arm don't show? It is hard to tell from the ref, but to me it looks like part of her underarm is showing, shadowed but suggested....or is this my brain telling me that there should be an arm? I googled harp players, and most of them showed a position like this, with the underarm showing as the elbow usually is positioned lower than the hand. I'm just wondering if the underarm shouldn't be suggested there. It wouldn't take much, you already have some darks there in the bg colors that could easily work with just a few more touches. I'm thinking about the area between the ring finger and the index finger. Well, just adding my thoughts for you to consider before you add the strings - I know that will be a bit tedious part to work and you won't want to remove it later if you find you're unhappy with the area...

Love the bg, love the skin colors (they are soooo good!), love it all - really outstanding work! Take your time, and enjoy every bit of the process....

[allydoodle]

Thanks deeliza, you're so very nice. That arm is a mystery to me, I was trying to figure it out just by looking at the photo (it's all I have), hopefully you and I are right.

Thanks so much Barb. No rushing, this will go along at a comfortable pace :D .

Thank you so very much Merethe. You know, if you look at that reference I posted, the indication of "something, but I don't know what" is there, but just, and I mean just by a little bit. It's even less in my photo, for some reason on the computer it shows a bit more. The problem is, what little bit is shown really doesn't look like an arm to me, though I guess it could be. I'm not sure what shape to indicate, what angle to put it at, and what width to show. I did have something indicated, and it didn't work at all. I took it out and put the background in, and it looked much better. I can play with it on the computer a bit to see if I can make it work, but I'm reluctant to put in something that looks awkward and unbelievable. I don't think I should try to make it up at this point. I'm hoping by putting the strings in it should throw everthing back (sort of like it is in the photo). I want her hand to seem like it is coming out of the shadows, the way it looks in the photo. I will study it some more and think about it to be sure. I really appreciate your input, you have such a good eye for detail and it's great to know you're looking in. I'll let you know what I figure out. Thank you so very much.

[luicre]

Chris, I also think that when you have the strings in place that hand it`s going to recede in the space.

It is incredibly beautiful.

Saludos

Luicre

[KariTirrell]

I agree with Luicre - once the strings are painted in, you might not have an issue with that arm. It's amazing how much of painting is problem solving, isn't it? You are doing such a fabulous job - I'm totally enjoying being able to watch this progress.

[Merethe T]

You're probably right Chris, the strings will help make the hand recede, and you can help that effect by adjusting the values too. I'd probably go for the same solution, I'd be afraid to run into problems when the rest is solved already! I think this may be my brain telling me that there should be an hint of the arm, but it is the musician talking, not the painter, lol! I'm a guitar player and often do finger picking style, and I know I'd cramp up before I'd gotten through the first song if I held my elbow higher than my hand. That's probably why I was wondering about that hand....nevermind me, I know you'll get this part down perfectly as well as the rest!

[allydoodle]

You're probably right Chris, the strings will help make the hand recede, and you can help that effect by adjusting the values too. I'd probably go for the same solution, I'd be afraid to run into problems when the rest is solved already! I think this may be my brain telling me that there should be an hint of the arm, but it is the musician talking, not the painter, lol! I'm a guitar player and often do finger picking style, and I know I'd cramp up before I'd gotten through the first song if I held my elbow higher than my hand. That's probably why I was wondering about that hand....nevermind me, I know you'll get this part down perfectly as well as the rest!

You're definitely right about holding the arm in an uncomfortable position. My daughter plays guitar, and I know for a fact that some positions just cannot be held for any length of time. Comfort is a real factor in playing. I was looking at the reference photo, and there seems to be a small, and I mean small sliver of a spot that indicates an arm. It's crazy, take a look here:

zoom of hand:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_4.jpg

I've marked the spot here:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_4a.JPG

I don't have this bit in, and I'm thinking this just might be the arm going back. Maybe by putting this little bit in, it might make it read better. I'm going to give it a try, it should be very easy to do.

The part here, that I've marked, is the bottom of her palm, foreshortened, so I'm not sure if we'd see more of her arm or not:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/23-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_4b.JPG

I definitely think the top of her arm is that small bit I marked in yellow. That may be enough, keeping my fingers crossed that it will work. Thanks so much Merethe, you forced me to really analyze the photo, and it came to me. If I continue the yellow line up, it pretty much reaches her shoulder, which tells me this just might be right. As far as putting the bottom part of her arm, I'm just not sure about how wide it would be, given the angle it's being held at and any foreshortening. It's really hard to make up, hopefully the indication of the top part is enough. What do you think, does this look like the arm to you?

I'll let you know how it works.

[Merethe T]

It sure looks like part of her arm, I didn't even notice that little bit! You have a good eye....I've been going back and forth between the ref and the painting, it had me puzzled as I couldn't figure out the angle of the arm. Could that be a small part of her upper arm, and the rest is hidden behind the hand? Maybe the pic is taken while shifting between the strings...if she was playing the strings near her body she'd probably be resting her arm against the harp, and the underarm would show underneath the hand. But in this pic she is playing strings further away from her body, which would mean she'd have to raise her elbow and upper arm to reach them. So, you are probably right!

Like you said, it's not a lot of work to try it out, it may just be enough to ground the hand, and the strings and bg will do the rest. It won't be hard to remove it if it doesn't work either...I'm glad you found my nitpick helpful - after all it really is just a tiny nit! I wasn't sure I should mention it at all as it will work out in the end. But my logic side got the better of me I guess... :lol:
I look forward to see how it goes....

[lorna12]

I look forward to seeing how you solve this problem...what a terrible photo to work from and what a fantastic job you're doing. :)

[John Palmer Fine Art]

Love the way this is taking shape Chris, you are having to overcome so many problems here and succeeding brilliantly. I am glad it's not my commission, but am really enjoying witnessing your trials and tribulations and how you are mastering this. Also great to read all of these positive contributions from our fellow artists.

[allydoodle]

Thanks very much Merethe. I do think that little bit is part of her arm, I'm pretty sure it is actually. Hopefully that will be enough.

Thanks lorna12. The photo is difficult, yet beautiful. I was inspired to give it a try because of it's beauty, knowing I would have many challenges ahead. I'm working out the issues one at a time, otherwise it would have been even more overwhelming.

Hi John! Thanks so much, I appreciate it. Yes, isn't it wonderful to get so much support from so many talented people? I'm humbled really...... and so very appreciative.

[allydoodle]

Okay, another update, a small one. I worked out the hand I think (her right one), though looking at it here I may need to indicate a bit more flesh tone under the hand and a bit more of the upper arm. I really think I need to put in some strings too, so I started more work on the harp. That will enable me to put in some strings to see where this is going.

I do have to go back and finish her shirt also, but I'm itching to see if the hands will work with the strings, so I think that will be my next step.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/24-Oct-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_13.jpg

[equinespirit]

I couldnt see what you were talking about with her arm atall in the photo even with the yellow line :o but I can see what you mean now in this :thumbsup:

[spirothet]

Hi Chris,

I just happened to see this post & now realize what you have been working on. There is just too much to read but oh how fantastic this work is! I can't wait to see it finished. You are very talented! Cali

[allydoodle]

I know Sarah, it's really hard to see in the photo. It took a bit of detective work, but I think I figured it out.

Thanks very much Cali, I appreciate it. This seems to be taking longer than any other painting I've done, so the thread is a bit large. Sorry 'bout that :o , I just can't seem to move quickly on this one though.

[allydoodle]

I took a bit of a break from this, and now I'm back at it. I finished an area of the harp, so I was able to put in a few strings to see how it might come together. I'm hesitant to make the strings any thicker, I don't want them to over \power the painting. Right now they're pretty thin, and I just may leave them that way. I know less than nothing about harps, but it seems that they can have strings that are both white and black. When I looked on the internet at some images, some even have red and blue strings. This one had black strings, as well as some white. I'm staying true to the placement of these strings, as I'm sure it has significance to anyone that has a knowledge of harps. Sort of like the rigging on a sailboat, if it's wrong, a true sailor will know it.

I think now that I know what the strings will look like and how I'm going to approach them, I'm going to finish her shirt and work on the background on the bottom right. Then back to the harp and strings.

Thanks for looking, and I appreciate your comments.

Edit to post: There's some kind of mark on her jawline here, but it's not at all on the original painting. Weird, when I look at it on my editing software on my computer it's fine, but here on Wet Canvas I see a small mark. Very strange.......

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Nov-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_14.jpg

[pastelrose]

what a wonderful start. Can't wait to see the finished piece. I am sure the husband will love it and treasure it.
Pastelrose :)

[Ruthie57]

Chris, I am so pleased and relieved to see an update on this! :) I have been pacing the floor the last several days everytime I open up the studio and the thread is not on page 1 :crying:
I also know nothing about harps so I agree that you should go with what you see on the strings. They actually look good like that anyway, more so than if they were uniform in colour. They could be different colours or it could be the light striking them differently as they vibrate....that's for the viewer to conclude.
Looking forward to more.......

[equinespirit]

Good idea to take a break I think, it eases any temptation to rush it.
Im really enjoying following this so much that I will almost be disappointed when you finish! :o :thumbsup:

[Turpintine45]

Wow Chris I have been gone for a while and look where you are. Everything is coming together so well. Really great work.

[SherryC]

I swear this is almost supernatural. She is coming to life and I know her loved one will feel that way also. What a stunnng woman and a stunning work of art.

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much pastelrose, I sure hope so :D ! So far he loves the work (I send him updates).

You're too funny Ruthie :heart: . I really had to take a mental brake from this, sometimes it's a good idea. Now I'm back at it, and it feels good. Take a look at the close-up of her hand, and you'll see the obvious difference in the string colors. I think it has significance for playing, the strings are certainly different notes, and I think they are marked by colors somehow. Take a look:

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/01-Nov-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_reference_photo_zoom_4.jpg

Thanks very much Sarah, what a nice thing to say :heart: . Hopefully I'll do some significant work on this tomorrow. Yeah!

Hi Jen, nice to see you back :heart: ! I'm glad you think I got far, I feel I'm moving at a snail's pace :lol: . Thanks so much.

[allydoodle]

Hi Sherry, we cross posted! Thanks so very much, I sort of feel the same way, her spirit is coming alive sort of. I don't want to sound weird, it just sort of does feel that way to me too :heart: .

[barriespapa]

Hi Chris No wonder you had to take a break i cannot imagine anything more difficult than putting in those strings, but you are doing a magnificent job of them. I know that when you complete this it will be a masterpiece. I keep hoping that one of these days you will breeze through the rest and be able to take a well deserved rest from the pressure you must be feeling from the emotional biuld up that is so much a part of this painting Happy painting
David

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
the work is moving along very well :) :thumbsup:

i did some homework about harp strings because
your ref pix is b+w , = red will appear black .
- also , i was curious if the tuning of a harp was similar to a piano
which is based on a C-major scale , and the white and black keys , etc. ,
and my guess was correct .
> C string is red , F is either black or blue
= a visual reference for octaves ( do re mi so fa la ti do ) ,
and so , because of construction/pitch/interval ,
F will be three strings closer to the harpist from C ,
and that's how you can figure out what colour goes where :D

Ed :}

[KD Art]

This is an absolutely beautiful piece - you must be so pleased!!! I'm so glad that I didn't miss the whole thing, having been off WC for a while. However, it does make me loathe to post my crazy, lighthearted cat paintings which I did as a break from the norm....it seems almost a little irreverent in the face of a piece which is special in may ways! So apologies in advance for that...Kat

[allydoodle]

Thanks David, I appreciate it. I also have to look at the colors of each string, and I'm now finding that there are either black or blue ones as well as red. So, before I continue on I need to be sure of that placement and whether the F strings are black or blue, as well as the placement of the C strings which are red. They are all appearing somewhat black, so I'm in a bit of a quandary right now.

Thanks Ed, I do see that now as I poke around on the internet. I think one of my black strings may need to be changed to red, but I'm not sure (I don't think it will be difficult to change, but I'm not doing anything until I'm sure). I also think harps come in different sizes, having a different number of strings. I'm not sure about the size of this harp, and so I'm not sure if it affects the placement of the strings? If what you say is right (and I'm sure it is), I would think that the first string is white, then the second string is either blue/black, and on from there the next two are white, then the next is red, then the next three are white, then a blue/black string, and on and on.... It sure looks that way to me but, not being a musician myself, I need some expert advice. I have emailed my client in the hopes that he either still has the harp, has a color photo of the harp, or remembers the colors and placement of the strings. He is a musician, so I'm hoping at the very least he can tell me, and if he has a color photo, even better. Nothing is easy is it :eek: ? I will move on to her shirt for now, that's a much safer place to be until I get some answers :lol: .

Thanks so much Kat, you're so very nice. A light hearted cat painting is just what I need right now, the strings on this harp are making me frustrated! Your paintings are georgous, and I cannot wait to see what you post next!

[barriespapa]

Hi Chris I went to the Spotlight and Painted a pumkin in just about half an hour it was so nice just to slap on the pastel and not half to worry about a thing such a pleasant and relaxing refresher after the portrait attempt of my daughter I highly recommend the therapy.
David

[bnoonan]

Still munching on popcorn with my mouth open in awe as you paint this Chris.... WOW!!!! Barb

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
the Western chromatic scale is based on half tones .

with the harmonic/tonic major scale ,
the interval between the third/fourth note and the seventh/octave note
is a half tone .

a single row pedal harp is designed to be tuned to a C major scale .
the major scale starts with C (red) ,
D (white) , E (white) , then F (blue) ,
G (white) , A (white) , B (white) and the octave C (red)
in ascending pitch ( longer to shorter strungs ) .
= the pattern of black/white is what tells you the string colour
even if the longest or shortest string on the instrument is Not C :D

Ed :}

[allydoodle]

Thanks David :D . Actually, I have been noodling around with other things to keep me sane. You are right, I might go crazy if I don't lighten it up a bit. I'm working on a landscape, just on Canson paper, and it's now at the point where I don't care and I'm just experimenting, which is okay. I also do weekly live portrait sketches, which keeps me sane.

Aw Barb, you're so nice :heart: ! I'm moving much slower than I normally do, but I think it's keeping me from messing it up. The strings are now a bit of an issue, but I think I have it figured out. Glad I procrastinated, it really did help me work it out.

Hey Ed, you are one smart fella! I wouldn't know a C from an F, let alone what the Western Chromatic Scale is! My daughter plays guitar and oboe, so she would definitely know what you're talkin' about, but me, not so much! I did speak with my client today, and he gave me the maker of the harp. I was able to go to their website and actually get a clear picture of the exact same string set up as this one is. I guess because harps come in different sizes, the first (or shortest) string isn't always white like this one is. So I wasn't sure what the second string was (either red or black). Of course, my lack of knowledge in this area is a definite deficit :eek:, which isn't helping. Also, this harp had black, not blue strings, which I needed to know (the client remembered that). I need a picture to look at, to be sure I'm doing it right. The website my client sent me to definitely provided that, thank goodness :clap: .

Anyway, you're so helpful, I really appreciate it. Thanks so much. I just wish I understood all that music-speak, I just never learned how to play an instrument (I tell my parents I was deprived all the time :lol: ).

[sketchZ1ol]

hello
Chris - aww shucks :evil:
- it's a math/geometry/construction/guy thing :lol:

ask your daughter why a guitar has frets ,
and how/why they change the pitch of the string .
>> if that doesn't provoke a dirty look ,
it could be the start of a good conversation :)

i taught myself how to play harmonica
and in particular the ' Chicago blues ' style ( that Mississippi saxaphone :evil: )
- a student asked me why it could make that sound
and it was off to the library !
... three months later i had an answer after getting my head around musical modalities , fixed pitch , and the math therein ( whew !)

anyway , it's nice to be able to bring that info into another area of creativity .

- sorry to ramble ...
take what you need and leave the rest :)

Ed :}

[Donna T]

Hi Chris! I'm stealing some of Barb's popcorn and munching along in awe too! Regardless of what details you put in or leave out the feelilng of this painting is what grabs me. Wow ...

[plt8769]

Hi Hello Chris. I feel sorry not to have come earlier but your work is just fantastic. Congratulation for your talent and how you made the light shining out of this! amazing! keep going

[allydoodle]

You're a man of many talents Ed! I really do wish I learned an instrument, but alas I never did.... I am however, strongly encouraging my daughter. Being 14, she doesn't always appreciate it :lol: , but I really think it's important to play an instrument, and she's exceeding my expectations by playing guitar, and oboe. She played saxophone for two years, but recently switched to oboe (a good thing). She also plays around on the keyboard (and she can draw as well - I'm not too proud am I :smug: :lol: ?).

Hi Donna! So nice to see you back! Hope all is well with you in your new digs..... Thanks so very much, I really appreciate it. This sure is turning into a labor of love.

Thanks so much plt8769. I appreciate your taking the time to look and comment, you're so very nice.

[allydoodle]

Another update..... The strings are proving to be the most frustrating...... Technically they're not difficult, just a few lines right? It's getting those lines in the right postition that is so tough, I've moved all but two, and changed the color of one..... I think I've got it now though. I stopped playing with them because I didn't want to get frustrated and make a mistake. I moved on to the bottom of the harp, the background on the right and her shirt. I purposely made the edge of the back of her shirt soft, I think this needs some lost and found edges to keep it from being too harsh. I'm not sure about the dark side of the harp. I may play with that a bit, adding some warmer tones and maybe lightening it up just a tad. It's not quite there yet. That dark blue I have on the bottom shadow of the harp is too strong.

Where the strings connect to the bottom of the harp there are some grommet like holes that need to be put in. Right now there's nothing to indicate that, but I will be putting them in soon. Thank goodness for the internet, I was able to find some really good photos of this harp online, so very helpful.

http://www.wetcanvas.com/Community/images/05-Nov-2011/93075-playing_with_the_angels_step_15.jpg

[Ruthie57]

Chris, I like the way you're doing the strings, varying the intensity of the line from almost invisible to more definite. This is just how the eye would observe them. And I'm really liking how the BG is developing.
You're, almost, on the home stretch now I think. Keep going. This is a masterpiece!

[DBfarmgirl]

I have been watching this one even though I haven't had much to add, but WOW. It's truly beautiful. thanks for sharing the progress.

[JudyG]

Me too. I'm just happily sitting back watching it develop. It is awsome.

[Turpintine45]

This is taking on a life of it's own and what a wonder it is. Love how the strings are turning out. It truly is a masterpiece Chris.

[John Palmer Fine Art]

Hi Chris, I agree we are indeed witnessing a wonderful work of art unfolding here, your tenacity is paying off and deservedly so.

[equinespirit]

Beautiful :heart:

[chuas2]

Ruthie is spot on. A masterpiece. I am in awe of your talent, Chris!
Kris

[allydoodle]

Thanks so much Ruthie. What a nice thing to say :heart: , though I don't know about masterpiece, it is turning into a labor of love I think. I'm starting to now get a bit stressed over the harp, the pegs and levers don't look easy. I also have to get the gromets (I think that's what they are) where the holes have the strings coming through put in. They have to be lined up correctly, another difficult task I think. Keeping fingers crossed here :crossfingers: ......

Thank you very much DBfarmgirl, I appreciate your stopping by. I always find it fun to watch other artists work, and I'm glad you appreciate my sharing it.

Thanks so much Judy, it's slow to develop, but at least I'm getting there :lol: .

Hi Jen, thanks so very much :heart: . It is taking on a life of it's own, and I am truly humbled by everybody's support. This is such a great group here on the Pastel Forum :grouphug: .

Thanks very much John, I guess tenacity can come in a bit handy sometimes, huh :D ? Sometimes too much of it can be too much, but this time it's proving to be helpful.

Thank you Sarah :heart: .

Aw shucks Kris, thanks so much :heart: , you're so sweet.

[barriespapa]

Well chris I don't think there is anything i can add that hasn't been said your work is awesome and you are getting so close you must be starting to feel some elation here at this point, you certainly deserve to be.
David

[Dcam]

Chris: I came upon this a little late.......just, just, WOW!

I love it, I love it!

Derek:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

[allydoodle]

Thanks David, I appreciate your support. I still don't feel out of the woods yet, the harp has some detail that I need to get from references off the internet. It should be interesting........

Hey Derek, thanks for stopping by! I appreciate it, thanks so much, you're so very nice.